Why the Colour Changes of 2004?

[cortman]

Wow, thanks for that fascinating dissertation Lego Historian! Very interesting!

[Faefrost]

Fascinating as always.

The yellowing effect of Lego bricks over time is not really a QC issue or defect, nor is it something that Lego has a lot of control over. It is caused by the flame retardant chemical that is added to the ABS (which in turn is mandated by safety regulations). There isn't much in Legos production process or in user care and handling of the bricks that can effect it.

[Mr Bill]

Thanks LH! That confirms what I've heard form other "official" sources... I never believed the other reasons people threw around (to compete with MegaBlocks/Tyco or testing showed moms were more receptive to buying the brighter greys and other such non-sense)...

For me I count myself among those who were greatly annoyed at first. Since every new color means I have to add as many as 20 new drawers to my sorting system I wasn't sure how I'd approach the 3 new versions... Ultimately (and after much thought) I lumped them with their original counterparts. I know many keep them separate but the deciding factor for me was simply this: because greys in my city MOCs represent concrete and brown represents trees/lumber, all I have to do is look at the world around me and see much variance in the concrete and trees/wood structures around me. And (unless it's a part that ONLY exists in one of the greys), if I don't like two "contrasting parts" aligned together, I simply swap them out. Problem solved.

I'm also keenly aware that over time the ratio of old to new will swing as I acquire more of the new. In fact after 40 years of accumuating Lego I'm now at the point where it's about 50/50 old to new in all three colors...

--Mr Bill

[1974]

Fascinating as always.

The yellowing effect of Lego bricks over time is not really a QC issue or defect, nor is it something that Lego has a lot of control over. It is caused by the flame retardant chemical that is added to the ABS (which in turn is mandated by safety regulations). There isn't much in Legos production process or in user care and handling of the bricks that can effect it.

This is interesting

I'm on a process of 'unyellowing' bricks (have not done so yet, but my partner in crime hase succesfully restored a 8880 - and I got loads of old light grey bricks waiting, using the wellknown 'oxy' trick)

So, are TLG still (I'd think so?) using that flame retardent chemical in the new grey (well any) bricks?

In short, do I/we need to do this trick again in 5/10/20 years?

[Artanis I]

So, are TLG still (I'd think so?) using that flame retardent chemical in the new grey (well any) bricks?

In short, do I/we need to do this trick again in 5/10/20 years?

I haven't noticed any yellowing in anything new I've bought since then. All yellowed stuff I have is from before my dark age, which started late 90s. I am curious about whether it's happened to anyone else.

BTW, I believe the yellowing is caused by the oxidation of bromine (in the flame retardant) near the surface of the plastic, hence why you can reverse the effect by reversing the chemical reaction. (Or is it the opposite, chemistry was so long ago...)

But the old stuff you definitely would need to do again, as the same chemical reaction will occur again over time, slowly yellowing your bricks. (Sunshine acts as a catalyst and speeds it up.)

[Good Cragger Fan]

Yep, and in 2004 both of the then-current pink colors (9 Light Reddish Violet and 22 Medium Reddish Violet) were replaced with 222 Light Purple and 221 Bright Purple. Again, the differences between Bright Purple and Medium Reddish Violet are so subtle that Bricklink does not differentiate between them and refers to both as Dark Pink.

Another color that has undergone some major changes even since 2004 is Silver. The first "pearl" silver color was 131 Silver, which was used up until 2006 even though it tended to be very inconsistent (it is referred to as both Pearl Light Gray and Flat Silver on Bricklink, depending partly on what plastic material it's used for, since in softer plastics it often appeared darker). In 2006, there was an attempt to replace it with a new color, 296 Cool Silver. This did not go over too well, though, because Cool Silver had a somewhat "washed-out" look and still was not free of inconsistency. In a move that I don't think I've ever seen happen with any other color, 131 Silver was brought back in 2007 and remained the standard until 2010-2011 when it was replaced with a newer color, 315 Silver Metallic (which Bricklink more consistently as Flat Silver, since it's a fairly consistent darker shade).

Gold has had similar changes, but it was a bit different in that the original pearl gold (127 Gold) coexisted with a few other gold colors such as 147 Sand Yellow Metallic and 189 Reddish Gold (which Bricklink often refers to, quite frustratingly, as Copper, despite not being nearly as brownish or reddish as the OTHER three or four colors they call copper). Every one of these pearl gold colors was replaced in 2006 with 297 Warm Gold which has been used consistently ever since.

Anyway, apologies for rambling. I'm very interested in the LEGO color palette, and enjoy sharing what I know about it.

It seems to me that LEGO has not learned their lesson in changing colours around for common (and somewhat common colours like the light silver and dark silver colours), thereby annoying many consumers, since, when I discovered that some of my short swords, battle axes and spears in the Kingdoms theme back in late 2010 into most of 2011 were of a different shade than my older ones, I was quite upset, and that means that I have to have all of my Kingdoms minifigures' light silver and dark silver weapons switched over to the new version of light silver and dark silver, as I have to have all of my light silver and dark silver weapons in the minifigures of the Kingdoms theme match in terms of shade and hue. (This applies to all of my Castle (and Pirate minifigures) -- as in any factions that were introduced by LEGO before 2004 must only use the old brown and old dark and light grays only, and any factions that were introduced after 2003 must only use the new brown and new light and dark grays, so they will match in terms of shade and hue.)

Edited March 8, 2013 by Good Cragger Fan

[davee123]

It seems to me that LEGO has not learned their lesson in changing colours around for common (and somewhat common colours like the light silver and dark silver colours)

LEGO basically made a compromise. They said that they would "lock" certain colors, and prevent them from changing (without consulting with or informing the hobbyist community beforehand). However, for other colors, they were considered fair game for changing-- including things like metallic colors.

One other thing that I've heard mention of is that LEGO *WAS* planning on revamping other colors (not just the grays and brown), but stopped dead in their tracks after the fallout in 2004. But while that was a rumor circulating around the community, I haven't heard any corroborating evidence directly from any official source.

DaveE

[Aanchir]

It seems to me that LEGO has not learned their lesson in changing colours around for common (and somewhat common colours like the light silver and dark silver colours), thereby annoying many consumers, since, when I discovered that some of my short swords, battle axes and spears in the Kingdoms theme back in late 2010 into most of 2011 were of a different shade than my older ones, I was quite upset, and that means that I have to have all of my Kingdoms minifigures' light silver and dark silver weapons switched over to the new version of light silver and dark silver, as I have to have all of my light silver and dark silver weapons in the minifigures of the Kingdoms theme match in terms of shade and hue. (This applies to all of my Castle (and Pirate minifigures) -- as in any factions that were introduced by LEGO before 2004 must only use the old brown and old dark and light grays only, and any factions that were introduced after 2003 must only use the new brown and new light and dark grays, so they will match in terms of shade and hue.)

Well, in the case of the silver and dark silver colors prior to the 2010-2011 change (131 Silver and 148 Metallic Dark Grey), one reason they were replaced is that they were inconsistent even before replacing them. Compare a Metallic Dark Grey part from 2007 to one from 2003 and the difference is abundantly clear: 2003 parts in this color typically have a somewhat greenish tinge to them, so much that I originally thought the color had been replaced in 2007. Silver parts were even more inconsistent, and 2010-2011 wasn't the first time TLG tried to replace the color-- in 2006 they tried to replace it with a new color called 296 Cool Silver, which was even MORE inconsistent than 131 Silver and tended to look washed-out. 131 Silver was returned to production in 2007. Still, parts in 131 Silver were terribly inconsistent throughout the color's lifespan. It's worth noting that prior to 2010, most parts labeled Pearl Light Gray or Flat Silver on Bricklink were in fact supposed to be the same color, often varying only in what plastic material they used or what surface finish they were designed with.

Since the switch to 315 Silver Metallic and 316 Titanium Metallic between 2010 and 2011, silver and dark silver parts have been much more consistent, and they often look better to boot. Is the change a bit frustrating from an army-building perspective? Yes, but if meeting the "target color" consistently was not possible with the older colors then it goes without saying that a change was necessary in the long run. Besides, generally it is possible to mix-and-match different metallic colors without the differences between them being obvious except under close inspection. There's a reason that Bricklink tends to identify two to five different metallic colors with the same name-- a lot of AFOLs can't even tell the difference, or can't recognize that any "change" has been more than random variation.

[TheLegoDr]

Ultimately I would chalk it up to random variation in coloring. I would want things to look as uniform as I could, but weapons are going to be differently colored, that's just how it is. If it is only subtle, then so be it. But when it is such a stark contrast, then it can be more unsettling.

[strangely]

Has anyone else noticed a variation in the yellow bricks. When I bought the Naboo starfighter last year I noticed that there are two different shades of yellow on mine and it just doesn't look right as some pieces are darker than others making it pretty obvious that they don't match. I've noticed a similar thing with minifigures occasionally, particularly in Spongebob sets where the hands are a bit lighter than the arms and torso.

[Faefrost]

Well, in the case of the silver and dark silver colors prior to the 2010-2011 change (131 Silver and 148 Metallic Dark Grey), one reason they were replaced is that they were inconsistent even before replacing them. Compare a Metallic Dark Grey part from 2007 to one from 2003 and the difference is abundantly clear: 2003 parts in this color typically have a somewhat greenish tinge to them, so much that I originally thought the color had been replaced in 2007. Silver parts were even more inconsistent, and 2010-2011 wasn't the first time TLG tried to replace the color-- in 2006 they tried to replace it with a new color called 296 Cool Silver, which was even MORE inconsistent than 131 Silver and tended to look washed-out. 131 Silver was returned to production in 2007. Still, parts in 131 Silver were terribly inconsistent throughout the color's lifespan. It's worth noting that prior to 2010, most parts labeled Pearl Light Gray or Flat Silver on Bricklink were in fact supposed to be the same color, often varying only in what plastic material they used or what surface finish they were designed with.

Since the switch to 315 Silver Metallic and 316 Titanium Metallic between 2010 and 2011, silver and dark silver parts have been much more consistent, and they often look better to boot. Is the change a bit frustrating from an army-building perspective? Yes, but if meeting the "target color" consistently was not possible with the older colors then it goes without saying that a change was necessary in the long run. Besides, generally it is possible to mix-and-match different metallic colors without the differences between them being obvious except under close inspection. There's a reason that Bricklink tends to identify two to five different metallic colors with the same name-- a lot of AFOLs can't even tell the difference, or can't recognize that any "change" has been more than random variation.

Metalic coloring in plastic is weird. Traditionally it has been very very dependent on the quality of and vagaries in the base metalic colored plastic purchased for use. But those could often be inconsistent over time. More so that any primary colors. That last big change we saw around 2010 was probably Lego working out a mechanism to use their new color injection technology to create acceptable metallics. Just as the change in gold, they are probably now injecting the color straight into the mix during the injection process instead of dealing with inconsistant batches of pre colored plastic. It results in a different looking coloring for those items, but much more consistency going forward.

Good Cragar Fan, you have to remember. Lego is a business. While you as a collector or more niche army builder wants a consistency of appearance over a very extended period of time, technology does evolve. The manufacturer will develop new ways of doing things. Many of these will prompt a change in traditional appearance, but will result in a long term increases in quality, efficiency and overall design.

Especially keep in mind, Lego's two main goals in production are A. Consistency and Quality of the Primary "Brick" building elements. What we think of as the main structural stuff. Bricks, plates, etc. B. Complete consistency of all colors and color pallets throughout a given Sub Theme. Far less critical are whether minifig accessories from a 2004 line perfectly match those from a 2010 line. They may be a slightly different color. They may be from a new or re-engineered mold. Just so long as all of the 2010 sets use the same colors and parts they are within their completely reasonable quality standards.