fhomess

Helga, you've basically done the same thing you're saying you're concerned about. Voting for a quiet player. The bandwagon on Wilhalm has moved along reasonably quickly to 5 votes. The difference with Wilhalm is that he got attacked once he did contribute because he didn't add anything. I'm not saying he's not scum, but it doesn't strike me as a way to encourage Sigrid, Dagstyrr, and other quiet people to say much. If any of them are scum and in the slightest bit concerned about coming off as townie, they'll probably just keep on saying nothing. As for me, I'll admit to thinking that Gofraid is a bit suspicious. Voting patterns let us group people into different subsets, and the one that interests me most from yesterday is the 6 votes that took the tally from 9-6 in favor of Sigrid to 12-8 in favor of Petr. Gofraid started that switch with the 7th vote for Petr, and that's what caused me to start looking at him. Following him, were Lefsi, Wary, Patrekr, Chlodo, and Dagstyrr. Chlodo's been proven town. I think Dagstyrr is more likely town than scum because of the very late vote and the initial vote for Naemr when first signing back on. That's more of a town tell to me than the hammer vote for Petr. As for the other four: - Gofraid led it - Lefsi is sandwiched in there (nice place for scum to hide?) - Wary cast the tying vote (if you think the scum were going for a no-lynch, then this is potentially suspcious) - Patrekr made it clearly in favor of Petr since he switch off of Sigrid (potentially suspicious if you think Sigrid is scum who was being saved) At any rate, I think it's highly unlikely that no one in this group is scum. I haven't yet heard anyone suggest that's not the case. It's just too many end of the day votes. Gofraid is the one who is pushing hardest that we really can't read much into the voting pattern, and that's why he's currently at the top of my scum list for this group.

You could try to actually help by, say, looking for clues and then letting us know what you find or commenting on the theories that others have put out there. We don't get any good read on you if you don't contribute. Maybe that's what you want...

Bear with me on this as it's a bit of a hack job given the primitive writing tools I currently am forced to employ (IE). At this point, both of these are dead and all 3 were town. I do still wonder if there was a scum influencing Petr's decision to target Tumi but we may not ever get an answer to that. If any townie was aware of Petr being in contact with others who are still living, I hope you share that information with someone you trust. These 4 were probably happy that attention was shifted away from them; Sigrid was under fire, and Dagstyrr, Baulf and Chlodochar barely said anything and were problably happy that their laying low was not the focus of attention. 1 of these four is bound to be a scum Only Chlodo is gone and I wouldn't put it past Petr to be right about his guess that one of these is scum. All of them have issues with their behavior yesterday. Sigrid's is well documented and the shift of voting from Sigrid being up 9 to 6 to Petr "winning" the lynch 12 to 8 could be notable if Sigrid is indeed a Servant. Dagstyrr came in late, said she had followed the conversation without being able to contribute, then voted for Naemr before suddenly changing her vote to Petr. Did her fellow Servants warn her that she essentially missed the memo that town was pushing for a last second lynch and she could help seal the deal? Baulf has been... Baulf. A complete mystery in a typically unhelpful way. These 2 are the most suscpicious to me, Kolgrima for being so vocal and defensive in distancing herself from me and Patrekr for being such a sheep I would be tempted to claim that both of them are scum Well, someone with a sword took care of any questions as to Kolgrima's loyalties. Can't say I'm too happy about that. Patrekr I'll talk more about in a bit. I have no idea on how to read these 2, I am leaning town. I know I'm town, so I'm not going to disagree with that. I don't have a particular strong read on Wary at this point, but he did cast the 9th vote for Petr which tied Petr with Sigrid for the lead. Earlier, he had been the 4th vote for Mist before that bandwagon fizzled. Oh look, Patrekr again! This was the quote that I felt indicated Patrekr was Petr's strongest suspect and should be considered a possible scum bus. Obviously, since Petr was not a Servant, that means it was NOT a scum bus. That isn't to say that Patrekr isn't scum. I would tend to agree with Petr's conclusion that it's highly likely one of these is scum. As for Patrekr, his vote for Petr was the 10th vote that broke the tie between Sigrid and Petr. That vote was coupled with an unvote for Sigrid. One does wonder if Sigrid and Patrekr are both scum from this. If the scum were originally hoping to merely get a no lynch on day 1, then this would have been an opportune time to steer the lynch towards Petr in the hopes that it would carry. That vote was placed just before this whole Petr conclusions banter began. Interestingly, Mursi had earlier said that Patrekr "follows votes like a scum would", and that's born out a little bit by him being the 2nd vote for Lefsi and the 7th vote for Sigrid. That vote actually put Sigrid ahead of Petr by 1 vote, and was followed by myself and Tumi giving Sigrid a 9 to 6 vote lead. Maybe Patrekr panicked but was afraid to change his vote from Sigrid until some others joined in. I don't know. This quote from Patrekr is kind of interesting as the 6-6 tie between Petr and Sigrid was broken by Patrekr, when he placed the 7th vote. Rurik had tied it up at 6-6 with a vote for Petr, and then some time later, Patrekr cast that leading vote for Sigrid. With this vote switch, he's now giving Petr that leading 10th vote and knocking Sigrid back down to 8. There's an element of casual disregard for the particulars of his votes and where the leading lynchee stands. This pushes him ahead of Sigrid on my suspicions list as it implies Patrekr's behavior is scummy beyond the need for Sigrid to be his fellow Servant. So do you think it's possible that Sigrid is scum and the votes were steered away from her? Or do you think Rurik's theory that both are town and scum are just splitting the vote is more likely?

On the first point, I've seen all sorts of information passed back and forth early throughout my various raids. It boggles the mind but it happens. Whether it was Petr sharing information or Petr receiving it I don't know. I will not rule out the idea of Petr deciding for himself, but if you want to ignore this as a possible source of clues for tomorrow, then I guess you're welcome to. I think there's a chance there's something useful in there and I will entertain that thought. What do you think we can learn from Petr's death if he turns up Einherjar as you seem to think he will? I think there are more possibilities than just someone told him to target Tumi. However, I agree that if someone told him to target Tumi then the only way they could've known that he was vengeful was if he told them that first. That isn't out of the realm of possibility for Petr. Maybe he shared that information too willingly with someone trying to clarify his position after his debacle. I'm not ready to rule out anything here. This is Petr, after all. His "Oh look, Patreker again!" suggested he wanted us to, you know, look at Patrekr. Kolgrima's a possibility, too, but that line made me think he was more concerned with portraying Patrekr as scummy than Kolgrima.

Honestly, I'm not really sure, but Petr called out a whole bunch of people in terms of their reactions and suggested we look at those groups. Tumi was notably absent in that conclusion. Either he intentionally left Tumi out of that analysis or something changed between the time he posted that and the end of the day. I suppose it's possible that he simply forgot Tumi, but that seems a lot less likely to me. Either he changed his mind on his own, or someone told him something in PM that led him to want to target Tumi. Now maybe he really was a Servant of Loki and he was just tricking us with that conclusion post. In that case, I think we take a more serious look at Patrekr as a possible bus since he didn't follow up on that idea with his action. If he comes back Einherjar, and Tumi's also Einherjar, then I'd be worried that we've already got a Servant manipulating our thought processes behind the scenes. That wouldn't be terribly surprising, but maybe an Einherjar who had contact with Petr has insight into who else also did. Obviously, if Tumi's a servant, then we can all be thankful that Petr's death was not in vain. Those are the three scenarios as I see them, and I think each of the first two leads us in a direction that might yield something positive.

Petr voted for Sigrid and gave me the impression that Patrekr would've been very high up on his list to vote for in his conclusions post. Attacking Tumi but leaving him out of his conclusions post makes me wonder if perhaps he learned something about Tumi that he didn't want Tumi to realize. Speaking of Tumi, pass the turkey this way. My tumi is growling.

Petr, I have to agree with the Chief and Canute here. Your conclusions need to indicate what each group represents. Do you think that Wary and myself are either both town or both scum because you grouped us together? What about those that you think sheeped you? What about those that don't fall into the 11 you listed. Are they all town or all scum? You voted for Sigrid. What does that mean to you regarding Dags, Chlodo, and Baulf?

Heh. When I was in school, someone tried one of these "traps", and they ended up being town. I guess we're all biased by our experiences and past lives. I guess a legitimate question, then, is why is Petr acting like he's never been here before? Fair enough, but I didn't read that comment from Sigrid as saying she thought voting was mandatory, merely that she was unsure of who to vote for. When you informed her that she didn't have to, she withdrew the vote. And now, she has yet to come back and throw her hat in the ring. You gave her an out and she's grabbed on to it. This approach is not out of character for Sigrid.

I agree wholeheartedly that there is nothing to be learned from today's voting pattern unless we successfully come up with a lynch today, and so I am going to reluctantly Unvote: Jarni Child-Sparer (Jamesn) One last note for you, though, Jarni: Don't encourage people not to vote. Voting is the strongest way to learn anything about how people really feel. We need that type of information and can look back on it in future days. By all means ask for reasons for a vote, but don't suggest that a lack of reason means people should abstain. Abstaining from voting only hurts us. I will be keeping my eye on you and I encourage others to do the same. As for where my vote will go next in the absence of Jarni, who among the leading vote getters is the most suspicious at this point? The three at the top of my list are the following: Petr's tricksy little attempt to call for attention strikes me as particularly useless in his expected gains, but for metagamey reasons (that actually go beyond Petr himself), I'm going to refrain from voting for him for now. Without going into full detail, I have seen similarly pointless attempts to root out scum on Day 1 and they've typically been townies. One in particular sticks in my mind. So I'm not comfortable voting for Petr at this point. To my recollection, Wilhalm doesn't appear to be any different than his normal self. Whether or not he's town or scum, I don't know. He pretty much always reads the same to me, which is not particularly on either side, and I'm not prepared to vote for him on a day 1 50/50 feeling. Sigrid will therefore get my vote. I'm not at all comfortable with Sigrid's behavior. It's not even the way she's talking in the third person, but the way that she's saying absolutely nothing. Her vote behavior is not helpful at all. Sigrid, the way to help is to tell the rest of us what you think. If you don't know what to think about someone, ask them to explain something to you. Maybe you'll learn something. You can gather evidence to help us simply by getting people to talk. Vote: Sigrid (Sisco)

I haven't noticed. I don't think it's appropriate to assume transcription errors, and they can be a rather big thing in terms of understanding what you're trying to say. I will take the salt. Perhaps a better way to get Naemr or Mist off your suspect list would have been to evaluate what they're really contributing. I know we base our opinions of people on past behavior, but the Servants of Loki will likely use that to their advantage as well. If not them, who do you think is the most suspicious?

I'm not sure I understand what you're saying here about Mist's past lives. You tend to think she's scum so this time you're not voting for her because you feel the same way? Or is it the opposite? I'm not comfortable with this rapid unvote at all. Why are you unvoting at this point, when there is no pressure on Wilhalm as he's not the vote leader and it's very early, without casting your vote elsewhere. You seem to have passively led the accusation on Mist. You state you have no hesitation voting for her, and yet, you still haven't voted. I'm surprised I'm the only one that considers this a red flag. Perhaps you're just waiting to see if the bandwagon picks up enough steam? Or maybe you're trying to bus very early? To be honest, I don't know what you're trying to accomplish with this, but it looks like you're trying to manipulate the rest of us. Vote: Jarni Child-Sparer (Jamesn)

You can stand over here, babe. Are you mocking me? Do not mock me! I don't have a particularly strong opinion about how annoying saying everything in quotes is or speaking in the 3rd person, but those types of behaviors strike me a bit as a way to distract us from having a real conversation. Sigrid in the third person will be particularly grating if she's planning to keep it up.

Children? What children? We need to make some children! A private eye who will stop at nothing, eh? You might come in handy!

Nonsense! If you've never jumped straight from a hot tub into a snow bank, you really need to.

Suffer and hammer do not rhyme. Hell in Valhalla? Impossible by definition She's a feisty one!

Greetings, ladies!

Ragnarok Later

That is not a very smart rabbit.

Impressive. I'm surprised that the cars move as smoothly as they do given that the driving surface isn't tiled.

FWIW, my daughter can't get enough of trains.

I fell like the undead snowman is just waiting for Santa to leave to wreak havoc on the peacefully sleeping family.

I still don't understand why lego insists on releasing a bunch of vehicles in smaller sets but rarely releases any buildings in smaller sets. It used to be that there were a variety of shops and businesses that lego would produce that fit the bill. Well... to be more accurate, Lego does release a decent amount of smaller buildings, the just happen to be half burnt or plastered over with Keep Out signs because they're criminal lairs. I want businesses that allow me to actually build up a working city without having to shell out $80-$100 for them each time. The 7641 City Corner set was a good example of what I'd like to see, but broken up into smaller sets. I really think it's easier to convince kids and parents to buy two sets for $30 than one set for $60 because they can do it at different times.

Ragnarok Again The Revenge of Ragnarok Ragnarok Reincarnated Again with all the Ragnarok! Back to the Ragnarok The Ragnarok Strikes Back

I have always wanted to see Alois' Cafe 't Hoekje released as an official Lego set. One of my absolutely favorite modulars I've seen.

King's Mountain Fortress was one of the leading causes of my dark age. I was enamored with 6080 King's Castle and 6085 Black Monarch's Castle. When I got 6081 King's Mountain Fortress, it was a big let down that the base plate took away so many bricks. The one side of the castle wall was a single row of bricks plus crenellation. I wasn't even a teenager yet and it struck me as too much juniorization. In that spirit, I really appreciated that the two most recent castles are essentially a modern take on the mid-80's castles. I'm not a fan of the lower minifig count and the need to have a woefully inadequate attacking force instead of properly populating the castle itself, but the sets are good official castle sets. It would be a bit of a let down to me to see raised baseplates return. The wall segments are, at the least, more versatile for mocing and expanding with the add-on sets, another great aspect of the most recent line. I'm not as down on the color scheme as many others have been, although I do wish Lego would stick with their factions for a few years so as to allow more backstory and a wider variety of sets. They just aren't producing enough sets of any one faction for kids or AFOL's to get attached to them. I really like some of this year's sets, and think they're every bit as good as the Kingdom's line that preceded it despite preferring the heraldry of Kingdoms. I just wish they'd stick with it. If they want to add factions, fold them into the existing world. It doesn't all have to be black and white as to who the goodies and the baddies are.