Bionicle 2015 Discussion

[Mandate]

...are you complaining that new Bionicle will have magical masks, like it always did? (except it was eventually explained to be the whole sufficiently advanced technology is indistinguishable from magic thing but whatever. in 2001, masks were magic.)

But nothing about BIONICLE screams "MAGIC!" other than the Masks themselves (and even then there are exceptions) , and you yourself just stated in the original plot they were advanced technology. Look at Kopaka's mask. Does it tell you that it is magic, or that it's technological in some way? Look at all of the vents on the masks. Assuming nothing has changed, none of this stuff is very magic-y. Shoulder/body/arm/weapon mounted machine gun cannons don't help. It fits the new Mask of Creation, yes, but if they over use the magic (my main concern) it's not going to fit, especially considering we're not using as many pistons now. Everything looks sleek and refined, not gritty, uncovered and mysterious.

[---Vertea---]

I do kind of miss matoran lettering though.

Still, Mask of Creation gets an A+ in my book. It looks cool as hell.

And flippable masks means mouthlessness can be a thing on masks again! yay! I honestly prefer the masks to be masks, not faces. That was my biggest peeve with the Bionicle trilogy.

[TwistLaw]

There was a lot of mystery and nonsense throughout the whole BIONICLE story, and as it was said calling it magic or protodermis is just a mere wording matter. Also:

>implying the won't give us a more specifical terminology as the story progresses

[Grima]

But nothing about BIONICLE screams "MAGIC!" other than the Masks themselves (and even then there are exceptions) , and you yourself just stated in the original plot they were advanced technology. Look at Kopaka's mask. Does it tell you that it is magic, or that it's technological in some way? Look at all of the vents on the masks. Assuming nothing has changed, none of this stuff is very magic-y. Shoulder/body/arm/weapon mounted machine gun cannons don't help. It fits the new Mask of Creation, yes, but if they over use the magic (my main concern) it's not going to fit, especially considering we're not using as many pistons now. Everything looks sleek and refined, not gritty, uncovered and mysterious.

Both masks and elemental powers took liberal use of magic to understand in early years, and in the end we STILL never got a clear technological answer for either, we were just TOLD it was tech, when for all intents and purposes it may has well have been magic all along.

[Timeline15]

But nothing about BIONICLE screams "MAGIC!" other than the Masks themselves (and even then there are exceptions) , and you yourself just stated in the original plot they were advanced technology. Look at Kopaka's mask. Does it tell you that it is magic, or that it's technological in some way? Look at all of the vents on the masks. Assuming nothing has changed, none of this stuff is very magic-y. Shoulder/body/arm/weapon mounted machine gun cannons don't help. It fits the new Mask of Creation, yes, but if they over use the magic (my main concern) it's not going to fit, especially considering we're not using as many pistons now. Everything looks sleek and refined, not gritty, uncovered and mysterious.

I think they probably only said "magic" and indeed "gold" so as to give a simple explanation on the facebook page. The phrase "there is a mask with really advanced technology made out of a metal called protosteel" doesn't have quite the same ring to it. Hopefully, in time, we'll get an explanation behind the mask, as we did with all the others, but for now, they seem to be simplifying for the sake of newcomers.

I do hope that this new mask attatchment doesn't mean the masks flip up though. I hated the idea that they all had identical faces under the masks. The masks WERE the faces to me. The head underneath was always akin to a skull in my mind.

Edited September 19, 2014 by Timeline15

[Gatanui]

Just took a closer look at the high-res version of the video on Google+ and it seems they're actually not the Nuva symbols.

-Gata

[Lind Whisperer]

I'm fine with the magic, if it's a continuation, but they shouldn't flaunt it too much. What they have right now sounds more like Imagination than it does like magic. Which is rather interesting:

"One persistent myth is that Artakha wears a mask designed by the Great Beings, a Kanohi Mask of Creation. While it does not actually bring things into being, it helps the wearer to envision how they should look and how they should be designed..."

Imagine if it's a reboot, but tied into LU.

Not going to happen, but they are defyingly similar.

[CM4Sci]

Woooo!!

-Sci

[Still Raindrop]

I think that the new mask attachment could actually be really, really good--I'm excited for it.

[Timeline15]

While it does not actually bring things into being, it helps the wearer to envision how they should look and how they should be designed..."

That doesn't sound like " a mask that will grant its bearer unspeakable power. "

[Lind Whisperer]

That doesn't sound like " a mask that will grant its bearer unspeakable power. "

Actually, it does.

Imagine your room. Now, imagine that you can reshape the contents in anyway your want. Completely reinvent everything. Now, go out and do that to the rest of the world.

Yeah.

That's pretty a powerful mask.

[Grima]

That doesn't sound like " a mask that will grant its bearer unspeakable power. "

Ignoring that, in a reboot, they can tweak mask powers as they need, according to the MoC's BS01 page:

The Mask of Creation allows its user to imagine a completed product from raw materials and learn how to construct it. It can also create an object if the user is already aware of how that object can be made.

I think the former combined with the latter is a pretty substantial power.

[TwistLaw]

Greg confirms it's not a continuation.

Edited September 19, 2014 by TwistLaw

[Dorek]

A lot of the Mask of Creation was elaborated upon through Greg answers (and he recently gave a fairly non-answer about what happens if you, say, destroy the Mask of Creation, which contradicts what was said about it before), so it could be rectonned.

Granted I never liked most of what was said about the Mask of Creation (I blame my good pal/horrible person Erebus), but it's one of the many reasons why this is hopefully a reboot.

Also also BZP mentioned that the NYCC reveal also does actually have to do with BIONICLE, so... few more weeks, neh?

[TwistLaw]

Also: Greg did not write the new story.

Happy or sad?

As for me, curious to see if the will duck up anything soon.

[Lind Whisperer]

And, let's not forget that as it's a media promo, they can tend to hype it up a bit.

"Four elemental ninjas use the incredible powers of Spinjitsu to create the unstoppable Tornado of Creation!"

Sort of true, but not entirely. I wouldn't dismiss continuation instantly just because there's a slight difference in descriptions.

Greg confirms it's not a reboot.

Link?

Edited September 19, 2014 by Lind Whisperer

[Dorek]

Greg mentioned on the LMB that it's not by definition a continuation; again, a fantastic non-answer, but still...

(also he's involved with it to some degree... hopefully just writing the books)

[Timeline15]

Greg confirms it's not a reboot

Not sure if you're joking or not. Nothing he said there confirmed anything in any way. Although the way he answered suggests that he IS involved with the new BIONICLE in some way.

[Lind Whisperer]

Also: Greg did not write the new story.

Happy or sad?

As for me, curious to see if the will duck up anything soon.

No particular feelings one way or the other. He was a good writer, but the incredible back-story of the franchise was created before him. (six Toa heal a dead robot in medicine pill canisters)

Great though if this is true - but it's 4chan so I'm afraid it may be their classic trolling unless Greg himself is confirming this...

[TwistLaw]

Link?

https://community.lego.com/t5/LEGO-General/Chat-with-Greg-Farshtey/m-p/11180255/highlight/false#M251989

Also, he was just asked some bits of story by the guys who are ACTUALLY writing the new story. The development was already advanced when Greg briefly "joined" the crew.

Great though if this is true - but it's 4chan so I'm afraid it may be their classic trolling unless Greg himself is confirming this...

I posted it there myself, as a quick way to give the image a link

[Lyichir]

Greg mentioned on the LMB that it's not by definition a continuation; again, a fantastic non-answer, but still...

(also he's involved with it to some degree... hopefully just writing the books)

He said on the LMBs that he's not writing the story—just consulting and making recommendations. That could very well change over the course of the theme if they want books or comics or the like, but for now it sounds like he's just a member of the story team, if even that.

[Gatanui]

I thought about that once, just not sure how that would work with the current story.

It could very well take place before the Great Cataclysm. In fact, at the very beginning of the Matoran Universe. Take into consideration that the Toa Mata were already around before the events after the Great Cataclysm. Keep in mind they were trained by Hydraxon and even had at least one mission in Karda Nui (as far as I recall). One of those missions might have been recovering the Mask of Creation from the place where it was kept prior to Arthaka and Karzahni fighting for the honor to wear it. The fact that the Toa are going on a quest to collecting masks of power again may be irritating, but could work with the storyline that has already been established. For one, it has never been stated that the Kanohi masks of power that the Toa wear are unique, meaning that each Toa had their very specific Kanohi Hau, Akaku and so on, which would make little sense anyway, as it would give the 12 Kanohi masks of the first BIONICLE year more importance as compared to other Kanohi masks. From a logic point of view, the Toa should be able to wear ANY mask of power, rather than having masks of power assigned to each one of them. It is thus conceivable that the Toa already had to collect masks of power prior to the Cataclysm. Logically, they would not be able to use them after that event since they invoke their masks of power through their suva and fail to do so over arbitrary distances, which became obvious when the Toa Nuva travelled to Karda Nui.

-Gata

[Logan McOwen]

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ヽ༼ຈل͜ຈ༽ﾉ

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Edited September 19, 2014 by LewiMOC

[Timeline15]

Honestly, a prequel would be dull, knowing the eventual fate of all the major characters concerned already, and indeed, the entire truth of the matoran universe. A continuation however, would allow them to actually add more to it, maybe actually develop spherus magna a little.

[InfurnallDragon]

Hello all! I've been watching the rumors for months and have been totally excited for the return of what defined my childhood, but I just now made an account to join in on this cool-looking AFOL community.

I figured the mask would be Artakhas the moment I saw it. A lot of things about the new sets made it seem like they wanted to be very true to what BIONICLE once was. After reading the mask's description online and then looking at it on the leaked card image I thought they wanted to get as much like that description of a very detailed work of art as possible.

But what really prompted me to make an account just now is the Technology vs Magic thing. In a lot of media today I have been very dissapointed by writer's needs to take something that started with magic and then totally blow that off as "advanced technology". Look to Thor for an example (Mata Nui I hope they dont pull that on the Dr Strange Movie...) Before I really took notice of this sort of thing I really loved Bionicle's orignal meeting of magic with technology, and it is one of the reasons I really love mixed high fantasy and sci-fi media more than either of the two apart (Eberron). There can something of a plot-void in pure magic, but pure sci-fi totally disenchants me from some plots (especially when its used to disenchant magic that was already introduced to the media in question).

Magic in a universe also allows for an organic feeling or the mysterious and unexplained. If you combine it with technology rather that throw it out completely over time you can keep that and still have technological aspects to be explained to stop that from going stale.With everything being explained away with technology becoming more prevalent than mixing them, theres definitely a risk of "its advanced technology" also becoming the new "oh its just magic" for explaining things away.

I see about as much a problem with Magic becoming a bigger theme (or should I say element) in BIONICLE as I do with it being a reboot or continuation (which is to say no problem with all 3). And the same for keeping technology strong alongside the magical themes.