DonQuixote Posted January 15 This topic is called : do you buy only Lego? How can you discuss this without mentioning other brands? And people are taking this way to serious. I love satire. About Mouldking : The Black Pearl is designed by MOCYourBricks. Even he uses alternative bricks. Just watch YouTube. He gets compensated by Bluebrixx. The quality of Mouldking is very good. I have bought the Black Pearl from Mouldking on the Bluebrixx site so I know what I am talking about . I was once a Lego purist myself. But because Lego is so much focused on Starwars and Harry Potter that I don't feel that I am their target audience anymore. Live long and prosper! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Horation Posted January 15 (edited) 3 hours ago, DonQuixote said: And people are taking this way to serious. I love satire. Oh, so you were sarcastically calling people who only buy Lego "scum"? 3 hours ago, DonQuixote said: I was once a Lego purist myself. But because Lego is so much focused on Star wars and Harry Potter that I don't feel that I am their target audience anymore. again, they are so focused on Star Wars and Harry Potter that they end up making almost as many city sets (62) as Harry Potter and Star Wars COMBINED (49+20=69) in a year (2023). If you don't like their offerings, buy from competitors, you don't need to shout it from every rooftop. 3 hours ago, DonQuixote said: About Mouldking : The Black Pearl is designed by MOCYourBricks. Even he uses alternative bricks. Just watch YouTube. He gets compensated by Bluebrixx. The quality of Mouldking is very good. I have bought the Black Pearl from Mouldking on the Bluebrixx site so I know what I am talking about . About Mouldking : The Black Pearl was designed by Disney, and they AREN'T being compensated by Bluebrixx, very honest... Edited January 15 by Horation Small mistaek Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Black Falcon Posted January 15 2 hours ago, DonQuixote said: This topic is called : do you buy only Lego? How can you discuss this without mentioning other brands? Noone complained about anyone doing it in this thread. But doing that in other threads that have different themes is another story ;) 2 hours ago, DonQuixote said: About Mouldking : The Black Pearl is designed by MOCYourBricks. Even he uses alternative bricks. Just watch YouTube. He gets compensated by Bluebrixx. The quality of Mouldking is very good. I have bought the Black Pearl from Mouldking on the Bluebrixx site so I know what I am talking about . Well they are doing that now because of a lot negative publicity for them for stealing mocs - but especially when the moccer refuses their offer they are still stealing it anyways. And even if they got the ok of the Moccer in this case, they don´t have the IP-Holders. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DonQuixote Posted January 15 (edited) 24 minutes ago, Horation said: Oh, so you were sarcastically calling people who only buy Lego "scum"? again, they are so focused on Star Wars and Harry Potter that they end up making almost as many city sets (62) as Harry Potter and Star Wars COMBINED (49+20=69) in a year (2023). If you don't like their offerings, buy from competitors, you don't need to shout it from every rooftop. About Mouldking : The Black Pearl was designed by Disney, and they AREN'T being compensated by disney, very honest... Yes, the Black Pearl is a Disney product. But the design of Mouldking was created by MOCYourBricks. MOCYourBricks gets compensated by Bluebrixx.(the company that sells the moc of him) And if Disney really wants my money they just have to make an ultimate collectors edition Black Pearl and I will buy it. But they don't so I buy Mouldking. And Disney is a shitty company that didn't support Johny Depp and it destroyed the original Starwars trilogy by making the sequels so bad. So they deserve to be pirated. Edited January 15 by DonQuixote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Horation Posted January 15 1 hour ago, DonQuixote said: And Disney is a shitty company that didn't support Johny Depp and it destroyed the original Starwars trilogy by making the sequels so bad. So they deserve to be pirated. Oh, so if I don't like what someone does with their intellectual property I can just steal, it is good to pirate from people you don't like? Really? I mean yeah the sequels sucked, but I have never heard anyone say : this guy's a jerk, let's steal 10 000$ from him. By that logic, if I think you are a scummy person, I can steal your ideas Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Toastie Posted January 15 (edited) 10 hours ago, Peppermint_M said: Maybe step away for a bit, then come in with fresh heads. Good call ! Slept well, stepped away for a bit, and have a fresh head . Just finished my lecture for tomorrow (8 am ) and the presentation for prospective students visiting tomorrow after lunch - it is that time of the year again. Soon they'll get their high-school diplomas and then ... we need to find chemistry freshmen and women. Chemistry is not necessarily the most sought-after discipline, I can tell, particularly when the words "physics" and "theory" are also in the name of my group - and I need to tell them that they need to learn a bit of math as well. We'll see ... So I need to clear up one of my mysterious and maybe irritating comments, as there were 129 question marks in a row in the post from @Horation (copied them into Notepad, and it told me so ;) "(And) time goes by so slowly" appears in the song "Unchained Melody" written by Alex North and Hyman Zaret, and is/was performed by The Righteous Brothers in their album "Just Once In My Life". Maybe Madonna asked them for permission for using this text fragment in her 2005 "Hung Up" song, maybe not, who knows. That was all. But then - any rights on the text may long have run out ... Now, Disney "made" the Black Pearl, that is true. Somebody else recreated it very nicely in clone bricks; TLG recreated London, Paris, Berlin etc. in their Architecture Series using LEGO bricks. I guess, they have asked for permission to do so. But another try: The #85007 Pantasy Steampunk Train Station featuring a suspended Steampunk steam train + carriage. Does that appear in any Disney, Mattel, (50 or more companies should be listed here), movie, comic, or any other medium currently available? I am not aware of any. But then again: What do I know. The set is made with Gobricks bricks - and has so many flat gold and silver pieces ... no, I do not only buy LEGO. There is also another interesting (neither saying good nor bad) development, as far as I am concerned: On Pinterest, and many other places pictures of AI generated LEGO compatible Steampunk buildings, ships and submarines, aircraft, and so on surface. These are really nice and mostly huge "builds". I don't know, but this could be a source for new sets, particularly when a set (e.g., P #85007) with almost 2800 pieces, only prints, and an amazing brick quality costs $/€140 + 5$/€ S&H from an established distributor located in Germany. But who has the license? An AI learns from input from so many different sources ... Oh well, have you all a nice day or night, Thorsten 4 hours ago, DonQuixote said: This topic is called : do you buy only Lego? How can you discuss this without mentioning other brands? Oh, that one is easy: <begin of post> "Yes" </end of post> = no need of mentioning any other brand! Best, Thorsten Edited January 15 by Toastie Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DonQuixote Posted January 15 1 hour ago, Horation said: Oh, so if I don't like what someone does with their intellectual property I can just steal, it is good to pirate from people you don't like? Really? I mean yeah the sequels sucked, but I have never heard anyone say : this guy's a jerk, let's steal 10 000$ from him. By that logic, if I think you are a scummy person, I can steal your ideas There is a difference between stealing from a person and stealing from a multi billion dollar company that doesn't care about the lore George Lucas created. But I can feal your anger. Anger leads to hate. Hate leads to suffering... Lol Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
MAB Posted January 15 10 hours ago, Peppermint_M said: Maybe step away for a bit, then come in with fresh heads. Fleshie or yellow ...? :-) 9 minutes ago, DonQuixote said: There is a difference between stealing from a person and stealing from a multi billion dollar company that doesn't care about the lore George Lucas created. George Lucas chose to sell it. The new owners can do whatever they like with their property. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Murdoch17 Posted January 15 (edited) 30 minutes ago, DonQuixote said: There is a difference between stealing from a person and stealing from a multi billion dollar company that doesn't care about the lore George Lucas created. But I can feal your anger. Anger leads to hate. Hate leads to suffering... Lol I thought everyone's parents told them stealing was wrong. Period. Full stop. Not 'Don't steal from people, but companies are fine.' Remember: companies are made up of people, who would like to be paid for there work. That pay partially comes from licensing fees. As for the George Lucas comment, I give you Grand Admiral Thrawn, who would have NEVER been in live action if it hadn't been for Disney. Also, what do you call Rogue One but a love letter to the OT? Or how about Kenobi and it's filing it prequel plot holes? EDIT: I just saw the moderators' comment from last page. Sorry. Must've missed that! Edited January 15 by Murdoch17 Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Black Falcon Posted January 15 26 minutes ago, DonQuixote said: There is a difference between stealing from a person and stealing from a multi billion dollar company that doesn't care about the lore George Lucas created. The only difference might be that it hurts an person more. But other than that I don´t see a difference. Stealing if wrong and that is about it. Quote But I can feal your anger. Anger leads to hate. Hate leads to suffering... Lol I don´t know but your posts don´t really sound like there is less anger involved honestly: 3 hours ago, DonQuixote said: And Disney is a shitty company that didn't support Johny Depp and it destroyed the original Starwars trilogy by making the sequels so bad. So they deserve to be pirated. Not really a fan of the sequels, but if you need to tell yourself that they were so bad that theft is ok, I don´t really agree with the way you see things. And honestly, without Disney there wouldn´t have been Series like the Mandalorian which I personally like a lot. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Toastie Posted January 15 1 hour ago, Murdoch17 said: I thought everyone's parents told them stealing was wrong. Period. Full stop. I generally do agree - that is exactly, what my wife and me told our daughters. The "period" and "full stop" bit is a bit too much for me, though. Ever been to (very) poor countries? Stealing becomes less of a period and full stop issue but rather a live or die question. One time, "they" "stole" my wallet in Dhaka, Bangladesh - and of course I had my credit cards and documents left in the safe of the hotel, as I was told so by native colleagues. Well, I also changed my money upon entry to the country (which I truly love by the way, next of my regular visits to the University of Dhaka is coming up in November of this year - looking very much forward to going there!) - so that loss was, well, a good thing for some very poor people. Again: Period and full stop should be put into perspective. There is virtually no LEGO in Bangladesh, I actually asked around, as this is my beloved hobby. There are Chinese brands, though. Most sets are around $0.5 to $5. Unreachable for most. Best regards, Thorsten Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
zoth33 Posted January 15 7 hours ago, DonQuixote said: This topic is called : do you buy only Lego? How can you discuss this without mentioning other brands? And people are taking this way to serious. I love satire. About Mouldking : The Black Pearl is designed by MOCYourBricks. Even he uses alternative bricks. Just watch YouTube. He gets compensated by Bluebrixx. The quality of Mouldking is very good. I have bought the Black Pearl from Mouldking on the Bluebrixx site so I know what I am talking about . I was once a Lego purist myself. But because Lego is so much focused on Starwars and Harry Potter that I don't feel that I am their target audience anymore. Live long and prosper! The total sets from last year I think Star wars and HP combined to make up 10% of 2023 total sets. That doesn't seem to be their target audience and I don't know why so many people say this kind of stuff without no proof. At any rate Lego has made a lot more sets for AFOLS over the last several years. 5 hours ago, DonQuixote said: Yes, the Black Pearl is a Disney product. But the design of Mouldking was created by MOCYourBricks. MOCYourBricks gets compensated by Bluebrixx.(the company that sells the moc of him) And if Disney really wants my money they just have to make an ultimate collectors edition Black Pearl and I will buy it. But they don't so I buy Mouldking. And Disney is a shitty company that didn't support Johny Depp and it destroyed the original Starwars trilogy by making the sequels so bad. So they deserve to be pirated. I don't think you know how licensing works. Eventually someone will see what they are doing and bury them in legal battles. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Horation Posted January 15 (edited) 3 hours ago, DonQuixote said: But I can feal your anger. Anger leads to hate. Hate leads to suffering... Lol Wait I'm the angry one but you're the one that's so angry at a company that you advocate stealing from it...Lol P.s. I'm not angry at all, mildly annoyed is the correct term, 1 hour ago, Toastie said: The "period" and "full stop" bit is a bit too much for me, though. Ever been to (very) poor countries? Stealing becomes less of a period and full stop issue but rather a live or die question. One time, "they" "stole" my wallet in Dhaka, Bangladesh - and of course I had my credit cards and documents left in the safe of the hotel, as I was told so by native colleagues. Well, I also changed my money upon entry to the country (which I truly love by the way, next of my regular visits to the University of Dhaka is coming up in November of this year - looking very much forward to going there!) - so that loss was, well, a good thing for some very poor people. Well, you are correct here, poor people in Bangladesh stealing a few bucks from a foreigner is a dilemma prone question, but one where I can't disagree about the positive impacts of. Bluebrixx is a German company, Germany is not a poor country [citation needed]. A business that can own a retail store at a profit is not poor [citation needed]. Such a business should therefore not commit intellectual property theft. But sure, I guess you can compare the CEO of Bluebrixx trying to make a few extra thousands of dollars to someone just trying to survive, those are...(checks notes)...fair comparisons? 1 hour ago, Toastie said: Now, Disney "made" the Black Pearl, that is true. Somebody else recreated it very nicely in clone bricks; TLG recreated London, Paris, Berlin etc. in their Architecture Series using LEGO bricks. I guess, they have asked for permission to do so. If I were given a penny for every false equivalency someone made in an online discussion with me, I'd have enough money to buy a sealed in box copy of the original cloud city set. The Black Pearl was designed for a Disney movie released less than a few decades ago, it is fairly under copyright protection. While those cities are under public domain, and except if you truly know nothing about copyright law, which seems unlikely, you have intentionally ignored those differences to make your argument seem better. Edited January 15 by Horation extra reply Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
aFrInaTi0n Posted January 16 (edited) Was a silent reader for some pages, still can't really see the benefit of this thread as some persons seems to have issues with others having not the same opinions.. I can't really understand what the efforts outcome shall be.. convincing other people of one's opinion? Chances for that happening are tiny to non existent. To add to the initial topic / question: I am mainly using GoBricks parts and others from reliable brands with GoBricks quality (CaDA, Panlos, etc). Reasons for me are: There are auch more color variants of parts and GoBricks for e.g. is on the same quality level as Lego, especially their very strong frictioned pins, loving them! (Lego purists would argument "no good molds being used", I need those for RC projects to not fall apart easily). Also for electronic components I am going with GoBricks / other 3rd party - as Lego discontinued those products (esp speaking of the PF buggy motors and PF Servos) - won't pay moonprices for used gear (keep in mind, the motors are brushed and the servos pcbs may also suffer over time). Besides pure parts I am with the opinion that copycats are a bad thing and I would like to see the other brands getting more into the MOC scene and then having a good attribution-attitude towards the creator. For somebody having another opinion: It is ok for me! Edited January 16 by aFrInaTi0n Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Horation Posted January 16 1 hour ago, aFrInaTi0n said: Reasons for me are: There are much more color variants of parts and GoBricks for e.g. is on the same quality level as Lego, especially their very strong frictioned pins, loving them! Lego purists would argument "no good molds being used" Not what I said, if it is a frictioned pin, it makes sense that it is meant to hold large models together, what I said is that if a regular brick has a tight fit, it is likely poorly made, source : worked in a company making injection molded products. 1 hour ago, aFrInaTi0n said: Besides pure parts I am with the opinion that copycats are a bad thing and I would like to see the other brands getting more into the MOC scene and then having a good attribution-attitude towards the creator. For somebody having another opinion: It is ok for me! Agreed Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Black Falcon Posted January 16 17 hours ago, Toastie said: I generally do agree - that is exactly, what my wife and me told our daughters. The "period" and "full stop" bit is a bit too much for me, though. Ever been to (very) poor countries? Stealing becomes less of a period and full stop issue but rather a live or die question. One time, "they" "stole" my wallet in Dhaka, Bangladesh - and of course I had my credit cards and documents left in the safe of the hotel, as I was told so by native colleagues. Well, I also changed my money upon entry to the country (which I truly love by the way, next of my regular visits to the University of Dhaka is coming up in November of this year - looking very much forward to going there!) - so that loss was, well, a good thing for some very poor people. Again: Period and full stop should be put into perspective. There is virtually no LEGO in Bangladesh, I actually asked around, as this is my beloved hobby. There are Chinese brands, though. Most sets are around $0.5 to $5. Unreachable for most. Well, the problem with that argument is though, that neither China is a poor country, and surely aren´t companies like Mouldking or Bluebrixx poor either. They could afford to go the legal way, they just don´t want to. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
aFrInaTi0n Posted January 16 I still can't really understand in general why people are getting mad at each other for having different opinions. Even if one would state "I am the bad guy buying all unlinced models to feed my pure evilness" - why should I personally get mad? It's an issue between different companies. It makes as much sense to discuss reasons for different opinion like it does for religions, parenting of children, having a dog, etc.. So in difference to my own opinion of buying 3rd party brands: It is very nice that the Lego company is investing in the community to get people with the same hobby together. Even if it can be seen as PR, it has the good outcome of allowing people to share their creations and enjoy others' builds. I would wish that the other major competitor brands would invest a little more in that regard. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Yperio_Bricks Posted January 16 35 minutes ago, aFrInaTi0n said: I still can't really understand in general why people are getting mad at each other for having different opinions. People can be in love with a brand: Quote This study also verifies four desirable behavioral consequences of brand love: brand loyalty, willingness to pay a price premium, word-of-mouth intentions, and forgiveness of brand mistakes. Quote managers should ensure their brands possess unique functional and sensory attributes. They are the cornerstones of brand love. Quote and its appealing aesthetics offer high sensory uniqueness that differentiate it from competitors’ offerings. Quote managers should encourage consumers to identify with the brand. Brand fit with the inner self can be influenced through functional and communicative brand uniqueness Quote finding a way to get consumers to establish meaningful personal memories that involve the brand, initiated by emotional events such as childhood, family, leisure If you want to dive deeper into the topic, follow the key words and references. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Toastie Posted January 16 1 hour ago, Black Falcon said: Well, the problem with that argument is though, that neither China is a poor country Oh, I was not looking at China, but commented on the "full stop" as a general remark when it comes to "stealing" things (which are not dealing with designs or patents or LEGO at all, that is another world or better universe). I for sure know that stealing is bad and not acceptable - but I've also seen too many people not having enough to eat to survive the next days or months. In such a situation, I do feel far less strict about stealing; food from a hotel lobby for example, which I have seen as well. That poor guy got caught, and I simply do not want to know what happened to him afterward. But back on topic: When it comes to China and LEGO as well as the other companies you listed: Yes that is a very different thing. Best, Thorsten Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
MAB Posted January 16 2 hours ago, aFrInaTi0n said: I still can't really understand in general why people are getting mad at each other for having different opinions. Personally, I don't care what brand people build with. But this is a LEGO based fan site, for discussing building with LEGO. If clone brands or fakes come up as a natural part of a discussion, it is fine. But if someone is only here to promote other brands, start threads about non-LEGO products and continually put down LEGO, then this is not the place for it. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
aFrInaTi0n Posted January 16 @MAB I agree. Also the forums are open for third party products (having a metal parts thread in the technics forum, approved by mods/admins - but asked before if it will be ok for their platform..). Both sides should just calm down and respect the other, I guess we would all benefit from it. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Toastie Posted January 16 (edited) 19 hours ago, Horation said: what I said is that if a regular brick has a tight fit, it is likely poorly made, source : worked in a company making injection molded products. I am just wanting to flip over another penny for your purchase of the original Cloud City set (don't take me too seriously, I am a PChemist, and the handling of errors usually drive students nuts. So I >have< to do this ) You know the injection moulding process very well. With friction pins, you have no problem when they are having a tight fit, as these are made to have a tight fit. But: The fit for the pins of the bad guys are - maybe per design - tighter than TLG's pins are. The assessment of "poorly made" = having an error only applies, when there is a) a random error in the dimension of these pins, or b) these dimensions are off by a systematic error, right? In case of a): Screw them, that is bad. As far as I have experienced from my Gobricks builds in 2023/4: They are not randomly tight, but always tighter. This appears to be a systematic erro. In case of b): That error is only quantifiable, when you know the "true" value. We now have to define "true". If TLG's dimensions are true, then you are right: Bad moulding. But what if the bad guys decided to design their plates and bricks also that way, because they want to make display models and/or models that "need" that additional grip? In that case, their dimensions are "true" and TLGs are poorly made. Don't you agree? Best, Thorsten Edited January 16 by Toastie Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Horation Posted January 16 1 hour ago, Toastie said: I am just wanting to flip over another penny for your purchase of the original Cloud City set (don't take me too seriously, I am a PChemist, and the handling of errors usually drive students nuts. So I >have< to do this) Well, you mention your comment where you falsely compared stealing IP to making a copy of an unlicensed design, and then you don't explain it at all, maybe I was right and you were acting in bad faith... You know the injection moulding process very well. With friction pins, you have no problem when they are having a tight fit, as these are made to have a tight fit. But: The fit for the pins of the bad guys are - maybe per design - tighter than TLG's pins are. The assessment of "poorly made" = having an error only applies, when there is a) a random error in the dimension of these pins, or b) these dimensions are off by a systematic error, right? fair enough, but please stop calling them "bad guys", you are trying to make me look like I am a "black and white, no nuance" kind of person, which I'm not, I just said that counterfeiting is wrong. In case of a): Screw them, that is bad. As far as I have experienced from my Gobricks builds in 2023/4: They are not randomly tight, but always tighter. This appears to be a systematic error. True In case of b): That error is only quantifiable, when you know the "true" value. We now have to define "true". If TLG's dimensions are true, then you are right: Bad moulding. But what if the bad guys decided to design their plates and bricks also that way, because they want to make display models and/or models that "need" that additional grip? In that case, their dimensions are "true" and TLGs are poorly made. Don't you agree? Again, stop trying to make it look like I am not nuanced. And no I don't agree, if the parts are made to be too tight, they will get more friction, OK for technic parts meant to have a lot of friction and for display models, NOT OK for parts getting reused a lot, the "true" value is the one which maximises reusability, not the one making for the best display models or the one allowing to create more structurally unstable builds. See in bold Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Toastie Posted January 16 (edited) Yeah, you are right. 12 minutes ago, Horation said: the "true" value is the one which maximises reusability, not the one making for the best display models or the one allowing to create more structurally unstable builds. OK, if this is "the" definition, then this is true. Will stop to call them bad guys and over and out. Edited January 16 by Toastie Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
DonQuixote Posted January 17 (edited) I just want to support an amateur designer (mocyourbricks) who earns a little bit extra so he can pay his college loans and save up for a house. What's wrong with that? Even if the IP is stolen from a multinational. I am fine with it. I have a soft spot for the weak and the underdogs. Oh, by the way : I viewed all the Starwars series without paying for it. Yes someone pirated that for me. Yes, I am pirate scum . But in return, the money I did not spend to that company, I gave to charity. I donate to charity every month. My opinion : yes, it's ok to steal from the filthy rich and give to the poor. Long live Robin Hood! Long live the forrest people from classic Lego castle! Edited January 17 by DonQuixote Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
