Trial by Jury - Day 3

[mediumsnowman]

DAY 3

Dusk fell as Alan Andrews (KotZ) returned from a long day of deliberation in the courthouse. 

"I hope this trial gets over soon so I can get back to my trees... I love trees. They're really the only ones that understand me."

He was approached by a dark figure.

"What can I do for you, stranger?"

The shadow replied only with a blast from his shotgun.

The shadow smiled grimly as Alan slumped forward.

"Sorry Alan, but it looks like you've chopped your last tree."

Elsewhere, Harry Oldman (fhomess) looked for somewhere to refill his dwindling supply of booze.

"Dez said his shop should be somewhere around here..."

A dark figure emerged from an alleyway, and Harry turned to face him.

"You know where I can find Mr. Hunter's legitimate storefront enterprise? I've been looking every-"

He was interrupted with a shotgun shell that narrowly missed him, shattering his bottle instead.

"Hey-!"

The second shot found its mark, bringing the story of the grizzled vet to a grizzly end as his blood mixed with shards of broken glass on the cold sidewalk.

Morning came and the judge addressed the remaining jurors.

"Gentlemen and women of the jury, I have some terrible news. Two of our own, Mr. Oldman and Mr. Andrews, were found dead last night. The police are investigating their deaths as homicides, and urge anyone with information to come forward. A thorough examination of their bodies has lent us some important information, however - Mr. Oldman was a loyal member of the Town. Even more troubling is our results on Mr. Andrews. He was affiliated with neither the town nor Sleaze's crew, but rather their rival the Moletti Crime Family. Make of that what you will, but it may have serious repercussions for the rest of our trial. Please, bring the chief and I whatever monster is responsible for the deaths of these men. You are dismissed."

 

Host (1)

 

Neil Justuss, played by mediumsnowman - Judge, Jury and Executioner

NPC's (2)

Chase McCain, NPC - Police Chief

Sleaze Ballagio, NPC - Crime Boss

Jurors (10)

Amanda Callahan, played by Khscarymovie4 - Cheerleader

Brock Martin, played by Tariq j - Radio Host

Clifford Schauer, played by LegoMonorailFan - Mailman

Dez Hunter, played by Forresto - Businessman

Gary Johnson, played by Kintober - Mine Foreman

Jared Hartman, played by Kwatchi - Software Developer

Stephanie Diaz, played by Lady K - College Student

Tina Hooper, played by Umbra-Manis - Receptionist

Tony, played by jluck - Chef

Anthony Dodson, played by Actor Builder - Athlete

Dismissed (4)

Cathy Bridger, played by Drunknok - Fell ill day 1, replaced by Jimmy Hessler (Steamdemon) - Alignment Unknown

Jimmy Hessler, played by Steamdemon - Committed suicide Day 2, replaced by Anthony Dodson (Actor Builder) - Alignment Unknown

Alan Andrews, played by KotZ - Killed Night 2 - Moletti Crime Family

Harry Oldman, played by fhomess - Killed Night 2 - Innocent Townsfolk

 

Note: For failing to post in thread or place a vote yesterday, Tina Hooper (Umbra-Manis) will receive 3x penalty votes when voting opens. 

 

Rules:

1. Each player will be given a character to play, who will be aligned with either the TOWN or the MAFIA. To win the game, the TOWN must kill off all the MAFIA members, while the MAFIA needs to outnumber the TOWN and/or any other factions. Third-Party (neutral) characters and/or factions will have their own win conditions as outlined in their roles.

2. Each day you will be able to vote to lynch a player. Voting should be done in the following format; Vote: Character (Player). Similarly, unvoting is to be done in the format; Unvote: Character (Player). No other format will be accepted. A majority vote is required to lynch. You must submit a vote each day.

3. A game day will last approximately 72 hours. You may not vote in the first 24 hours. After the day has concluded, a night stage will commence, which will last a maximum of 48 hours. Night actions must be sent to the host in the first 24 hours of the night stage.

4. The alignment of lynched players, as well as those that died during the night, will be revealed at the beginning of the following day.

5. You may not quote or pretend to quote anything sent to or from you in PM with the game host, or in PM with any other players. This includes all the details of your character and role, as well as any night action results. Role claims and reporting of night action results are acceptable, but in your own words only. Do not attempt to use the structure of your role PM to your advantage.

6. Do not play the game outside the thread. Similarly, do not post out of character inside the thread; you must always play the role given to you. Game tactics and roles may only be discussed in the game thread or via PM with other players. Private discussion is done at your own risk and should be treated as part of the game.

7. If you are dead, you may not post in thread or discuss the game with any of the players. Any information you had becomes void, and may not be passed on.

8. You may not edit your posts, unless you are me. Your host often makes typos and will be compelled to correct them.

9. You must post in every day thread.

10. There probably aren't clues in the pictures or flavor text, but wild speculation is encouraged. It's fun. 

11. If you encounter a problem or have a question, please contact the host via PM.

12. Violation of the above rules will result in a vote penalty of half the required majority against you on your first and second offense, and the death of your character on your third offense. Violation of rule 7 will have a heavier penalty, including suspension, made at the discretion of the Games Moderator.

Edited February 1, 2018 by mediumsnowman

[Kwatchi]

((sip))

I'm not going to lie.  I'm, like, completely stunned right now.  Going to sleep on things, and try and pick a part the last two days and try to come up with a pattern.

((sip))

 

[Lady K]

Ok, didn't see that coming.  A completely different and rival crime family infiltrating us as well as the Ballagio crime family.   

And poor belegerant and gruff Mr. Oldman was indeed a loyal town jury member.  Time for some review of the past two days conversations and voting.

[Forresto]

Mr. Oldman...we may have squabbled but I am truly sorry to find you no longer with us. You were a loyal member of the town who deserved better.

Despite the obviously horrific manner in which we discovered them, I feel some vindication. As I tried to bring up yesterday there does appear to be a third faction at play here with the other crime family and last nights actions only proves that. 

[jluck]

Dang...well done judge, this really shakes things up!

Ok, so my immediate reactions: 

1) small jury, not much room for huge 3rd parties, so I can imagine there can be too many Mollatis in here.

2) 0 kills night 1 but 2 kills last night. I don’t know what to make of it.

[Kintobor]

Ho wow, okay, well, that was a weird turn of events. First no night kill on day one, and now it seems we have two rival mafia factions amongst us, and not just the Bellagios as we initially thought. 

It seems with Harry gone that removes him from a day three lynch, unfortunate and as sardonic as that may sound. If I'm being upfront, I find Tony and Jared the most suspicious people going into day 3, although we'll see where my thoughts go from here.

[Trekkie99]

Two mafia families?!!! Didn't see that coming. So who are we after now? Both families or just the Ballagios? 

[jluck]

On 1/18/2018 at 5:33 PM, fhomess said:

I'm going after you for the reasons I outlined above.  Why don't you reply to my actual concerns?  Yesterday, you said we learned a lot.  Today the "a lot" turns out to be that I had the most votes and was therefore the scummiest?  Seriously?

It also appears that both dead men went at each other a small bit yesterday. Harry wasn’t a big fan of Allen. 

Just now, LegoMonorailFan said:

Two mafia families?!!! Didn't see that coming. So who are we after now? Both families or just the Ballagios? 

Our job is still the same, stop the Ballagios. I assume the other family has/had a survival win condition or something of the sort. 

[Trekkie99]

Sorry I ever thought wrong of ya Harry. We'll kick their butts just yet!

[Khscarymovie4]

Well this is a T-W-I-S-T! Different one then the ones we do at cheer practice though. I think Mr. Andrews might have been a vig of some sort. i can't really see a game of this size having 2 different mafia fractions, and it would explain why we had two kills. I believe the late Mr. Oldman was killed last night by Alan, then Alan was killed by scum. I will definitely read up on things Alan and Gary said tomorrow and post what I think. Tonight I'm just tired. As for me not being as active I was sick for about 2 days, I was still checking to see what was going on but not posting. I will try to post more often now. I wish we had lynched Anthony yesterday as his former characters were scummy. 

[Actor Builder]

(Takes off Football Jersey)

whoa-ho-ho that's wild. A secondary mafia? I'm all up and intrigued over here.

I'ma sleep now and get reconvening tomorrow. 

[Tariq j]

Now this is interesting, two families we have to deal with. 

[Kwatchi]

7 hours ago, Khscarymovie4 said:

 I believe the late Mr. Oldman was killed last night by Alan, then Alan was killed by scum.

((sip))

I was, like, thinking along the same lines this morning over my morning joe. I have the beginnings of a theory anyway.

- Alan was likely killed by Balagio (as Moletti would not kill off one of their own).

-Oldman was killed by Moletti, Whether that be by Alan or a compatriot cannot be determined yet.  On day 2, he responded to Stephanie's assumption that there were 3-4 crime family members by saying he thought that was a little high.  I am going to take a leap of faith  and say he dropped a truth here and therefore make the assumption that there are/were only 1-2 Moletti in the jury.

 

So it is the why that I am still trying to figure out.  Alan consistently (in my view) tried to direct conversations towards refreshing inter-juror conflicts or lynches.  So Moletti's "win condition" may involve identifying and eliminating Balagio or it may involve taking over the jury themselves.  One consequence of the Oldman kill is that it could shift pressure to Actor-Builder from Jluck, or a new target that would have come to light today.

If we take Balagio's Alan kill, it could have been either a direct attack or to put pressure on Jluck from Actor-Builder today.

So the good news for us is that they are working at cross-purposes.  Whether they are protecting there own assets or not is a key question to look at it. (And I haven't even considered a double-bluff here tbh)

 

I'm no where near my vote yet unfortunately, other than my regular Stephanie one.  I hoping to carve out some time later today to see if I can identify someone who supported these moves in discussion.

((sip))

 

 

 

[jluck]

1 hour ago, Kwatchi said:

((sip))

I was, like, thinking along the same lines this morning over my morning joe. I have the beginnings of a theory anyway.

- Alan was likely killed by Balagio (as Moletti would not kill off one of their own).

-Oldman was killed by Moletti, Whether that be by Alan or a compatriot cannot be determined yet.  On day 2, he responded to Stephanie's assumption that there were 3-4 crime family members by saying he thought that was a little high.  I am going to take a leap of faith  and say he dropped a truth here and therefore make the assumption that there are/were only 1-2 Moletti in the jury.

 

So it is the why that I am still trying to figure out.  Alan consistently (in my view) tried to direct conversations towards refreshing inter-juror conflicts or lynches.  So Moletti's "win condition" may involve identifying and eliminating Balagio or it may involve taking over the jury themselves.  One consequence of the Oldman kill is that it could shift pressure to Actor-Builder from Jluck, or a new target that would have come to light today.

If we take Balagio's Alan kill, it could have been either a direct attack or to put pressure on Jluck from Actor-Builder today.

So the good news for us is that they are working at cross-purposes.  Whether they are protecting there own assets or not is a key question to look at it. (And I haven't even considered a double-bluff here tbh)

 

I'm no where near my vote yet unfortunately, other than my regular Stephanie one.  I hoping to carve out some time later today to see if I can identify someone who supported these moves in discussion.

((sip))

 

 

 

I'm curious if both families had a kill, it would really seem excessively stacked against the town if so. Kills could also have come from a Vig, SK, or a vengeful character. 

[Umbra-Manis]

Well this is quite the turn of events....

I'd also like to take a moment to apologize for sleeping through yesterday's deliberations and leaving everyone hanging. I accept my penalty votes and will be readily available for the rest of the trial.

 

[Kwatchi]

2 hours ago, jluck said:

I'm curious if both families had a kill, it would really seem excessively stacked against the town if so. Kills could also have come from a Vig, SK, or a vengeful character. 

((sip))

I think it would be safe to say that Moletti and a vigilante would be acting so similarly in practice as to be essentially synonymous in our case.  The big difference is the win condition and whether they are solo or teamed up.  If we don't experience anymore multi-death nights in the future, we'll have our answer regardless of what Andy was.

I can't speak to Serial Killer or Vengeful, as I don't have any practical knowledge on how they work.

((sip))

Sorry.  I made a typo.  Andy should be Alan (Kotz).

[Tariq j]

2 hours ago, jluck said:

I'm curious if both families had a kill, it would really seem excessively stacked against the town if so. Kills could also have come from a Vig, SK, or a vengeful character. 

I'm thinking at least one of the other two families would. If both families had a kill, plus if you consider the lynch, that could potentially take out a quarter of the players each night. 

[Umbra-Manis]

4 minutes ago, Tariq j said:

I'm thinking at least one of the other two families would. If both families had a kill, plus if you consider the lynch, that could potentially take out a quarter of the players each night. 

This seems excessively high in the kills for our game size. I think the odds are that the Moletti had to outlive the Bellagios, but I could see a limited number or every x number of nights option being used to give more kill options.

[Tariq j]

13 minutes ago, Kwatchi said:

((sip))

I think it would be safe to say that Moletti and a vigilante would be acting so similarly in practice as to be essentially synonymous in our case.  The big difference is the win condition and whether they are solo or teamed up.  If we don't experience anymore multi-death nights in the future, we'll have our answer regardless of what Andy was.

I can't speak to Serial Killer or Vengeful, as I don't have any practical knowledge on how they work.

((sip))

Well a Vig is town aligned so it's unlikely they'll be teamed up. But you're right in saying about the win condition. If the moletti family is another mafia group 

 then I imagine the win condition would be to kill all the other groups. A vengeful means if they get lynched they can choose a person to kill, since no one was lynched last night the kills jphere cant have been a vengeful but that doesn't rule one out of being in the game.

 

[Tariq j]

1 hour ago, Umbra-Manis said:

 but I could see a limited number or every x number of nights option being used to give more kill options.

That's possible, and it might even explain as to why there were no kills on the first day. One of the killers was blocked/target was protected and the other Mafia party can only kill on even nights.

[jluck]

48 minutes ago, Tariq j said:

That's possible, and it might even explain as to why there were no kills on the first day. One of the killers was blocked/target was protected and the other Mafia party can only kill on even nights.

My only problem with the blocking theory is that since there was no kill on night 1, then I'd assume the blocker targeted the same person again, but this time the kill went through. However, it's all speculation at this point and I don't know if it is beneficial to guess at in the long run.

[Lady K]

20 hours ago, Forresto said:

Mr. Oldman...we may have squabbled but I am truly sorry to find you no longer with us. You were a loyal member of the town who deserved better.

Despite the obviously horrific manner in which we discovered them, I feel some vindication. As I tried to bring up yesterday there does appear to be a third faction at play here with the other crime family and last nights actions only proves that. 

I would say you argued more than just squabbling, which implies little disagreements.  I did find where you suggested a third-party, which was curious at the time because we actually discussed a third-party on Day 1 and came to the conclusion that it was too early to tell; so that brings us to the question on why you brought it up Day 2 after no night one kills?   Were you not paying attention Day 1?

19 hours ago, jluck said:

It also appears that both dead men went at each other a small bit yesterday. Harry wasn’t a big fan of Allen. 

Our job is still the same, stop the Ballagios. I assume the other family has/had a survival win condition or something of the sort. 

Harry was also at odds with Dez as well.

 Harry voted for Alan before switching to Tony near the end of the day.

18 hours ago, Khscarymovie4 said:

Well this is a T-W-I-S-T! Different one then the ones we do at cheer practice though. I think Mr. Andrews might have been a vig of some sort. i can't really see a game of this size having 2 different mafia fractions, and it would explain why we had two kills. I believe the late Mr. Oldman was killed last night by Alan, then Alan was killed by scum. I will definitely read up on things Alan and Gary said tomorrow and post what I think. Tonight I'm just tired. As for me not being as active I was sick for about 2 days, I was still checking to see what was going on but not posting. I will try to post more often now. I wish we had lynched Anthony yesterday as his former characters were scummy. 

Why would you think Alan was a Vig? A Vig is aligned with the loyal town jury members.  It was told to us by the Judge the he was a member of the rival Moletti crime family.

If we had lynch Anthony and he turned up as loyal town then we would have lost two town members yesterday  Please elaborate on what you have found scummy about (Cathy/Jimmy) Anthony over the last two days?  

6 hours ago, Umbra-Manis said:

This seems excessively high in the kills for our game size. I think the odds are that the Moletti had to outlive the Bellagios, but I could see a limited number or every x number of nights option being used to give more kill options.

Interesting; although what you say make sense the way you say it seems like you have more knowledge of that than a loyal town jury member should. 

6 hours ago, Tariq j said:

Well a Vig is town aligned so it's unlikely they'll be teamed up. But you're right in saying about the win condition. If the moletti family is another mafia group 

 then I imagine the win condition would be to kill all the other groups. A vengeful means if they get lynched they can choose a person to kill, since no one was lynched last night the kills jphere cant have been a vengeful but that doesn't rule one out of being in the game.

 

Speculating on the win condition for a secondary mafia family doesn't help the loyal jury members find any other mafia crime family members whether they be Ballagio or Moletti.  And based on what the Judge told us it is more important for us to find all the Ballagio crime family members and hand them over.  

4 hours ago, Tariq j said:

That's possible, and it might even explain as to why there were no kills on the first day. One of the killers was blocked/target was protected and the other Mafia party can only kill on even nights.

This really seems like you know what you are talking about with detail....as insider information and I find this highly suspicious.

3 hours ago, jluck said:

My only problem with the blocking theory is that since there was no kill on night 1, then I'd assume the blocker targeted the same person again, but this time the kill went through. However, it's all speculation at this point and I don't know if it is beneficial to guess at in the long run.

It is all just speculation and it distracts the loyal jury from finding Ballagio crime family members. 

As for my own thoughts, Tony still stands at the top of my suspicious list.  However, after looking back through Day 1 and Day 2, as well as the voting for both day and the response so far today, I'll add Brock and Amanda to that list.

Why you ask?  

Brock seems to have detailed thoughts on the other mafia family (Moletti) win conditions and kill ability as if he were on the inside.   Also, I found it suspicious that he suggested that we should have had a Day 1 lynch but then failed to go for the Day 2 lynch of Tony; preferring to stay on the obvious bandwagon of Anthony which spilt the jury vote. 

Amanda didn't even bother to listen to the Judge about Alan being from the Moletti crime family and suggesting he was a vig of some sort.  She stated she wanted a lynch on Anthony yesterday due to the scummy behavior of the two jury members he replaced.  

Amanda, like Tony, was really pushing for a (Cathy/Jimmy) Anthony lynch for the last two days.  

Harry tried to point out the suspicious behavior of Dez, and Alan, and even questionable Clifford but no one wanted to listen to him and instead kept after the bandwagon setting upon (Cathy/Jimmy) Anthony.  Now with him gone we know he was town and Alan was from the Moletti crime family (not town).  So we need to look closer at the past conversations of both of these former jury members.

 

[Kintobor]

8 hours ago, Kwatchi said:

((sip))

I think it would be safe to say that Moletti and a vigilante would be acting so similarly in practice as to be essentially synonymous in our case.  The big difference is the win condition and whether they are solo or teamed up.  If we don't experience anymore multi-death nights in the future, we'll have our answer regardless of what Andy was.

I can't speak to Serial Killer or Vengeful, as I don't have any practical knowledge on how they work.

((sip))

Sorry.  I made a typo.  Andy should be Alan (Kotz).

If we have a vigilante they're going to be pro-town. 

Without a lynch for the past two days, the town's looking at a disadvantage. I find it odd that Harry of all people was axed off last night, as Harry's suspiciousness was brought up both day 1 and 2. 

I'm in agreement with Stephanie that Tony's the most suspicious person going, but I also find Jared highly suspicious. Your continual support for not having a lynch has led us down this path. We're at Day Three, and if you're still going to support not lynching someone, I'll overlook my suspicions of Tony to vote you out. Not wanting a lynch is to passively admit you don't want evidence for the town to analyze. 

[Lady K]

 

Ok, so here is the final vote count for Day 1 and Day 2:

Day1:

Final Vote Count:

 

4 votes for Harry Oldman (fhomess): Tariq j, LegoMonorailFan, Umbra-Manis, Forresto

3 votes for Clifford Schauer (LegoMonorailFan): KotZ, Drunknok, Lady K

3 votes for Cathy Bridger (Drunknok): jluck, Kintober, Khscarymovie4

1 vote for Stephanie Diaz (Lady K): Kwatchi

1 vote for Dez Hunter (Forresto): Fhomess

Nonvoting (0):

Day 2:

Final Vote Count:

5 votes for Anthony Dodson (Actor Builder): Khscarymovie4, Tariq j, jluck, KotZ, Forresto

5 votes for Tony (jluck): Lady K, Kintober, LegoMonorailFan, fhomess, Actor Builder

1 vote for Stephanie Diaz (Lady K): Kwatchi

Nonvoting (1):  Umbra-Manis

I have highlighted the votes for you to see of the deceased jury members.  Looking at who voted for who, we can see that Alan jumped on bandwagon each day for a rather newer jury member.  He voted in the middle area so as not to be noticed and never gave solid reasons for his votes.

Harry voted with reasons for who he felt strongest suspicion for.  On day two he did vote for Alan, but as the only vote and as the day played out he had a stronger suspicion of Tony.  Knowing we needed a lynch he switched his vote to Tony while mentioning that he would keep a watch on Alan.

Both Brock and Dez voted for Harry Day 1 and Anthony Day 2.  Essentially, bandwagons.

While both Amanda and Tony voted for Cathy Day 1 and Anthony Day 2 (same jury member spot as Anthony took over from Cathy and Jimmy).

I bring out these four specifically due to being previous jury members they know the importance of a lynch on Day 2.  Day 1 can go either way (lynch or no lynch); usually a loyal town gets lynched on Day 1; but Day 2 it is important to have the lynch and there is always a possibility of getting a scum on the second day's lynch.

On Day 2, a no lynch is a bad idea; and all four of them, in addition to Alan voted for Anthony (an easy target) and  thus effectively splitting the town vote for a second day of no lynch.  

So I question to Amanda, Brock, and Dez; what made Anthony so much more suspicious in your eyes than Tony that you were willing to spit the town and have a no lynch?

Also of record, Jared had voted for me two days in a row; indicating that in his mind I was the most suspicious.  

So I pose the same question to Jared:  Was a no lynch Day 2 worth keeping your vote on me (when you were the only one who voted me)?  Even Harry changed his vote to Tony from Alan because he saw the necessity of a Day 2 lynch.

A Day 2 lynch is in the best interest of the town.  

[Actor Builder]

(Takes off Shoulderpads)

I'm over here agreein' with whoever suggested that the Moletti's might have an every-other-night system in place for their killin'.

I've never been on a jury with more than one mafia family before, I don't think, so I'm not sure what all the possible options are for their winnin' conditions, but is it possible they're not actually anti-town?