Gideon8 Posted February 7, 2018 (Can't find the forum relating to PF components. Since it is about the Carousel, I guess it could be placed in the Town forum) Anyway, for the 10257 Carousel, Lego recommends the M-Motor. My M-Motor from July 2017 has already become weaker and worn out! I guess it is not robust enough. Has anyone tried the L-Motor with the set? The video shows the trouble I have. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Trekkie99 Posted February 7, 2018 Well the L motor has double the torque, but thereby much more power consumption*. (However you're using the 9V train controller box so that's probably not an issue for you.)* Was the M motor new when you started using it on your carousel? You could also use the almighty XL motor. You'd have to gear up, but XL motors have a ton of torque. Meaning you could probably gear up till the cows come home and the motor will will still run like a champ. But build strong. The XL motor loves to break stuff. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Gideon8 Posted February 7, 2018 7 hours ago, LegoMonorailFan said: Well the L motor has double the torque, but thereby much more power consumption*. (However you're using the 9V train controller box so that's probably not an issue for you.)* Was the M motor new when you started using it on your carousel? You could also use the almighty XL motor. You'd have to gear up, but XL motors have a ton of torque. Meaning you could probably gear up till the cows come home and the motor will will still run like a champ. But build strong. The XL motor loves to break stuff. Thank you for your feedback! Glad to know about the difference in power consumption of the motors. Yes, the M motor was brand new when I bought it along with the Carousel in July 2017 . I reviewed my video of the Carousel, which I took right after I built it, and saw that the motor had nearly no issue in cranking the gears. It is unfortunate how quickly its strength has eroded. Yeah, I could use the all mighty XL motor. My older brother has one so I will see if I can borrow it to test it with the Carousel. One of the way to "gear it up" might be connecting the XL motor to where the crank currently is because of how the gears are arranged in the "power box". How many "gearing ups" would I need to do for the XL motor to produce the same speed as the M motor? Never had a set with so many gears until the Carousel! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Trekkie99 Posted February 8, 2018 4 hours ago, Gideon8 said: Thank you for your feedback! Glad to know about the difference in power consumption of the motors. Yes, the M motor was brand new when I bought it along with the Carousel in July 2017 . I reviewed my video of the Carousel, which I took right after I built it, and saw that the motor had nearly no issue in cranking the gears. It is unfortunate how quickly its strength has eroded. Yeah, I could use the all mighty XL motor. My older brother has one so I will see if I can borrow it to test it with the Carousel. One of the way to "gear it up" might be connecting the XL motor to where the crank currently is because of how the gears are arranged in the "power box". How many "gearing ups" would I need to do for the XL motor to produce the same speed as the M motor? Never had a set with so many gears until the Carousel! So the easiest way to do this would be to remove the two 16 tooth gears located in the crank box, and replace them with a 20 tooth gear on top, and a 12 tooth gear on the bottom. This results in a 20:12 ratio, which can be simplified down to 5:3. Divide 5 by 3 and we get 1.66666...etc. The max RPM of an XL motor when no load is applied is 224, and the max torque when no load is applied is 90.4 Nm. Multiply 224 by 1.66 and you get around 372 RPM. Divide 90.4 Nm by 1.66 and you get around 54 Nm of torque. Now when compared to an M motor running under no load at a 1:1 gear ratio, here's what you get. [M motor] (1:1 gear ratio, no load) RPM: 380 Nm torque: 40 [XL motor] (5:3 gear ratio, no load) RPM: around 372 Nm torque: around 54 As can be seen for the XL motor, the torque is higher, but the revolutions are slightly slower. Regards. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Gideon8 Posted February 9, 2018 On 2/7/2018 at 11:50 PM, LegoMonorailFan said: So the easiest way to do this would be to remove the two 16 tooth gears located in the crank box, and replace them with a 20 tooth gear on top, and a 12 tooth gear on the bottom. This results in a 20:12 ratio, which can be simplified down to 5:3. Divide 5 by 3 and we get 1.66666...etc. The max RPM of an XL motor when no load is applied is 224, and the max torque when no load is applied is 90.4 Nm. Multiply 224 by 1.66 and you get around 372 RPM. Divide 90.4 Nm by 1.66 and you get around 54 Nm of torque. Now when compared to an M motor running under no load at a 1:1 gear ratio, here's what you get. [M motor] (1:1 gear ratio, no load) RPM: 380 Nm torque: 40 [XL motor] (5:3 gear ratio, no load) RPM: around 372 Nm torque: around 54 As can be seen for the XL motor, the torque is higher, but the revolutions are slightly slower. Regards. Thank you for being such a great teacher! Will definitely try what you suggested with the XL motor this weekend. Will also post updates! Thanks again. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Trekkie99 Posted February 9, 2018 Just now, Gideon8 said: Thank you for being such a great teacher! Will definitely try what you suggested with the XL motor this weekend. Will also post updates! Thanks again. No problem! Glad I could help! Best of luck! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
moustic Posted February 9, 2018 I had the same issue here. My first though was to dismantle the set and to rebuild it to check all gears. It improved the case, but same problem occured again after few times. Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Fuppylodders Posted February 10, 2018 On 08/02/2018 at 9:20 AM, LegoMonorailFan said: So the easiest way to do this would be to remove the two 16 tooth gears located in the crank box, and replace them with a 20 tooth gear on top, and a 12 tooth gear on the bottom. This results in a 20:12 ratio, which can be simplified down to 5:3. Divide 5 by 3 and we get 1.66666...etc. The max RPM of an XL motor when no load is applied is 224, and the max torque when no load is applied is 90.4 Nm. Multiply 224 by 1.66 and you get around 372 RPM. Divide 90.4 Nm by 1.66 and you get around 54 Nm of torque. Now when compared to an M motor running under no load at a 1:1 gear ratio, here's what you get. [M motor] (1:1 gear ratio, no load) RPM: 380 Nm torque: 40 [XL motor] (5:3 gear ratio, no load) RPM: around 372 Nm torque: around 54 As can be seen for the XL motor, the torque is higher, but the revolutions are slightly slower. Regards. I just had to screen shot that, such useful information! And easy enough to understand too! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Trekkie99 Posted February 10, 2018 7 hours ago, Fuppylodders said: I just had to screen shot that, such useful information! And easy enough to understand too! Thanks! Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
Gideon8 Posted March 2, 2018 Thank you, @LegoMonorailFan, again for the suggestion to try the 20 and 16 tooth gears. Here is my update! I have tried several different ways to gear the system in the powerbox with the XL-motor and the M-motor. I have found that there are three easy and possible alternatives to the original gearing system. 1. Simply remove the crank from its pin and add the XL-motor to the same pin(instead of where Lego instructs to add the M-motor as the clutch gear almost cannot deal with the XL-motor's torque!) 2. Gearing down the system for lightening the load for the M-motor. 3. The way @LegoMonorailFan has suggested is definitely optimal: using a 20 tooth gear on top and a 12 tooth gear on the bottom, and a monstrous XL-motor! ----------------------- @moustic, do you think any of these alternatives would work for your Carousel? Share this post Link to post Share on other sites
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