Fuppylodders

Again, still waiting for you to say something relevant. Maybe today isn't the day for you. @danth See, that's helpful and relevant. And helps people in my position understand more. Learn a lesson from it, as I have. Thank you Williejm.

I'm not trying to pigeon hole, I'm literally trying to understand what you are now so I know what to refer to you as. As someone in the community, understanding terms or gender, uh, positions(?) it comes easy to you. For me, i see a rapidly evolving community with an ever increasing amount of definitions I can't keep up with. If I'm going to learn, I want to know fully, and not assume. *edit* I'm not trying to categorise or justify what to call people, I'm trying to understand. So I can break past my whatever it is and get with the times. If I understand something, my mind opens up like the pubs after lockdown.

See, here's the thing with that. All anyone sees is words. Way too many convoluted unnecessary excessive amount of words. Well, welcome to my difficulty (disability doubtfully counts). I was late learning to talk. By a few years. I even went to speech therapy to try help progress my talking and get it started. Eventually I did. But I was a late starter, couldn't keep up with others around me, so didn't talk much outside of being a happy bubbly quiet kid. Fast forward to now. I struggle to put things short, clear and concise. I don't like talking but when I do, I can't figure out how to translate it from my mind to my mouth/fingers properly. I can't remember basic words. I feel I need to express all that my mind is thinking about that specific point so I feel someone understands me. There's probably a much quicker way of saying that too, but here we are. I don't make a thing of it, people think I'm just waffling. To you and everyone else, yeah that's all you see. To me, i don't know how else to do it. My brain literally can't. That's how my brain is wired and I can't change it.

There at least appears to be some middle ground and agreeance here to be had too. For me, this is progress... @Danth At least I'm trying. If that's all you can do, well... You keep at it. Maybe someday something you say will be relevant.

"that's fair and I don't think anyone expects you to". Firstly, if its a fair situation, then it's not unreasonable. Secondly, I'm open to my mind being changed, and it has been, albeit slowly. I mean, I have no concern with gay/bi/transvestites/hermaphrodites, or many other people in that spectrum (not sure that's the right naming?) But, yes, they do expect me to. That's what all this is about, because I/we aren't. Bigot: "a person who is obstinately or unreasonably attached to a belief, opinion, or faction, especially one who is prejudiced against or antagonistic towards a person or people on the basis of their membership of a particular group. I am not prejudiced in any stretched against non cisgender people. I dislike all people equally. I also distrust people equally. Takes me ages to like and trust someone regardless of gender (all of my trust issues stem from cisgender people, so there you go). I'm not antagonistic. I don't wake up feeling like it's bash LGBTQ day. I don't walk around thinking 'Oo they look trans, I'ma go call him a name'. I don't randomly bump into one and go 'oh excuse me Mr he she or whatever you are'. I don't say things just to get a reaction. So how is it I'm a bigot? Or, is it your own made up definition? Like people nowadays using the word 'sick' to mean awesome instead of vomit? (something that grinds on me everytime I hear it). You telling me you went through your entire education without asking questions, putting forward hypothetical and real situations in order to ascertain a conclusion?? Yes there are times a teacher would ask one to 'shut up and listen!', but then you don't see how much I've listened because I'm not in a classroom with you. So you only see me asking the questions and hypothetical/real situations. So don't for one second assume everything is as you see it. Way to lower yourself to condescending. And you expect me to take you seriously and listen now? Good effort.

I cant control the level of emotions my mind feels. I don't control when my adrenaline kicks in (sure, that can *over time* be adjusted. I don't control what makes me sad. My mind does that through years and years of experiences and situations, my mind reacts automatically to things. Just as my mind figured these things out and attached feelings to them, gender is a construction defined by humans who created words to attach meanings and definitions to, which in turn, is attached to a feeling. Naturally, one ends up figuring out their own gender. Had society not played a part in my upbringing and therefore, swayed my mind on certain things to end up naturally accepting and attaching feelings and emotions to various things. Take a pair of twins. Give them the same upbringing. The same everything. They will still think differently on things. Why? Because our brains don't all think the same way right from birth. There is soooo much going on that affects our growth before we're even born but after conception. *edited in* How can 2 siblings who grew up with the same parents who had the same upbringing before school or nursery, be soooo different in personalities? Because our minds are immensely complex and different things that can think differently from birth. Society swayed my mind from an early and impressionable age, and my mind being what it is, challenges everything I'm told. I'm an over thinker. It's who I am. I wish I wasn't, it affects a hell of a lot of things I do. That means I question *everything*, and therefore, require something to seriously beyond all reasonable doubt, change my mind on every aspect before I freely give up my previous stance. Sure, I can change my mind kn some aspects and therefore freely give up some of my stance to bring me closer to giving up all of my stance, but it's how I think. I literally can't change the way my brain perceives things. Our eyes see. The world's image is actually upside down once our eyes gather the image at the back of them. It is our brains that flip it the right way up again. From birth, we actually see upside down. But we're too young to ever remember seeing upside down. A trial was done where people wore glasses that inverted what they saw. Over time, their mind ended up adapting to things being upside down like it was normal. They stopped wearing the glasses. Had to readjust all over again. Why couldn't they just do it instantly when they know what's what? https://www.google.co.uk/amp/s/amp.theguardian.com/education/2012/nov/12/improbable-research-seeing-upside-down

Bold response: No, I wouldn't be missing the point at any stretch of the imagination. Danth has now posted a second link to which he has misunderstood the fundamentals of the content disproving his intended meaning. While I'm getting told to 'read a book', Itd be nice if others also read to a full understanding the things being aimed at us. Yes, my situation *IS* being dismissed. Glossed over. Shoved to the side. Deemed irrelevant. Deemed a bigot view. Deemed idiotic. Its as close to like for like as it could possibly get. One day you might feel and believe to be a specific gender. The next month, you might have figured out you're a different one. The next month, you might feel you actually belong into an entirely different gender. I've been born to think differently. If I really wanted to, I guarantee I could find a different gender category that I fit into other than cisgender. But I couldn't care less. However, my mind now thinks a certain way. I explicitly can't change my thought process in the blink of an eye. If that truly was possible, rapists could be brainwashed to stop. Psychopaths could be brainwashed to be average (there's no normal nowadays). Cleptomaniacs could be told to stop stealing and they would in an instant. People who smoke could stop, because addiction is all in the mind. And controlled by the mind (which adversely affects the body over time). Not sure how in touch with the real world you are, but that shit doesn't happen. Underlined response: Please link where I've been offensive? I mean actually offensive. Not simply 'not pandering to your demands instantly because you demand I do as you say or I'm instantly a bigot and plague on this world' kind of thing. Italics response: You have to be joking.... You're literally coming across as the kind that finds offense in everything and anything, which just leads onto nerdforprez's point this is no longer about LGBTQIA+.

And I can throw that right back at you.

I'll tell you where the double standard is. LGBTQ have had bucket loads of time to figure out who they are and become who they want to be/feel they are, no switch flicking required. Me for example, essentially brainwashed due to society, and what society wanted me to believe for years, now has to 'instantly' flip my brain switch to think and do the opposite? My thought process is now natural to me. I'm now being *demanded* to change my natural thought process. I'm sorry but it's absolute ignorance to expect that to happen at your very whim. I'm not flat out refusing ever, I'm just saying give me time to work at flicking the switch *because it can't happen instantly* just because you demand it. That in ABSOLUTELY NO WAY makes me a bigot. For you to be throwing that word around to justify someone else's bigotry is also pathetic in itself. I wasn't insistently repeatedly disrespecting lira bricks or relentlessly bullying in absolutely *any* manner, so quit with the snowflakyness. I have genuine issues and concerns in my mind *because of society*, which has made me who I am. People can change and adapt easier if they can make it past those issues. To have my own mental issues dismissed and mocked in such a way is as much of being a bigot as one can get, the very type of person the LGBTQ community despise. So quit justifying bigotry from someone in the LGBTQ community or you're no different.

Am quoting because you've put it so much better than I could. Am simply trying to learn more, understand more, while providing a set background of current thought processes and legitimate concerns, while being dismissed and mocked... How is one supposed to become educated when the teacher doesn't want to teach but becomes the bully. And here I was thinking I was having a discussion with a mature adult. I guess someone slipped through the minimum age restriction... 'idiotic "counter argument" about toilets', is as much of a legitimate fact as you wanting people to cater to your gender desires. So all you've done is literally disprove all those LGBTQIA+ people claiming people in the LGBTQIA+ movement can't be bigots. Great effort there for your own movement

Naw it's cool. I've used that term often before, but outside of a LGBTQ+ context, which is why I also used it which may add some level of misconstruing my intended meaning, even though it appears to be of similar use, my use can be rewired, but not so straight forward as' undoing a screw, pulling a wire, popping it in another slot, doing other screw up' kinda thing... I can't just flip a switch and think differently. Trust me, if it was that simple and easy, I wouldn't have half the problems I do have. Appreciated, a lot more clearer now Appreciated I slept well, but damn, I still feel groggy as heck! You are also correct regarding your last 2 sentences

Wow, there's a LOT to reply to here! for those who hate wall of texts, you can skip this Certainly a lot of food for thought here, a lot to be learned, and also actually learned, and hopefully a bit more understanding for all sides (sides perhaps isn't the best term as it in itself is divisive when here is all about being inclusive! But I don't know a better choice of words, do feel free to help out there!) I'll state a big confusion I seem to be having which is making it really difficult to follow some things... Example, a LGBTQ+ person says ' this transgender man...... Are they a man now who was cisgender female? Are they pre-op cisgender female turning into a man, or pre-op cisgender man turning into a female, or post op male turned into a female or post op female turned into male? Or Cisgender male who became female by gender and no operation to change biology? Or cisgender female who didn't have op to biologically become male but identifies as male? My mind has become so blurred trying to keep up, I literally can't seem to figure this out now.... I really don't want to cause offense with this question, but I genuinely am struggling to understand because what I identify as male is now something else.... and can literally be any cisgender at any point in time of their transition or non transition.... It's cool, I brought it up, although, this thread here is my first real deep interaction with the whole LGBTQ+ context, so it's a news to me, but am open to being enlightened that it's not new to the situation. I certainly never knew about those of the Dominican Republican minority situation! That is extremely interesting, and certainly opens one's mind about this whole situation. You mention most species don't fall into male and female, but, we are talking about the human species, and human rights, human acceptance. Humans are a hell of a lot more complex to compare to other species (except primates, but I'm just not even going to go there), although I do understand the intent you meant. You mention brain wiring. I totally get that, and entirely agree. But brain wiring works in more ways than just regarding gender. It works in everything we do. Everything we believe in, the way we account for ourselves. It provides the strength behind our own individual ideologies. It provides our different levels of stubborn-ness. It provides us with individuality, some who's resolve is greater than others. It provides each individual with different levels of ability to *adjust, adapt, view objectively*. Some benefit from greater levels of it while others have minimal levels of it, if any. Just as you can't change your mind on your gender, I can't just 'change my mind' on something that has been a lifelong thought process that my mind has reasoned as 'the way life is because it's what society has dictated', accepted and, due to *society* has had impressed upon me when young and impressionable and at my most important stage of learning and adapting. Which makes it extremely difficult to suddenly change just because others are telling me it's not right, when it contradicts my entire upbringing. I'm old enough and have enough brain cells (sometimes!) to understand and accept LGBT+ have absolutely *every* right to be treated equally. The issue is, society has provided me with an upbringing that doesn't make it as straight forward as that. Might I add, absolutely everyone has had a very different upbringing, and therefore, has different experiences, which has provided differences in many aspects of our lives. So, to say you find it horrific if someone wanted to change someone's brain wiring... well, welcome to our world, where we're being forced to have our brain wiring changed at a late stage in our lives when we're already typically set in our ways in mind, and thought process and having to change what quintessentially, now comes natural to us. Civilised conversations such as this, most certainly does help, as it aids in enlightening. But please, while I understand your community has had a hell of a struggle on your hands (that shouldn't be a struggle but a freedom), understand, that some of us have our own struggle. Struggles internally with what has been one thing and now *must* be the other, or be called a bigot, when the initial thing was absolutely accepted and essentially brainwashed into us from a young age. Like I've said before, some of us are adapting quicker, others, taking a lot longer, but still adapting. Then, there are the vocal (can't really say minority as I've no idea on percentages) that entirely are bigots beyond all reasonable doubt. That absolutely makes sense. I mean, it wouldn't have to be just male jawline features, it could be female features too in some manner or form. I'm not stating an exhaustive list of 2 things, there are more possibilities, probably a lot more if more people threw down suggestions. But I do understand, that physical attributes are difficult to show with respect to the level of detail typically afforded to minifigs, unless kept to the stereotypes, which, I now understand more of why they're *potentially* damaging (although I kinda still feel it wouldn't be as bad, but, that's just how my mind is seeing it. I'm probably missing a lot of pieces of the puzzle to make a more informed thought process decision on that). I understand the situation of self identification, but, I feel that it brings difficulties that I'll get into later regarding the toilet situation and trans people. I also fully understand how the media scaremonger and sensationalise to make stories that essentially aren't typically true or are entirely misrepresented or clickbait. Covid has massively proved that. Naw it's cool, if I'm honest, I ended up having to skip dinner before bed and, ended up going to bed at 01:30am this morning because I spent actual hours typing my reply on my phone. Now I'm on my crappy laptop, but its ever so slightly more friendly for typing long paragraphs and reading long paragraphs to reply to which I'm hoping enables me to get to bed at a more decent time! I have no issue at all with you in any manner, and apologise if I came across harsh or, perceived your comments as harsh. I'm trying real hard to improve that, I have my own issues I'm trying to work through, anger clouding my judgement being a big part of it. It's ok if you don't reply, I've a feeling there will be plenty more other posts from other people to reply to! I understand that, except, almost the entirety of everything under that link promotes tolerance of intolerance, *unless* the intolerance leads to unequal rights or violence, abuse, murder etc. It almost feels that people have misunderstood everything in the paradox of intolerance and took one tiny snippet of it and purport that as the ultimate freedom to fight bigotry with bigotry without calling it bigotry. Just as much as white people can be racist, blacks aren't immune from being racist themselves neither. Just as much as LGBTQ+ people face bigotry on a big level, doesn't mean they are immune from being bigots themselves. The acceptable level of intolerance of intolerance is at a level that, a governing institution must intervene in order to bring equality to the foreground and as a baseline. *That* is the tone set by what you linked. For example, criminalising anything that promotes inequality or favouritism opposing LGBTQ+'s rights etc. It is most certainly *not* the freedom to be intolerant of others' disagreeing passive views. Sure, if their actions in any form are provoking violence, acts of abuse, exclusion, murder, unequal rights etc... By all means, intervene. But the paradox of tolerance most certainly does not promote the oppression/suppression of one view to enable another to exist. Both can exist simultaneously. It is only when one actively seeks to reduce the rights of the other, that intolerance must intervene to stop the intolerance forming inequality. I spent a lot of time reading the link, and that is exactly what the parody of tolerance (and the statements of the people referred to in that link) is referring to. Your comparison that 'violence is wrong, unless violence stops violence'... You have massively oversimplified it to suit your view. So, shooting someone in the back who is running away from you after punching you in the stomach is acceptable? After-all, violence to stop violence. Gouging someone's eyes out who is kicking you in the shins is acceptable? I mean, violence to stop violence. Now I'm exaggerating it. Yup, because it's a lot more complex and requires a reasonable level of violence, which, is deemed different in every country. I think I've made my point. Last I knew, Eddie Izzard was a transvestite, who identified as a he. This was years ago, before different genders and pronouns became a thing, I haven't honestly kept up with what he identifies as, I just enjoyed watching Eddie's stand-up comedy regardless of Eddie's gender. Eddie identifying as a she is entirely news to me. Please, can you stop comparing someone who supports the freedoms and equal rights of LGBTQ+'s to Nazi supporters simply because they're having their own internal struggles with adapting to LGBTQ+ being a norm when it hasn't been a norm nor socially acceptable for years in a stereotypical upbringing in certain communities/countries. The fact he is supporting and backing your equal rights-which is what you're fighting for, is exactly what the LGBTQ+ community wants, as it propagates the changes necessary (that shouldn't even be needed, but unfortunately, is) to promote equality and adds another number to the correct side. It's his own internal struggle/view but it most certainly isn't him being a bigot by any stretch. Regarding point #2. You have severely misunderstood the context in it's entirety for us straight people. While LGBTQ+ are now more comfortable in whatever gender you feel you naturally belong to/are, and therefore have no issue going to a public bathroom to what gender you identify as... For me, my entire life, toilets have been male or female. If a male walked into a female's toilets, that's it, you're a pervert. I sure as hell don't want to be labelled a pervert. I don't look left or right while I'm peeing. I pee, wash my hands, and go. If I saw a pre-op pulling up to aim, I'd literally freeze, feel uncomfortable and not know wtf to do, and then struggle to pee. Now you're affecting my ability to pee. Because I'm subconsciously scared of being labelled a pervert, I don't get to *choose* that mindset, it's been brainwashed into me through the ever changing society that I've grown up in where women need their own privacy and men are the largest sexual predators of women. Women are largely known 'not to fart' (I'm fully aware they do....But, as a matter of respect, it's deemed more rude/more frowned upon to pass wind in-front of a woman than a man). I don't even feel comfortable sharting into a toilet with men around. Let alone a female! now there's what once was a female, in my immediate vicinity that'll hear the thundering echoes of my logs doing the 10 meter dive within the space of half a foot. Now I'm going to have a painful time clenching holding it in or trying to pinch it through a hole the size of a needle to reduce the noise. You think I'm exaggerating? OK. You go and take off all your clothes, and walk around town in *just* a G string in public. Don't feel comfortable doing that? Why not? Because society brought you up to see that as unacceptable. But, our skin is natural. We all have skin. we all have bits of varying degrees between our legs. It's all nature gave us (or surgeons). So why does society deem our natural bare nakedness unacceptable to show in normal public? Because that's what *society* has *at this point in time* dictated. 150 years ago, showing an ankle was akin to showing cleavage. Nowadays, people (mostly females tbh) are wearing leggings that literally leave nothing to the imagination other than how much did the leggings cost. Society now dictates that is acceptable. Guarantee if I walked into a gym in tight leggings with my elephant trunk and coconuts blatantly shaped, I'd be told at some point that it's not acceptable gym attire. But for females, it is... Jason Derulo had his instagram pic taken down because it showed his candlestick in all its glory except for the tightest of shaped material around it. Why? Because currently, society dictates that unacceptable. The amount of times I've been at the gym doing cable fly's or sat on a bench during my rest period between sets just looking directly forward waiting for time to go by, and some girl comes along, uses the machine in front of me which is the leg spready one, or drops down and starts doing hip thrusts in my direct line of sight with a protruding cameltoe the size of a hotdog bun is beyond what I can count on my fingers and toes twice over. Yet damn if it makes me feel uncomfortable as fk because I don't want to be seen as staring and then called a pervert or called out for making them uncomfortable because they're in my direct line of sight, so now I have to make a conscious effort to look away because I'm fearful of what I might be perceived as, when I just want to do my bloody workout! Society has made me fearful. Because I'm cisgender male, and the stereotypes that go with it, and because I lack confidence around females. Irrationally so. If you've seen The Big Bang Theory. I'm literally like Raj and females. It's my nature. Women who have been sexually assaulted, feel a female public toilet as safe. They can have *SEVERE* mental issues with trust of the male gender. So for them to see any level of man can cause them serious mental harm/nervous breakdown/PTSD. Yet for you, it's soooo black and white that everyone should simply let non cisgendered people go in whatever toilet suits their gender. I'm sorry, but that's intolerance and absolutely inconsiderate/borderline bigotry. Find another solution. Male toilets, female toilets, other gender toilets. Everyone wins. (disabled get's their own, which encompasses all genders in itself as they're typically a one person private room). All you need to do is pee or poo. You get to do that comfortably, so does everyone else. Males are excluded from female and other gender toilets, females are excluded from male and other gender toilets, other gender toilets are excluded from male/female. If a man is not ashamed of being seen going into a male toilet designated for cisgender males, cisgender female is not ashamed for being seen going into a cisgender female toilet, why should a other gender feel ashamed of going into a cisgender toilet? The exclusion is equal across the board. Exclusion equality. He totally never said he doesn't want you to exist, nor denied your existence. He's simply not adapting as fully and fast as you demand. again, another level of intolerance and understanding when he is showing full *support*. Give him the freedom to have his struggles. Trans people don't NEED to convince him. But if you want equality, it's achieved by support. Support that you're throwing back in his face for simply having a different upbringing to you, that he didn't choose to have, but is a *fact of life*. You know, that thing called diversity.... Diversity includes people of different social backgrounds too, which inherently includes upbringing. You of all people given the struggles you face, should understand that. However, I feel the level of bigotry you have faced during your unimaginable struggles (I'm not saying that in a mocking tone at all, it's a genuine sentiment) has tainted your thought process to be more dismissive of people unless they literally change every part of their own mental existence to your own interpretation of LGBTQ+ support which is 'you're either fully with us, in absolute entirety, or you're absolutely the enemy, a humungous bigot equal to Nazis'.... Banning transgender people from womens bathrooms absolutely is NOT to make life harder for trans people. It's the slow process of doing what is best for society as a *whole*, taking *everyone* into consideration. I feel your viewpoint here is entirely skewed and misaligned again, because of the bigotry you have faced and feel anything that isn't with you, is absolutely against you. No apologies necessary, I understand it's probably like bashing your head against a brick wall. So, regarding the hidden text, that's something I never knew/considered. I, through my viewpoint of seeing the social transformation of the acceptance of LGBTQ throughout my years, only by immaturity of youth considered that. As I became older, and more aware of the diversity of people, had my own life experiences, learned what truly defines people, I knew that the contents of the hidden text in absolutely no way defines the community. Many straight people even more so nowadays engage in similar, and that in no way makes them appear less of a person, nor simply not a person. To me, it feels more like adding a demand just for the sake of it. If anything, to me, it feels more like I'm being dehumanising by drawing attention to the fact you're people too, when it's blatantly beyond all reasonable doubt and a mockery to consider otherwise. Similar to the whole issue of 'Black lives Matter too'. Those 3 letters.... what a whole shitstorm it created. Yet it's stating the obvious. That doesn't need to be stated. I think that is why I'm hesitant to ensure I absolutely every time, add the wording, because of that. Like, of course you are. But let's not detract from the main issue at hand. Regarding the intolerance situation, I feel I've already responded to that sufficiently to cover your post as well, in my response to Danth's. However, one point I will add... you are inserting your belief's into other's lives, by essentially demanding to be known by your pronoun if different from birth. You're demanding they ignore their upbringing and acknowledge your lifestyle. That's like someone demanding I acknowledge and believe in God and speak with religious context. For me, not happening. Regarding calling someone by their preferred pronoun... I'm internally struggling to accept it because it's soooo different than what I've essentially, been brainwashed to do and think. Oh, I am swinging to your direction of it for sure. It just makes me feel slightly uncomfortable because it's not natural *to me*. It might be for you, and that's great, but you're asking me to go against *my* nature. It's such a conflicting feeling. I think I believe I know it's not right (you follow that? because I'm not sure even I do...) but it's how my mind has been socially wired from birth. Yep, back to brain wiring. I'm trying to rewire my brain. Like you can't flick a switch to change your brain wiring, neither can I. But I know to be inclusive and assist people with equality, I'm trying to change my thought process. I'm trying. But it's got 37 years of single minded thinking going against it. I'm all for LGBTQ+ people having equality.... while I might not immediately call you by your preferred pronoun, I shall not disrespect you by intentionally calling you the incorrect pronoun to your nature. I shall refer to you (I say you, I mean LGBTQ+ people) by your chosen name. Can I at least work from there? Can others be allowed the same consideration (albeit they could be at different points in time of their own internal struggle of fully embracing LGBTQ+ people's preferences. Referring to the bold text.... this'll sound harsh, I don't mean it to, but I see no other way... But isn't that what you're doing to them? Forcing your view upon them? Dog's don't change their genders. I can crouch down and check out if a dog is typically male or female. Dogs keep whatever nature gave them. People generally accept a dog's gender as cisgender. Dogs get called inanimate objects as their actual name. Yet the bits between their legs still very stereotypically define the pronoun of a dog. You can't really compare as there's a lot more complex issues at hand with humans, the whole brain wiring thing and other previous points I've mentioned previously. I understand your sentiment, but I really don't think you can compare it to being given less respect than a dog because of such differences. I really can't agree more with the bolded statement. It is things like that, which help push my mind in what is the right direction of inclusion acceptance in my own internal struggle. Yeah.... again with the Nazis... just stop it, please.... I don't get offended easily, but that's crossing the line and is offensive. While your comment is aimed at Allanp, I've already addressed this bathroom issue above. I genuinely am sorry for the bigotry you have had to face. I shouldn't have to apologise, but to see how it's twisting your view of someone who *does* support you, but is held back to some degree because of how society/his upbringing has made his thought process occur, you mock his support and dismiss it as bigotry. You're showing a side that puts people off supporting LGBTQ+ people. Not because I reckon you're a horrid person with a black and white view of absolutes, but I feel you've been ground down and it's worn too thin on you. A lot of bitterness is very easily coming through your posts. I get why. I have not experienced why. Don't let the bitterness overcome what you're aiming to achieve (which you shouldn't have to) It just isn't aggression, thats an extreme exaggeration. But thankfully, one that nerdsforprez has already addressed, so I don't have to make a clusterf**k of trying to put my thoughts into comprehensible rationality. And therein lies the problem. Society. Society thinks one way one decade, then changes it another decade. Outlaws it another decade later. While being worldwide, and having different timelines of progression in different countries. People are fighting individuals because of what society as a whole has dictated. People are punishing others because of what society has dictated them to believe and do/follow. People are being punished as individuals for not keeping up with the change in society. People as individuals generally don't like change. They get accustomed to things. It becomes a way of life. Society comes along and dictates they must now do a 180, meanwhile Mr Bob has been quietly living his life without any requirement to have any consideration (yep lucky him). But now, he is being called a bigot because society as a whole being as diverse as it is, has changed while he as an individual hasn't had to change anything, and has been essentially brainwashed into a certain way of thinking. Society is fickle. Society is difficult to change. Once it does change, it can happen fast. Too fast for some, not fast enough for others. I can't agree more with this. This NEEEEEEDS to occur. Sure, move the thread into community. But it has every right to occur. It is one subject/thread. There is more than enough lego on this forum to satisfy ANY Lego fan's desires. It's going absolutely nowhere because of this thread and lack of lego included in it. I don't think I can emphasise and support the bold type enough. Well, I started typing at 22:06, it's now 01:10. I've fked up my sleeping again, but it's with good intentions. I'm struggling with tiredness enough as it is, so I might have to bow out here, or i'll end up sleep driving. That never ends well for anyone. I shall read replies, but possible I won't reply. If you wish a reply, please do PM me, it'd make it easier to reply personally rather than hit people with a critical wall of text x1000 and space them out so I'm not spending more time on a forum than I am avoiding females at the gym. Take care all of you, I'm glad TLG released this set.

I've numbered inside the quote to make it easier to follow my replying. 1. From my ignorant viewpoint, Eddie Izzard instantly springs to mind when you mention that. He's the first person I remember being openly trans and making me aware of it more than a subconscious thought. Chiseled jawline as often seen on male minifig heads perhaps? No beard necessarily required? I know it's not how all trans are, but, you gotta start somewhere if you want a minifig to represent specifically a trans person. And those that wish to portray themselves in such a view also deserve representation, as, was it not essentially the basic level of how trans were before the modern world of current trans? (please do correct me if that's an incorrect view/thought). Further to my ignorance, I never even knew autogynephilia was a harmful thing in the/to the trans community. Is it because it involves the sexualisation of trans and thus diminishing the nature of those who are for reasons outside a sexual desire? (That's a complete guess, but I'd be interested to learn how?) 2. Ahhh ok, I see where you're coming from. I can't see that bearded trans people would necessarily be a poor representation, again, I feel that view still kinda diminishes their value... As much as trans serial killers aren't all trans people, not all bearded trans are just 'men in dresses'. I would hope, that nowadays, people would be smart enough to distinguish the difference between a serial killer who dresses as a woman of various tendancies to having no relation at all to all trans people in general... But I guess, here we are having a conversation that shouldn't really be being had at all... (I don't mean you and me, i mean the entire discussion) 3. But, that is their viewpoint. Is it also intolerant to not accept that not everyone will accept LGBTQIA+ as it is against their opinions and lifestyle? As wrong as we may feel it to be? At one point in time, society dictated LGBTQIA as frowned upon/not tolerated/illegal etc... Society dictated that. Times *are* changing and society is now swinging the other way. Some are swinging faster than others. But there are still pockets of society that are alive and were through the time of the negative perceptions which were initially acceptable, and living in communities where it was widespread and taught through the generations, and thus still in places has strong resentment. It is naive to expect it not to exist, but to blame them for their own life circumstances? For having been alive during the time it was acceptable to resent/be afraid of it, and sticking to their beliefs? It kinda feels like fighting bigotry with bigotry. (I know that statement won't go down well, but that's my honest feelings). 4. I apologise for not picking out statements you've made that I totally agree with (they are there! ) to counter the perception I'm only taking a harsh view of your comments (not all, just some, but these were the ones that stood out to me that I feel others haven't addressed - perhaps because only I see them and its me that's the issue ). Back on target, defend? Nope. Understanding both perspectives and trying to explain the religious person's perspective? Yes. I say this, fully in my own belief there is no God, that none of what he says matters(in the judgy damning kinda sense) -even moreso due to my belief. That in the outside world, I have to be respectful and mindful that religion plays a part in a lot of people's lives, and as much as I wish people simply had their own morals and did good deeds by their own merits instead of following a book open to all sorts of interpretational abuse, it always will be a part of life. That some will have extreme views that I disagree with. But that's their freedom too. 5. Someone mentioned something about finding it offensive or disliking or something, about wanting the words 'people' or community after LGBTQ, someone mentioned LGBTQIA (extra letters), given someone is offended at not explicitly being referred to as a collective noun when the implication is there given that is literally what every human is, and how the list of letters is getting longer and longer like the list of different genders, it's a matter of time before someone becomes offended at not saying their specific letter but genericising with just LGBT... It wasn't specifically aimed at you (hence no quote or anything), it was a pre-emption given the proceeding statement I made after. That was definitely a thing, it's why I said it, but there is soooooo much text in these pages, I lost track of where or who said it. 6. No need to retract at all, I don't believe you've misinterpreted anything I've said. I understand I come across harsh in my statements, I struggle with words and remembering the right words, it gets frustrating as I forget such simple words which may literally be the single word that my entire point is based around and without it, I make no sense.... So I kinda just say things how my mind can, in addition to my life path has made me end up just saying things without beating around the bush and being (perhaps too) blunt.

I'm going to throw my (hope for) +1 to the food stalls, specifically the lego ideas submission ones. Those were literal perfection and impeccably executed, and exactly what is missing from the lineup history.

Thank you, appreciated :)

Can't figure out how to type above the quote as I can't move the quote down (on my phone) but have just read the whole thread, and is a wholesome read. To respond to the above quote, regarding the 'crass and offensive stereotypes', can you define them? I ask this, because, these crass and 'offensive stereotypes' exist because there are actually people who genuinely are like that. Isnt this meant to be about inclusion, diversity and acceptance? Those people who genuinely do fall into the stereotype are seen as offensive to you, why? Aren't they just as equally part of the LGBTQ community as you are, yet you're providing an undertone with the view of being better than them. Yet, they, for their 'crass and offensive stereotype' have probably done a lot for the LGBTQ community, I'm guessing, as the overtly exaggerated gayness etc... By being openly proud and excessive about it, has helped to keep it in the public eye much easier and given the people who were closet, some strength to come out as they knew they weren't alone. By all means, I'm sure I've misunderstood, but that's how that statement is coming across to me. So, you'd rather they hid in the shadows and made a snide hidden comment to everyone but those in the community? They opened themselves up for being seen for their view. While you might disagree with it (I'm certainly not saying they're right), at least they've been open and owned their view balls deep. They've also put *their* morals above the lego community. There is nothing wrong with that at all, it shows how strongly that is their belief. What blows my mind, is yes, I understand (but don't agree with!) some of (*edited for clarification/correction of my view) the bigotry aimed at the LGBTQ community, but your community want everyone to understand and let you guys simply be, and for everyone to understand your point of view. Which is entirely fair. But you're doing so while not understanding their point of view, but simply blanket dismissing nearly everything as bigotry that disagrees with LGBTQ. I'm going to be slightly crude in my explanation, I don't mean to offend, but I don't know how to word it differently /better... That person has likely been brainwashed with strong religious views right from the start. Am going to assume a strong religious community, or something that gives them a strong and extreme belief. LGBTQ people are naturally the way they are. Being brainwashed is essentially as close as you can get to that. People are all different. Some people will have extreme views, but be open to understanding and learning. Others, will be extremely set in their ways. Those extremely set in their ways, they can't help it, it's their resolve. It's their belief. It's the way they live their life. I don't agree with religion at all. But I understand there are people who are extreme in their religious (or even non religious) views. As long as they're not bombing places/killing people, and theyre not physically affecting my life or others, they're free to believe what they want. Just as the LGBTQ community are free to live how they want (well, in some countries). Sure, there's pushback, it's been frowned upon for a few thousand years and then some. Romans freeborn were only legally allowed to be the consenting masculine side (let's say the dominant one). Anything else, and it was illegal and punishable. Soon as Christianity came along properly and roman gods weren't a thing anymore, that was it. No more gay at all. Its been a thing of contention for thousands of years, you can't expect absolutely everyone to accept it right now just because you say so. Some will still have strong views. Some will just shy away from it and not want a part of it. As time goes by, those with extreme against views will be watered down and it'll be a norm. But, while it's not right for people to want to actually stop you doing what feels natural to you, you can't expect everyone to simply jump on board. But it is amazing how many people's minds are being opened up due to (mostly) civilised discussions such as these. Sorry for not quoting your whole post, but I'm referring to the whole of that post (cutting space down on my phone screen). Absolutely great post and couldn't agree more! I've shortened the quoted text as above, but I wholeheartedly agree with everything in your post! I'd have made a horrid mess of it trying to get that from my head into words... Moving on from quotes, I'm getting lost... LGBTQ I get, but where's the IA come from with LGBTQIA? Additionally, and connected to the above question, and something someone said... Aren't people getting offended just a little too easy now? I mean, LGBTQIA, how many more letters do I have to remember in order to include absolutely everyone so I don't neglect to include a type and be seen as offending them for not being inclusive? We know LGBTQ(IA?) are people or a community, not stating the words 'community' or 'people' is being just a bit touchy.... Like, I'm not offended if someone refers to me as straight because they're dehumanising me by not acknowledging that I'm an actual human being!? It's implied. I know I'm a person. I know I'm included in the community of cisgender straight people (as much as sometimes I wish I was my own community... And I'm sure some people might wish me to be in my own community too... ), I don't need to be spoon-fed I'm a person too. Everyone knows you're people too. Keep the focus on the real issues and not on the excessive offensiveness... Adding onto that, one thing I dislike, is that now everyone is getting offended for not being represented now that LGBTQ+ are. While I respect disabled people, because life is a shit ton tougher for them with issues a lot of people couldn't handle, can we stop with the 'LGBTQ getting representation, Where's mine?!' You realise how many different disabilities there are? Wheelchair bound is an obvious visual one that can be easily represented hence why it was (I assume) the first(or blind guide dog). Partially deaf? Hearing aid head print. Fully deaf? Well... Most minifigs are already representing them as they typically have no ears to start with! People with ears aren't represented enough in that case.... So how do you represent actual deaf people, so as not to offend fully deaf people? Blind people? You got your guide dog, and people with solid blacked out glasses for partially blind, minifigs already have solid black dot eyes which doesn't represent true eyeballs and therefore, people with normal sight. What about paraplegics? Quadraplegics? Dementia? Depression? Bi-polar disorder? Meningitis? Mental health issues? People born with mini limbs (no idea what the name is) and other physical deformaties from birth? Burn victims? Narcolepsy sufferers? ADHD, downs syndrome (I'm almost certain that last one would be a big can of worms). The list is endless... Where does it end?! It doesn't. And that's the problem. There is always someone out there who won't be represented because it's impossible to represent *every disability* because there's just tooooo many!! 'yeah but my disability is common'... And so are a dozen others... They're trying.... Give them a break. Let the LGBTQ + have their moment with this, they deserve it. Its not a snuff to disabled people by any stretch, and that's not to say disabled people don't deserve it. But can we just stop with finding offense in absolutely everything....?? Final statement... I'm glad for nudists too. Even they're represented in this set

I'ma be upfront, the structure as it is won't hold up very well and at best will be sagging in quite a few places. It'll need supporting with some level of technic structure for how big you're wanting to do it. I see you building the interior walkways, which is cool, but, how would you access that to see the interior? Which leads to some level of seperation requirement, which leads to requiring extra strengthening. And then, how big its going to be, you literally wouldn't be able to reach the middle of it without either hovering above it (couldn't access the underside then unless the model is hanging) or build from the middle outwards. Additionally, as an LDD project, unless you keep it modularised, the program itself will struggle. I think it struggles at 25k+ parts. Which at the scale you're working at, won't take too long to reach at all. Perhaps consider building the cockpit in real life at this point in time to see how that goes, before spending more time designing in LDD so you can get a grasp of the effect gravity and the size of scale you're working with will have on it. The cockpit in itself would make for a nice display piece. I hope this doesn't come across as being negative about it, but constructive in giving suggestions on things to consider and try

You nailed this! It certainly stirs a lot of memories watching TNG when I grew up! The exterior is nice and sleek, very in keeping with the source. We'll done!

Am loving reading the updates on this! Those towers are just ! Especially the walkway connecting them! I would love to see it look a little more 'decayed' but I understand you are using reference material to make this and so it wouldn't be in keeping with the source material...? The lit up chandelier is a great touch! I'm also happy for you that you got to meet the guy as well!

That Maul.... His eyes almost look 3D... What an exceptional version of him! Now we see where darth vader's arm printing budget went

Personally, I'd go with the probe Droid. Looks such a good display, would fit nicely on the desk, is a complete model and then some, and is unique in that probe Droid builds don't come along often in any scale. Darth vader bust is nice, but imo, has room for improvement in areas, and while is a nice display piece, isn't too interesting to look at for long. Entirely my opinion of course.

I really want to get into it, specifically for the monster metal side... But alongside the over pricing, and blind boxes (only seen them in the actual lego store... No way I'm sitting there pulling sticky tabs open in the actual lego stores!) puts me off... I have a set of digital scales... If I can get the banshee, I'll crack on... Anyone have the weight for this one? *edit Just seen on BrickLink the weight is listed as 26.4grams... (same as werewolf unfortunately) Is that inclusive of the box and any paper contents or just the plastic figure/items itself?

I've never really ventured into the marvel sets... But damn, that Benatar set has me sucked right in! That's a magnificent piece of art!

The image still isn't visible :(

Same here, except I can understand why they included the speeders (playability etc). I'd rather as many others do, they'd spent the part count of the speeders on the ship, but then would we be getting back into the territory of highly detailed sets for expensive price? (at this point, its already got its price point and considering it includes all 5 bad batch, I'd easily drop the money on a higher detailed ship...) I think star wars lego is about to have a reawakening with extremely interesting and high quality sets. Something just felt 'off' with the majority of their episode 8/9 sets. However, it feels like right from the get-go, Mandalorian sets are spot on and I feel we're about to get a lot more decent quality sets/minifig choices.