Dragonfire

Yes, I think it is. I can't see why the scum wouldn't janitor you after everything that happened on Day 2. OK. I think this is wrong - there is a janitor. But it is likely that the Scum blocked the SK, or two of the killers targeted the same tree. Peter was definitely not an Oak. It would be a great Scum claim. To claim vengeful and then ask to be lynched, using double bluffing and a fear of being the hammer to keep votes off him. My role PM did not say Miller specifically, but I asked Alder for clarification if it was the same role as the Miller, and he said yes (the Elder has confirmed that I can say this) Good - so it is confirmed that you were the tree that passively killed Peter last night. Nice one, mate. Jack, worst case scenario, there are two scum and a SK. If you get lynched and are an Oak, then there will be seven players left during the night. One of them is the vigilante. The vig is obviously not going to target themselves, Simon or Bruce, so that leaves four players to choose from. Three of them are non-town. So, in the worst-case scenario, there is a 75% chance that the vigilante will kill a non-town player tonight. The SK would also have a 1/3 chance of killing a scum. Then on Day 7, the remaining townies can lynch another scum. This is very unlikely, though. Jack, it is better for the town that you die now, rather than later when the game really does hang in the balance. Stump Vote: Jack Pine (with regret, since I think you have behaved like an Oak for the most part of the game) Jack? If Jack is the SK, then I would say that there are good odds for lynching him, as otherwise we might lynch a townie. There are probably two Maples left if he is the SK, and we are unlikely to lose the game tonight unless the vig shoots wrong.

Here's my vote analysis Excel thing. Hope it works.

Oh, OK.

I'm not sure -- I'm not a Maple Maybe because Peter was the least valuable Maple, and maybe because they would look towny later. I looked at Day One again to see who didn't end up on the main bandwagon. The only living trees who ended the day with their votes on someone other than Alastair were Lassie, William and Sammy (who all voted for Bruce) and Jack (who voted for Hazel)

Oh, did Hazel do things like this before ?? Simon (these are what the stumps have told me. Can you confirm this) : n1083 JIUQ 159 ?? n1704, n3198 did not JIUQ 3.14 ?? n6144, n2262, n9689, n6155, n8358 JIUQ 3.14 ?? n9689 FUQS 326 ?? n6144 FUQS n9689 ??

Chester's name should be in green. I think that if Hazel and Peter were both scum, then the scum would have tried to keep the ratio of Hazel : Peter votes fairly even, but then most of them would have piled on Hazel. If Hazel was scum, then I think you should add Adelaide to the list. Out of those suspects, I think Lassie is looking the most scummy right now. Sorry, no. If Hazel is telling the truth, she was town. But if she isn't, she could well be the SK. Before she sent me the PM I received yesterday, she was probably more likely to be the SK than a Maple.

Umm..... the player whose name I just coded is not Hazel. Hazel did not claim that role. I deleted my PM thread with Hazel already. And Walter has decided not to suspend Hazel from future games (or at least, that's what I inferred from his post in the C&D thread).

Simon, can you re-send your codes using the role codes on post 4 of page 3 of our PM ??? Besides, just for your information, n4888 326.

Even scummier. Well, I am pretty sure that Hazel was an Oak. The ancient rules of the forest are preventing me from being any more than "pretty sure". I'll just say that if Hazel was a Maple, she is the most despicably manipulative player I have ever played with -- more manipulative than you would be if you turned out to be Scum fooling us all (exceedingly unlikely). She struck me as genuine, but confused. Simon, the codes you gave me only covered the players' names and a few role names. You never sent me any role codes. Can you please use the role codes that I sent you in post 4 of page 3 of our PM ???

If Peter was the SK, then who did the Scum kill last night? Or were they blocked? He told me that he believed my claim. It's odd that he spent this amount of time undermining me. Scum must have really wanted me gone (they even janitored Hazel to frame me) This is similar to Sammy's vote analysis yesterday, where he included me as Scum. Whereas Sammy's action was more presumptious and cocksure than scummy, Lassie's could come across as a slip. Ditto. Simon's case has made me look at Lassie's posts in a new way. She's joined Sue up there on the Scum list.

I guess you're right about it being how she plays. I think that the Scum have a janitor, and have chosen to use the janitor action on all the Scum who have died so far, and Hazel. I think that Barry was definitely scum and that Peter was definitely non-Town. Alastair could go either way, but I think Hazel was an Oak. The reason she gave for messaging me was that she didn't want me to think that she had manipulated me. Correct. If all scum are "janitored", then I believe that the SK would also be "janitored". A neutral survivor (benign neutral) could go either way. But I think that the scum have a janitor action though. I called him out for that yesterday. I found his reasons for voting me the most strange and he seemed almost fanatically defensive of the Hazel = Maple idea.

Simon, I'll get round to your codes later. Hazel. I'm sorry, but I can only say that it is my feeling. Rules are rules. Yes, I have a similar strong feeling. It was not a living player who PM'd me. Yes, I can see a scum doing that, but why would the Maples want us to believe that there are lots more living Maples than we originally thought? Surely the Maples would want us to think that all the janitored people were scum, so that we would underestimate their numbers. I don't want to go into detail, but it is my belief that they were town. I can vouch for this -- Clem and Waldorf confirmed that this was true in the stump PM. Barry, Maggie, Buck and Vicky do seem like good SK targets. I wonder if the scum were blocked on Night 2... I agree with this. Peter was almost certainly scum. Maybe the SK/scum were blocked? Maggie does seem like an ideal SK target though. That does look bad for Jack. If Simon was converted, he would have told the scum about Chester's bomb claim. Unless Peter was the SK... Based on the assumption that Peter was scum and Hazel was town, we should look at the Day 4 voting patterns - especially the people who defended/didn't want to lynch Peter, the people who jumped on Hazel's wagon or the people who jumped from Peter's wagon to Hazel's.

I am fairly sure that at least one of the "janitored" players was an Oak whose stump was removed by the Scum. Please don't ask why or how I think this. I would suggest looking into all the players who are opposed to the existence of a janitor. In other words, there probably is both a janitor and a Serial Killer. There are two or three Maples left. Sorry for the double post btw)

I was just remarking that the tree in the picture looked like both Sammy and Chester. Rereading this again, it was definitely Chester.

Sorry.

Since I wasn't janitored, I do think it is likely that Maples' alignments are hidden upon death. After some discussion with the other stumps, I am fairly sure that a SK does exist. I agree with your explanation of the Day Four voting. Assuming Peter and Hazel were both scum, Hazel would have made a better bus option than Peter, and there was also an opportunity to set up my lynch. I never defended Peter- you must mean Hazel. And it is my belief that we have one Maple and one SK remaining among us. I would suggest looking at Adelaide, Sue and Sammy. Simon, do you want to transfer information to me via the PM codes, or should I transfer information to you?

Let all those who doubted me rue this day! Told you guys so! As for the night kills, Chester being the bomb makes sense, although the "steel spikes" tree could also have been Sammy (but that is unlikely) All I can say is told you so! I think this is likely. I doubt we have a SK. This.

No. Please no. You've already stumped me once, don't do it again!

Does that count as breaking Rule 7 ?? If so I'll edit my post to remove that.

It's OK. I'm still coming to terms with life without a trunk, branches or leaves. Believe me, it takes time getting used to.

I skimread Cosplay Party to get a meta on some people in this game. It was about Day 2 or 3, I think. I only focused on certain players' comments and roles -- I was aware that someone had claimed miller, but I didn't look back at the claim. In fact, I thought that claiming miller first thing on Day 1 was stupid. Yes, I'm acting different than I did in Excalibur TNG. In that game, everyone was new and people were just randomly bandwagoning townies. Someone had to be aggressive and take the lead; I did and I was killed very early. Now, most people are highly experienced so I'm changing my playstyle and keeping a lower profile. That probably is the reason for me sticking to my guns. I know that being openly worried about how you will come across to everyone else and what reads they will get on you is scummy, so I haven't done that until now. Oaks are worried about looking scummy too. So yes, that is spot on.

After rereading Peter's previous games, I think it's more playstyle than scumminess that pings me. Unvote: Peter Cedar (badboytje88) Vote: Chester Chestnut (Lego Spy)

There was that whole Day One business with your vote. You then lurked, fillered and bandwagoned your way through the rest of the game. Not to mention your scummy twisting of Jack's words yesterday (yes, I'm aware that Hazel did this too). Sorry, my bad. I swear you did somewhere though...

But not the case against Chester? Gotcha. Let me get this straight. I have played before on two different sites. 1. MafiaScum - I have played two games on this site. Neither game had a janitor or a miller. I have not read the wiki pages on millers or janitors. 2. epicmafia - This site is very, very different from Eurobricks. Games are over in less than half an hour, and are comprised of fewer players. I have played with both miller and janitor on epicmafia, but as I said, the site is very different and I don't know how to play miller on forum mafia games. Don't believe me? Check out epicmafia and see for yourself. 3. I have read several recent Mafia games on Eurobricks. 4. Despite all this, I consider myself a newbie to forum mafia. So I'm "just stupid". Excuse me? You're voting me because I'm "just stupid" and I think Hazel was town? I can't believe this. Here are three blatantly obvious scum (Nash, Chester and Peter) who can't be bothered to make cases against me, are just voting with the bandwagon, and are just copying what other people say. This game has turned into "Simon Says". Literally. (I'm not implying that Simon is scum, just that a lot of people, namely those I have mentioned in this post, just blindly follow Simon and don't bother scumhunting for themselves. They're either complete sheep, or Maples.)