[CADA] CADA General Discussion Topic

[gyenesvi]

37 minutes ago, T Lego said:

Now that the CaDa's parts catalogue is fully compliant with TLG's copyright, us designers can safely work with all parts in their current catalogue (and help innovate new parts!) without unwanted surprises like was the case during development of this set. Hence, the quality of the sets will only continue to go up, exciting stuff to come!

Interesting to hear about those copyright issues, can you (or others) explain a bit more in detail? Is it the case that TLG has copyright protection on certain parts only? Which ones, and any ideas why? Has the others already expired? Are parts protected in groups, for example the same type of part in all sizes?

Does CaDa also do copyright protection of the innovated parts?

[Lego Tom]

2 hours ago, T Lego said:

Now that the CaDa's parts catalogue is fully compliant with TLG's copyright, us designers can safely work with all parts in their current catalogue (and help innovate new parts!) without unwanted surprises like was the case during development of this set. Hence, the quality of the sets will only continue to go up, exciting stuff to come!

 

 

Now they need to work on their instructions. I just received the Hummer and the instructions are really bad! I'll do a review when I finish the build but I suspect the instructions will be the biggest negative.

[ExtranceIT]

9 hours ago, Lego Tom said:

Now they need to work on their instructions. I just received the Hummer and the instructions are really bad! I'll do a review when I finish the build but I suspect the instructions will be the biggest negative.

To be honest I never had that much trouble following CaDa instructions. Theirs are a bit more messy than TLG ones, but I also feel like the latter are sometimes too "dumb-proof", which is not a bad thing, but I wouldn't ask to CaDa (or any other third party brand) the same level of detail

[Davidz90]

10 hours ago, Lego Tom said:

Now they need to work on their instructions. I just received the Hummer and the instructions are really bad!

I have the CADA orrery. Instructions indeed had some minor issues. Specifically the order some pieces are added seemed a little random at times and not like a sensible person would do. As if the instruction creation was at least partially automated.

Edited April 10 by Davidz90

[T Lego]

12 hours ago, gyenesvi said:

Is it the case that TLG has copyright protection on certain parts only? Which ones, and any ideas why?

Correct. I see no logic/patern in why some parts have active patents and some haven't. The vast majority of the parts is not protected. As far as I'm aware of, in the technic catagory only a list of panels, some frames, rotary catch and these parts: , , , , , .

13 hours ago, gyenesvi said:

Does CaDa also do copyright protection of the innovated parts?

Yes, that is the plan.

 

 

[TeamThrifty]

12 hours ago, Lego Tom said:

Now they need to work on their instructions. I just received the Hummer and the instructions are really bad! I'll do a review when I finish the build but I suspect the instructions will be the biggest negative.

Their instructions are fine for adults.. TLG's are aimed at 7 yr olds and are tedious. Cada's made me think sometimes, but how's that a bad thing? If somethings a challenge it doesn't mean its a problem.... unless you're gen Z!

[Lego Tom]

1 minute ago, TeamThrifty said:

Their instructions are fine for adults.. TLG's are aimed at 7 yr olds and are tedious. Cada's made me think sometimes, but how's that a bad thing? If somethings a challenge it doesn't mean its a problem.... unless you're gen Z!

I would suggest you get your hands on the instructions for the Hummer and then come back and correct your statement.

[AVCampos]

As @kbalage said in one his reviews, LEGO sets tend to be directed towards a broader, more casual audience, while CaDa sets tend to be directed towards a narrower, more experienced audience.

[Lego Tom]

Look at the picture and tell me which parts are black and which are dark grey:

Here's a hint - there are NO GREY PARTS. So if you wasted time looking for them, too bad.

CaDA also removed all color after the item is assembled as show here:

Also note that the instructions read right to left instead of the left to right most of the world uses. For reference, here is what the assembled part looks like. Note how the greyed out picture removes several colored parts that could have been used for fast location.



Not deal breakers when it comes to recommending the set, just things that CaDA could have done much better on.

 

 

Edited April 10 by Lego Tom

[TeamThrifty]

2 hours ago, Lego Tom said:

I would suggest you get your hands on the instructions for the Hummer and then come back and correct your statement.

'correct' in this context is subjective and your use implies your opinion the only right one. 

Errors in instructions are one thing and are clearly a problem, but the moans that i've seen have been around difficulty to follow... i'm referencing the latter. I prefer difficult to the TLG one's. I've built 3 cada sets and not really had any problems, admittedly not the hummer. 

[williamyzfr1]

I should receive the CADA F1 Alfa Romeo tomorrow. In the Sales pictures it looks even nicer than the Lego F1 Mercedes that I have recently finished.

[Stephan]

12 hours ago, williamyzfr1 said:

I should receive the CADA F1 Alfa Romeo tomorrow. In the Sales pictures it looks even nicer than the Lego F1 Mercedes that I have recently finished.

The build is awesome. A bit strange if you are coming from LEGO. Some sections are/feel a bit forced, some a strangely attached and random pins continue to stick out in some places. Some pins are also very hard to insert due to them being able to be rotated. But the set looks amazing, even without the STAMPs applied.

My instruction manual has an error when installing the 2nd side pod. The arrow points to the wrong hole. But you'll find out :)

Edited April 11 by Stephan

[MarkyMark42]

13 hours ago, williamyzfr1 said:

I should receive the CADA F1 Alfa Romeo tomorrow. In the Sales pictures it looks even nicer than the Lego F1 Mercedes that I have recently finished.

The only downside is the stickers, they are not on the same level as Lego stickers.

Plus there are some which cover multiple panels which renders the set a once-off build unless you get another set of stickers

[Akassin]

The other day I finished building the C61507W Military Crane Truck  from M. Efferman. I would like to share with you my impressions of this set and the Cada brand in general. Of course, all comparisons will be with the Lego. I already had experience with Cada: a large set C61056W Goliath and a small set C61071W Tiger.
Why Cada at all? My last Lego set was the wonderful 42128. And after that the abyss came... Cars do not interest me, and the price of such flagships as 42146 is far beyond the amount that I am willing to pay for a construction set. Cada still maintains reasonable prices and regularly produces sets of heavy equipment. In addition, I like the style that combines of Technic and System elements.

So, about the set. The truck is impressive in size and number of functions. I immediately remembered my first set of Lego technic 42082. And later in my review I will make a comparison with this particular set. The use of system elements provides a cool appearance.
  Assembly is not tedious or very difficult. Those this set is even suitable as a gift for a teenager who already has experience assembling of technic sets. I discovered several new and interesting assembly methods (for example, I liked how the switches on the gearbox were made). The set is an excellent source of parts for the MOC: a huge number of gears and new double-sided liftarms of different sizes. Universal gray color. I think almost any type of truck can be built from it; there are enough panels even for a dump truck. 8 small actuators are enough to build a crane and there will still be some left for outriggers. In general, this is an excellent basis for creating your own MOCs.
The quality of the stickers is average. Print resolution is not very high quality + very small images. Because of this, it is very difficult to understand what is depicted on them. But in this set they are present only for the gearbox switches, so they do not affect the overall appearance of the model.

Now about the functions: not everything is clear here. Yes, their number is impressive. There is everything that is present in a real crane. But this comes with its own difficulties. And it seems to me that the main problem is in the very concept of this set: a crane that is initially controlled manually, but for which motorization is available (I purchased motorized version). This obliges the designer to create a complex gearbox. Of course, this is the essence of the Technic series, but in such a large model, the gearbox significantly increases the load. Because of this, significant downshifts have to be used. As a result, in manual mode, the winch (arguably the crane's main function) operates so slowly that it is difficult to even demonstrate the function, let alone play with it. Therefore, if you buy this model not only for a shelf, but to play with it, be sure to order a motorization kit.

Test results of the motorized version: 1) drives quite fast. The turning radius is good. Overall the handling is very comfortable for such a large model. 2) The outriggers fold out and extend quickly. update: the crane can lift itself using actuators (before this I thought it couldn’t). You just need to add additional stands to have enough height 3) The rotation of the upper platform is perhaps too fast. It would be possible to lower the gear by 2-3 times. It would be more realistic and easier to control. 4) The boom lift raises some questions. A slight cracking sound can be heard even when lifting the boom without additional weight (there was none in manual mode). Those, this is either gears slipping at high speeds, or a crackling sound inside the actuator itself. 5) Boom extension works perfectly even with additional weight. 6) The winch is VERY slow even in the motorized version. A load weighing approximately 130g is lifted without any extraneous sounds. With a load of 150g, a crackling sound of gears slipping in the gearbox began to appear. The 200g load was still lifting without the white safety gear tripping, but the cracking noise had gotten much worse and I didn't dare put more weight on it.
And here I would like to remember 42082 set. I didn’t think about it then, but it was designed very competently. In it, the motor and main gearbox for controlling the crane are located in the upper rotating part. Thanks to this, the mechanisms that require the most load do not go through many gears. In addition, all functions are protected by a white gear located immediately behind the motor, so when peak loads are reached, the mechanisms will not suffer.
To sum it up, I would like to see this Cada set be completely manual. With a simpler gearbox or with separate control for each function.

Now about the Cada brand in general. There will also be pros and cons here.
Pros: Overall the quality of the parts has improved (compared to a bulldozer kit from two years ago). In the last set, I had to try many times to connect the parts with different sides to get sufficient rigidity of the connection. In this set, all axles and pins connect well and predictably. The Cada has no molding points on the side of the beams or on the large panels, which is also a plus.
There were no problems with the instructions. And this despite the fact that the entire set is black and gray. The print quality is good, contrasting. Perhaps the instructions really lack some intermediate stages of testing functions. If you make some mistake and it is discovered at the very end, it will be almost impossible to find the reason in such a complex gearbox. For those who are just about to assemble this set, I strongly advise you to avoid any friction and squeezing of the gears by neighboring parts. After installing each gear, I used tweezers to adjust it so that it rotated freely. This significantly improves the quality of the gearbox.
Cons: 3 out of 7 red gears of the gearbox (LEGO art. number 18946) were defective. The diameter of the central hole was too small. As a result, they were put on the axle with great effort. And they didn’t even turn around. I think I can fix them with a file. But for now I just replaced them with lego parts from my stock.
I was very unpleasantly surprised by the hair in a sealed bag with pins. There were small shards of plastic in a couple of the parts bags. And there were some pretty bad scuff marks on a couple of the large panels. However, other parts from this package were in perfect condition.

Bottom line: I would rate this set a 7 out of 10. First of all, I expected a little more playability from this set. Especially from the motorized version. But the overly complex gearbox lets us down. It looks great on the shelf and this set will remain 100% assembled in my collection next to the Cada bulldozer (now the two of them are really looking forward to the excavator from Eric Trax). Thanks to designer M. Efferman for designing this set. I'm sure it wasn't easy.

Edited April 11 by Akassin

[Divitis]

Hi @Akassin, thanks for your detailed review, I've been growing more and more curious so that's been helpful.

One question: you rated the set a 7 out of 10. Would you rate the same a Lego set that came with three unusable gears and a few others damaged?

[Akassin]

36 minutes ago, Divitis said:

Hi @Akassin, thanks for your detailed review, I've been growing more and more curious so that's been helpful.

One question: you rated the set a 7 out of 10. Would you rate the same a Lego set that came with three unusable gears and a few others damaged?

I'm glad that the review was useful to you.
Of course my assessment is very subjective. Surely, for the level of quality to which we are accustomed when buying Lego, such defects would have a greater negative impact. As in all other aspects of our lives. When I bought my last used car, of course I didn’t pay attention to any nuances that would have outraged another buyer in a Ferrari showroom 
Likewise, the defective red gears did not leave a significant negative mark on me, because I simply put them aside and took others from a box containing 20 of the same ones. But for another person, for whom this would be the first set of Technic, this would become the main problem. Because he wouldn't be able to use any of the functions. And this would be a reason to return the purchase. And this would be a well-deserved rating of 0 out of 10. I don’t know how well the Cada service works in such cases. I have no experience communicating with them. If they work the same as Lego, then this is not a problem . When I took out my 42043 Arocs 3 years after purchase and its pump stopped working due to an air leak, I wrote to Lego support about it and they sent me a new one. They didn't ask for any proof/receipts/photos. They simply sent me a new one and wished me good impressions from using their products. I hope Cada will strive for this.

[msk6003]

4 hours ago, Akassin said:

3 out of 7 red gears of the gearbox (LEGO art. number 18946) were defective.

I also had same problem on mine. Seems like some burr is left on hole so I scratched it up using nipper.

[ExtranceIT]

3 hours ago, Akassin said:

I'm glad that the review was useful to you.
Of course my assessment is very subjective. Surely, for the level of quality to which we are accustomed when buying Lego, such defects would have a greater negative impact. As in all other aspects of our lives. When I bought my last used car, of course I didn’t pay attention to any nuances that would have outraged another buyer in a Ferrari showroom 
Likewise, the defective red gears did not leave a significant negative mark on me, because I simply put them aside and took others from a box containing 20 of the same ones. But for another person, for whom this would be the first set of Technic, this would become the main problem. Because he wouldn't be able to use any of the functions. And this would be a reason to return the purchase. And this would be a well-deserved rating of 0 out of 10. I don’t know how well the Cada service works in such cases. I have no experience communicating with them. If they work the same as Lego, then this is not a problem . When I took out my 42043 Arocs 3 years after purchase and its pump stopped working due to an air leak, I wrote to Lego support about it and they sent me a new one. They didn't ask for any proof/receipts/photos. They simply sent me a new one and wished me good impressions from using their products. I hope Cada will strive for this.

@Akassin regarding the customer service I got to experience how it works. I got the Alfa Romeo back in January, then accidentally broke one 15-long flip-flop beam (and I want to remark how I broke it, and to be honest I was an idiot, I stressed the piece so much cause I did a mistake and didn't want to disassemble a huge portion of the model, thus tried to fix it by bending pieces). I used their customer service, I had to attach a picture of my order (didn't matter where I bought it, simply a proof that I actually had the set) and the replacement part arrived in about a week from when I asked for a replacement. Inside the envelope (in cardboard) the piece came in a nice plastic bag with their logo on it (see flickr image, sorry for the dust, but it stayed on a shelf for about a month since I got it).
So for me at least their customer service was really good, considering also that their brand is much less famous than lego (thus many less sets are sold).

[williamyzfr1]

On 4/11/2024 at 7:56 AM, MarkyMark42 said:

The only downside is the stickers, they are not on the same level as Lego stickers.

Plus there are some which cover multiple panels which renders the set a once-off build unless you get another set of stickers

I have now finished the build and you are right the stickers are not on the same level. Ignoring the stickers that cover multiple bricks my biggest let down was the solid white stickers applied to black panels - They are semi transparent and after application look grey rather than white which detracts from the overall model.

Edited April 18 by williamyzfr1

[Lego Tom]

I finished the CaDA Hummer and here are my thoughts on this kit. Please note that these are my thoughts based upon my experience with this kit. The sole purpose in posting is to act as a reference for anyone considering purchasing this product.

The build is unlike anything I have done to date. You build the complete chassis first all the way to adding the tires and wheels, then assemble the body panels separately before piecing them together to then put onto the chassis. There’s nothing wrong with this manner of construction but if you do something wrong it may leave you wondering why things aren’t going together properly. Don’t make any mistakes and all will turn out fine. The build is complex with some steps presenting a test to your manual dexterity, but to CaDA’s credit, everything goes together well. The end result is a beast! The engineering on this is first rate and CaDA deserves high marks for both design and execution. Form, fit and function are on a par with anything available from LEGO, at a price that is much more palatable than recent LEGO products.

Packaging is in line with other recent CaDA master build products. Everything is contained in mostly numbered bags similar to LEGO. The kit comes in a very sturdy cardboard box with the parts bags divided into 5 attractive boxes within. The internal boxes are attractive in that they have an outline drawing of the completed product on the boxes themselves. Also, keeping in line with the other CaDA model I built, all the standard build pins are located in their own individual bags. I like this method, as the pins are separated and can be dumped into one bowl for each type rather than working through individual bags, each with their own supply. It’s a simple thing, but simple things often make the process flow better.
 

Another simple thing – most of the pins are black, so there are no blue or red eyesores. The 3L friction pins are black, the 2L axles are black, etc. Again, it is a minor thing but the end results is much better, in my opinion. As was noted in the review I did about the CaDA truck mounted military crane, there are some parts that CaDA made in two pieces vs LEGO’s one piece counterparts. This was probably done due to copyright concerns. The pieces still perform the same functions. While creative builders may be able to make use of the individual pieces, I couldn’t think of any real advantage to having the pieces literally split in half.

The most negative thing I have to say about the kit is what was touched on in earlier posts – the instruction manuals. Note the plural as there are 5 in total. In size, they are about the equivalent of 2 LEGO technic manuals, as each of the manuals are relatively thin. However, CaDA saves space by putting two, three or even four steps on a page where LEGO would typically use a full page for each step. While this good for the planet (saving paper), it also means the pictures are generally smaller and not as sharp as the LEGO counterpart. The instructions for this model also show the various part colors for the initial assemble process, but once the parts are assembled, the resulting assembly is done in grey. In most cases, this isn’t a problem but sometimes, especially on complex assemblies of which this model has many, keeping the colors visible greatly aids in the assembly process to quickly identify proper orientation. Additionally, the color of the pieces isn’t consistent with the actual parts, especially in the call out area for the pieces needed for that numbered step. In particular, black parts may be shown as black, or gray. Since there are gray parts in the kit, this can be confusing at times, especially when starting the build and encountering this discrepancy. Once you realize this, it’s not too bad but still disconcerting. In general, CaDA small pictures in the parts callout area are lacking in clarity and color consistency. Lastly, concerning the manual, sometimes the steps read right to left, top to bottom and other times, they read top to bottom, left to right – so pay attention!!!

Note actual assembly vs gray picture:

 

Note number sequence:

 

Someone mentioned CaDA’s stickers in another post, and the stickers in this kit are inferior as well. They feel thinner than LEGO’s, which isn’t bad, but the color is way off from the color it is being placed on.  They are so far off, I haven’t put them on, at least not yet. There are only 4 stickers in the kit, which given it’s a military vehicle, is kind of odd. Not that military vehicles have a lot of writing on them, but they do have some for identification purposes.

Like other CaDA products, this one can be built using manual or motorized options, and can be motorized at a later date after they build. This is a really great option as it allows the user to buy the kit at a lower price if they aren’t interested in motorizing the model. Nor does adding the motors later on require major revision of the model to add the motor(s) and power supply. Again to CaDA’s credit, the power supply has a self-contained rechargeable battery supply that uses any standard USB wall wart. CaDA is way ahead of the curve on this! Included in the kit is 5 motors, a rechargeable power source and controller. I was annoyed however that the connections on the motors and hub CaDA sent me did not match those shown in the instructions. The drawing shows the new USB type plug in connections while the set I received had the older LEGO style connectors. Figuring out how to hook everything up wasn’t rocket science but could leave the uninitiated builder scratching his/her head. On top of that, CaDA’s website will not let you request replacement parts for the drive system, no matter which style you receive. The automated page steps you through the process where you have to up load a picture of your receipt and also requires the set number. When you key in the set number, the site takes you a listing of all the parts in the set and you simply select the missing/damaged part(s). The problem here is none of the motorizing parts are listed. Even if you key in the number for the motorized set instead of the model set, it takes you to model parts with no motorized parts listed. Nor could I find a simple way – or any way for that matter to contact them and explain the issue.

Here are a list of the operating features:
Doors, hood and rear deck open and close.

Doors are spring loaded to stay shut.

Removable roof panel to insert rocket launcher/chain gun (both, traverse, launcher fires, gun barrels rotate).

Steerable front wheels.  

Locking front and rear differentials.

Four wheel drive.

Folding seat backs.

Working front mounted winch.

Operating pistons.

Motorized Functions:
Drive forward/reverse.

Steerable front wheels.

Selectable locking/open differentials.

Power front winch.

Traverse/operation of weapon.

Headlights

So that is my take on this model. In summation, it is a great model at a very acceptable price. Only experienced builders should buy it however as it goes beyond your standard build criteria.
 

 

 

EDIT: I forgot to mention that before purchasing, I had read in another review that the 12L axle connecting the front and rear drive was pretty flexible and a potential problem. The writer suggested either reinforcing the axle or replacing it with the CaDA carbon fiber piece. At $1.60, It's a bit pricey but when you compare the two, there really is a huge difference in flexibility with the carbon fiber being much more rigid. Ordering it with the set saves the cost of shipping.  

Edited April 25 by Lego Tom

[nerdsforprez]

On 4/10/2024 at 8:42 AM, TeamThrifty said:

'correct' in this context is subjective and your use implies your opinion the only right one. 

Errors in instructions are one thing and are clearly a problem, but the moans that i've seen have been around difficulty to follow... i'm referencing the latter. I prefer difficult to the TLG one's. I've built 3 cada sets and not really had any problems, admittedly not the hummer. 

I agree here.  @Lego Tom I believe you are confusing preference with reality.  That is great to state your preference, but the reality is your preference is not one that all folks share.  I, along with @TeamThrifty, would prefer a non-color vomited set and more difficult instructions even if that means it is more difficult to assemble.  

Perhaps where some of the confusion lies is between folks differing ideas of how they enjoy the hobby. We use the terms "assemble" and "build" synonymously, when in reality they are not.   One really implies just following instructions, paint-by-numbers type of thing.  Deductive logic may be used on occasion, but no real inductive logic. 

Building is quite different.  If there is any paint-by-numbers going on, those numbers might mismatch or be a digit off here and there at times.  There is some mystery and mistic about how one arrives at the final product. Not only is deductive logic used, but inductive logic at times as well.  THere may be a few swear words, perhaps even tears, but if the final destination is arrived at the joy is typically more delectable, because of work and toil was so much greater to get there.  

Folks hobby different.  There is no right or wrong way.  Although it is tempting to think of "the former is for average people and the latter is for smart people" that is not necessarily the case.  Perhaps one's job is full of "building", inductive logic, etc. and "hobbying" simply means a beer, good music, and a simple assembly job to relax.  I feel that is what Lego is for.  Nothing is wrong with that.  But RELAXing is the operative phrase here.  All your doing is assembling.  Kinda like Ikea Furniture.  As a company, their job is to make the instructions as easy as possible.  Take all the guess work out of the equation.  True building on the other hand, while enjoyable, many times is NOT RELAXing at all.  There is lots of guess work.  Almost like you are solving a mystery.  And there is a place in "hobbying" for that as well.  In the US in the last couple of years we are seeing a burgeoning of what are called "escape rooms" where one is to solve a bunch of riddles to escape a physical space they are locked into.  The process is supposed to be hard.  Its supposed to stump you a bit.  But that is the fun.  Don't go on a Friday night after a 60 hour work week and your fried - you'll hate it.  But when you are well-rested, and ready for a challenge - they are great.  

Edited April 23 by nerdsforprez

[nerdsforprez]

On 4/11/2024 at 5:39 AM, Akassin said:

But the overly complex gearbox lets us down

I queried about this in the past.  Perhaps it needs its own thread.  I certainly should test my own theory.  But in really complex gear boxes, I wonder if we should start seriously considering using lubrication to reduce friction.  I know folks use like a silicone spray when using applications where there is a high RPM, but perhaps we should consider using it also in low RPM functions but with high friction.  Real machines do.  Cats, cranes, dozers, any heavy machinery of low RPM/high friction application uses some form of lubrication.  It would be tedious to lubricate each part, but really you would only have to lub functional items (axles, gears, etc.).  Interesting to give it a test....

[Lego Tom]

 

@nerdsforprez The thing is, people who want a more difficult assembly can rip out pages of the instructions or just ignore them altogether. The rest of us dummies depend on them.

 

[TeamThrifty]

On 4/22/2024 at 12:31 PM, nerdsforprez said:

Almost like you are solving a mystery.

Worded far better than i could - but i'm a developer so its not my skillset! I loved the comparison of assembly vs building, but what struck home was the quote above. I love moc's most of all, its 99% of my lego time and that quote sums up moc-ing perfectly, its a puzzle to solve. Its big fat 3d jigsaw with complex mechanisms and its all a mystery at the start, thats what pulls me back year after year, the challenge and the mystery.

[kingiswide]

On 4/21/2024 at 8:43 PM, Lego Tom said:

So that is my take on this model. In summation, it is a great model at a very acceptable price. Only experienced builders should buy it however as it goes beyond your standard build criteria.

Really appreciated your in-deepth review on this HUMVEE tech set, pros & cons. That's a very constructive to make the brick world better (hope the C-company team could read your comments and make improvements in the future)! 

Edited April 24 by Milan
Removed quoted post.