Ninja Castle Subtheme return potential

[Fulcrumfan91]

Any chance of Lego revisiting the Castle Ninja theme and making new sets based on that theme? Nostalgia is strong with me for that theme and would love to see new sets based on that theme in particular, not Ninjago.

[Murdoch17]

13 minutes ago, Fulcrumfan91 said:

Any chance of Lego revisiting the Castle Ninja theme and making new sets based on that theme? Nostalgia is strong with me for that theme and would love to see new sets based on that theme in particular, not Ninjago.

As long as Ninjago is around, not a chance. Also, Castle themes don't seem to be selling very well anymore, whereas Ninjago is evergreen at this point.

[Classic_Spaceman]

10 hours ago, Fulcrumfan91 said:

Any chance of Lego revisiting the Castle Ninja theme and making new sets based on that theme? 

Short answer: No 

Long answer: 

10 hours ago, Murdoch17 said:

As long as Ninjago is around, not a chance. Also, Castle themes don't seem to be selling very well anymore, whereas Ninjago is evergreen at this point.

 

[TeriXeri]

Ninjago minifigs are pretty easy to convert to some sort of Ninja Castle factions when you get bored of using the minifigs as characters, the main team of characters colors remained quite consistent over the years.

Like if you have multiple Kai figures, maybe some swapping heads, would turn it into a red ninja faction etc.

 

Edited April 2, 2023 by TeriXeri

[LegoAUT]

7 hours ago, TeriXeri said:

Ninjago minifigs are pretty easy to convert to some sort of Ninja Castle factions when you get bored of using the minifigs as characters, the main team of characters colors remained quite consistent over the years.

Like if you have multiple Kai figures, maybe some swapping heads, would turn it into a red ninja faction etc.

 

With zero historical accuracy, yes.

[TeriXeri]

5 hours ago, LegoAUT said:

With zero historical accuracy, yes.

I don't think flying ninja with dragon wings or giant eagle kites were accurate in the theme in the first place.

Other then that, I agree the original Ninja theme overall did have a nice balance between faction flags, horses, and lots of strongholds/hideouts.

 

Edited April 2, 2023 by TeriXeri

[Lion King]

Everyone here knows that Ninjago is an evergreen theme. But dont’ get me wrong…I wold LOVE to grab a traditional Japanese castle with proper ninjas (not with crazy weapons and vehicles). I’m a huge fan of Japanese culture myself and I always want to have one wiht some historical features.  We have Lion Knights’ Castle and soon we will have a medieval village set.  We have Galazy Explorer.  So I dont’t hink we would need a subtheme. A very sets would do better. 

On 4/1/2023 at 9:59 AM, Murdoch17 said:

As long as Ninjago is around, not a chance. Also, Castle themes don't seem to be selling very well anymore, whereas Ninjago is evergreen at this point.

We don’t need a subtheme. Only a few sets. 

[Murdoch17]

55 minutes ago, Lion King said:

Everyone here knows that Ninjago is an evergreen theme. But dont’ get me wrong…I wold LOVE to grab a traditional Japanese castle with proper ninjas (not with crazy weapons and vehicles). I’m a huge fan of Japanese culture myself and I always want to have one wiht some historical features.  We have Lion Knights’ Castle and soon we will have a medieval village set.  We have Galazy Explorer.  So I dont’t hink we would need a subtheme. A very sets would do better. 

We don’t need a subtheme. Only a few sets. 

The issue with that is Classic Space, Classic Castle, and Classic Pirates are just that, classic - they are the originals, nothing was before them. Ninja is a later subtheme of Castle from a time when Lego was doing badly. Very badly. As a side note, Ninjago CORE has several temple / castle sets that might fit the bill somewhat: 71767 (Ninja Dojo Temple) and 71787 (Creative Ninja Brick Box) are can work, if you remove the vehicles and / or snake-people.

 

EDIT: I forgot about 70670 Monastery of Spinjitzu as well, from 2019 Legacy. Just add two more walls as I did to make an proper octagon.

Edited April 3, 2023 by Murdoch17

[MAB]

There are loads of ninja figures available on bricklink.

When it comes to architecture,  Ninjago does a better job than the old Ninja subtheme.

[Aanchir]

On 4/2/2023 at 9:38 AM, TeriXeri said:

I don't think flying ninja with dragon wings or giant eagle kites were accurate in the theme in the first place.

I mean, while Ninja didn't REALLY fly around on hang-glider-sized kites, those ARE a part of traditional ninja legends and folklore. Likewise, real ninja would've disguised themselves as ordinary people, rather than dressing in kabuki stagehand garb — and they certainly wouldn't advertise their allegiance with color-coded outfits!

In these regards, the Ninja theme is much like the Pirates theme, or even the Castle theme's Forestmen, Dragon Masters, and Fright Knights factions — drawing heavily from fictional portrayals in folklore, literature, theater, and film, not just from "true" history.
 

All in all, even ignoring the Ninjago factor, I think others are right that we're not anywhere near as likely to get 90s Ninja throwback sets as we are to get more traditional Castle, Space, or Pirates ones. Some of these late 90s themes/subthemes like Ninja and Wild West might be really iconic to those of us who grew up with them (myself included!), but they were short-lived, and came out at a time when a lot of the AFOL "old guard" was becoming disillusioned with the company's newer offerings.

By contrast, the longer lifespans of the Castle, Space, and Pirates themes has given them a lot of nostalgic appeal among multiple generations of AFOLs. I may not have grown up with Lion Knights, Black Falcons, Forest People, Classic Space, or Blacktron sets specifically (at least outside of stuff my folks obtained secondhand from yard sales or online auctions) — but I DID grow up enjoying LEGO Castle and LEGO Space on a more general level.

It is possible that LEGO might eventually branch out and start making throwback sets based on short-lived late 90s themes/subthemes like these. But I don't see it being a high priority for them currently — not when there are so many other possibilities for throwback sets still on the table.

[Lion King]

Look, you are right about Ninjago stuff but I just don’t care about that fact. Sure, Ninjago has amazing buildings and has a load of minifigure parts. But..I just wish tha Lego wold do a standalone set that pas tribute to the 90s theme Ninja.  

[Lion King]

I see some “classic” lego sets making their comeback, such as Eldorado, the rumored black spaceship, Medieval Town Square, 

sI do think that Ninja (Castle subtheme) could have its own Icons standalone set with some improvement from Ninjago and most recent Japanese sets (such as Tranquill Gaden, Himeji Castle). 

[Breakspear]

 

On 2/12/2024 at 1:08 PM, Lion King said:

I see some “classic” lego sets making their comeback, such as Eldorado, the rumored black spaceship, Medieval Town Square, 

sI do think that Ninja (Castle subtheme) could have its own Icons standalone set with some improvement from Ninjago and most recent Japanese sets (such as Tranquill Gaden, Himeji Castle). 

i think you're right. A one-off Icons set is very possible - either as a revival of a past Lego IP (as was done with the Viking Village), or though licensing some a popular film, tv show or video game.

However it happens, I'd love Lego to give us more traditional samurai/japan inspired minifigures then just the occasional CMF.

[Black Falcon]

I don´t see them doing that with Ninjago around honestly. It is not impossible but still very unlikely I think.

[Lion King]

8 hours ago, Breakspear said:

 

i think you're right. A one-off Icons set is very possible - either as a revival of a past Lego IP (as was done with the Viking Village), or though licensing some a popular film, tv show or video game.

However it happens, I'd love Lego to give us more traditional samurai/japan inspired minifigures then just the occasional CMF.

Exactly, one-off set based on tv show, movie or video game would be perfect. Revisiting a classic subtheme would be nice but we have Ninjago sets on shelves. Still, it’s not impossible.

I would love to collect traditiaon Japanese characters with highly detailed prints, such as printed samurai’s armors, ninja’s uniform etc. 

[MAB]

5 hours ago, Lion King said:

Exactly, one-off set based on tv show, movie or video game would be perfect. Revisiting a classic subtheme would be nice but we have Ninjago sets on shelves. Still, it’s not impossible.

 

I cannot see how an ICONS set based on a TV show, movie or video game could be seen as anything close to a return to the Ninja theme. That is like saying SW is a return to Classic Space or LOTR or Harry Potter is a return to Castle. If they did a licensed ninja based set, it would be a licensed ninja based set and not the old Castle Ninja subtheme.

The recent reimagined sets have all been classic sets from classic themes. I cannot really think of anything in the Ninja theme that would have a similar status.

 

[Kit Figsto]

16 minutes ago, MAB said:

The recent reimagined sets have all been classic sets from classic themes. I cannot really think of anything in the Ninja theme that would have a similar status.

Agree.  I think really the only sets that have a chance of getting full-on Icons remakes are the well-known Castle/Pirates/Space stuff (probably not Town just because a remake would essentially be a modern City set) and then maybe some of the late 90s fan-favorite themes like Adventurers.  But when it comes to the Castle/Pirates/Space, it's definitely going to skew heavily towards the well-known subthemes, like Dragon Knights or Blacktron.  We're not going to get a reboot of UFO or Imperial Armada or Ninja, IMO.  The most obscure subthemes that I can see even potentially being remade as an would be Ice Planet 2002 or Wolfpack, and both would probably be small GWP-sized models, not a full $200 Icons set.

[TeriXeri]

6 minutes ago, Kit Figsto said:

Agree.  I think really the only sets that have a chance of getting full-on Icons remakes are the well-known Castle/Pirates/Space stuff (probably not Town just because a remake would essentially be a modern City set) and then maybe some of the late 90s fan-favorite themes like Adventurers.  But when it comes to the Castle/Pirates/Space, it's definitely going to skew heavily towards the well-known subthemes, like Dragon Knights or Blacktron.  We're not going to get a reboot of UFO or Imperial Armada or Ninja, IMO.  The most obscure subthemes that I can see even potentially being remade as an would be Ice Planet 2002 or Wolfpack, and both would probably be small GWP-sized models, not a full $200 Icons set.

Yeah, or perhaps a ninja 3-in-1 ninja castle at most, since those old Ninja buiilds were quite basic to begin with. 

I mean  Vikings were remade via 3-in-1 and then IDEAS, not icons at all.

Viking ship retired, I think 3-in-1 Castle is retiring after this year as well, so perhaps some new classic theme's turn is up for 2025 for a 3-in-1 set.

Altho, Ninja would be a whole lot more similar to Ninjago, while the closest to Vikings would be the recent Thor Goat Boat (marvel / licensed)

Edited February 13 by TeriXeri

[Lion King]

I’m not going to lie but i feel that it’s such disheartens when you (MAB, Black Falcon and Kit) express your negative opinion toward Ninja (Castle subtheme).  I competely understand that there is Ninjago. Ninjao is not exaclty what I’m looking for. It does have a “classic’ vibe at all. 

I prefer traditaionl Japanese castle with ninjas, samurai, shogun and citizens. I feel that Ninja subtheme (along with Vikings and other old themes) are oerwhelemd by Big Three (Castle, Pirates and Space). 

Let’s face Castle, Pirates and Space had several subthemes that ran short.  Wolfgang and Dragon Knights subthemes lasted for a few years.  Ninja is one of Castle subthemes. 

It’s really nice to see Vikings receiving revival treatment - 3-in-1 and IDEAS sets. Adventurers heroes showing up in Modular Buidling (Dr. Kirby), IDeas (Pippins) and City’s Jungle subtheme (Johnny Thunder).  

Sorry but it’s such heartless or disheartening-y of you.  It’s just pointless now, so whatever. 

Edited February 13 by Lion King

[Black Falcon]

2 hours ago, Lion King said:

I’m not going to lie but i feel that it’s such disheartens when you (MAB, Black Falcon and Kit) express your negative opinion toward Ninja (Castle subtheme).

Noone here expressed a negative opinion about the theme, but a set beeing released for it is just very unlikely because of the reasons mentioned. Sure the classic Ninjas are very different from Ninjago but I still don´t think Lego would do a Set that is competing with its own theme even if both have a very different aproach.

2 hours ago, Lion King said:

Wolfgang and Dragon Knights subthemes lasted for a few years.

Wolfpack got three sets and that was it - though they also appeared in other sets but even then it´s just 6 Sets in total they appear which were released from 1992-1993, so they were actually around just a short time compared to the Forestment for instance but still they are one of the most famous factions I think.

5 hours ago, Kit Figsto said:

The most obscure subthemes that I can see even potentially being remade as an would be Ice Planet 2002 or Wolfpack, and both would probably be small GWP-sized models, not a full $200 Icons set.

Why are those themes obscure to you? Wolfpack just got a minifigure in the new Medieval Town Square so at least a GWP including them sounds very likely to me actually.

[Kit Figsto]

28 minutes ago, Black Falcon said:

Why are those themes obscure to you? Wolfpack just got a minifigure in the new Medieval Town Square so at least a GWP including them sounds very likely to me actually.

I suppose obscure isn’t the right word…maybe just “smallest” or “subthemes with the shortest run” would be more apt in this case.  Wolfpack technically only got 3 sets, if I recall correctly, and while I think it has far outlasted what most people would expect from a 3 set subtheme, I don’t know if it’s as well-known as, say, Forestmen or Black Falcons or Lion Knights.  Either way, I don’t think Wolfpack or Ice Planet are necessarily “obscure”, but more that I can’t see many themes that are smaller/less known than those being rebooted in a major capacity (other than, say, an Easter Egg in a set or possibly a CMF).

 

5 hours ago, TeriXeri said:

Yeah, or perhaps a ninja 3-in-1 ninja castle at most, since those old Ninja buiilds were quite basic to begin with. 

I mean  Vikings were remade via 3-in-1 and then IDEAS, not icons at all.

Viking ship retired, I think 3-in-1 Castle is retiring after this year as well, so perhaps some new classic theme's turn is up for 2025 for a 3-in-1 set.

Altho, Ninja would be a whole lot more similar to Ninjago, while the closest to Vikings would be the recent Thor Goat Boat (marvel / licensed)

This is true, a Ninja fortress/padoga would make a good Creator 3-in-1, but I think the trouble there is that it’s kind of similar to Ninjago.  Even if the builds aren’t directly the same, you have to look big picture and think that most consumers will see “LEGO set with Ninjas” and equate the two.  

[jodawill]

I wouldn't be surprised if they released a ninja Icons set, but I'm afraid they'd use one of the ridiculous Ninjago hoods since they don't make the originals anymore. Very often recently, Lego has tried to bring stuff back in such a half hearted way, I wish they would have just not even attempted at all. There are some themes that just shouldn't be revived unless they're willing to invest money on parts.

However, if they just brought back the old hood, I think the rest of this theme could be done well with existing parts. Would it sell? I have no idea. Maybe it would be better if they started incorporating some classic ninja elements into the Ninjago sets. That theme started out very well in my opinion, but it quickly devolved into - whatever you would call what it is today. The first wave in that theme had some really cool sets with lots of great parts. I was very excited when it was originally released.

[Lyichir]

8 hours ago, jodawill said:

I wouldn't be surprised if they released a ninja Icons set, but I'm afraid they'd use one of the ridiculous Ninjago hoods since they don't make the originals anymore. Very often recently, Lego has tried to bring stuff back in such a half hearted way, I wish they would have just not even attempted at all. There are some themes that just shouldn't be revived unless they're willing to invest money on parts.

However, if they just brought back the old hood, I think the rest of this theme could be done well with existing parts. Would it sell? I have no idea. Maybe it would be better if they started incorporating some classic ninja elements into the Ninjago sets. That theme started out very well in my opinion, but it quickly devolved into - whatever you would call what it is today. The first wave in that theme had some really cool sets with lots of great parts. I was very excited when it was originally released.

I fail to see how bringing back the old hoods would be ideal... yes, they're authentic, but they're also very dated and limiting (among other things, the classic ninja hood prevents the head from turning and the fixed clip on the back is less versatile than a solution that allows for alternate weapons or accessories). There's been a huge number of Ninjago hoods since then, and I'm sure at least one of those could evoke the classic hooded look especially if molded in monochrome plastic.

Then again that gets to the crux of why I think an Icons revival of the classic ninja theme would be unlikely. The Ninja theme came out during a period of weaker Lego set design overall. It was novel for a company that had only started to branch out from European subject matter, sure, but the builds were blocky and simplified, and there's very little about them overall that Ninjago hasn't done better in the intervening years (with the sole exception is Ninjago has never had horses, which I'd love to see the theme include at some point). Ninjago does have a broad focus so obviously not all sets fit that historical Japanese aesthetic, but that's not to say no Ninjago sets do so—there's been various temple or dojo sets that fit the bill over the years.

[Breakspear]

On 2/14/2024 at 4:48 AM, MAB said:

I cannot see how an ICONS set based on a TV show, movie or video game could be seen as anything close to a return to the Ninja theme. That is like saying SW is a return to Classic Space or LOTR or Harry Potter is a return to Castle. If they did a licensed ninja based set, it would be a licensed ninja based set and not the old Castle Ninja subtheme.

You're right - I got carried away in my earlier comment and ended up conflating 'return of Lego Ninja sub-theme' with my desire to see more samurai-inspired sets in general. The latter can be achieved through licensed sets, the former, not so much. 

Putting discussions of licensing aside, I think there are two three possible avenues for a limited revival of the Ninja theme:

1.  a fan designed, non-licensed, IDEAS a set (like the Medieval Blacksmith, or the Viking Village)
2.  LEGO notices that the Viking Village is enjoying strong sales and decides to develop more ICON sets for other famous warrior cultures, of which the Japanese Samurai would be a strong contender. In doing so, it might choose to draw on its own Ninja-IP as part of the development of the set
3. Lego decides to make some Samurai/ninja inspired Creator 3-in-1 sets, which include references the Ninja sub-theme  (as per TeriXeri's idea above).

 

On 2/14/2024 at 4:48 AM, MAB said:

The recent reimagined sets have all been classic sets from classic themes. I cannot really think of anything in the Ninja theme that would have a similar status.

On 2/14/2024 at 5:07 AM, Kit Figsto said:

Agree.  I think really the only sets that have a chance of getting full-on Icons remakes are the well-known Castle/Pirates/Space stuff (probably not Town just because a remake would essentially be a modern City set) and then maybe some of the late 90s fan-favorite themes like Adventurers.  But when it comes to the Castle/Pirates/Space, it's definitely going to skew heavily towards the well-known subthemes, like Dragon Knights or Blacktron.  We're not going to get a reboot of UFO or Imperial Armada or Ninja, IMO.  The most obscure subthemes that I can see even potentially being remade as an would be Ice Planet 2002 or Wolfpack, and both would probably be small GWP-sized models, not a full $200 Icons set.

I agree, as a Castle-sub theme, Ninja has an extremely very low profile (unlike say - Wolfpack), and lacks sets of sufficiently 'classic' status to justify a modern, nostalgia-fueled remake (e.g. like Eldorado Fortress). This is a major impediment. As such, i believe any future set would probably be marketed primarily on the global appeal of Japanese samurai/ninja imagery, rather than the appeal of the Ninja sub-theme itself. Again, I see parallels with the recent Viking Village set here.

 

On 2/14/2024 at 10:36 AM, Black Falcon said:

[...] Sure the classic Ninjas are very different from Ninjago but I still don´t think Lego would do a Set that is competing with its own theme even if both have a very different approach.

On 2/14/2024 at 11:10 AM, Kit Figsto said:

[...] I think the trouble there is that it’s kind of similar to Ninjago.  Even if the builds aren’t directly the same, you have to look big picture and think that most consumers will see “LEGO set with Ninjas” and equate the two.  

While these are fair points, I believe LEGO is becoming more adventurous in the regard. For example, LEGO will soon be offering medieval/fantasy sets across multiple themes simultaneously (Creator, ICONS (Castle/Vikings) Harry Potter, LoTR and soon, D&D). So never say never! 

 

8 hours ago, jodawill said:

I wouldn't be surprised if they released a ninja Icons set, but I'm afraid they'd use one of the ridiculous Ninjago hoods since they don't make the originals anymore. Very often recently, Lego has tried to bring stuff back in such a half hearted way, I wish they would have just not even attempted at all. There are some themes that just shouldn't be revived unless they're willing to invest money on parts.

However, if they just brought back the old hood, I think the rest of this theme could be done well with existing parts. Would it sell? I have no idea. Maybe it would be better if they started incorporating some classic ninja elements into the Ninjago sets. That theme started out very well in my opinion, but it quickly devolved into - whatever you would call what it is today. The first wave in that theme had some really cool sets with lots of great parts. I was very excited when it was originally released.

Good point re opportunity to deliver a new set using mostly existing parts - great way to keep costs down.

Regarding incorporating more classic Ninja elements into Ninjago - yeah that's certainly possible. The concept art from the early days of the theme drew more heavily on traditional Japanese style motifs. However, those influences have been less evident lately. Would love this to come back.

Edited February 15 by Breakspear

[Triceron]

I mean honestly, Ninja is kinda left in the dust and forgotten.  It's kind of up there with the Bull Knights or Knights Kingdom 2.  You're not gonna hear Lego putting in many Bull Knights references in new Castle themed sets, or bring out a Knights Kingdom 2 Icons set any time soon.