LDD update 4.1.8 released

[Seluryar]

i may have said that ldd is now complete, but i forgot about one thing that i want to see added:

the ability to place items on flat tiles, such as wheels on roadplates and now the dock pieces, as well as flat elements/tiles, but also items that cannot fit onto tiles such as suitcases, tracked items such as construction equipment, pretty much anything should be able to be placed onto flat surfaces

[BasOne]

i may have said that ldd is now complete, but i forgot about one thing that i want to see added:

the ability to place items on flat tiles, such as wheels on roadplates and now the dock pieces, as well as flat elements/tiles, but also items that cannot fit onto tiles such as suitcases, tracked items such as construction equipment, pretty much anything should be able to be placed onto flat surfaces

That would be nice, sliding doors without building scaffolding... and that work.

[Brickdoctor]

i may have said that ldd is now complete, but i forgot about one thing that i want to see added:

the ability to place items on flat tiles, such as wheels on roadplates and now the dock pieces, as well as flat elements/tiles, but also items that cannot fit onto tiles such as suitcases, tracked items such as construction equipment, pretty much anything should be able to be placed onto flat surfaces

Basically the Gravity Button that we've been asking for in the LDD 5 Wants thread.

[Fallenangel]

i may have said that ldd is now complete, but i forgot about one thing that i want to see added:

the ability to place items on flat tiles, such as wheels on roadplates and now the dock pieces, as well as flat elements/tiles, but also items that cannot fit onto tiles such as suitcases, tracked items such as construction equipment, pretty much anything should be able to be placed onto flat surfaces

I don't know, I'm still waiting for the ability to place a Technic pin into a stud receptacle (or vice versa). That and being able to wedge plates between studs...

[Brickdoctor]

I don't know, I'm still waiting for the ability to place a Technic pin into a stud receptacle (or vice versa). That and being able to wedge plates between studs...

In all likelihood, we'll never get those, since they've been deemed illegal connections.

[Fallenangel]

In all likelihood, we'll never get those, since they've been deemed illegal connections.

That's what I was getting at.

Edited August 12, 2011 by fallenangel309

[Man with a hat]

Downloaded without problems. Always nice to have more parts.

But I do need to get used to all those parts movements to other categories.

Train wheels have disappeared; the ones with the axles...

Yes I noticed this too. Very annoying. I used them a lot for my LDD trains. Hope they will be back soon.

[Brickdoctor]

That's what I was getting at.

You're so mean.

TLG could allow illegal connections in a special version of the program, but then that would probably require so many changes to the way LDD attaches bricks that such a program would have to have no set attachments, in which case it just becomes LDraw with better graphics and a different file format.

[roamingstop]

It seems that the 4x6 train plate with 7mm (or 6mm) pin is also missing... (sorry dont know the part number). But what is interesting is that the two pieces 30036 (Plate Wing Profile) and 2460 (plate with vertical snap) now interact properly, as is required in the 7939 cargo train freight wagon.

So perhaps the missing part is being updated?...

[Superkalle]

It seems that the 4x6 train plate with 7mm (or 6mm) pin is also missing... (sorry dont know the part number).

I think it's 4092. Has it ever been in LDD?

4025 is in there however, but it's the one with 5mm peg.

But what is interesting is that the two pieces 30036 (Plate Wing Profile) and 2460 (plate with vertical snap) now interact properly, as is required in the 7939 cargo train freight wagon.

It's a good testamente that the brick bugs we report actually get fixed.

[roamingstop]

4025 is in there however, but it's the one with 5mm peg.

Thanks... I had spent ages looking for it but see it now in a different place...

It also works with the modified wing piece; so we can now update some of the (sub) models from 7939; unfortunately the locomotive will loose its wheels...

Edited August 13, 2011 by roamingstudio

[xSergio74]

Hi,

At every new release of these application it is always the same story: some new parts are made available, while some other disappears !

I'm sorry, but I find really annoying (just for not to say "unacceptable") that part in my mocs can appear or disappear upgrading from a release to the next.

A "serious" application (if a game could be considered serious) should at least preserve its compatibility with pre-built models, or at least give the user a way to preserver their "hard" works. Just imagine work with a word processor and when upgrading to a next version you find in your documents some missed paragraphs... !!!! And you have not get an advice about which paragraph will no longer be readable...

Not all users are kids that enjoy just building whatever is available at the moment: among them there are some (or many) AFOLs that really dislike loose their works or part of them...

Anyway, this is just my personal opinion...

Sergio

[Brickdoctor]

I'm sorry, but I find really annoying (just for not to say "unacceptable") that part in my mocs can appear or disappear upgrading from a release to the next.

A "serious" application (if a game could be considered serious) should at least preserve its compatibility with pre-built models, or at least give the user a way to preserver their "hard" works. Just imagine work with a word processor and when upgrading to a next version you find in your documents some missed paragraphs... !!!! And you have not get an advice about which paragraph will no longer be readable...

I assume when they remove a piece, it's because they've found an error in the part and want to fix it. Pretty sure they usually get re-added in a later release, and they add far more bricks than are removed each update, so if you weigh the pros and cons it's not that bad.

[marco9999]

The biggest issue is about the chain link 3711.

I don't know if that part was forgotten or left out of the program on purpouse because of its missing connectability to gears and sprockets to be fixed in the future. It makes no sense that such an important part in Technic sets is not in the program especially after so much progress has been made by LDD people in improving the program's features to simulate real Technic building. I am confident that it will be included in the next release so I'm not saving changes in files when the chain is removed and hope that the program will upload it correctly from old files.

Obviously that would not happen if the part were even slightly modified in geometry or displacement as single links would collide to one another and the program would leave them out once again. In that case chains should be rebuilt from new in all models and builders really spent some time in placing "scaffholded" chains around gears with no connection help.

From my personal point of view I prefer to have that part exactly the way it was in order to keep the completeness of the models which have been already posted in this forum. A new release is unnecessary for that, a quick update would be enough. But I understand that someone else would like to reset it in the name of easy building. The ideal - but maybe impossible - would be to kill two birds with one stone.

Regards

Marco

[Calabar]

I'm sorry, but I find really annoying (just for not to say "unacceptable") that part in my mocs can appear or disappear upgrading from a release to the next.

Absolutely agree.

In LD4 they removed the corner panel 4737 from my 6972 Polaris Lab, and in the meantime introduced flexible hoses 73590 (e.i. the hose was already in LDD, but they introduced the flexibility).

So I have to decide if renounce to the hoses or to the corner panel!

And for big mocs this thing is even worse.

I hope the LDD team changes this politics.

From my personal point of view I prefer to have that part exactly the way it was in order to keep the completeness of the models which have been already posted in this forum. A new release is unnecessary for that, a quick update would be enough. But I understand that someone else would like to reset it in the name of easy building. The ideal - but maybe impossible - would be to kill two birds with one stone.

I hope the new pieces are better than possible, instead.

For example they could add a function to place the chains, so we can all easily replace, one time for all, the old unconnected ones.

[Esser-Z]

Hooray, start of the old cockpits! I'd like to see the long ones, like were used in so much of Aquazone and the Space lines, but it's good to see SOME start in that direction.

The Aquashark armor remains broken, though. This is sad.

Really wish the tube they added that I first recall seeing in Life on Mars was a bending-equipped piece, too

Edited August 14, 2011 by Esser-Z

[Aanchir]

With Superkalle's help, I created these decorated parts, new to this latest update:

LXF File

Included are previously missing minifigure torsos and heads from set 7961 Sith Infiltrator, decorated Hero Factory shells from sets 2231 Waspix and 2233 Fangz (All three have an error in that it has a white background rather than a transparent one), and dog and minifigure torsos from set 10218 Pet Shop. The cat decoration from set 10218 Pet Shop and 4842 Hogwarts Castle was also included in the update, but unfortunately the kitten piece 6251 currently lacks any decoration surfaces for this decoration to be applied to.

I'm sure many people will appreciate these new decorations. While they don't change the actual building potential of LDD quite like new building elements do, they can help you add extra realism to MOCs and sets which you intend to use these decorated parts on. Soon I will update my LDD Decorations file in the LDD Reference topic with all these new decorated parts, so keep your eyes peeled.

[PerryMakes]

Is the "Decoration Tool" still available in LDD? I've only recently gotten involved with this tool, so I wasn't around when all the "hacking cool features -> LEGO allowing a backdoor to be opened" business was going on. Could someone please sum up the current state of that? What exactly can be enabled? What additional behavior does that give you? Or does it simply add additional parts?

Also ... with all weekend for nothing but coding, we can expect to see a new version of LDD Manager tomorrow, right??? ;)

Cheers ~ Perry

EDIT: Found the decoration tool, so I'll rephrase the question as such: Does LDD Extended mode provided everything that the old "hacked" LU mode did?

EDIT #2: Found the new release of LDD Manager!

Edited August 15, 2011 by PerryMakes

[Nix Mills]

The single train wheel has been removed and won't be displayed when loading older models. That's quite a shame.

[alienwar9]

I have to say, when LDD gets updated and pieces go missing in MY huge city sections, it really makes me mad, because it's painfully hard to find out what piece went missing (and I now have 7 sections to worry about).

That's why I keep a back-up of every LDD version, just in case. Super useful if you worry about what you'll lose. Just keep the LDD "programfiles.legocompany.LEGO Digital Designer" folder and the "users.'your-username'.appdata.roaming.LEGO Company" folder copied in a different location. If you want to go back to an older version, just replace the current contents of those folders with your back-up ones.

It's also useful to save the new version, so you can go back to it without having to install it. It's just a little bit quicker (at least for me). Just label the folder you put the back-up in so you know which version is which.

[PerryMakes]

I've been a software developer going on 15 years now, and I've NEVER seen a major application do what LDD does when it opens a file and tells you that some parts can't be placed so it's just going to throw them away ... without bothering to tell you which parts or why. Pardon a crass comment, but that pure rubbish LEGO (or whatever 3rd party does the actual development).

[Calabar]

I've been a software developer going on 15 years now, and I've NEVER seen a major application do what LDD does when it opens a file and tells you that some parts can't be placed so it's just going to throw them away ... without bothering to tell you which parts or why.

When that happens, LDD create e file, UnplaceableBricksDump.lxfml, in the user directory, that shows the impeached bricks.

It is not surely intuitive, but it is something, at least!

[Superkalle]

I've been a software developer going on 15 years now, and I've NEVER seen a major application do what LDD does when it opens a file and tells you that some parts can't be placed so it's just going to throw them away ... without bothering to tell you which parts or why. Pardon a crass comment, but that pure rubbish LEGO (or whatever 3rd party does the actual development).

Yeah, I agree it's not particularly user friendly But I think it's important also to remember under which condititions LDD Extended Mode was released to us fan, and that is as strictly as-is, free of charge, with no support and as more of beta software. Basically they are letting us see and use bricks they wouldn't otherwise bother to show. Just to give the background to how this whole Extended Mode was released in the first place.

Also to clarify about the UnplaceableBricksDump.lxfml:

When you open an LDD file, two things can happen

1) The file contains bricks that are illegally placed (i.e. overlapping collison volumes). This can be because you managed to place a brick in a way that was accepted during design, but when LDD re-parses the layout during opening, it finds the error. It can also happen if a brick has been updated between versions and collisions boxes have been increased in size. The latter is very rare since colission boxes most often are reduced rather then enlarged.

2) The file contains brick that no longer exist in the brick palette (like the example with the chain link in 4.1.8).

The UnplaceableBricksDump.lxfml is only created in case 1). For 2), it will not work since the missing bricks is simply not in the brick database/palette.

The problem is however, that UnplaceableBricksDump won't do much good in case 1) either, because when you try to open it, the problematics bricks are removed. So what is the UnplaceableBricksDump? It's a file used during development debugging when it is possible to open a file with physics controll turned off. In those cases, you will be a able to see the removed bricks as red, and all the others as yellow. But for us normal users that don't have the developers tools, this won't do much good.

So how do you work around all this? The easiest way is off course to compare the file before and after opening in LDD, and then you can catch both 1) and 2) above. For this you can use LDD Manager. There is a feature for it called "Compare Models" that simply gives you the part content difference.

Now, how come bricks are removed from the palette at all? Well, from what I understand there are at least three reasons:

1) The brick has been deemed redundant or is not applicable anymore. There has been some cases before.

2) The brick has some fault in it, and is put to side while being "repaired" (i.e. it's in the to-do backlog and before it's fixed TLG won't put it back)

3) A mistake was made and the brick was omitted when the brick palette was created. In these cases it's naturally put back in the next release.

It should be noted that we are talking a handful of bricks out of almost 2000 and the majority of the cases, they are put back in the next release. And for what it's worth, the quality of the brick database is getting better and better so I think we will see less and less of this problem in the future. Sure, I find it extremely aggravating when a brick has been removed, even temporarily, but I though I'd just explain what I know.

[Aanchir]

Also to clarify about the UnplaceableBricksDump.lxfml:

When you open an LDD file, two things can happen

1) The file contains bricks that are illegally placed (i.e. overlapping collison volumes). This can be because you managed to place a brick in a way that was accepted during design, but when LDD re-parses the layout during opening, it finds the error. It can also happen if a brick has been updated between versions and collisions boxes have been increased in size. The latter is very rare since colission boxes most often are reduced rather then enlarged.

2) The file contains brick that no longer exist in the brick palette (like the example with the chain link in 4.1.8).

The UnplaceableBricksDump.lxfml is only created in case 1). For 2), it will not work since the missing bricks is simply not in the brick database/palette.

The problem is however, that UnplaceableBricksDump won't do much good in case 1) either, because when you try to open it, the problematics bricks are removed. So what is the UnplaceableBricksDump? It's a file used during development debugging when it is possible to open a file with physics controll turned off. In those cases, you will be a able to see the removed bricks as red, and all the others as yellow. But for us normal users that don't have the developers tools, this won't do much good.

Now hold on. I thought Unplaceable Bricks Dump colored all parts involved in a collision red-- that means both the ones that were removed and the ones that were kept. So if a lightsaber blade were colliding with a jumper plate, only one of the two would be removed, but both would be colored red. If this is the case, then LDD Manager remains valuable to regular users, since it shows where the collision occured (but not why). If not, then I'm wracking my brain trying to figure out how I found it so useful back when I was encountering parts collisions more often.

I haven't tried opening all of my LDD files, but those I have opened haven't tended to have removed bricks. So I'm wondering if people could isolate which parts started causing problems after the update-- whether, for instance, it's a certain type of hinge connection or what-have-you.

[Superkalle]

Now hold on. I thought Unplaceable Bricks Dump colored all parts involved in a collision red-- that means both the ones that were removed and the ones that were kept. So if a lightsaber blade were colliding with a jumper plate, only one of the two would be removed, but both would be colored red. If this is the case, then LDD Manager remains valuable to regular users, since it shows where the collision occured (but not why). If not, then I'm wracking my brain trying to figure out how I found it so useful back when I was encountering parts collisions more often.

Gotta do some thinking...

Ok, done thinking. No, it should be only the brick removed that will be red. In the classic case you mention with the jumper plate, 1x1 cone and light saber blade, only the light saber blade will removed and colored red, i.e. the Unplaceable file would look like below (a mockup since the blade would be removed if opened like this).

But you are right that the Unplacable file will contain all bricks, including the ones removed colored red. So I guess the way you used it was to open it in an editor and search for the red color code to locate the brick. So in that sence the Unplaceable file is off course useful (i.e. you dont need LDD Manager to spot the problematic brick).