Updated motors comparison page

[Philo]

New update of my motor comparison page! Now includes Control+ Large and XL motors.

I am puzzled by the L/XL twins: their rotation speed and delivered power are so similar that I don't see the point of the more bulky XL version! Only the no-load current/efficiency of XL are better. Maybe XL has a better reliability at high torque?

 

[aol000xw]

Isn't the chart missing the new motors?

[suffocation]

29 minutes ago, aol000xw said:

Isn't the chart missing the new motors?

Huh? Ctrl+ Large & Ctrl+ XL aren't keyboard commands.

Anyway, thank you Philo!

[Zerobricks]

Seems new L and XL are more or less interchangeable. I see no sense in having 2 motors with 2 different form factor, yet same performance... I don't get it...

[pleegwat]

Haven't we previously also seen in X-rays that the new L and XL have near-identical internals?

[Philo]

1 hour ago, aol000xw said:

Isn't the chart missing the new motors? 

I had a few missing images, but AFAIK no chart is missing?

37 minutes ago, Zerobricks said:

Seems new L and XL are more or less interchangeable. I see no sense in having 2 motors with 2 different form factor, yet same performance... I don't get it...

I don't either... This was partly the reson for this belated update: verification because I didn't believe what I measured!

6 minutes ago, pleegwat said:

Haven't we previously also seen in X-rays that the new L and XL have near-identical internals? 

No, its PFS vs. C+ that have very similar motor cores.

[aol000xw]

I meant in the last image, the power bar chart, I see the old PF-XL for example but not the Control+ XL

[Philo]

15 minutes ago, aol000xw said:

meant in the last image, the power bar chart, I see the old PF-XL for example but not the Control+ XL

Mmhhhh... I see what you mean. I sometimes have server side cache issues. Try http://www.philohome.com/motors/motorcomp.htm, it works here.

[johnnym]

3 hours ago, Zerobricks said:

Seems new L and XL are more or less interchangeable. I see no sense in having 2 motors with 2 different form factor, yet same performance... I don't get it...

 

3 hours ago, Philo said:

I don't either... This was partly the reson for this belated update: verification because I didn't believe what I measured!

Did anybody confirm that the new XL motor can be also used for steering like the new L motor?

[9v system]

i would love to see some internal photos of these new motors, it looks like the XL has the same cheap internal motor with the extremely thin brushes which causes them to break easily

 

[kbalage]

That's interesting, I measured approximately 15% more torque with the PU XL motor compared to the L one which is quite similar to the difference between the PF variants geared to the same speed (although I'm sure my tests were far less accurate than Philo's tests).

About the naming - looking forward to see what the official name of the motors will be once they'll be sold separately, I still think Control+ is only the name of the Technic app so technically these should be Powered Up L and XL motors.

2 hours ago, johnnym said:

Did anybody confirm that the new XL motor can be also used for steering like the new L motor?

XL has the same absolute encoder so it can be also used for steering, at least with the BrickController 2 app for now :) 

[sirslayer]

How about the Medium size motors??  These Powered up motors are also don't make any since!! The one without the encoder is small and haves a lighter weight but the performance is bad if you compared it to the other M motor with the encoder. The one with the encoder seems to have performance very similar to my PF based Large motor !!!!  

https://flic.kr/p/2hx4qar

 

Lego technic Control + motors by victormendoza_jr, on Flickr

 

 

Edited October 19, 2019 by sirslayer

[Philo]

10 hours ago, kbalage said:

About the naming - looking forward to see what the official name of the motors will be once they'll be sold separately, I still think Control+ is only the name of the Technic app so technically these should be Powered Up L and XL motors.

Yeah, naming is a mess. Now add to this WeDo, Boost and Spike Prime, all based on compatible hardware... Looks like indeed Powered Up is now the name of that range of devices, but I kept C+ for the Technic style motors.

6 hours ago, sirslayer said:

The one without the encoder is small and haves a lighter weight but the performance is bad if you compared it to the other M motor with the encoder. The one with the encoder seems to have performance very similar to my PF based Large motor !!!!  

According to my measurements, simple M motor delivers 1.1W, version with encoder (Boost external motor) provides only 0.8W, but the PF large motor gives 2.2W!

[Jonas]

Good work, Philo.

Does anybody know how is the encoder connected to the output wires? Can we just read binary values on one or two wires to count pulses and get the relative position?

[Philo]

39 minutes ago, Jonas said:

Good work, Philo.

Does anybody know how is the encoder connected to the output wires? Can we just read binary values on one or two wires to count pulses and get the relative position?

Thanks ;)

No you can't count pulses, encoder data is returned as a 115200bps serial stream. See http://philohome.com/wedo2reverse/protocol.htm

Edited October 19, 2019 by Philo

[Jonas]

Thank you, Philo, for the fast response.

[shadow_elenter]

Very interesting, thank you Philio

[jorgeopesi]

Very useful thank you Philo.