[CADA] CADA General Discussion Topic

[LvdH]

Nice review. The custom parts and the prints look really good. LEGO usually leaves a small gap on each of the sides but it's nice to see CaDA doesn't do that, especially for the AMG print in the front. I hope to see more licensed sets from them in the future, if that means we get the same treatment with special parts.
I can't really get behind the new panels myself. I much prefer the straight edged ones from LEGO. But I do see the advantages in some cages, like the fuel tank of the Suzuki motorcycle CaDA recently unveiled.

Btw: in my experience the knob gears create a ton of friction which is probably why you never see them in drivetrains. I wouldn't really use that as an alternative myself.

Edited September 15, 2023 by LvdH

[amorti]

22 minutes ago, LvdH said:

LEGO usually leaves a small gap on each of the sides but it's nice to see CaDA doesn't do that, especially for the AMG print in the front. 

 Btw: in my experience the knob gears create a ton of friction which is probably why you never see them in drivetrains. I wouldn't really use that as an alternative myself.

I reckon the tiles have been assembled on a brick or base plate, and printed as a group. The alignment is really perfect.

In the bug fix video I do mention that the knob gears add friction, however I don't see another solution in this case. The pullback motor requires a lot of torque to wind it up, but more to the point once it stops you pit the stalling torque of two of CaDA's high power L-motors against that one gear pair. Between them the motors are stronger than an XL motor and will beat whatever bevel pair you could use. Even if you manage to wedge a bevel frame in there for perfect alignment and add a bunch of bracing, they'll eventually just bend the teeth. Anyway, most of the time they are just idling, so I'm less worried about the friction.

That said - I'd love to be proven wrong :)

Edited September 15, 2023 by amorti

[astyanax]

Any thoughts on how the choice between 2WD and 4WD affects accelerating and top speed?

[amorti]

9 minutes ago, astyanax said:

Any thoughts on how the choice between 2WD and 4WD affects accelerating and top speed?

I plan to do a driving video outside this weekend. I'll put a phone with a GPS speedometer app in the car, and top-speed run it in both configurations right after a full charge. It's not going to be very scientific but I reckon if I run a battery through it in each configuration, I'll have a fair idea how long the battery lasts, as well as what the achieved top speed will be. Not sure how to measure acceleration at these kinds of speeds? It's not like I have a trap to measure time between two points, and anyway we all know the time will mostly depend on which run had fewer steering corrections.

I'm not expecting a huge difference in top speed. The noticeable difference is going to be steering angle, which is really drastically reduced for 4WD. @brunojj1 has specifically cautioned against running 4WD without the limited steering angle as it'll spit out the CV joints. I don't have enough spare CV joints to fact check the maestro, so I won't be testing that! Also, there is no central differential, the car weighs some 3kg and the tyres are very grippy, so it's definitely going to wind up the propshaft.

Edited September 15, 2023 by amorti

[brunojj1]

Here comes my presentation and a little of the background story:

 

If you like my creation, I recommend to order directly from CaDA and save 5% by giving me the tip.

If you're in Europe and want to save customs & taxes, I recommend to order from the general importer Freakware.

Edited September 20, 2023 by brunojj1

[williamyzfr1]

Fantastic & congratulations its next level.

 

[amorti]

Great presentation, and really interesting details about the marketing cooperation. Thank you!

I'll also do a run time test in 2wd. Maybe I'll get a little less since it'll be outside on uneven ground.

I'm not sure about running laps for ten minutes in 4wd, seems like you'd get transmission wind up? 

Edited September 16, 2023 by amorti

[Bensch55]

@amorti maybe you could also do a run with the improved wheelhubs, just to see if you can achieve a measurable difference :)

[amorti]

Maybe one run as 4wd. Otherwise I'll be at it all afternoon 😅

[amorti]

On 9/15/2023 at 6:49 AM, R0Sch said:

Correct me if I'm wrong, but the extension over the battery box doesn't need to hang loose if you plug the motors in the first and third socket holes. At least this is what I understood from the video.

You're dead right - definitely better than hanging it loose 

 

[amorti]

I made a driving video.

Here you can find out about the battery life, and compare the speed in 2wd and 4wd, and with ball bearing rear hubs.

As expected the 4wd variant is a little slower, and as expected it steers much worse.

Unless you *really* need it to be 4wd like the real one (and won't drive it much), go with 2wd 

@Bensch55 - the ball bearing hubs are cool and I really like how you use one part universally for front and rear... but they don't fit on the front of this model. Even just on the rear though, they do let it go a little faster.

https://tf-engineering.at/wheelhub/ 

Edited September 17, 2023 by amorti

[brunojj1]

By popular demand and since we are in the Technic forum, here some theory behind the pullback motor. Obviously it has resistance only in one direction and spins free in the other. Its main purpose was to prevent the second motor from passively spinning while only the first is active in slow gear while driving forward. The secondary purpose is to play with spooling up and down for having a sort of "kers" or "launch control" function. Driving backward usually works slowly in first gear - you don´t need to go fast in reverse with a real car either - and here you can clearly see how the second motor is passively being rotated counterwise. If you push both buttons in reverse, you can move the car at decent speed, just until the pullback motor is being spooled up again. You don´t need to go far in reverse anyway, but most likely just for a small correction in the parking lot or to get back on track again .

I think both the AWD / 2WD options as well as the pullback motor idea can teach some small physics lessons. Reflect about boundaries of technology, how more or less efficiently it can be applied and where the differences are between small scale and real life.

[Alex Ilea]

This solution with the pullback motor is interesting to say the least, and I can see how it mimics the real car system. But I think it can be done way easier by having one L motor for 1 side of the diff and one XL for the other side (boost side). Concept it very simple, it doesn't need any "buildup" and, the XL motor, due to the higher internal gearing, wouldn't spin out when the main L is working. Even better, have one XL as the main drive and a buggy motor for boost (and a boost gauge in the cabin when the buggy is engaged would be cool). This double motor, double speed is a neat concept, especially for these hybrid systems.

Reference (check 1:22): 

 

[therealjustin]

I just discovered this incredible set while watching RacingBrick's recent video and my goodness @brunojj1 , you've captured the AMG ONE so beautifully!

[SNIPE]

Anyone have instructions yet? I cant find them online, maybe CADA has not made them yet

There is an improvment PDF file from bruno here: https://bricksafe.com/files/brunojj1/amg-one/C61503W-Additional Sheets.pdf

[Polarlicht]

I want to set so bad! But to me, all the RC components are useless and i will leave them out of the model, unless Cada makes a static version.

Yes i know they are needed for all sorts of functions and it probably won't work in a static version..., but most of these models are shelf queens and get driven once!

[brunojj1]

3 hours ago, SNIPE said:

Anyone have instructions yet? I cant find them online, maybe CADA has not made them yet

There is an improvment PDF file from bruno here: https://bricksafe.com/files/brunojj1/amg-one/C61503W-Additional Sheets.pdf

I'm afraid they won't be available from CaDA as a download too soon. The improvement sheet is meant for the byers of the set. Most of the corrections are subliminal, not worth to bother. There is only 1 substantial improvement where a plug on the distributor should be moved to the outer hub to make the battery button accessible from above: 

1 hour ago, Polarlicht said:

I want to set so bad! But to me, all the RC components are useless and i will leave them out of the model, unless Cada makes a static version.

Yes i know they are needed for all sorts of functions and it probably won't work in a static version..., but most of these models are shelf queens and get driven once!

Sorry to disappoint you, but my models usually are not designed to be static. If to look at it from a different POV - you are getting a bunch of RC components which exceed the Pro Power Pack (worth around 80 bucks) :

[Maaboo the Witch]

Ooh, red engine pistons! They haven't been used since 1997.

[MarkyMark42]

On 9/23/2023 at 7:06 PM, brunojj1 said:

I'm afraid they won't be available from CaDA as a download too soon. The improvement sheet is meant for the byers of the set. Most of the corrections are subliminal, not worth to bother. There is only 1 substantial improvement where a plug on the distributor should be moved to the outer hub to make the battery button accessible from above: 

@brunojj1 do these supplementary instructions solve the bug fixes amorti mentions? As I haven't watched his video yet

[brunojj1]

1 hour ago, MarkyMark42 said:

@brunojj1 do these supplementary instructions solve the bug fixes amorti mentions? As I haven't watched his video yet

There is nothing to solve for the mainstream user who will not even bother. The "bugs" mentioned by Aaron represent his subjective opinion and the "fixes" suggested are his own solutions to them (which I endorse). Of course they are helpful to consider, so you should definitely watch his video before or while assembling your model and improve it to your preferences . 

[Sokolov Edward]

On 9/23/2023 at 12:06 PM, brunojj1 said:

I'm afraid they won't be available from CaDA as a download too soon.

CADA removed the instructions for the LaFerrari C61505 from its website without explanation. IMHO, in this regard, the likelihood of instructions for the next supercars appearing is very questionable.

[amorti]

On 9/24/2023 at 1:58 PM, brunojj1 said:

There is nothing to solve for the mainstream user who will not even bother. The "bugs" mentioned by Aaron represent his subjective opinion and the "fixes" suggested are his own solutions to them (which I endorse). Of course they are helpful to consider, so you should definitely watch his video before or while assembling your model and improve it to your preferences . 

I agree! Mostly they're either small bugs, tips, or matters of preference.

The only real bug IMHO is the bevel gears. But even here, if you simply don't push forward on the drive motor and *simultaneously* back on the charge motor, it'll never be noticed. Even if you do press both simultaneously but release the drive motor before the moment in which the pullback locks up and the system stalls, you'd probably be fine. Mind you, even once will damage the teeth and then it's game over. In my imagination this wasn't found in testing because it's a cruel thing to do to the system, and the testers weren't so unkind!

[brunojj1]

30 minutes ago, amorti said:

The only real bug IMHO is the bevel gears. But even here, if you simply don't push forward on the drive motor and *simultaneously* back on the charge motor, it'll never be noticed. Even if you do press both simultaneously but release the drive motor before the moment in which the pullback locks up and the system stalls, you'd probably be fine. Mind you, even once will damage the teeth and then it's game over. In my imagination this wasn't found in testing because it's a cruel thing to do to the system, and the testers weren't so unkind!

I'm having 2 cars assembled on my shelves, both built with 100% original CaDA parts and according the original instructions in the set. I have tested them one more time 5 minutes ago. I swear nothing is grinding in the "useless" mode (1. forward / 2. backward) in my both cars! 

Of course I believe what you say and there is nothing wrong with testing in the early stage when the car is not completely assembled, prior the chassis has reached the final sturdiness. So your point is justified anyway because we kids should play and improve our "legos" builds at any time of the day .

Edited September 25, 2023 by brunojj1
legos w/o "R"

[amorti]

For it to happen, the car needs to be completed to its full weight, and on its wheels. If the car is upside down, there's no weight holding the differential still so when the pullback locks the force can easily escape in that direction. That's what I'm replicating in the video by jamming a piece against the diff to lock it.

Or maybe I really am just unlucky or excessively cruel? IDK anymore!

Edited September 25, 2023 by amorti

[brunojj1]

10 minutes ago, amorti said:

For it to happen, the car needs to be completed to its full weight, and on its wheels. If the car is upside down, there's no weight holding the differential still so when the pullback locks the force can easily escape in that direction. That's what I'm replicating in the video by jamming a piece against the diff to lock it.

Or maybe I really am just unlucky or excessively cruel? IDK anymore!

No problem, you´ve done your proper research and offered the solution ! The reason I haven't used the knob gears in the design from the beginning is that I have that unpleasant memory from long time ago when they got deformed in a similar heavy duty application. Though it happened when I used a double XL motor setup where the torque is even stronger. Your solution is unreservedly recommended!

Btw. did you ever see a Lego designer being open for critics / willing to discuss the flaws in his model ? (Except talking with and about people with the "chinese bad" attitude)