10228 Haunted House

[Meatman]

Looking at the side by side natesroom posted you can clearly see there's more differences than similarities. Of course they're going to be the same shape, look at all the real houses that have been posted, they're ALL the same shape. Besides, who cares if he saw that house and used some things from it he saw and liked. This argument is ridiculous. All MOCers do it. I read it all the time on here, "I'm gonna use that technique" "neat _____, I'm gonna use that" and so on. Are we really making a big deal just because it's a LEGO designer? Is he supposed to be above that and only make a model using new, never before seen models? Give me a break. I'm ready and waiting September. For all you calling foul, don't buy it.

That's fine if you come out and say that you are using whomever's techniques, but building something very similar to someone else and claiming that you never saw their model is something different. It is pretty obvious that the 10228 is completely different from the older one in the majority of the build technique, but from a moderate distance, you probably would think they were the same thing.

[Graysmith]

I guess some people aren't going to shut up about it until LEGO folds and cancels this set. I don't really see what other purpose there is for natesroom to keep "fueling the fire".

[Omega 8]

I guess some people aren't going to shut up about it until LEGO folds and cancels this set. I don't really see what other purpose there is for natesroom to keep "fueling the fire".

^^^ THIS ^^^

[Meatman]

In fact if the guy who built the older House displayed it at a show this fall after the release of the 10228, most spectators would probably think that he/she just got their ideas from the 10228 and copied it.

I guess some people aren't going to shut up about it until LEGO folds and cancels this set. I don't really see what other purpose there is for natesroom to keep "fueling the fire".

I agree. I am excited for this set and can't wait to get it. I am done with the petty arguments about this. Like I said before, I think it is very well done.

[Algernon]

I doubt LEGO would cancel this set after it's already been made and ready to ship. I also SINCERELY HOPE THEY DON'T! It would be a terrible way for such a fantastic set to end up. I think we can agree that these arguments are no longer worth the trouble.

[TheLegoDr]

In fact if the guy who built the older House displayed it at a show this fall after the release of the 10228, most spectators would probably think that he/she just got their ideas from the 10228 and copied it.

I agree 100%. Timing is everything. If one was released later, people would be mad at the other designer. As the designer said, if it were a different color, no one would be saying anything.

I still don't see any similarities in the two builds other than the obvious similarities for that particular style of house. I don't believe he copied anything. I still don't understand what the fuss is about.

[Graysmith]

I doubt LEGO would cancel this set after it's already been made and ready to ship. I also SINCERELY HOPE THEY DON'T! It would be a terrible way for such a fantastic set to end up. I think we can agree that these arguments are no longer worth the trouble.

Well LEGO put together that Friends 2012 Advent Calendar, designed the box, photographed it and all that and then they (apparently) cancelled it so I wouldn't say it's out of the question.

[natesroom]

I'm in favor of the set, and WILL buy it.

I'm not the one with the controversy i just said lets take a better look at them side by side.

[gotoAndLego]

I am retiring from the discussion as I feel both sides have presented their case. We're all smart enough to make up our own minds from the evidence presented. I would ask that everyone else let the discussion return to the merits of the set itself.

Back on track, I'm interested to see how the release mechanism for the attic ladder looks from the outside.

Edited June 14, 2012 by gotoAndLego

[Ultr6L3g0]

This would be cool for a Lego youtube Flip that house show where the haunted house is remodeled

[Vindicare]

That's fine if you come out and say that you are using whomever's techniques, but building something very similar to someone else and claiming that you never saw their model is something different. It is pretty obvious that the 10228 is completely different from the older one in the majority of the build technique, but from a moderate distance, you probably would think they were the same thing.

Why would he lie about seeing/not seeing it? It wouldn't gain him anything by doing so... Of course at a distance they're going to look the same, the shape/color is the same. Nobody is denying that.

Edited June 14, 2012 by Legocrazy81

[IAmWillGibson]

Did the older version have Zombie Chef and Frankenstein Butler [in glorious Black and White]?

No?

Case closed.

[kris kelvin]

One more from me (advocatus zomboli).

Look at this:

Do you really, REALLY think, that someone who can build something like this has to steal window shapes? For the set which had dreamed for a long long time?

C`mon

[Paul Boratko]

One more from me (advocatus zomboli).

Do you really, REALLY think, that someone who can build something like this has to steal window shapes? For the set which had dreamed for a long long time?

C`mon

As a member said in an earlier post here, the only people that seem to be using the words Steal are the guys who are supposed to be defending the integrity of the designer... I don't care who used what from who, the end result is absolutely stunning and I think this is one of the finest sets to come along in quite some time...

[Algernon]

As a member said in an earlier post here, the only people that seem to be using the words Steal are the guys who are supposed to be defending the integrity of the designer... I don't care who used what from who, the end result is absolutely stunning and I think this is one of the finest sets to come along in quite some time...

My thoughts exactly! This set is brilliant. September can't come quickly enough.

[kris kelvin]

Adam asked me for posting his last speech in this topic:

"Now. Again, I read thru the thread and honestly? I have no idea what you want to hear? I usually stay out of discussions like this, because I don’t know how to deal with it. If I write to you now, half of you will think “he reads thru it, he is aware that he stole from the community, tries to defend himself”. Or maybe you think that when I don’t say anything? He is quiet, so that means he did that and that… Do you want to hear that I was inspired by this built? How, if I haven’t seen in just before the end of the design process? Sure, could have replaced the slopes on the top of the windows with two cheeseslopes. But by then I didn’t give a damn. It just looked right, so I didn’t care. It was an obvious choice. As many other things too. Tons of stuff just came together with no reflections on anything, oh, that is a cool brick, I could use that. Oh, this looks like the metal things so many houses have around the lower part of the windows, I get that. Oh, I need to go from one stud to support two plates, I take the slopes, oh there are so many ornamentations there and here, let’s see how that can be done…

What do I know.

The only thing I know is that I don’t browse Brickshelf, Mocpages, or any other host anymore. Just to avoid getting inspired from such builds and to avoid having to discuss it with anybody. Yes there is a similarity. Yes there are very obvious similarities. And now what? Shall I excuse myself for that? Shall I regret that I built it in sand green (a color community cries for?), shall I begin to apologize to each and every one of you? I have no idea what to do now. No idea when that other house (houses? There seem to be more than one like that now) were built, who built them, why they look like they look like, and I didn’t care much when I saw them for the first time, now I am annoyed. It honestly pisses me off that they are out there. As mentioned, DO YOU REALLY THINK I WOULD NOT DO EVERYTHING POSSIBLE TO COME UP WITH ANOTHER IDEAS FOR WINDOWS, PORCH, AND WHATSOEVER IF I SAW IT BEFORE I BUILT THE SET? Why would one in my position copy stuff, not only because it is not “nice”, but being well aware that if I did, there would be a discussion like that? I don’t want to be involved into the community, I don’t care about what happens, I don’t want to read what people wish, see what people build to avoid any resemblance between what I do and what someone else did.

I check Brothers-Brick because I still like LEGO, I check LugPol because there are friends of mine. Every single creation that I built for myself that was in any way inspired got it’s proper credit, my work stuff is community free with one exception, which is the Imperial Shuttle (and which shows that LEGO doesn’t have any problem whatsoever to ask people if their creations can be used for products, so why would we not ask for the permission to copycat the houses you mention?).

I don’t see why one should build “different”, and seek for another solutions just for the sake of building it different. Especially now, when I look at the other house, there are no “magic” techniques, some crazy SNOT or super innovative use of elements/shapes. It’s basic, and very obvious stacking. He/She used 2x2 windows to make the windows, and guess what, I actually used the 2x2 window element to make… You guessed it, a window… There is tons of other things that explain this or that. Like the only brick available in sand green when I began to build that house was a 1x2 brick. Now, I can’t recolor everything I wish, so I added a 1x1 and 1x6 if I remember right, and out of these bricks I built everything sand green there, and so some solutions were just a plain necessity, math, logic. Or the already mentioned little roofs above the windows. They are just there. Looks good. Two 1x1 round with a tile on top to make… “Things”. It looks like that on so many houses. Or kind of like that, a little roofy thing above the windows. If I would have built it for myself I’d SNOT something there. But I couldn’t, so I had 1x4 space above every window that I wanted to do something with. So simple. At least to me.

I buid the ornamentations above the porch out of the 1x1 with a round plate because I have seen it on some modulars by Jamie. Never occurred to me that a detail like this would screw my whole day once I read about it in a forum… Actually the whole space under the roof was built like this originally, but then I used round 1x1s. Again. Whyever. I don’t know, remember, want to discuss it because Reading thru it it seems that I really try to defend my stuff, and I don’t. I build that house as I build it because of one thousand different reasons. There was talks with my bosses, Jamie, rebuilds, can you do this, that, can you make that tower that way, this way, can you add detail here blablabla.

One way or another, to make some of you “believe” me I’d have to reveal our timelines (You have any idea how old the first version is?), processes, and prototypes. And I am not allowed, and even if I was, I wouldn’t do so. Already got too much involved in this here without a proper reason. You either believe me, or you don’t. Your choice.

Over and out."

[Vindice]

Thanks for the post Kris!

I like many others am extremely disappointed at some of the morons on here who seem to want to tear down a seriously great model someone has produced for us.

It's little wonder that LEGO designers stay way from sites like these now when they get this sort of moronic responses from a minority of idiots.

There are not "billions" of ways to arrive at the same designs in LEGO. for something to be authentic you often will need to adopt similar techniques as another skilled builder. That is a basic of any architecture. If it works well one way then you don't change it just because it may be similar to someone elses technique.

I can't wait to buy this awesome model. And I hope the designer carries on building many more great sets just like it.

[Fuppylodders]

I have to say, I was sceptical but unsure at first. But now thinking about it, I can totally see how he could easily have come up with similarities coincidentally. Not from his recent responses, but by thinking about how it could happen to me.

Im still relatively new to moccing, so I do look to other places for inspiration.

He however is already an experienced lego builder/designer. So for him, those inspirations can simply come from his experience of 'just knowing' which parts would fit and work best with a certain look. As said previously, if working from the same source,there most certainly will be similarities, because they are both trying to achieve the same source image feel.

I've designed a minifig scale AT-AT. I know others have done this, and I also know there are a few that have achieved this near to perfection. When I was designing parts of mine without having looked closely how they achieved theirs, I found that I came to similar conclusions after looking through the list of available parts to use.

First off, the general shape is already so similar that I could be easily accused of having 'far too many similarities' that I hadn't so much designed it myself, rather than had just simply copied the majority and changed a few bits here and there to make it 'appear' different'. But how am I to achieve what I feel is the best representation which works with certain methods, when others have also done what they feel works with the best method, of which we have both individually come to the same conclusion?

I actually feel ashamed for my original but un-thought out scepticism, for the fact that I now understand how very easily possible it is that this could innocently happen, and that he more than likely feels his very nicely designed house is now tainted with these thoughts...

I don't think I posted much, if anything, to debate the whole similarities thing, but even for thinking it, I feel I owe him an apology.

Edited June 15, 2012 by Fuppylodders

[brickie]

For an old codger, this new set takes me back to the Munsters and Psycho.

It is exactly as i would imagine a haunted house would be.

I will be first to buy one ; for the grandkids of course.

Adam, you have done a brilliant job; I admire your skill.

I am looking forward to building this so that I can learn from all the brilliant building techniques that you have incorporated in this set.

A brilliant set, well planned and well executed by LEGO.

[Blondie-Wan]

Well LEGO put together that Friends 2012 Advent Calendar, designed the box, photographed it and all that and then they (apparently) cancelled it so I wouldn't say it's out of the question.

What? Sorry, I know it's OT, but since it came up here, when did this happen? Has it been verified?

[kris kelvin]

I like many others am extremely disappointed at some of the morons on here who seem to want to tear down a seriously great model someone has produced for us.

Well, I wouldn`t say morons

Buildings are similar so it`s rather obvious that there are some doubts. We are discussing, Adam made his comments...

So, people may or may not belive him. That`s the life.

For me case closed

[natesroom]

who cares about a stupid haunted house make me a PREDATOR!!!!

[MstrOfPppts]

I didn't really read the whole topic, but just enough to get the idea of the problem. I didn't see any of the houses mentioned before and when I saw the model I was amazed how great it is. It's hard to say if it was copied, but I believe not especially for the fact mentioned in Adams last reply - the timelines and the amount of time it takes for such a model to be designed ...

It's little wonder that LEGO designers stay way from sites like these now when they get this sort of moronic responses from a minority of idiots.

My thoughts exactly and then a few moments later you'll all be complaining how TLG does not listen to the community feedback. Well the chances are, because of such stupid topics, they won't even be reading our feedback anymore!

... just had to add this!

[mrlegoman]

Wow, wow and wow, definately on my buy list. An epic model indeed!

[alois]

Well, after the responses of the designer I think he's sincere. And who am I to judge him? After all, this is something you can't defend yourself against. However, I still find that the similarities are large enough to have a discussion about it. And shouldn't the legal people at Lego have foreseen this?

Edited June 15, 2012 by alois