SHIELD vs. HYDRA Mafia - Day 4

[Bob]

Score!

Vote: James Cunningham (Bob)

I reject the notion that you are town!!!!

Goodbye

Jokes on you, I've already planned my getaway escape. I'll wait until the conclusion of the day though, then I'm out of here!

[jluck]

Were you sent anything by the host about the fruit before the day went up?

Usually: Prank roles have something that would be sent to the target.

Usually: Prank roles are not shown in the pictures.

Usually: Pictures mean nothing and are only for fun.

I don't think the fruit means anything, but I also don't understand why the host would be putting it in the openers if it doesn't mean anything.

No, the host didn't tell me anything. I didn't notice it until I reread the start of the day. I'm trying to remember what game it was, but a few games back a bunch of people have or have themselves prank roles. It got a little obnoxious as I recall. I'll go back and look if I get a chance.

Well, sir, let's see if you think this is making something of nothing. YOU ARE SCUM. I investigated you last night and you are full-blown Hydra scummy scumness.

So let me open the voting with

Vote: James Cunningham (Bob)

Ha!

Vote: James Cunningham (Bob)

[JackJonespaw]

No, the host didn't tell me anything. I didn't notice it until I reread the start of the day. I'm trying to remember what game it was, but a few games back a bunch of people have or have themselves prank roles. It got a little obnoxious as I recall. I'll go back and look if I get a chance.

If I remember correctly, Main Street Mafia had some, as well as Blacktron.

Anyways,

Vote: James Cunningham (Bob)

We've almost won, fellow townies! Almost there!

[Umbra-Manis]

Good work Investigator!

Vote: James Cunningham (Bob)

[Piratedave84]

Jokes on you, I've already planned my getaway escape. I'll wait until the conclusion of the day though, then I'm out of here!

Are you going to monologue and tell us your plan like a true vilain?

[mostlytechnic]

Are you going to monologue and tell us your plan like a true vilain?

Oh please do - that's always the best part, when the villain stalls for time and brags about his/her/their plan.

In this case though, I don't think even you think you're in a position of power. Either we win with your lynch, or there might be 1 more left and it won't take long to hunt them down as well.

[Bob]

There will be no villainous monologue because I actually want to help the town out. I am not out to destroy it as it might seem. Friends, I have a confession to make. I am in fact not a loyal Agent of Shield after all. However, I am not a member of HYDRA either.

I am a Werewolf.

It was included in my role description for a reason; to make my survival that much harder. While I am a neutral third party, I am not the Serial Killer. I'm a survivor. It's a rather desperate claim, I know, but I make it only because I never win any of these games and I finally wanted to win one now that I had a role that would let me coast to the end. The Survivor role is designed to be difficult to survive, which is probably why I was investigated as HYDRA and not as a neutral third party. I was hoping I wouldn't be investigated, because it would've made my role that much easier, but it wasn't meant to be. If you're looking for historical evidence, I can point to one of my own past games, Excalibur Mafia. CallMePie was a survivor then and his win condition was to survive until the end. I would've had his result come back as scum in order to make his role more difficult, but he was never investigated and he was night killed instead.

Here's a wild and crazy thought, let's vote for the Serial Killer, who is clearly not out to help the town, as evidenced by the fact that she killed a loyal townie last night. The Serial Killer's win objective is to be the last person standing. Don't forget this.

Vote: Alyssa Turner (CallMePie)

When I mentioned my getaway, it's because I will ultimately turn into a werewolf upon death and flee the carrier. I will lose all the same though, which sucks. Please friends, I know I have been quiet, but it's because I've been trying to survive. I am not out to kill any of you or bring harm to SHIELD, I'm just trying to survive this game...of life and make it to the end.

You might see it as a pathetic plea of a man who is one foot in the grave and is rapidly losing his balance, but I am telling the truth and I hope you will believe me. I can be an asset to the town, mostly because I know things. After all, how do you think I found out who the serial killer is? I'm asking that you unvote me, even if it is only temporarily, so I can continue to try to prove my innocence. If you're not satisfied, you can vote for me again. There is still plenty of time left in the day, after all.

Question me all you like, I am ready to answer anything you throw at me.

[jluck]

If I remember correctly, Main Street Mafia had some, as well as Blacktron.

Anyways,

Vote: James Cunningham (Bob)

We've almost won, fellow townies! Almost there!

I believe your right. I went back and looked at a few old ones trying to remember which it was. Remember the cosplay game with the rotating costumes? That was well done! I also really enjoyed the submarine game by tammo which had secret codes and the like.

Our host has done a good job here as well

[mostlytechnic]

Ok James...

I checked into the roles you're claiming. Both werewolf and survivor are mafia roles, but they are NOT the same. So why would our host have mixed them up, when all the other role claims I've gotten were exactly stock, just like MafiaScum describes them?

Werewolf

Survivor

Of special note, there is NOTHING there to suggest that survivors should be reported as scum to an investigation. It's a hard enough role to pull off - why would Mr Fury make it even harder?

And the other question - on what basis are you claiming that Alyssa is a SK? We don't have any evidence of one being here (in fact, the low night kills would indicate there is NOT), and I have no reason to suspect that she is a SK at this point.

[Lady K]

Yeah, pictures don't contain clues. So why do you think they do? What does getting a pineapple have to do with getting dead? The pineapple just seems like a joke / prank role, if it's from a role at all and not just a funny thing in the story.

Well, several things you had said it at first seemed like you knew who delivered the pineapple and that it was in fact just for fun. Then you turned around and said the same person actually blocked but didn't really give the pineapple. Now the receiver of said pineapple is dead. That is why I was just wondering if there might be a connection especially if you don't know who gave the pineapple.....unless you know for sure there isn't. In which case why not just say 'hey I know for sure there is no connection' instead of saying it 'seeems like it is'.

Were you sent anything by the host about the fruit before the day went up?

Usually: Prank roles have something that would be sent to the target.

Usually: Prank roles are not shown in the pictures.

Usually: Pictures mean nothing and are only for fun.

I don't think the fruit means anything, but I also don't understand why the host would be putting it in the openers if it doesn't mean anything.

I agree, which is why I was bringing it up. If it does mean anything then we have discussed it and not just forgotten about it. If not then it was just for fun.

Well, sir, let's see if you think this is making something of nothing. YOU ARE SCUM. I investigated you last night and you are full-blown Hydra scummy scumness.

So let me open the voting with

Vote: James Cunningham (Bob)

Well done.

Vote: James Cunnigham (Bob)

[Tariq j]

Well I guess we know what was so disconcerting after all...

Vote: James Cunnigham (Bob)

Here's a wild and crazy thought, let's vote for the Serial Killer, who is clearly not out to help the town, as evidenced by the fact that she killed a loyal townie last night. The Serial Killer's win objective is to be the last person standing. Don't forget this.

Vote: Alyssa Turner (CallMePie)

This feels like an attempt to just try and call someone else out.

[Bob]

Ok James...

I checked into the roles you're claiming. Both werewolf and survivor are mafia roles, but they are NOT the same. So why would our host have mixed them up, when all the other role claims I've gotten were exactly stock, just like MafiaScum describes them?

Werewolf

Survivor

Of special note, there is NOTHING there to suggest that survivors should be reported as scum to an investigation. It's a hard enough role to pull off - why would Mr Fury make it even harder?

And the other question - on what basis are you claiming that Alyssa is a SK? We don't have any evidence of one being here (in fact, the low night kills would indicate there is NOT), and I have no reason to suspect that she is a SK at this point.

Just because everything you've seen thus far has been vanilla doesn't mean the entire game is vanilla. Also, my role isn't necessarily "Werewolf." That is my faction/allegiance/whatever you want to call it. I specifically stated that I am a Survivor. Additionally, don't defer to the mafiascum wiki for all of your information on roles and mafia for Eurobricks games. There are many differences between standard mafia and mafia that we play here. It was an unspoken rule in earlier games that the mafiawiki was to be seen as not representative of games on these forums. That's been ignored recently and it's a shame that the first thing people do is run to the wiki rather than look back for evidence in past games.

The role of survivor is also traditionally a rather easy one. If you lay low and are just active enough to not rouse suspicion, you'll be fine and able to coast right on through. I suppose our host wanted to make the role a little bit harder. As I stated, there's been evidence of this in past games and in one of my own games. I obviously didn't know about it, but I still didn't want to be investigated. Being investigated as a third party still would've been just as bad for me, since I'm sure you would've lynched me today anyway.

As for Alyssa being the serial killer, I'm afraid you'll just have to trust me on that one.

Well I guess we know what was so disconcerting after all...

Oh, what, you don't find people dying at night disconcerting? Psycho.

This feels like an attempt to just try and call someone else out.

Call it what you will, but I know I am 100% correct that Alyssa is the Serial Killer.

Or at least 90%.

[mostlytechnic]

You're right, we would have lynched you as a third party as well - so that's why having a supposed survivor appear as scum makes absolutely zero sense.

[jluck]

(snip)

As for Alyssa being the serial killer, I'm afraid you'll just have to trust me on that one.

Oh, what, you don't find people dying at night disconcerting? Psycho.

Call it what you will, but I know I am 100% correct that Alyssa is the Serial Killer.

Or at least 90%.

I cut out most of the BS from a dying man, however, I dont want to ignore it all. James knows he's caught and everything he says will be viewed as coming from a scum-o, so the Alyssa stuff is a real WIFOM moment. I'm just wondering exactly how she factors in or if she's just a townie he's throwing shade at.

[Bob]

You're right, we would have lynched you as a third party as well - so that's why having a supposed survivor appear as scum makes absolutely zero sense.

It makes perfect sense actually. It makes my role all the more difficult.

[Tariq j]

It makes perfect sense actually. It makes my role all the more difficult.

Not really. Whether you're a survivor who who had a scum reading or a survivor who had a third party reading we would still lynch you anyway, it wouldn't have any effect on the difficulty of your role.

Oh, what, you don't find people dying at night disconcerting? Psycho.

Hey! I may be drunk but I ain't no Psycho!

Also, is it normal in a small game to have 2 third party roles?

[Bob]

Not really. Whether you're a survivor who who had a scum reading or a survivor who had a third party reading we would still lynch you anyway, it wouldn't have any effect on the difficulty of your role.

Hey! I may be drunk but I ain't no Psycho!

Also, is it normal in a small game to have 2 third party roles?

You wouldn't always lynch a third party player, at least I wouldn't depending on their role. Some third party players have historically been helpful to the town.

And yes, it is normal.

[Darkdragon]

That's a pretty impressive defense from James, I didn't realize he had so many words.

The whole thing about Alyssa is strange though, and where is she to defend herself? I don't believe there is an SK here and if there was, how would someone with no abilities figure it out anyway and have nothing at all to support his claims?

It's obviously a complete fabrication, but why? Is she really the last scum and James thinks that after the night finishes and he's shown as scum, we will all discount anything he's said? Is she simply a quiet townie and Bob is trying to set her up as a kill for vig with his WIFOMness? Was it just a random name he could throw a vote on since he knows it's over for him?

Vote: James Cunningham (Bob)

[Bob]

It's obviously a complete fabrication, but why? Is she really the last scum and James thinks that after the night finishes and he's shown as scum, we will all discount anything he's said? Is she simply a quiet townie and Bob is trying to set her up as a kill for vig with his WIFOMness? Was it just a random name he could throw a vote on since he knows it's over for him?

Perhaps it's because he's spoken to the scum who agreed to let him coast and survive after being rolecopped.

[mostlytechnic]

Not really. Whether you're a survivor who who had a scum reading or a survivor who had a third party reading we would still lynch you anyway, it wouldn't have any effect on the difficulty of your role.

Also, is it normal in a small game to have 2 third party roles?

Exactly - since you'd be lynched either way, it does NOT increase the difficulty. I suppose there's a 1% chance that a neutral survivor might be able to talk the town into living, but it's close enough to zero to not matter. Second, for a neutral party to appear as scum would mean the host is LYING to the players (unless there's some framer or insane cop or something like that). And hosts don't lie to the players, or the game becomes crap.

And no, I'd be SHOCKED to have 2 different 3rd parties going in a game this size. It's rare enough in a huge game.

That's a pretty impressive defense from James, I didn't realize he had so many words.

The whole thing about Alyssa is strange though, and where is she to defend herself? I don't believe there is an SK here and if there was, how would someone with no abilities figure it out anyway and have nothing at all to support his claims?

It's obviously a complete fabrication, but why? Is she really the last scum and James thinks that after the night finishes and he's shown as scum, we will all discount anything he's said? Is she simply a quiet townie and Bob is trying to set her up as a kill for vig with his WIFOMness? Was it just a random name he could throw a vote on since he knows it's over for him?

I can't imagine that Alyssa is scum - if she was, she'd have to be the only scum left after James is lynched, so he'd know we'll vig kill her just to be safe (assuming she hasn't already claimed a PR to the block...) He's just desperately flailing and trying to get a townie killed. And at this point, it doesn't matter. Even if we do kill her and she is town and there's another scum left, we'll catch them tonight with all the PRs we have left. So his stories just serve to add some interest to the end of the game, for which I thank you sir.

[Bob]

Exactly - since you'd be lynched either way, it does NOT increase the difficulty. I suppose there's a 1% chance that a neutral survivor might be able to talk the town into living, but it's close enough to zero to not matter. Second, for a neutral party to appear as scum would mean the host is LYING to the players (unless there's some framer or insane cop or something like that). And hosts don't lie to the players, or the game becomes crap.

And no, I'd be SHOCKED to have 2 different 3rd parties going in a game this size. It's rare enough in a huge game.

The host isn't lying if the role is designed to be that way.

I can't imagine that Alyssa is scum - if she was, she'd have to be the only scum left after James is lynched, so he'd know we'll vig kill her just to be safe (assuming she hasn't already claimed a PR to the block...) He's just desperately flailing and trying to get a townie killed. And at this point, it doesn't matter. Even if we do kill her and she is town and there's another scum left, we'll catch them tonight with all the PRs we have left. So his stories just serve to add some interest to the end of the game, for which I thank you sir.

I'm really damned if I do or damned if I don't at this point. If for some reason you decide not to lynch me, I'll be killed tonight by either Alyssa or the scum out of fear that I'll reveal which one of them spoke to me. I've handed you the serial killer, it's up to you to act on that. I'm not a big fan of flailing mostly because I think it's useless. If I was scum then I'd just give up, but I'm not scum. I've done it before, but that was mostly a humorous flail.

Although some of you might think this is funny when it clearly isn't. Don't just hand this game over to the scum. If (although it seems I am, sadly) I am lynched and when I come up as having told the truth tomorrow, please read over my statements once more.

[mostlytechnic]

The host IS lying to YOU though if you show up different than you expected. Any role that does that that I've ever heard of (godfather, miller, etc) it's a known thing to the player.

[CMP]

Sorry James. I know how desperate one has to be to claim third party. Vote: James Cunningham (Bob).

[Bob]

Sorry James. I know how desperate one has to be to claim third party. Vote: James Cunningham (Bob).

Laughing all the way to the conclusion, are we? I doubt you'll be able to kill everyone in time. However people don't want to listen to reason. They'd rather take the easy way out, which is why I'm being lynched. It's really sad.

I'm not giving up. I'm adamant about my claim and I know I'm right. Plus I want to win as a neutral. Nobody ever makes me a neutral player. I don't think I've ever been a neutral. That's just not fair. Hey, whoever hosts next, make me a neutral again. It got screwed up this time because the town doesn't want me help.

If you're not going to kill Alyssa tonight (bad move, you should do that) then I'd suggest investigating her and blocking her and then seeing what happens. Especially when I flip neutral tomorrow.

I guess I understand why you guys don't believe me though. If the roles were reversed, would I give thought to this? Probably not, the peer pressure about unvoting makes everyone hesitate, even in the face of a neutral player who is willing to help the town. People are too worried about their own skins rather than trying to do what's best for the town.

The host IS lying to YOU though if you show up different than you expected. Any role that does that that I've ever heard of (godfather, miller, etc) it's a known thing to the player.

Godfather and Miller aren't really third party roles. Neutral characters are designed to be wonky.

[mediumsnowman]

Vote Tally

9 votes for James Cunningham (Bob): (mostlytechnic, Piratedave84, jluck, JackJonespaw, Umbra-Manis, Lady K, Tariq j, Darkdragon, CallMePie)

1 vote for Alyssa Turner (CallMePie): (Bob)

With 10 players remaining, a majority of 6 is required to lynch. Approximately 24 hours remain in the day.