mostlytechnic

Vigilante comes up as killer in a role cop since the role cop (generally) doesn't get to know the allegiance. So vanilla would mean either vanilla town or scum. Killer would be vig, SK, or the scum's killer. Protector could be either side. Etc. If the role cop's result said "vig" that would obviously mean town. And yes, it's very possible that the scum have a role cop. That'd help explain how we've lost 2 PRs already. (I'm assuming we really have lost the vig and investigator since there's never been any counterclaim)

Well, I appreciate the vote of confidence (and you're right, I AM 100% town) but still, this seems overconfident given that we have so little to go on. Why would a role cop and investigator be impossible to have? They normally check different things (role vs allegiance) so it sounds like a logical combo to have to me. I know other towns have had just one or the other (or both combined into one person) but I see no reason we couldn't have both (and if I was running the town, I'd probably give both since they seem so complimentary to each other) As for no vig kill - the fact that we haven't seen any (other than the possibility that the poison is the vig in action) seems to support the possibility that Kimberly was the vig to me. She was killed night 2 - so perhaps didn't kill night 1 since it's such a crapshoot and odds are you're killing a townie, and then either chose again not to kill night 2, was blocked, the victim was protected, or this town's rules meant that getting killed off meant the vig couldn't kill. After all that talking, I almost forgot to actually DO what I meant to. So: Unvote: Boris Wheeler (TheBoyWonder) Vote: Kenneth Emanuel (fhomess) Because I think the info Tristan has shared fits the situation well enough to be trustworthy. I think Kenny there is poisoning people and it needs to stop. I think his initial scum-hunting at the beginning of his time with us was genuine, since if he is indeed a Serial, he needs some scum to get killed or he'll lose when the scum win. SKs generally need both sides getting killed off in balance and so far we do NOT have that. In fact, that's the one thing that made me hesitate with my vote - if he IS the SK, he'd be needing for sure to poison some scum next to keep the game going.

According to the journal that Tony linked to, role cops normally do NOT tell allegiance. So they don't distinguish between a SK and Vig for example - both just appear as killers. Or scum vs town vanilla. Etc. Sometimes a rolecop can tell everything, but that's not the standard version. Don't know what the Captain here is using though... or even if we really HAVE a role cop. For the record, Tristan talked to me in private as well about this early today. We discussed what we think of the sheriff (SK vs vig as well as if he's involved wtih the poison at ALL) or if it's just a coincidence. However, I did not know about the role cop info, kimberly, etc till it was shared in thread. I am the one he referred to as asking Ken directly about it in PM - the sheriff's response was that he has nothing to do with the poison and why should he claim anything to me. I can't really read anything into that since it's probably the right answer no matter what his role and allegiance is when asked out of the blue by me. As for me, I think Patrick could be exactly right that the day kill was a one-time exception due to getting a new sheriff and if that's the case, then what Tristan has said could be exactly true. That'd make him town, Kenneth a SK, and we'd finally have some good reliable info on who to lynch.

And yep, that's what I expected Tristan to explain... At the beginning of today both he and PAtrick hinted at this idea about Kenneth without being too explicit, but I think anyone with a couple brain cells available could put their hints together. Given this explanation (which he'd also been talking to me about in PM) I understand his switch on the sheriff... when we got the new one he sure came out swinging and scum hunting, but then a couple people got dead and he's been strangely quiet. That's made me flip on him too. Even just earlier today I said I thought he was "slightly town" but now I'm not sure sure at all about that.

Anything you can share to help the rest of us judge her? Abigail, anything you'd like to say in your defense to the whole town? As for me, I'm currently leaning towards either Boris or Tristan as well, based on what either has to say before the end of the day. You know, screw that. I'm going to go ahead and (at least for now) say Vote: Boris Wheeler (TheBoyWonder) since he is still the scummiest in my personal rating list. And beyond that, I think I know what Tristan is going to say and I'm curious to see if I'm right...

If I had anything specific, I'd say so. It's just a gut feel at this point, nothing more. And I don't take it too seriously, since all of our gut feelings so far have sucked. if I had specific things on ANYONE I'd be pointing them out. At this point, we have little to go on so vague is all we've got. As for Michael - you're assuming a vanilla would defend themselves more vigorously, where either a PR or scum would be trying to stay out of sight to avoid too much attention from the other side? I can see that - with the caveat that once a PR started getting serious heat they'd defend themselves where a scum would stay more laid back (in general). So yeah, with that, I'd say he's more likely scum than PR.

My one big hesitation with our (and I mean all of us, not just me and Tristan's latest posts) scumreads is that they're mostly based on lack of activity - the same reason we've been lynching people the last 2 days, and look at how well that's gone.

I'm not at all ready to pick out exact combinations, but of all the people on your lists: - Kane - nothing I can put my finger on exactly, but slight scum read to me. - Carletta - sure loves to grow her name, but haven't seen much useful out of her other than chuckles. 60% scummy. - Kenneth - not sure this is a good scum read. He's been pretty active lately and seemed to be scum hunting hard. slightly town IMHO. - Prudence - almost forgot she was playing! - Liz - one of the less suspicious, but still... call this one maybe 50/50 to me - Abigail - nothing solid here. 50/50. - Damien - didn't bother to vote, which almost townreads to me. Doubt a scum would risk the penalties. eh, 50/50 here too. - Tony - nothing solid here. 50/50 - Clay - not terribly active, but nothing overtly scummy either. 50/50. - Boris - not very active. I think he got over-accused on his metagaming of the private mode comment, but that doesn't mean he's not scummy. The rest of his play hasn't done much either. 65% scummy to me. Kinda surprised Michael didn't make your lists, given that many others are suspicious of him for fluffing. Care to explain why? As for those not on the list, here's my thoughts on them too: - Perry - claims to have been cleared by the dead investigator. Haven't heard a counterclaim, but it's also possible that he's scum and Jessica really was the investigator, so he's claiming to have been cleared to get "on the inside" of the town. Also, Abigail rightly pointed out that a gentle accusation like this list could easily be a scum move to deflect suspicion. But his conversation today has been pretty good, so I'm leaning town. - Tristan - Seems decent enough. leaning slightly town so far to me. - Patrick - nothing solid, no read so far. - Sheridan - got the scapegoat thing of course. Slight town read, mostly based on that claim. - Michael - slight scum read here too, mostly due to quiet play as many others have pointed out.

All of them - not sure which of the lists is the closest or that any of them are right, so just keeping an eye on all those people. Well, keeping an eye on EVERYONE obviously since I can't say there's anyone I'm convinced of yet (in either direction) but they're definitely all people leaning towards the scummier.

So the only evidence we ahve the Jessica was investigator is one claim by someone, who says she told them she was in PM after investigating them? That's thin... Although I'm sorta inclined to believe it since there hasn't been any counterclaim. If our investigator is still around, speak up so we know if he's lying here! Dang it sucks not having anyone we can trust for sure around here! Agree with this - see if you can find anything out in private from your suspect first. That'll give away your suspicion to them, but seems worth it to see what they say. Making a public discussion would give it away too, so might as well start private and then move it public if justified. Baker, that was quite the list of suspects you made there. Gotta say, I sorta suspect you're not far off. They're all people I'm keeping a close eye on.

Dang, this is off to a terrible start. Definitely harder than any other town I've been in.... Gotta go do my shift at the saloon, but I'll be back to talk more later. I'm with liz though in susecting that the poisoned know they're dying but can't tell us. Heck, maybe we oughta have people report regularly that they're ok, so that if/when they STOP declaring that we know they're about to die...

Yeah, so when you're getting lots of votes because you're not defending youself, your defense is that there's no reason to defend yourself? Say something!!! If you're town, people need something out of you to make them reconsider their votes. Saying nothing again sure doesnt help your cause.

So now we're 7-6 with 3 unvoted still. dang... close and hard to call. Have to say I'm not surprised to see no PR results since I don't know anyone that I'd consider trustworthy yet. Some more than others, but no one I'd want to see our PRs revealing themselves to yet.

Not to defend Liz, but we've been in several towns together and they've all been heavily driven by PR actions by this point. I was starting to wonder when we'd see some results myself. And as for the current Beatrice/Connie split, I'm getting pretty borderline and pondering switching. But I've already gotten criticism for late vote switching, so I'm sorta hoping the town falls strongly one way or another.

Not sure how much I'll be around, given that it's a holiday here (lots of dancin to do!) so I'll Vote: Connie Radford (Clanure) I'm sorta openly bandwagoning here. Connie's constant reluctance to point fingers is worrying to me like many others. I waited hoping anything would happen to get an even better vote option, but nothing has.

Noticed the name thing too - what's up with that? I assume just goofing around, but not sure. Town roster says Beatrice too. As for trusting the new sheriff - doesn't the new and old sheriff have to be the same alignment and possible roles? So as for trustworthyness, you have to look at both of them as a whole. I agree the new guy is off to a great start.

My gut says that Zach got fatalistic first because people were stating their suspicions of him. Then he got poisoned and KNEW he was going to die and made his later statements. Not sure why someone would choose to kill him, but hopefully we'll learn tomorrow. Perhaps our vig is a poisoner and chose Zach based on everyone's suspicions. I doubt the scum would have reason to off him when he's drawing suspicion.

Love so much here... already have the normal model and wasn't planning to get this, but now I'm rethinking that. The box is fantastic, the chrome parts are gorgeous, and the wheels are way cooler than I thought they'd be... now to decide if it's $200 cool or not :) Maybe I should sell my other offroader. Or keep both for racing. Dilemmas...

Cult sure seem to fit what we've got goin on here. Between shifts at the saloon I did some readin (yes, we dancin ladies can read. Well, some of us at least) on cults Scary stuff! If we do have one around here we gotta wipe it out fast before they get too strong. At this point though it's a possibility and nothing more. There's other reasons we could only have 1 dying a night. Zach, I'll echo the rest - why're you suicidal? That makes no sense! And as for the new sheriff, hope you're up to speed and ready to help. Unless you're a scummo of course, and then I want you dead.

I agree he's pinging my radar too, but his reaction to being suspected reads lazy town to me, not scum. And given our track record here of picking suspicious people, well.....

My guess is that Esther was desperately flailing trying to save her life. Did a lot of damage with it though... definitey wanna talk to her in the afterlife. As for the single night kills... first, seems unlikely that the vig would get thwarted two nights in a row. Possible that he/she didn't kill night one and got blocked / victim was protected night 2. Or maybe the scum are playing well and already figured the vig out and perhaps killed her last night? (I have no knowledge of the vig identity, that's just an idea). Second, could we have a non-serial-killer third party? What independent could be a non-killer? could have something odd like a "survivor" or group of mimes, but that seems far out. But I'm starting to seriously think there's no SK since the odds of vig and SK both being stopped 2 nights in a row is insanely low.

If she'd claimed a PR in private to any scum by mistake, then the whole scum team would know her role, and none of the town would. That's how it benefits. And then the scum could kill her or have her lynched and one of them fake-claim her role since we'd have no way to argue against it. They could then throw out all sorts of bad info.Sure, that's a long game to play but sure worth trying if you can get her to private claim to a scummo! Generally, public claims on day 1/2 are bad. But ONCE SHE'D CLAIMED TO HAVE A ROLE, THE DAMAGE WAS DONE and I see no reason not to get specific in public since the original claim was in public.

[assuming for the moment that Esther is town for the sake of this argument] And how does supporting her confirm to her that said person is a loyal town? No scum would support her in any way? I'd think with the town divided, the scum would be on both sides too. and like was said, how does a private claim to 1 person help her anyway? At best it'd get her 1 person who already supported her to support her more. [/end assuming]

I still don't see how... well, unless the rest of the town is forgetful. I may not be voting for lil' Sherri, but I sure as heck don't trust her either. So just what inroads does her claim make? A big part of me feels like NO scum would have gone vanilla after all that claim drama. Considering this town already has a claimed scapegoat, why not claim something obscure so there's little chance of there being a real town with that role? If I were scum in her situation, I wouldn't claim vig, investigator, etc, but I might claim janitor or something. Or maybe dig even deeper for an even more crazy role that's unproveable. Declaring your claim to be a lie and you're just vanilla feels to me like poor play by a desperate townie. But then we have considerations like all the distractions she's caused, "lynch all liars", etc.... so I'm still likely to leave my vote. +1,000,000 here. I didn't understand the plea for private claims since she couldn't and shouldn't trust anyone. That's why I voted aye on her public claim question. All those asking for private claims have been noted for scrutiny... Yup. Frankly, this is part of why I'm leaving my vote. Either caught or giving up, and either way is bad.

Well y'all, it's Saturday night and I got dancin to do. But I still managed to get in here, get caught up, and say some things. First, I do understand what Boris was trying to say with the observation that Esther is on private mode. No, we can't read too much into it since I have no idea if that's a new status, but still, it certainly seems suspicious. Second, Vote: Esther Thomson (Esurient) Third, Clay observed that Zach wouldn't need to fish if he and Esther were both scum. Well, I think they're both suspicious and so suspect that either A, one's scum and one's 3rd party (perhaps esther since she's flailing pretty hard for a scum with a team to help?) or B, both could be scummy and he thought she's going down so decided to attack to make himself look good. Or of course C, one or both is just clumsy town. We'll see how things progress from here...