LEGO LotR - general discussion

[Alcarin]

Maybe I'm in the minority, but I hope there's not a huge Minas Tirith set. I'd like it better if there were smaller, more affordable sets, maybe make them so they can connect. I prefer the smaller sets with more minifigs personally. If the set is much over 100 USD, a lot of people like me can't afford to spend that much on legos, though I'd like to. If it was about the same size as Helm's Deep, that'd be fine. In fact, if it was like Helm's Deep with connectable smaller walls, that would probably be really popular. That's what I'm hoping for anyways.

Thats such a popular lie really...

i mean if you can buy 5 x 40$ set over 2 or 3 months you can simply SAVE MONEY and buy 200$ set after 3 months..... its just an illusion of ''cannot afford'' its more being lazy to save money!

Tell me how much LEGO you have in $$$ I bet its alot more than 200$.

[Deathleech]

This, for the most part.

We really need a Gondor army builder on top of that. Very difficult to build a proper army from a small handful of soldiers in a D2C set.

I completely agree. I would even say I prefer a proper Gondor Army builder over a Minas Tirith set. As long as it had Faramir in it, it would be more valuable imo. You can always MOC a Minas Tirith but massing a Gondor force? Not so easy if the soldiers are only available in a $100+ set. Ideally we would get both, an army builder add on and a big set, but if I had to choose I would be fine with a white wall piece that had some Gondor Soldiers and Mordor Orcs.

[Alcarin]

I completely agree. I would even say I prefer a proper Gondor Army builder over a Minas Tirith set. As long as it had Faramir in it, it would be more valuable imo. You can always MOC a Minas Tirith but massing a Gondor force? Not so easy if the soldiers are only available in a $100+ set. Ideally we would get both, an army builder add on and a big set, but if I had to choose I would be fine with a white wall piece that had some Gondor Soldiers and Mordor Orcs.

i dont need mordor orcs in it really.

[kevkipo]

Rotten Tomatoes is a platform that aggregates the review scores of all important US movie critics and determines a score that indicates how many critics gave a positive or negative critique (so a score of 75% means that 75% of the critics gave that certain movie a positive review)

Bias= vooringenomenheid (I know German and Dutch are very closely related, but I still find it amusing how similar some words are )

Personally, I'm among the crowd that enjoys the Hobbit movies just as much as the LOTR ones I always think of them as one franchise

Sounds like an Important site!

And i was kinda stunned when i saw a dutch word :P So "Vooringenomenheid" now i understand :) and yes we are very close related!

Im kinda in that croud too, for me it's just The Hobbit 100% and LOTR %99

Again thanks for explaining!

Well you are entitled to your opinion, but the general consensus does not agree with you. The LotR films all hold a 90%+ fresh rating on Rotten Tomatoes while neither of the two Hobbit movies are above 75%. In fact AUJ is only 65% and DoS is 75% atm. That's a long way off from the 91%, 96%, and 94% FotR, TTT, and RotK hold. Also just because you like AUJ and DoS does not mean you will like TABA unless you are being bias. PJ is adding TONS of his own material so the book and movie versions may end up being quite different.

And i site doesn't tell me that I like a movie or not!

[Legoman123]

Is there any news on more LOTR sets?

[AFOLguy1970]

Thats such a popular lie really...

i mean if you can buy 5 x 40$ set over 2 or 3 months you can simply SAVE MONEY and buy 200$ set after 3 months..... its just an illusion of ''cannot afford'' its more being lazy to save money!

Tell me how much LEGO you have in $$$ I bet its alot more than 200$.

Don't forget that Lego also has kids in mind when they designed these sets. Let's face it, a pirate ship or a Black Gate with the Mouth of Sauron would not be the most wanted sets for AFOLs in general. In fact, that is yet another mistake they made with the pirate ship. Sure, kids like pirate ships, but I do not know many of them who have $100+ to spend in one sitting. The last trip to Walmart revealed a shelf full of pirate ships and a handful of Council of Elronds. Kids typically like to save for smaller and mid range sets, because they do not want to save money for an extended time to get the larger sets. Sure, most of my son's classmates who enjoy Lego would like a pirate ship or an Orthanc, but very few actually have them. That is an awful amount of time and allowance money to invest for one of them to get these.

If there was to be a third wave, and we can only hope, I would expect the usual assortment of price ranges. You could potentially have a $100+ Gondor set, but there would be other offerings as well.

[Alcarin]

Don't forget that Lego also has kids in mind when they designed these sets. Let's face it, a pirate ship or a Black Gate with the Mouth of Sauron would not be the most wanted sets for AFOLs in general. In fact, that is yet another mistake they made with the pirate ship. Sure, kids like pirate ships, but I do not know many of them who have $100+ to spend in one sitting. The last trip to Walmart revealed a shelf full of pirate ships and a handful of Council of Elronds. Kids typically like to save for smaller and mid range sets, because they do not want to save money for an extended time to get the larger sets. Sure, most of my son's classmates who enjoy Lego would like a pirate ship or an Orthanc, but very few actually have them. That is an awful amount of time and allowance money to invest for one of them to get these.

If there was to be a third wave, and we can only hope, I would expect the usual assortment of price ranges. You could potentially have a $100+ Gondor set, but there would be other offerings as well.

I was talking about a person writing on forum... he is obviously far older possibly older AFOL.... and if a person who is 18, 25, 30, 40 cannot save money for 2-3 months to buy 1 big set instead of 3-4 smaller ones then that is no excuse to call it out of his budget.... its only out of his discipline to save money.

I remember I saved money for 4,5 months to buy myself Black Seas Baraccuda back when I was a kid!!!!

Everything is possible, but only if you desire something high enough.

[kabel]

So are you the moral authority now when it comes to Lego LOTR?

[Deathleech]

i dont need mordor orcs in it really.

Ehh, if the Mordor Orcs had a new print and armor that would be ideal, but honestly I would take the same old ones we have got the last few waves as long as they have the hair and ears. If Lego DID make an army builder they would probably put some good and bad guys in it like they have for the past few Middle-Earth army builders. Mordor Orcs have been in a number of sets, but most of them are higher priced and none are really good army builders save maybe Orc Forge (which still was pretty bad for this at $10 per minifigiure). We need a GOOD way to actually bulk up our Mordor army. If Lego made a Gondor Soldier set I could easily see myself buying 25-40 of them. I would love to kill two birds with one stone and amass a huge Mordor army while also getting all the Gondor Soldiers.

[Alcarin]

So are you the moral authority now when it comes to Lego LOTR?

I am no authority... But if someone here says a 200$ or 300% set is out of his ''budget'' he should look at his LEGO collection if its over 200 or 300$ it means he could've bought that set instead.... it depends how much he/she/we want such set.....

plain logic.

Ehh, if the Mordor Orcs had a new print and armor that would be ideal, but honestly I would take the same old ones we have got the last few waves as long as they have the hair and ears. If Lego DID make an army builder they would probably put some good and bad guys in it like they have for the past few Middle-Earth army builders. Mordor Orcs have been in a number of sets, but most of them are higher priced and none are really good army builders save maybe Orc Forge (which still was pretty bad for this at $10 per minifigiure). We need a GOOD way to actually bulk up our Mordor army. If Lego made a Gondor Soldier set I could easily see myself buying 25-40 of them. I would love to kill two birds with one stone and amass a huge Mordor army while also getting all the Gondor Soldiers.

Well to be honest... you can mix orc Hunters, mordor orcs, and Gundabad orcs if you trully want diverse mordor army..... + add armors ....

But ye i understand your point!

[Blakstone]

Alcarin is passionate about this theme like most of us.

I have to disagree about a D2C Gondor set. LEGO never makes such sets with new molds. The Ewok Village used the CMF Forest Maiden for Leia and Orthanc used the eagle from the Black Gate and Sauran's hair / beard from the wizards duel. There are never any new molds for such expensive sets (though they do existing molds in new colors) since they know they won't move a large volume of sets like the cheapter sets.

The only way we could get a D2C Gondor set is if it had no new molds or it came out shortly after smaller sets that introduced (and paid for) the molds.

I think the tell of the Second Wave is that it literally paved the way for the Orthanc.

[SirBlake]

Don't forget that Lego also has kids in mind when they designed these sets. Let's face it, a pirate ship or a Black Gate with the Mouth of Sauron would not be the most wanted sets for AFOLs in general. In fact, that is yet another mistake they made with the pirate ship. Sure, kids like pirate ships, but I do not know many of them who have $100+ to spend in one sitting. The last trip to Walmart revealed a shelf full of pirate ships and a handful of Council of Elronds. Kids typically like to save for smaller and mid range sets, because they do not want to save money for an extended time to get the larger sets. Sure, most of my son's classmates who enjoy Lego would like a pirate ship or an Orthanc, but very few actually have them. That is an awful amount of time and allowance money to invest for one of them to get these.

If there was to be a third wave, and we can only hope, I would expect the usual assortment of price ranges. You could potentially have a $100+ Gondor set, but there would be other offerings as well.

I see where you're going here, but this completely ignores a major facet of the Lego buying public. I would put money on the supposition that most larger sets are purchased by parents/grand parents for birthdays and holidays.

[Nobrux]

I am no authority... But if someone here says a 200$ or 300% set is out of his ''budget'' he should look at his LEGO collection if its over 200 or 300$ it means he could've bought that set instead.... it depends how much he/she/we want such set.....

plain logic.

That is not logical at all.

First of all, I could have a 10k dollar lego collection. Let's suppose I lost my job. My new one pays me considerably less. My budget now is very restricted and I cant' afford what I could in the past. Therefore, the value of my collection means nothing at all.

Secondly, perhaps the person is simply not willing so spend so much money in LOTR collection. Or at lego at all. He may have other interests. Maybe he can't save the money for so long because his money is somehow compromised in the future.

Your point is not logical. It's just your opinion based on assumptions you've created in your head.

[Alcarin]

That is not logical at all.

First of all, I could have a 10k dollar lego collection. Let's suppose I lost my job. My new one pays me considerably less. My budget now is very restricted and I cant' afford what I could in the past. Therefore, the value of my collection means nothing at all.

Secondly, perhaps the person is simply not willing so spend so much money in LOTR collection. Or at lego at all. He may have other interests. Maybe he can't save the money for so long because his money is somehow compromised in the future.

Your point is not logical. It's just your opinion based on assumptions you've created in your head.

It is entirely logical...

for everything else.. there is Ebay/Bricklink....

asking for a smaller set just because ''you'' cannot afford it is very egoistical... I want more Orthancs even if I will not buy them all... because they look great and are much more true to the source they are made out ....

Heck if a 500$ or 1000$ Minas Tirith came out with 60 - 100 figs id save my money for a whole year just to buy it..... i would simply skip everything else and I would not feel bad, and i know that is just me but I am sure others might to the same....

If your priorities are different than buying LARGE LEGO sets then I personally believe asking for worse/smaller sets is pretty lame.... But I am just 1 guy.... :)

Edited January 18, 2014 by Alcarin

[SMC]

There is also the point that d2c sets are a lot harder to get on sale so orthanc cost me 3 times what helms deep cost me which is why its not just about saving its vaule fir money too.

[Hammerhand]

Thats such a popular lie really...

i mean if you can buy 5 x 40$ set over 2 or 3 months you can simply SAVE MONEY and buy 200$ set after 3 months..... its just an illusion of ''cannot afford'' its more being lazy to save money!

Tell me how much LEGO you have in $$$ I bet its alot more than 200$.

Well, it's not quite that simple. I wouldn't buy a whole lot of $40 sets, I'd actually maybe buy two, possibly three if the price is low enough. Then brick link if I really want more minifigs. Factoring in that I'm in college, my lego budget is not very high, and I have another $ consuming hobby. As for how much lego I have in $$$, well, probably thousands of it (though I'd like to sell some of it because a lot of it isn't useful when all I ever build is castle stuff) but that's because I've been collecting lego since I was tall as a hobbit.

I also would rather buy more smaller sets with more minifigs and stuff than one big one. I don't think hoping for smaller army building/connectable sets is any more egotistical than hoping for a big D2C set...

[Faefrost]

Alcarin is passionate about this theme like most of us.

I have to disagree about a D2C Gondor set. LEGO never makes such sets with new molds. The Ewok Village used the CMF Forest Maiden for Leia and Orthanc used the eagle from the Black Gate and Sauran's hair / beard from the wizards duel. There are never any new molds for such expensive sets (though they do existing molds in new colors) since they know they won't move a large volume of sets like the cheapter sets.

The only way we could get a D2C Gondor set is if it had no new molds or it came out shortly after smaller sets that introduced (and paid for) the molds.

I think the tell of the Second Wave is that it literally paved the way for the Orthanc.

A better way to look at it is they will almost never make a new mold exclusively for a D2C set, or without having a clear more general release planned purpose for the parts. Case in point the new Simpsons House. Which have a ton if new molds. But which is buffered by the Simpsons CMF line. I believe the only exceptions to this rule are very very rarely large technic sets (which I guess technically aren't D2C as they also see TRU shelf release) and some specialized train parts. (Which is a small but exceptionally stable long term niche. Almost it's own hobby).

If we were to see a D2C Gondor set it would be pretty well guaranteed that we would not see unique new specialized Gondorian helmets. We would get some creative re use of an existing mold. Be it castle, LotR or something else. Honestly at this late stage I would be surprised to see a large number of new molds in either Middle Earth line, unless we had some indication that they were planning on renewing or extending the license. I suspect we got the Rohan helms in large part because the shaping / tooling on them is not really all that license specific. Without printing they are pretty generic helms that can be reused in other lines. Gondor helms might be trickier that way. (Heck we didn't see classic Stormtrooper helms in Star Wars until 3 years in, when they had decided to renew the short term license for the first long term one.)

[MKJoshA]

Maybe I'm in the minority, but I hope there's not a huge Minas Tirith set. I'd like it better if there were smaller, more affordable sets, maybe make them so they can connect. I prefer the smaller sets with more minifigs personally. If the set is much over 100 USD, a lot of people like me can't afford to spend that much on legos, though I'd like to. If it was about the same size as Helm's Deep, that'd be fine. In fact, if it was like Helm's Deep with connectable smaller walls, that would probably be really popular. That's what I'm hoping for anyways.

My feelings exactly!

I remember I saved money for 4,5 months to buy myself Black Seas Baraccuda back when I was a kid!!!!

Everything is possible, but only if you desire something high enough.

Heck if a 500$ or 1000$ Minas Tirith came out with 60 - 100 figs id save my money for a whole year just to buy it..... i would simply skip everything else and I would not feel bad, and i know that is just me but I am sure others might to the same....

If your priorities are different than buying LARGE LEGO sets then I personally believe asking for worse/smaller sets is pretty lame.... But I am just 1 guy.... :)

You have a point, but you are still missing some pieces of logic. I might buy 10 $20 sets over 5 months, or I could wait 5 months and buy 1 $200 set. The difference is if I want any variety in what I buy, 1 $200 set wouldn't give it to me. I would end up with a whole lot of black (Orthanc) or tan bricks (Simpsons), but I wouldn't have variety. If I bought 4 $20 LOTR sets and then 6 $20 sets from other lines I'll have a lot more in my Lego pallet to work/play/build with. That's my number 1 reason for not liking the D2C sets. It's not that I can't afford it or can't save the money for it, it's that I don't want all my Lego budget eaten up by 1 kind of set.

[Deathleech]

You have a point, but you are still missing some pieces of logic. I might buy 10 $20 sets over 5 months, or I could wait 5 months and buy 1 $200 set. The difference is if I want any variety in what I buy, 1 $200 set wouldn't give it to me. I would end up with a whole lot of black (Orthanc) or tan bricks (Simpsons), but I wouldn't have variety. If I bought 4 $20 LOTR sets and then 6 $20 sets from other lines I'll have a lot more in my Lego pallet to work/play/build with. That's my number 1 reason for not liking the D2C sets. It's not that I can't afford it or can't save the money for it, it's that I don't want all my Lego budget eaten up by 1 kind of set.

For me, I like the variety and also the minifigures smaller sets offer. Orthanc was $200 for 5 minifigures.. Uruk-hai and Mirkwood Elf Army were $30 for 6 figs. Of course that isn't typical, but larger sets do seem to offer less minifigures for the price. I do like some of the big impressive sets like Helm's Deep and ultimately would probably prefer a standard mixed wave with some a low priced set, a high, and a bunch in between.

[deskp]

Yeah, 4 sets meant 13 new printed figures. one big d2c set is like 9 figures tops? and alot of them not new.

[Alcarin]

You have a point, but you are still missing some pieces of logic. I might buy 10 $20 sets over 5 months, or I could wait 5 months and buy 1 $200 set. The difference is if I want any variety in what I buy, 1 $200 set wouldn't give it to me. I would end up with a whole lot of black (Orthanc) or tan bricks (Simpsons), but I wouldn't have variety. If I bought 4 $20 LOTR sets and then 6 $20 sets from other lines I'll have a lot more in my Lego pallet to work/play/build with. That's my number 1 reason for not liking the D2C sets. It's not that I can't afford it or can't save the money for it, it's that I don't want all my Lego budget eaten up by 1 kind of set.

Yeah ofcourse there are alot of ways of having a LEGO Hobby but I just feel that wishing for a smaller set just cos you want to obtain more variety is pretty weird logic considering you have Bricklink for that... Sure you can also say I can MOC a ''bigger'' Minas Tirith for example..... but its alot harder to do that than buy variety if you already are a ''good'' MOCer...

For example I dont really MOC ..... sure i did a few ''vignettes'' but none of my MOCs surpassed 200 pieces... I have alot of LEGO displayed though (MMV, MVR, Helm's Deep) and pretty much all I add to those beautiful sets are

1. figs

2. fig accessories (food, weapons etc.)

3. random accessories like barrels, horses, foilage

To make the display look great.

So you can still buy 10 20$ sets (for example) and MOC pieces from the 200$ set that you need (or figs) but people like me we cannot go from 0 bricks to MOCing 100k pieces Minas Tirith (for example)

[ZCerberus]

I disagree with Alcarin.

I would also prefer smaller sets. I believe assuming smaller means "worse" is making an assumption that might not be true. Why someone desires/values a set is completely different from one person to the next.

For me, I never keep sets together because I am a MOCer. As such, I want more parts variety and odd parts in quantity in affordable sets and more minifigures than I want a display model. Minifigure Bricklink prices can also be strange because they tend to be 2.50 to 3.00 for even "ordinary figures" and way more for more exclusive figures and if I get the whole set I might spend an extra $2 or $3 but maybe I'll get $6 or $7 worth of bricks as well.

Look at Uruk-hai Army- I know it is no longer in production- but it had 1 Eomer, average BL price, 7.91, 1 Rohan soldier Average price 8.39, 1 Uruk with hair average price 3.81, 1 Uruk without armor average price 5.20 and 2 Uruks with armor avg price 5.78. Price of all the figures- $36.78, that price does not including shipping or accessories or bricks and maybe it takes a few WEEKS to get your bricks, or even worse, they never send your bricks at all or they get lost in the mail. I bought a ton of Uruk-hai Army on clearance at Walmart for 15.00 - 21.00 depending on location. Even at the 21.00 mark, I would have had to spend almost double on Bricklink to get the same figures in just one set, and again, I didn't get the extra bricks or accessories if I had Bricklinked.

Bricklink may often be a more affordable way to get brick, but when we factor in clearance prices and the "cost" of uncertainty and having to wait for bricks for arrive, then it might not always be the optimal way to go.

I think we need to be careful about telling people their thoughts or opinions are wrong or illogical, we can disagree without making people believe their thought process is wrong and that there is only one right way to participate in this hobby.

Wouldn't your philosophy teacher be annoyed that you are proposing all these absolutes?

[Alcarin]

I disagree with Alcarin.

I would also prefer smaller sets. I believe assuming smaller means "worse" is making an assumption that might not be true. Why someone desires/values a set is completely different from one person to the next.

For me, I never keep sets together because I am a MOCer. As such, I want more parts variety and odd parts in quantity in affordable sets and more minifigures than I want a display model. Minifigure Bricklink prices can also be strange because they tend to be 2.50 to 3.00 for even "ordinary figures" and way more for more exclusive figures and if I get the whole set I might spend an extra $2 or $3 but maybe I'll get $6 or $7 worth of bricks as well.

Look at Uruk-hai Army- I know it is no longer in production- but it had 1 Eomer, average BL price, 7.91, 1 Rohan soldier Average price 8.39, 1 Uruk with hair average price 3.81, 1 Uruk without armor average price 5.20 and 2 Uruks with armor avg price 5.78. Price of all the figures- $36.78, that price does not including shipping or accessories or bricks and maybe it takes a few WEEKS to get your bricks, or even worse, they never send your bricks at all or they get lost in the mail. I bought a ton of Uruk-hai Army on clearance at Walmart for 15.00 - 21.00 depending on location. Even at the 21.00 mark, I would have had to spend almost double on Bricklink to get the same figures in just one set, and again, I didn't get the extra bricks or accessories if I had Bricklinked.

Bricklink may often be a more affordable way to get brick, but when we factor in clearance prices and the "cost" of uncertainty and having to wait for bricks for arrive, then it might not always be the optimal way to go.

I think we need to be careful about telling people their thoughts or opinions are wrong or illogical, we can disagree without making people believe their thought process is wrong and that there is only one right way to participate in this hobby.

Wouldn't your philosophy teacher be annoyed that you are proposing all these absolutes?

a MOCer can use different figs as substitutes and figs do not represent the 100%.... in 99.9% (yes its a made up number but lets look around) a MOCer focus is the build itself..... figs supplement the build to a degree.

If a MOCer wants parts check how much cost all parts (excluding figs + weapons) on bricklink and how much is the retail of a set. it is cheaper in 99% of the time. And that is also what the person was talking about he wants variety of parts(bricks) and those are pretty much always cheaper bought separately.

in such comparisons you cannot really argue with discounts in mind.... not everyone in the world gets same discounts..... and that is why retail price should be taken as the main price point (entry) and today I just bought 10 uruk-hais(armor+helmet) with 5 shields/swords and 5 halbeards for 37€ on Bricklink and retail for uruk-hai army inside EU = 39.99€ and thats 6 vs 10 figs.... since to me bricks hold 0 value as I have nothing to do with them.

I never said there is only 1 way to participate or have a hobby in LEGO, but if there are (for the sake of the argument) 2 LEGO lovers out there and 1 is a MOCer the other is NOT.

If there is a beautiful 500$ set the MOCer can still MOC it while the guy who does not MOC can display it, so potentially both get their way (because bricks can be rebuild)

but if there is only a 50$ set that looks average the MOCer can still MOC a ''beautiful'' creatin worth 500$ but the guy who does not MOC is left out.

And thanks to Ebay/Bricklink the MOCer can buy parts of that 500$ set.

Sure you can argue the non-MOCer can buy the MOCer work but how many times did that happen versus how many orders happened through Bricklink for parts :P

[Gremer]

My feelings exactly!

Same here. Why should I save up for a $500-$1000 set with twenty or so minifigs, when I could get a bunch of smaller sets and get twice as many minifigs (they're the most important part of a set for me)?

[Alcarin]

Same here. Why should I save up for a $500-$1000 set with twenty or so minifigs, when I could get a bunch of smaller sets and get twice as many minifigs (they're the most important part of a set for me)?

If such logic would be thought by TLG we would only get 9.99, 12.99 and 14.99 sets :) ''everyone'' could afford those....

You are mixing the argument here now though.... a guy said he does not want to purchase LARGE sets because he wants variety in parts and as parts I assume he means mostly on Bricks 8as he is a MOCer ...

And quite honestly noone forces you to save 500 or even 1000$ but if you want to have Death Star you have to save 400$.... now its up to you do you want it or not..... same goes for modulars/orthanc etc.

There are already hundreds of small fig/brick packs/sets but only handful of Castle era display worthy sets (Joust, MMV, MVR, Orthanc, potentially helm's Deep etc.)