[MOC] Classic Porsche 911 1:10

[lnteknik]

Hello everyone, hope you are doing well.

I have recently re-visited a model which I started building years ago when I first dove in the world of lego technic. I have made some final adjustments and the model is now complete. It's my pleasure to share it here:
911S 2.4L from the 70's
- 1800+ parts
- 1:10 scale
- air-cooled flat six
- 4 speed manual gearbox (an adaptation of the gearbox found on @Charbel's Volcano supercar)
- working steering wheel
- independent rear suspension
- macpherson strut front suspension (courtesy of Gergely's Technic Models on Youtube)
- openable doors, bonnet, and engine cover

What do you think?

P.S.:This MOC shares ~70% of the parts with set 42096 - Porsche 911 RSR. And I have also make sure no blue pins are visible outside.
If you are interested, instruction is available here
And with the orange F150 fenders available, I'm thinking about building a Targa version too :) 

Edited June 26, 2021 by lnteknik
added more photos, instruction link

[Thirdwigg]

Very clean look. Great job.

[1gor]

Very clean look; is it possible to use another wheels; this one are too much "truck" like?

Forgot to mention 2.4 and 2.7 engines are the best 

Edited June 25, 2021 by I_Igor

[Gray Gear]

I have to agree, the bodywork looks very well made, but the wheels don't fit.

I was happy when I saw that you brick built the black stripe in the front, but then I saw the back... I hate stickers with a passion, so I think the rest of the stripe should be brickbuilt too.

 

Thx for sharing 

[Jurss]

For classic Porsche those wheels fit really well.

I'm impressed by front suspension setup. 

Could You show more pictures from front supension?

[1gor]

22 minutes ago, Jurss said:

For classic Porsche those wheels fit really well.

I'm impressed by front suspension setup. 

Could You show more pictures from front supension?

It should be very similar to this mini 959 by @sirslayer 

 

[syclone]

Great looking Porsche! A bit of a shame that the engine can't be seen in any way, but the detalisation is good. And that front suspension is really ingenious 

Would have to agree with Gray Gear in regards of the rear bumper, as for me it is a bit inconsistent when front archieved with parts, whereas rear is stickered. 

[lnteknik]

Thank you everyone for the kind words! I love your suggestions and I will consider some mods in the future :)

I have added some more photos for the chassis as well as the front suspension, kudos to Gergely who is the original creator of such an awesome setup.
 

14 hours ago, Gray Gear said:

I have to agree, the bodywork looks very well made, but the wheels don't fit.

15 hours ago, I_Igor said:

Very clean look; is it possible to use another wheels; this one are too much "truck" like?

Wheel-wise, the closest possible alternatives are 1989 batmobiles wheels. However, they do stick out about 1 stud at the rear and half a stud up front (pics below). Perhaps a Turbo S or RWB version can use those wheels :)
 

14 hours ago, Gray Gear said:

I was happy when I saw that you brick built the black stripe in the front, but then I saw the back... I hate stickers with a passion, so I think the rest of the stripe should be brickbuilt too.

 

12 hours ago, syclone said:

Would have to agree with Gray Gear in regards of the rear bumper, as for me it is a bit inconsistent when front archieved with parts, whereas rear is stickered. 

Rear bumper, yeah I think it's possible to not to use stickers and brick-build the bumper strips, I'll definitely do this for the Targa version.

[amorti]

That's a great job especially on the suspension.

I see caster angle, and Ackermann geometry, I think? That's awesome at this scale.

Also great for Lego - the tyres are in scale! These are 20mm wide, and original 911's came, apparently, with 205's.

@nicjasno - ICYMI, always interesting to hear your opinion on 'proper' suspensions.

Edited June 26, 2021 by amorti

[Igor1]

This MOC is incredibly cool and in my favorite scale! I like it a lot more than the recent 10295 set. I would also love to see the motorization of this MOC in the future, if possible.

Edited June 26, 2021 by Igor1

[nicjasno]

On 6/26/2021 at 10:04 AM, amorti said:

That's a great job especially on the suspension.

I see caster angle, and Ackermann geometry, I think? That's awesome at this scale.

Also great for Lego - the tyres are in scale! These are 20mm wide, and original 911's came, apparently, with 205's.

@nicjasno - ICYMI, always interesting to hear your opinion on 'proper' suspensions.

I really don't like the upper spring support with the offset balljoint. It makes the spring bend and basically jams it. There is not other way here ofc, but i still don't like it.

[Scoar Sonander]

On 6/26/2021 at 2:17 AM, lnteknik said:

 I'll definitely do this for the Targa version.


 

Ooh, looking forward to that! 

[gyenesvi]

Really nice use of panels on the bodywork, simple and quite clean results. I also like the front suspension, as it's something rare and more realistic, and I haven't seen it before at that scale. But was also wondering about how smoothly it actually works:

6 hours ago, nicjasno said:

It makes the spring bend and basically jams it.

Does this actually happen? In my experience, when the spring's two ends are supported from the opposite side (as is the case here), it can actually work smoothly without bending/jamming, as the two opposite forces at the two ends kind of balance each other I suspect (depending on the exact geometry). @lnteknik can you share your experience or maybe a short video of it working where it would be visible whether it bends or not?

[lnteknik]

On 6/26/2021 at 4:04 PM, amorti said:

That's a great job
the tyres are in scale! These are 20mm wide, and original 911's came, apparently, with 205's.

Thank you! Regarding the choice of tyres, yes indeed I pick those tyres mostly because of how well they fit the scale :) The only thing I don't like is the rim. If only I have the skills create 3D printed Fuchs rims haha

On 6/26/2021 at 4:24 PM, Igor1 said:

This MOC is incredibly cool and in my favorite scale! I like it a lot more than the recent 10295 set. I would also love to see the motorization of this MOC in the future, if possible.

Thank you! 10295 is also cool but imo, the bumpers are a bit chunky and I also prefer technic than creator. Motorization is very possible for this MOC. There is plenty of space for a servo/control+ motor behind the front axle and if the gearbox and backseats are removed, a battery pack and 2 motors can fit there. I'll consider doing so in the future,

13 hours ago, Scoar Sonander said:

Ooh, looking forward to that! 

Thanks! Stay tuned :)

7 hours ago, gyenesvi said:

Really nice use of panels on the bodywork, simple and quite clean results. I also like the front suspension, as it's something rare and more realistic, and I haven't seen it before at that scale. But was also wondering about how smoothly it actually works

Thank you for the kind words. Yes, the front suspension is really unique and all credit to the original designer. I do think it's pretty awesome so I have incorporated it in my MOC.

 

13 hours ago, nicjasno said:

I really don't like the upper spring support with the offset balljoint. It makes the spring bend and basically jams it. There is not other way here ofc, but i still don't like it.

 

7 hours ago, gyenesvi said:

Does this actually happen? In my experience, when the spring's two ends are supported from the opposite side (as is the case here), it can actually work smoothly without bending/jamming, as the two opposite forces at the two ends kind of balance each other I suspect (depending on the exact geometry). @lnteknik can you share your experience or maybe a short video of it working where it would be visible whether it bends or not?

The suspension does work smoothly in my experience, no jamming so far. Using only soft springs but because of the positive caster angle, it can support the weight of the model well. I do have some footage of the suspension in action, will find time to upload it to youtube and share it here ofc << done!
 

 

Edited June 28, 2021 by lnteknik
embedded video

[nicjasno]

8 hours ago, gyenesvi said:

Does this actually happen? In my experience, when the spring's two ends are supported from the opposite side (as is the case here), it can actually work smoothly without bending/jamming, as the two opposite forces at the two ends kind of balance each other I suspect (depending on the exact geometry). @lnteknik can you share your experience or maybe a short video of it working where it would be visible whether it bends or not?

Here the upper part of the spring is being acted upon by a lever (the pin with ball joint) and the part is very soft, and likes to bend.

Edited June 28, 2021 by nicjasno

[gyenesvi]

2 hours ago, nicjasno said:

Here the upper part of the spring is being acted upon by a lever (the pin with ball joint) and the part is very soft, and likes to bend.

Yeah, but what I was trying to say is that the lower part is also being acted upon by sort of a lever (the pin that holds it from one side), and that puts an opposite direction force on the spring, which kind of cancels the upper one. Although the towball and a pin are not exactly symmetric, as the towball enables more freedom of movement, I didn't think about that. But on the video, it's behaving quite okay, maybe with harder springs it would be different. Anyway, could be an okay compromise..

[nicjasno]

1 hour ago, gyenesvi said:

Yeah, but what I was trying to say is that the lower part is also being acted upon by sort of a lever (the pin that holds it from one side), and that puts an opposite direction force on the spring, which kind of cancels the upper one. Although the towball and a pin are not exactly symmetric, as the towball enables more freedom of movement, I didn't think about that. But on the video, it's behaving quite okay, maybe with harder springs it would be different. Anyway, could be an okay compromise..

It totally does not work this way :P It does not matter what happens on the hub end. That part may be a one piece mold with the wheel bearing for the purpose of this conversation. The black part that slides is the soft part and that one will bend.

 

Edited June 28, 2021 by nicjasno

[Lipko]

According to my experience, even hard springs work okay if the piston end is attached with a pin (frictionless pin, so quite flimsy) and the housing part is properly braced. By far my smoothest suspension design had this mounting (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4oZYLFo1tbU).
Not sure about ball joints though, and yes, @gyenesvi is not quite right about opposite mounting cancelling effect. But my feeling (I haven't thought it through) is that opposite mounting is stronger than same-side mounting, as in the former case the soft part would bend like an "S", while in the latter it would bend like a "C". It's takes a bigger load to bend something to an S than a C because the bending radius is smaller (bigger deformation).
Or whatever, my diploma is only for decoration.

 

[Gray Gear]

I agree that the shock is being bent the way it is mounted here. And while I do not like it I don't think it will cause any issues in this case because it is only a soft shock absorber. It would be a different story for a hard shock absorber.

Edited June 28, 2021 by Gray Gear

[Bartybum]

But despite the lever nature of the mechanism, from the video it clearly shows that bending issues aren't really a problem. There's slight bending but it doesn't seem like anything major

Edited June 28, 2021 by Bartybum

[gyenesvi]

11 hours ago, nicjasno said:

It totally does not work this way :P

While I can easily understand this

11 hours ago, nicjasno said:

It does not matter what happens on the hub end.

I am not sure I understand what this means, can you elaborate? (just curious about the physics behind things). So I would say I am pretty sure that the way the hub end is mounted does matter in some way and changes things visibly, as

9 hours ago, Lipko said:

my feeling (I haven't thought it through) is that opposite mounting is stronger than same-side mounting, as in the former case the soft part would bend like an "S", while in the latter it would bend like a "C".

This is exactly what I have seen in my experiments, this may be a more precise way of expressing what I have vaguely described as forces kind of cancelling each other, thanks @Lipko. So I can accept that the forces don't really cancel, but in some way the bending is less serious (maybe they do partially? I don't know).

[Bartybum]

I can attest to this. For simple beams (in this case we can approximate it) it takes more force to buckle into the S mode shape than the C mode shape.

[Celeri]

Very good design! The model is instantly recognizable and the inherent limitations of technic seem very well managed there: I think anyone loving Porsche should like it!

The only 2 problems I can see are the choice of wheels which are much more "trucky" and the edge of the rear which seems a little too sharp – even for a classic Porsche.

Other than that, congrats!

[930 Turbo]

I wonder if you could rebuild this moc into a Carrera rs2.7. Widening the fenders cant be that hard, and then all you need to do is alter the color of the trim. You could also add a 5 speed gearbox I think possibly

Edited October 29, 2022 by 930 Turbo