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LEGO Star Wars 2021 Set Discussion - READ FIRST POST!!!

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3 hours ago, McMurder_them_softly said:

AT-AT and promos arrived yesterday! Wondering if anyone has or will put a dog head on the AT-AT (wife and I affectionately call it our "robot dog"). 

LOL no - but I'm tempted to name it "Spike".

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On 12/1/2021 at 2:28 AM, Brikkyy13 said:

So there’s a page in the instructions of the lightsaber GWP that states it’s the saber Luke had in RotJ… I’ve defended the LEGO Star Wars team a lot this year but I think I finally get where some of the gunship haters have been coming from. They definitely need someone on the team who is actually a Star Wars fan to be checking for that sort of stuff. 

Yeah, someone should be giving all of this a once-over for sanity checks at a minimum! For things like that and the Imperial logo vs. Republic logo, it doesn't even have to be a full-time Lego employee. I would honestly be a little surprised that Lucasfilm doesn't have someone who could do it for Lego, since it does have a small effect at their own brand.

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1 minute ago, autolycus said:

Yeah, someone should be giving all of this a once-over for sanity checks at a minimum! For things like that and the Imperial logo vs. Republic logo, it doesn't even have to be a full-time Lego employee. I would honestly be a little surprised that Lucasfilm doesn't have someone who could do it for Lego, since it does have a small effect at their own brand.

Most-annoying-thing-ever these days.

Examples of my biggest pet peeves that make my friends laugh (not all pertaining to lego):

1: You go look for a TIE Fighter LED Kit - lasers are red. THE #### IS THAT?! It's like they've never seen Star Wars Movies!

2: 1st of the new movies - a scene where the "Imp" officer orders the Laser Cannons to open fire - scene cuts to a Gun Turret launching obviously a Concussion Missile or a Torpedo. (screams internally)

3: 2nd of the new movies - Large Dreadnought starts firing its main guns - laser shots are "arc'ing" in space....yeah 'nough said.

4: Bombs mysteriously dropping in space with no obvious gravity or propulsion (2nd movie again).

 

I get that these little details may be funny to some - but its the little things that make what we enjoy so much special. Lego's are a big deal to me in that regard.
Whomever they have checking facts - should be a die hard fan-atic to ensure things are accurate. I get creative liberties - but seriously - continuity for the sake of continuity! Even in Star Wars movies themselves - they just simply don't make im like they used too.

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Just now, Kage Goomba said:

Most-annoying-thing-ever these days.

Examples of my biggest pet peeves that make my friends laugh (not all pertaining to lego):

 1: You go look for a TIE Fighter LED Kit - lasers are red. THE #### IS THAT?! It's like they've never seen Star Wars Movies!

 2: 1st of the new movies - a scene where the "Imp" officer orders the Laser Cannons to open fire - scene cuts to a Gun Turret launching obviously a Concussion Missile or a Torpedo. (screams internally)

 3: 2nd of the new movies - Large Dreadnought starts firing its main guns - laser shots are "arc'ing" in space....yeah 'nough said.

 4: Bombs mysteriously dropping in space with no obvious gravity or propulsion (2nd movie again).

 

I get that these little details may be funny to some - but its the little things that make what we enjoy so much special. Lego's are a big deal to me in that regard.
Whomever they have checking facts - should be a die hard fan-atic to ensure things are accurate. I get creative liberties - but seriously - continuity for the sake of continuity! Even in Star Wars movies themselves - they just simply don't make im like they used too.

If you're really going to complain about terrible space physics, you should also add the rather lengthy list of problems in ANH, ESB, ROTJ, etc. The space combat scenes are intentionally more like WW2 combat than what would exist in space. Oh, and... umm... LIGHTSABERS!!!

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4 minutes ago, Kage Goomba said:

I get that these little details may be funny to some - but its the little things that make what we enjoy so much special. Lego's are a big deal to me in that regard.

Whomever they have checking facts - should be a die hard fan-atic to ensure things are accurate. I get creative liberties - but seriously - continuity for the sake of continuity! Even in Star Wars movies themselves - they just simply don't make im like they used too.

There have been tons of problems with virtually all of the reference books published recently, too. Stuff that there's just no reason to be wrong about. To take a random example, the Wookieepedia page for the Encyclopedia of Starfighters and Other Vehicles from 2018 has a list of dozens of errors, and that's not even all that're in the book. I don't understand why this seems to be so hard, since like you say, they literally only have to get one single person who knows the material to read through this stuff and point out the problems. It's not like Star Wars fans are hard to find; you'd think they could hire some.

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7 minutes ago, Kdapt-Preacher said:

There have been tons of problems with virtually all of the reference books published recently, too. Stuff that there's just no reason to be wrong about. To take a random example, the Wookieepedia page for the Encyclopedia of Starfighters and Other Vehicles from 2018 has a list of dozens of errors, and that's not even all that're in the book. I don't understand why this seems to be so hard, since like you say, they literally only have to get one single person who knows the material to read through this stuff and point out the problems. It's not like Star Wars fans are hard to find; you'd think they could hire some.

I frequently encounter what I call "zealots" that swear what some website said (even wookiepedia) is NEVER WRONG and such.

I have a very large library of books - blueprints - tech manuals - I'm a stickler for ship tech and minor things.

One of the reasons I utterly despise this "new time line" is the mass chaos it caused in changing so many things that did not need changing.
you likely saw some of this mentality on my MOC project lol XD

Granted debate and discussion is inevitable - but the things that are considered "canon" tend to royally fry my tail feathers when it comes to common sense and reason.

16 minutes ago, autolycus said:

If you're really going to complain about terrible space physics, you should also add the rather lengthy list of problems in ANH, ESB, ROTJ, etc. The space combat scenes are intentionally more like WW2 combat than what would exist in space. Oh, and... umm... LIGHTSABERS!!!

Sure - I can get behind that....but the older movies didn't have the tech we have today in terms of CGI/Rendering.

So it can be forgiven to some degree - but today? Nope..not a chance.
That and it's not as painfully obvious as it is today in term of "wut" factor.
Even if Star Wars physics are "far out" - at least keep it consistent!

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46 minutes ago, Kage Goomba said:

Most-annoying-thing-ever these days.

Examples of my biggest pet peeves that make my friends laugh (not all pertaining to lego):

1: You go look for a TIE Fighter LED Kit - lasers are red. THE #### IS THAT?! It's like they've never seen Star Wars Movies!

2: 1st of the new movies - a scene where the "Imp" officer orders the Laser Cannons to open fire - scene cuts to a Gun Turret launching obviously a Concussion Missile or a Torpedo. (screams internally)

3: 2nd of the new movies - Large Dreadnought starts firing its main guns - laser shots are "arc'ing" in space....yeah 'nough said.

4: Bombs mysteriously dropping in space with no obvious gravity or propulsion (2nd movie again).

For point 4, one of Newton's laws is that an object would remain in motion unless acted upon by another force. There is no drag, friction or gravity in space, so assuming that the bombs were pushed out of the bomb bay by some unseen but likely existing mechanism, rather than freefalling, they would remain on the downward trajectory constantly. I am no astrophysicist so I may be wrong though.

For the rest I completely agree.

One nitpick I have is that starfighters bank when turning. Banking is due to gravity which doesn't exist in space, also there should be no noise. And if they can build a planet sized space station, why on earth haven't they invented the guided missile?

Though considering the main storyline is a about space wizards who can practice telekinesis and fly around a galaxy faster than the speed of light and destroy a planet sized battle station which can destroy another planet, aided by aliens, and ghosts and talking robots and fight against other space wizards with laser swords who can conduct electricity and they all fly around in spaceships and floating vehicles, I feel that these are the least of our worries.

One of the keys to enjoying star wars though is that it forces the audience to accept some unrealistic principles, which once they are moved past, the rest is rather enjoyable, provided the limits are not pushed to far, which the sequels did in a way.

Edited by Stuartn

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21 minutes ago, Stuartn said:

For point 4, one of Newton's laws is that an object would remain in motion unless acted upon by another force. There is no drag, friction or gravity in space, so assuming that the bombs were pushed out of the bomb bay by some unseen but likely existing mechanism, rather than freefalling, they would remain on the downward trajectory constantly. I am no astrophysicist so I may be wrong though.

For the rest I completely agree.

One nitpick I have is that starfighters bank when turning. Banking is due to gravity which doesn't exist in space, also there should be no noise. And if they can build a planet sized space station, why on earth haven't they invented the guided missile?

Though considering the main storyline is a about space wizards who can practice telekinesis and fly around a galaxy faster than the speed of light and destroy a planet sized battle station which can destroy another planet, aided by aliens, and ghosts and talking robots and fight against other space wizards with laser swords who can conduct electricity and they all fly around in spaceships and floating vehicles, I feel that these are the least of our worries.

One of the keys to enjoying star wars though is that it forces the audience to accept some unrealistic principles, which once they are moved past, the rest is rather enjoyable, provided the limits are not pushed to far, which the sequels did in a way.

My only reaction to your point 4- yes valid point - but the bombs simply "dropped" - didn't see anything pushing them - unless you want to pull a "there was anti-grav plating on the ship itself" that gave it a "nudge" - which gets into a very massive complex discussion that may not be appropriate here lol.

In any case - yes....totally agree.

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20 minutes ago, Kage Goomba said:

My only reaction to your point 4- yes valid point - but the bombs simply "dropped" - didn't see anything pushing them - unless you want to pull a "there was anti-grav plating on the ship itself" that gave it a "nudge" - which gets into a very massive complex discussion that may not be appropriate here lol.

In any case - yes....totally agree.

Nothing as fancy as antigrav; it's just a magnetic accelerator, according to the Incredible Cross-Sections book. That's tech that already exists, so it's quite reasonable that it would be cheap and efficient in SW.

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18 minutes ago, Kdapt-Preacher said:

Nothing as fancy as antigrav; it's just a magnetic accelerator, according to the Incredible Cross-Sections book. That's tech that already exists, so it's quite reasonable that it would be cheap and efficient in SW.

At least that explanation makes good sense - I can live with that. :)

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Does anyone else have a problem with their Gunship on Bag 4 where the cannon extensions don't have enough clutch to stay on the cannons?

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14 minutes ago, Gremer2 said:

Does anyone else have a problem with their Gunship on Bag 4 where the cannon extensions don't have enough clutch to stay on the cannons?

Is it the connection between the half ball and half pin, half pin and long bar, or long bar and the end pin hole connector?

For any of those, I'm guessing you just got a part with weirdly low tolerance (this has happened to me before with pins). I'd replace the half pin with another from your collection. If you don't have a spare long bar or half ball, lego will send you one for free most likely.

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4 minutes ago, Mandalorianknight said:

Is it the connection between the half ball and half pin, half pin and long bar, or long bar and the end pin hole connector?

For any of those, I'm guessing you just got a part with weirdly low tolerance (this has happened to me before with pins). I'd replace the half pin with another from your collection. If you don't have a spare long bar or half ball, lego will send you one for free most likely.

It's the long bar, and then the two round connectors(?), one 2L and one 1L connected with a black pin. 

 

I just got a different black pin from my dismantled Mando Starfighter and it worked fine. None of the ones from the actual Gunship, including spares, had enough clutch.

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1 hour ago, Gremer2 said:

Does anyone else have a problem with their Gunship on Bag 4 where the cannon extensions don't have enough clutch to stay on the cannons?

I had one...but I had a spare part that fixed that. Course in the end I wired it for Led's and that by definition anchored it lol.

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6 hours ago, Kdapt-Preacher said:

Nothing as fancy as antigrav; it's just a magnetic accelerator, according to the Incredible Cross-Sections book. That's tech that already exists, so it's quite reasonable that it would be cheap and efficient in SW.

Although, you can see in the film that there is artificial gravity within the bomb bay anyway, with the falling launch control button etc. so doesn't even need that explanation (although I guess the bombs lower down the bay would not be falling for long before leaving the ship, so might need a little extra push).

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17 hours ago, Stuartn said:

One nitpick I have is that starfighters bank when turning. Banking is due to gravity which doesn't exist in space, also there should be no noise. And if they can build a planet sized space station, why on earth haven't they invented the guided missile?

 

Banking isn't due to gravity, per se. Very indirectly, in the sense that gravity creates atmospheres, but not really otherwise. Banking causes turning because the angle of the airfoil creates lift, which literally pulls the airplane around its turn. Starfighters don't really have airfoils like airplanes, and so they wouldn't behave that way in space or atmosphere. SW Starfighters also have another big physics problem: They slow down in space without any kind of reverse thrusters. How is that possible? In atmosphere, it's caused by drag, but again... no atmosphere = no drag.

Oh, and space is completely silent. You can't hear sounds from explosions or other ships because there's no atmosphere to transmit the sound waves.

But again, these were all intentional decisions made by George Lucas. So... before you criticize the fake physics of the ST, remember that you're actually upset with George, not Rian or JJ.

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15 minutes ago, autolycus said:

Banking isn't due to gravity, per se. Very indirectly, in the sense that gravity creates atmospheres, but not really otherwise. Banking causes turning because the angle of the airfoil creates lift, which literally pulls the airplane around its turn. Starfighters don't really have airfoils like airplanes, and so they wouldn't behave that way in space or atmosphere. SW Starfighters also have another big physics problem: They slow down in space without any kind of reverse thrusters. How is that possible? In atmosphere, it's caused by drag, but again... no atmosphere = no drag.

Oh, and space is completely silent. You can't hear sounds from explosions or other ships because there's no atmosphere to transmit the sound waves.

But again, these were all intentional decisions made by George Lucas. So... before you criticize the fake physics of the ST, remember that you're actually upset with George, not Rian or JJ.

I'd not be so quick to say it was George....he pretty much walked away from this and let Disney have their way last I checked.
yes he gets credit...but I seriously doubt he's hands on anymore.

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16 minutes ago, Kage Goomba said:

I'd not be so quick to say it was George....he pretty much walked away from this and let Disney have their way last I checked.
yes he gets credit...but I seriously doubt he's hands on anymore.

You missed my point entirely: George made the decision to have the space combat within the SW universe look like WW2 air combat. He made that decision in 1975-1976. JJ and Rian were just following his lead on that. The bombers in TLJ were quite intentionally an homage to WW2 bombers, just like the star fighter combat sequences in the OT were an homage to WW2 air combat. Lucas literally showed footage of Spitfires, Messerschmidts, Zeros, and various US fighters to his FX crew so they knew what he wanted ANH's combat to look like.

Quote

As VFX artist Paul Huston described the shot in the book Star Wars Storyboards: The Original Trilogy, “[An artist] would show me a shot of a Japanese Zero flying left to right in front of a conning tower of an aircraft carrier and say, ‘The aircraft carrier is the Death Star, the Zero is an X-wing. Do a board like that.’ ”

 

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2 minutes ago, autolycus said:

You missed my point entirely: George made the decision to have the space combat within the SW universe look like WW2 air combat. He made that decision in 1975-1976. JJ and Rian were just following his lead on that. The bombers in TLJ were quite intentionally an homage to WW2 bombers, just like the star fighter combat sequences in the OT were an homage to WW2 air combat. Lucas literally showed footage of Spitfires, Messerschmidts, Zeros, and various US fighters to his FX crew so they knew what he wanted ANH's combat to look like.

 

And you missed my point - George Lucas may have come up with the concepts and stories for the originals/prequels but that doesn't mean George made the call to do it the way they did it in the new movies - not by a long shot.

They where making their own conclusions based on what George did in the previous movies. That much is clear with the insanity of various things they did throughout the series. Excluding Rogue One and possibly (possibly!) Solo (which have their own issues but nothing as stark as the new movies)

Therefore - blaming George - isn't going to fly in my book.
Hell - I don't think JJ and company even had a say in it either. JJ's work generally is of much better quality imho. Or at least it was. :P :)

And yes its all subjective - but I can't fault George Lucas for all of it just because his name is in the credits :poke:

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25 minutes ago, Kage Goomba said:

And you missed my point - George Lucas may have come up with the concepts and stories for the originals/prequels but that doesn't mean George made the call to do it the way they did it in the new movies - not by a long shot.

They where making their own conclusions based on what George did in the previous movies. That much is clear with the insanity of various things they did throughout the series. Excluding Rogue One and possibly (possibly!) Solo (which have their own issues but nothing as stark as the new movies)

 Therefore - blaming George - isn't going to fly in my book.
Hell - I don't think JJ and company even had a say in it either. JJ's work generally is of much better quality imho. Or at least it was. :P :)

 And yes its all subjective - but I can't fault George Lucas for all of it just because his name is in the credits :poke:

I mean, by this logic, you should be giving JJ and Rian credit for using lightsabers because they didn't have to follow George's lead but were instead making their own decisions completely independent of what George did. George established a specific set of physics and style for the space combat and the physics associated with it--that of WW2 air combat, which was clearly done in atmosphere rather than in space. JJ and Rian simply followed that. Suggesting otherwise shows a pretty grotesque bias toward just finding as many unfair criticisms to pile on as possible.

Think of the alternative: JJ or Rian deciding to completely reinvent the way combat happens in space to make it more physically realistic. That would mean radically different ship designs -- probably something more podlike with thrusters on all sides with built-in robot pilots instead of the absurd astromech droids that George created. It would mean no swooping, no "blasters", etc. etc.

 

Edit to add: Anyway, as much fun as it is to debate this, I think we're ok just disagreeing on it, so I won't add any more. Fire away with the last word, just make sure you stay on target. :wink:

Edited by autolycus

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2 minutes ago, autolycus said:

I mean, by this logic, you should be giving JJ and Rian credit for using lightsabers because they didn't have to follow George's lead but were instead making their own decisions completely independent of what George did. George established a specific set of physics and style for the space combat and the physics associated with it--that of WW2 air combat, which was clearly done in atmosphere rather than in space. JJ and Rian simply followed that. Suggesting otherwise shows a pretty grotesque bias toward just finding as many unfair criticisms to pile on as possible.

Think of the alternative: JJ or Rian deciding to completely reinvent the way combat happens in space to make it more physically realistic. That would mean radically different ship designs -- probably something more podlike with thrusters on all sides with built-in robot pilots instead of the absurd astromech droids that George created. It would mean no swooping, no "blasters", etc. etc.

 

Edit to add: Anyway, as much fun as it is to debate this, I think we're ok just disagreeing on it, so I won't add any more. Fire away with the last word, just make sure you stay on target. :wink:

If all it is - is a matter of following George's lead? Then yes - that's my point.

Because frankly - it would have been consistent and would have made it better.

The new movies where way off target - across the galaxy imho.

To be honest in my case it was never a question of realism - just keeping things more Star Wars and less...whatever that was. I was content with George Lucas's fantasy world of Star Wars for all of its errors/weirdness/crazy.

New Movies just kind of.....over did it? Or Ignored it.

Now you want to talk realism?

Go check out "The Expanse" - that's pretty damn close.
No Shields - no fancy tech like "anti-grav" - not even Armor plating (cause Rail Guns say "lol")

Now if only they didn't cheapen on the effects in the last seasons. But I digress. :)
Should go see if there are some good Expanse Lego MOCs...tempting.

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17 minutes ago, Kage Goomba said:


Should go see if there are some good Expanse Lego MOCs...tempting.

There are, indeed, some Expanse models on Rebrickable and Brickvault. (OK, that's REALLY my last response to you for today! :) Have a great weekend!

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16 hours ago, Gremer2 said:

It's the long bar, and then the two round connectors(?), one 2L and one 1L connected with a black pin. 

 

I just got a different black pin from my dismantled Mando Starfighter and it worked fine. None of the ones from the actual Gunship, including spares, had enough clutch.

Yeah, most tolerance issues I have are with newer black pins. no idea why.

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21 hours ago, Kage Goomba said:

3: 2nd of the new movies - Large Dreadnought starts firing its main guns - laser shots are "arc'ing" in space....yeah 'nough said.

4: Bombs mysteriously dropping in space with no obvious gravity or propulsion (2nd movie again).

I hate the last jedi more than anyone else, but this complaint is invalid. They are directly above a planet, gravity is in full effect.

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3 minutes ago, Brikkyy13 said:

I hate the last jedi more than anyone else, but this complaint is invalid. They are directly above a planet, gravity is in full effect.

If you call that "directly" - id have concerns about your spatial reasoning. :) Watch it again (yes I'm aware you will need a barf bag - your hatred is shared)

I'm aware that Gravity will cause light to bend - but THAT Much? no.... (and yes physics in star wars are a "lol" but there's just no reason for this)

A turbolaser is a turbolaser is a turbolaser - even a "bigger" one - just fire the damn gun and be done with it. Why they had to put flourish on it..... ugh.


As for the bombs? This was explained in an earlier post. Mag-catapult/mechanism - shoves the bombs out the bay and let inertia do the rest - even if its a stretch albeit poor taste - but I can live with it.

Planet gravity would have pulled them away at an angle even then as it was at their "backside" metaphorically speaking so gravity's pull would have little to no effect - I know this because hyperspace wouldn't have worked inside a gravity well - which they ignored in a later movie with skipping (not touching that nuclear subject) so yeah....they tend to ignore the "star wars rules of tech" too often.

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