kurigan

At first I wasn't going to comment, my initial reaction being something like: "big deal". But I'm glad I took a closer look. You actually added a lot of detail to the old girl, and I rather like it. My favorite has to be those arms used for chains; they really look the part. Also, do I spy the gunner (my sig-fig) on the quarter deck? Hope they don't get lost. Nice! He must be what convinced me to swap out the guns. Thanks for sharing, it brightened my day.

Oh this is a fun conversation... *evil grin* Though the external appearance of the pre-fab Lego guns (on land they are cannons but once afloat they are guns) is convincingly detailed and easily satisfying their bore size is quite a bit over sized for historical use. Since we've already set the vessel in question in the 19th century and since there is so much data on that time frame lets run with that assumption for this argument as well. At that time the largest guns afloat were only found on the lower decks of the largest ships of the line. Some fired as big as a 42lb round shot (cannon ball) but most were no larger than 36s. A 42lb iron shot measures just shy of 7" in diameter (6.68). Hold a ruler up to your chest and measure 7". Then hold a 3062b up to a mini-fig's chest and note the difference. It's a little bit bigger to the figure no doubt, but considering the strange proportions of mini-figs its a reasonable comparison. By bore size, Lego guns can't be less than the largest guns of the day, 42lb-ers. QED, unless your building a ship of the line, you really don't need pre-fab Lego guns. Arn't i just an annoying little know-it-all? There are myriad designs out there for brick built guns which are often a lot more scale appropriate, even if less visually impacting. I've assembled several batteries of varying sizes using different, common, bricks. The most useful, has to be the a fore mentioned 3062b since they can be two different sizes by turning them one way or the other. An interesting bit of data/reference http://www.arc.id.au/Cannonballs.html I believe that at one point an attempt at a brick-built gun index was started but there were so many different designs it became pointless and confusing.

This might be fungo participate in but most of my guys are custom.

Thanks! It's been a long time in development. I'd been fascinated (perhaps "haunted" is a better word) by Slyowel's original for years. I tried so many other methods to try and achive a similar effect and nothing quite worked. The most surprising thing about this technique is its stability. Thouse shrouds are actually taught and providing support. It does have its limitations though. I chose to maker a schooner, in part, because I couldn't get her bow any bluffer. The plastic just wouldn't bend any tighter with out deforming. There are also gaps between the deck and the hull, that just have to be there. It's a good technique for small, late period hulls, but I can't quite figure any descent way to simulate sheer or counter with it. As for the town, civic development suffers as I tend to focus time and resources on my fleet. Those four buildings are new in the last year tough ( I've been lurking around Historic Themes and Classic Castle trying to absorb new techniques.) It is defiantly one of those things that may never be done. P.S. is anyone still keeping the index?

Indeed I cannot deny it. Perhaps if I didn't keep rehashing old ground I might make some forward progress. Since I've no deadline or venue to accommodate though, I think I'll just content myself with my meager fleet for as long as it takes... or I die. Hulls are defiantly more fun but good rigging is so rewarding. Incredibly frustrating at times, but rewarding. There were a couple of times my wife came hurrying down stairs alarmed by the blasphemy I hurled at Nuisance for her defiance of natural law (hence the name, harmless but oh so annoying). However, when I had her all prepped and hoisted her main sail, trimmed her sheets and put her before the wind (fans) my spirits lifted and it all felt worth it. Of course when it came time to change the set of her sails and take some different images I'd had enough of fiddeling in tight quaters with tweezers and forceps, so just put her back in port. I showed some of this in my profile, but that's a bit out of the way. Why I bothered is; for one, because I too find it fascinating, but also because when I look back at some of my old offerings here, I wonder that people don't think I'm something like a broken record. If you follow along with the history here it all makes a bit more sense. There is method to the madness. What's more though, is I actually care. Don't ask me why, but actually want to contribute to the enrichment of this community. It's such a unique place and such a singular craft, Lego ship building. It's not that I want everyone to be like me, or build like me, but if I can be inspirational, it all feels a lot more worth the while. The thing to take away form this is that there are still places to go with ship design/technique and it doesn't have to involve a professional level brick collection.

Welcome! What an interesting note to introduce yourself on. Though this be the "pirates" forum, we appreciate all manner of period sailing ships. After all, if every one were pirates there'd be no booty. I personally like to see some non-men-of-war from time to time. You've got some intriguing elements and parts usage in there. The doors used for the head is an interesting detail and looks very whaler like. In fact her lines are all very whaler like. If I may make a suggestion; though the ginger-bread-work on her transom is particularly nice, I'd knock the stern cabin off entirely. It's a bit much for a 19th century vessel. I'm thinking of something more like Charles W. Morgan my self. There it is, do with it as you will, she a nice MOC either way. Thanks for sharing!

On display at Arizona Science Center is a Lego built schooner, of the variety popular at the turn of the last century. I found a rather low resolution image of it while killing time on google. There isn't much about her out there, that I could find, as to who built her, etc. About all I can be sure of is that the model is a permanent part of an exhibit called "Lego Travel Adventure". Why she stood out to me and why I'm broaching the topic here, is her brick/built sails. The real world viability of brick built sails, likes we've seen on Dunkleosteus' LDD fleet most recently, has been a topic of interest here several times in the past. from what I could make out the model in question seems to be supporting just such sails with little non-Lego or unconventional techniques. It would bee a boon to the community if we could pick the brain of her creator or some one who could observe her more closely. Is any one here able to shed some light on this mystery? The best image I found:

Thanks! They're pretty much mixed in here on my old photobucket.

UPDATE November 2nd 2019 I told myself I wouldn’t start another hull until I was done with my current queue of MOCs, but I just couldn’t resist. After all the fun I had trying to finish Nuisance, I’ve been just a bit tired of sewing and rigging. Instead as I sat there watching Scorpion (the 4th edition) continue to collect dust, with her crew stoically awaiting completion or reconstruction of their ship, I just kind of snapped. I liked the old hull, but it just needed to be redone. The style, with which it was built, was good and rather conventional but ultimately inferior to the newer one I’ve adopted and adapted. I grabbed a few shots for posterity and reference and began tearing hull. A few hours later I was ready to pass out and had little to show, I went to bed feeling defeated and a little guilty. A couple of days later I came back to the table determined to right the wrong and reduced the old hull down to individual bricks. With the components sorted and accounted for I was in a better place and much more up for the challenge. I’d like to say I did the responsible thing and quit at a reasonable hour, but honestly I became a bit obsessed and in the wee hours, finally stopped work. Rather impressed with myself, I used my cell phone camera to grab a few shots and this is what I had. She’ll be a 16 gun brig ( 2more ports were added in the bows after the images were taken), a sloop in the Royal Navy under command of my own Charles Finley. Finley is my own fictional character who briefly commanded two previous Scorpions, the original brig and the later post ship. When construction was started on the new hull, I wasn’t sure if I’d be settling for another schooner or if a brig was going to be a possibility. At this stage I’m convinced rigging a schooner on this hull is right-out and have decided she must be a brig. The old battery, made up of something like 12s, is being recycled from the 4th hull. I’m considering adding a quarter (really poop) deck and stern cabin, but I’m not sure. Some of the Cruizer Class had cabins added aft, but it wasn’t part of the original design. Then again, this isn’t an exact model any way. For the sake of my fiction it’d be nice if Finley could have a cabin, since he’s essentially taking a demotion just to have a ship to command, but not at all necessary. If it would ruin the lines of the ship I’d rather not, but I like the idea of having one otherwise. What say you all? Now just for fun The History of Scorpion: The first 12 gun brig was a rather rudimentary model. It was a first attempt to recapture my lost skill with a very limited supply of bricks. In universe she was sailed to her station but was shortly thereafter deemed unseaworthy, having been much abused and sadly, sent to the knackers’ yard. Much of her timbers were reused on later iterations. The second Scorpion was intended to be a replacement for the aged brig but never sailed under that name. She was cutter rigged and had half as many guns as her predecessor, but a slightly more refined technique was used. After being abandoned for a time, in favor of a more suitable replacement, the hull was recycled into what would become Narthex. Though slated for a re-dux, Narthex is still with in service. http://www.eurobrick...showtopic=59351 The third rendition was a grand experiment in a new technique, intended to stretch my brick supply as far as possible. The ambitious project, had it worked out, would have resulted in a 20 gun post ship, but it was far too fragile. The entire concept relied on gravity and quite a bit of SNOT to stay together. After the second time it was dashed on the floor the design was abandoned. In the grander story, she too never sailed. While fitting out for sea, she was blown up as an act of revenge by pirates. In both reality and fiction she took the cutter Hawk, which had been serving as a test bed for the same techniques, with her. http://www.eurobrick...c=66085&hl=hawk http://www.eurobrick...showtopic=59877 The fourth iteration was yet again a complete experiment in technique. Intended more to “stick it to” my detractors, the exercise served to open my eyes to significant new possibilities. As has become my wont, much of the initial concept was inspired by other works here, but to serve my needs required refinement and ingenuity. The result was intriguing and I took it rather far, but still put it aside unfinished. Even though this hull was never complete and a yet another replacement is in the works, she was written in to the tale and the role she played stands. The details will simply be adjusted to accommodate the few differences between the two vessels. The fifth, and perhaps final, version uses my latest technique and has created a rather impressive effect even at this early stage. Though I had hoped this one could have been more of a direct model of the Cruizer Class, it would require a significantly greater investment in bricks (money) and I just can’t afford that at this juncture. Instead I’ll pour my heart in to yet another historically reverent interpretation, based mostly on the Cruizer Class, of which there was a famous Scorpion in the same historic timeframe.

Not at all, I see no market for my particular brand anyway. Something which bugs me about this though; its billed as having been built by Lego, but why would Lego promote their product by sawing, gluing and painting pieces? The whole thing is rather intriguing and a bit curious.

I respect and support that. A little character is usually a good thing any way

Thanks everyone! You have a good eye and ask good questions, Mr. Townsend. The hoops on the mainsail, are actually O-rings, another recycled part from past projects. It’s one of those things where I just cold not find a Lego made part that would work. I'd tend to agree on the pennant staff if it was a permanent part of the ship, but it was just a last minute idea to show the wind blowing. Since she’s not a man-o-war, nor a national ship she wouldn't likely fly a pennant, but for the sake of the images I jammed one in the rigging. Indeed I do cheat a bit with dowel in the masts and spars. I would go the same rout as you with flex tube save for two reasons. 1. I don't have any, yet I do have dowel. 2. I foresee the same troubles you complain of, they flex. What would be great is the same material as light saber blades, but in longer lengths, perhaps to be cut to size. To my knowledge such does not exist so dowel it will be for now. On future projects I want to try the technic connector method. As for scaling, it's hard to place. Snake, Ramcat, the Green Schooner, etc. are intended to be illusion scale, or something like it. For the most part they come close. The smaller craft are even harder to place. Though they could fit in to that same scale, they can also be considered a bit smaller. Adder for instance, by herself could very well be a period fishing ketch. She’d be on the small end of the spectrum but still a reasonable size boat for a family operation; 2-4crew. Her gun however seems to betray her actual scale. It represents something, in my own system, between a 12 and an 18 pounder. To the mini-figs it's pretty well to scale, but to her hull, that’s a lot of iron to float. The Fishing Sloop is much the same, but without a frame of reference it fails to matter. On Nuisance here things are a bit more dubious. If she were to scale, even with the tiny Bee she was inspired by, a mini-fig would be able to walk for to aft without turning sideways to fit between obstructions. Since she is not a model of any particular ship and more of an interpretation we can simply assume she is to scale in whatever idiom we put her. If nuisance were true to Mini-fig illusion scale she would be no smaller to my Green Schooner than Bee is to her sister ship Tecumseh. Though they don't look terrible interacting, the size difference is quite daunting. It's like putting Pickle next to Victory. Where nuisance and the others look proportional is up against the quay side of my ever developing port town. A size comparison for my latest ship MOCs My small hulls in port.

Well, take it with a grain of salt. If its as old as you theorize, it was long before Bricklink, Shapeways and Eurobricks. Who ever built it was on their own to supply parts and solutions. I don't much care for the painted, cut, glued or drilled pieces my self, but you have to respect the scope if the thing. It doesn't appear to me to be built to commission. It has the pallor of a personal indulgence, modified over time. She could defiantly use some TLC and a good dusting as well. Though there is plenty to wonder about and criticize on the model with out the benefit of the original builder in the conversation, I'm more stunned at the price it's going for. I'd never believe that there would be a market for Lego model ships, as such, but here it is. If this one can garner $1800 American, what can some of the newer, more refined, builds around here fetch?

I found ths on a random Google search when I was bored. Was any one else aware of this before? http://toysnbricks.com/lego-dragen-ship-danish-navy/

Im a little surprised my self that I've not yet commented on any of your LDD series. I used to have quite the LDD fleet myself and usually try to show support to my roots. This one may be your best yet. It's certainly not the largest or grandest but seems the most stylistic. I just plane like everything about her, from her color scheme and ginger/break-work, to her shape and historic reverence (a subject which is no secret dear to my heart). I too wonder about the feasibility of building her in living plastic and how heavy those brick built sails would really be.

I like the black! I think she's rally starting to look like a proper man-o-war. No longer all flash and pomp but a tough fighting ship take her licks and give better than she receives. Indeed the hammock getting is a fine touch, purism be damed! I wonder about the gun port at the waste, will they be staying open? It seems she'd still benefit from flaps there to keep the seas out.

170D Nuisance is a small, early 19th century schooner the like favored by smugglers for its shallow draught. With less hull below the water, small ships like these can sail in shallower water and over obstructions that larger ships cannot, opening up a lot more options for ports. In my story her name derived (tongue in cheek) from the local’s perception of the level of threat she poses and the behavior of her crew. In actuality I named her Nuisance because after months on end of struggling to finish her, that’s exactly what she became. The project started, perhaps a year or so ago when I was experimenting with different hull building techniques. Initially she was never meant to be a complete MOC but I just kept adding on until I was at a point I just couldn’t bring myself to give up. The hull is a little more than inspired by SlyOwel’s “Pimp Your IMPT” contest entry. Much of the rigging and some other parts came from the wreck of Raven and the sails are yet another attempt at sail making for the sake of function. Some of the images were taken in front of some fans to fill her sails with wind. Once I had figured out SlyOwel’s technique I started realizing its potential for small hull building and decided to expand on it for an even more realistic shape. From there I began scrounging up cast-off parts from other projects and decided I could afford a schooner. To design her rig I first looked at the schooner Bee, a replica very much of the same style and era of my own Nuisance. I didn’t entirely like her rig with only one topmast, so some of it wound up coming for other inspiration as well. The overall effect is pretty impressive but imperfect. I like her and she’ll serve her purpose well. Purest may grumble at some of her elements but aside from the wooden dowel, which I’ve defended more than one on other MOCs, there’s really nothing involved that not used in Official Lego sets. For the moment I need to concentrate on my other projects so I’ll call this one done and move on. In the future I want to revisit this technique. I’m not sure how necessary the rubber bands and shrouds (2541) actually are. I’m also planning a comic showcasing Nuisance in her role as a smuggler, but I don’t know when I’ll be able to get it. As always there are a lot more pictures on my photo bucket. Question, comment, etc. welcome. I resolved weeks ago, to get her finished and posted just to do my part and help revive activity around here, so enjoy.

It looks as though this could be a really good start, it's just too early to tell much. There is a long road ahead, but I'd encourage you to keep with it. The one thing I can't stress enough is, reference material. Weather you're simply using images off google, period drafts or some where in between, having something to compare to if not model after is invaluable. I find the proposed placement of her guns curious. It's not unheard of, but was uncommon to have the battery so divided. It seems more conventional to continue along the gun deck before moving up to the quarter deck. I like this DPW/Pickle hull type and the shape it gives. I once looked to it my self for inspiration when reconsidering my technique. I might suggest the addition of some 3937c01 to the sides to give her some tumble home. As for the gaps below deck, consider a SNOT deck. It may not completely eliminate gaps, but using plates to stagger closer to the walls they could get unnoticeably small. Keep at it, thanks for sharing and if I can help, let me know.

Here-here! Bumpers boys and no heel taps for Hispaniola! A lovely bark and a fine recreation of her cinematic inspiration. A wonderful addition to our index she'll surly make. Success, fair winds and following seas may they be her constant companions. This truly is a great build. Certainly there are areas where further refinement wouldn't go amiss, but no where I'd suggest it'd be necessary. In profile she is the spitting image of Bounty/Hispaniola. Her lack of gun ports is indeed rare in these parts and a refreshing take. Though the understated gallery astern may seem simplistic I find it compliments the build perfectly. I might suggest that some more photos of her finer points and detail could only further her acclaim. Thank you for sharing her with us! P.S. I'm a fan of "Treasure Island" myself, but have yet to see this rendition. Clearly I must remedy this as soon as possible. Have you seen the recent adaptation available on Netflix starring Eddie Izzard as Silver? It's really quite entertaining and Izzard's portrayal of that infamous pirate is fascinating.

Well since its been bumped, might as well get on the band wagon... This is truly beautiful work. Instantly recognizable. I'm glad this resurfaced as I might never have had the privilege. Thanks.

OK, that's honestly pretty epic. like everyone I'd love to see her sail. Now i have to wonder about the feasibility of a mono hull, particularly a square rigger.

I really like this build. Over all it’s just a nice ship. If there is one thing I don’t like about her, it’s the stern gallery, seems less refined than the rest. As for the shape, color scheme, level of detail, etc. I love it. I don’t want to throw around words like “historic” or “accurate” too much but, there’s a lot of effort to that effect in there and it shows. The rigging is actually pretty clever. I’ve seen, heck I’ve used worse solutions. One question though: that brick at the center of your neat little brick built guns; the one with the post which holds the barrel up. What brick is that? Do I spy a Mega Block? *gasp* Thanks for sharing her!

not sure what you mean here. if you mean to continue the tumble home, no i suppose not, but don't see why you would. if anything the curve should be the other way on the bow. In any case the curve on two dimensions would conflict to either, cause the bricks to cover over one another or leave gaps between them respectively. I think you mean like a flush deck similar to Constellation, where the single deck very much follows the sheer (vertical curve along the length of the ship). Yes, but to so would be difficult and require a lot of under structure. Essentially you'd be doing something very similar to Revenge. I had thought of using tape or stickers on the inner wall to add color, likely red (as purest every where grit their teeth). That would certainly bring that element back to the project, but I thought it more a thing for a proper man-of-war. The only other color that would look right would be more gray and why bother? I think the green works, but perhaps I'll try some red on the inner gun flaps.

To avoid cracking I'd suggest drilling a pilot hole. Use a smaller bit than the final hole first and go slowly. Then work up in stages to the intended diameter. To avoid slipping make a divot. If it were metal or wood I'd suggest a spring loaded center punch, but that might be too powerful and crack the torso itself. You could use a sharp nail and tap it lightly but still be careful not to apply too much force.

What's been bugging me is indeed the optical illusion created be the side galleries. As you said before, I'm sure it's just that, an illusion. What I think reinforces the illusion, though, is the sheer. With out being able to count studs down the length of the ship I can't be sure, but it would seem in that image, the galleries should be one plate higher than the gun port ahead of it (perhaps that whole section). Now I doubt that's the kind of thing that could be changed at this stage (I wouldn't want to tear hull at this point to be sure ) so well just have to call it "character" and move on. They are still some of the best yet. I see this as a function of the inherent problem simulating curvature in Lego.This is essentially a digital medium in which curves tend to represented by sections of straight lines. When the curvature of the hull reaches its zenith it's angle relative to the water line hasn't changed. Despite rising above the height of the waist the member parts are still level. The only ship in recent memory which didn't suffer this has been Revenge (http://www.eurobricks.com/forum/index.php?showtopic=87939), and that's just on a scale and level of intricacy most (all?) of us simply are not ready for. As for the transom windows, those are correct for the period. Easiest reference is Harmonie, the recently completed replica, being of about the same era.