SD100 Posted June 14, 2019 I finally purchased all the Power Functions components I needed to motorize and light a duel Horizon Express set. I replaced the *lead* trucks in each power car with motors, one running off a long extension cord, all one battery box, one IR receiver. So far its just derail city. I have jacobs bogies under all the coaches, and I primarily derail on the coaches end trucks (that connect to the power car), but half as much as that the motors come off the rails. Is there a "best" set up that people have found, or some ideas that would help this train actually run? I just finished reading every topic I could find via the search feature and it seems that the derailing is mentioned, but not really solved. Thanks everyone. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Toastie Posted June 14, 2019 Hmmm. My HE consisting of two sets has two motors (one 9V w/ power pickup and one PF motor) + PF light all in one engine. The other engine is not motorized. At least when the motorized engine is pulling the entire consists it never derails. Some people are worried about the different characteristics of the two motors - but: Never had problems at all. I don't know about having the engine pushing the other cars - never tried. Sometimes I have issues on other trains (= derailing) when the wires from the PF motors cannot move freely enough upon negotiating curves or particularly switches. The motors need to pivot without much resetting forces coming from the (rather stiff as compared to 9V) PF wires. I believe that this issue may even be more severe, when a motor in the back is pushing the front section with a motor already loosing some contact with the track. But I am just guessing. Good luck with your HE! Thorsten Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JopieK Posted June 14, 2019 I also think you can solve it best using Powered Up! I still need to build my second HE. Probably in the coming summer vacation... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
ALCO Posted June 14, 2019 I agree with @Toastie that your issue is that you have one end of your train pulling, and the other end pushing it. This might work great if you had a heavy train going over a steep grade, but I don't believe this is the case. I had thought about doing your setup with my extended (2 copies) of 60051. Now, from your post I will not do this. If you got a pole-reverser and put your 2nd motor in the front so just the front of your train is powered, then I think you will eliminate your problem. You can still use the long wire light the end unit. I would be careful to have your wire run through the connection between coaches in end so that the wide side of the wire is facing the right and left sides of your train. In this orientation, it will flex with the curves and switches better. PoweredUp is a good idea if you don't mind pushing two buttons at the same time. As of yet there is no way to control two different hubs from the same side of the controller. There are 3rd party solutions to this if you wanted to be pure. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
TuffTuffTuff Posted June 14, 2019 (edited) Tried the same setup but ended with two motors in only one engine, because pushing and pulling is bad on curves, switches, inclines etc. Now I just have to be bit carefull when pushing. Some weight in the front engine without motors helps. I still have some derail issues due to the light cables, e.g. on double curves. I will try to give them a bit more space. Edited June 14, 2019 by TuffTuffTuff Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
JopieK Posted June 14, 2019 1 hour ago, ALCO said: I agree with @Toastie that your issue is that you have one end of your train pulling, and the other end pushing it. This might work great if you had a heavy train going over a steep grade, but I don't believe this is the case. I had thought about doing your setup with my extended (2 copies) of 60051. Now, from your post I will not do this. If you got a pole-reverser and put your 2nd motor in the front so just the front of your train is powered, then I think you will eliminate your problem. You can still use the long wire light the end unit. I would be careful to have your wire run through the connection between coaches in end so that the wide side of the wire is facing the right and left sides of your train. In this orientation, it will flex with the curves and switches better. PoweredUp is a good idea if you don't mind pushing two buttons at the same time. As of yet there is no way to control two different hubs from the same side of the controller. There are 3rd party solutions to this if you wanted to be pure. So then maybe the best suggestion would be to just motorise the two bogies on one and and put some weight blocks inside it! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Eaglefan344 Posted June 14, 2019 Mine has a motor, battery box, and IR receiver in each loco. Polarity switch on the rear one. I haven't had many issues with derailing as long as it's going a reasonable speed. I don't have the extra jacob's bogeys so maybe that's the issue? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
LEGO Train 12 Volts Posted June 14, 2019 Personally I have two PF engines on the first locomotive and on the last one I put the standar train trolleys without technical axes Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SD100 Posted June 15, 2019 I've seen multiple sources saying the jacobs bogies help with stability, and I have tried it both ways. Having the cars articulated like that reduced the problems derailing between the carriages there but seemed to make it worse on the power cars and between them and the coaches. I've got to try putting a loaded battery box in the second power car, and then just the two motors in one power car and see what produces better results. It sure sounds like running two separate IR receivers works better than having a wire but I'm wondering if that's because the wire binds the cars up... Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
dr_spock Posted June 15, 2019 I was able to get away with one powered engine on level track after I replaced the two passenger car non-jacob bogies with a jacob bogie and the technic axle bogie on the second engine with the wheels from one of the non-jacob bogie. Basically reducing rolling resistance on the train. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Duq Posted June 16, 2019 When does it derail? I'm guessing when the front engine goes into a turn and slows down while the rear keeps pushing at a higher speed. Do you have rubber bands on all motor wheels? It might help to remove the rubber on one side of your engine, that might make it slow down less in turns. If that doesn't help, go with Toastie and just put the motors on one end of the train. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
legotownlinz Posted June 16, 2019 I never had derailing issues with the dual Horizon Express setup. I have one motor in each power car and a layout with inclines/declines. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
SD100 Posted June 17, 2019 What position are your motors in and are they linked by wire or do you use two receivers? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Toxic43 Posted June 17, 2019 My setup is two PF train motors in the lead loco and a pole reverse switch to make both run in the same direction, along with a set of PF lights. With those two motors in the front, I can pull the whole train to full speed on fresh batteries. Reversing is a different matter. If I have to reverse, it's slow speeds and no harsh switch negotiations. I find as long as the track is smoothed out, I have no issues in reverse. I had planned to put another two motors in the rear loco and another battery box, but it just doesn't need it. When my youngest is old enough to not need to separate it all the time due to wanting "just the carriages", I'll run a PF extension to the rear, a set of lights and some red cheese slopes for the full effect. A worthwhile mod for your lead loco is below also: Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
legotownlinz Posted June 17, 2019 16 hours ago, SD100 said: What position are your motors in and are they linked by wire or do you use two receivers? Everything as described in the instructions but with the motor polarity swapped in one motor. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
