Bionicle 2015 Discussion

[Dorek]

That said, it would indeed be terrible if the quality was like those horrible, clearly-traced Bionicle comics that surfaced earlier this year. But I don't think that's likely to happen at all.

Aaaaand you blew it. I'm all for that style, especially since I think calling them "tracings" is incredibly reductive and runs counter to the sentiment you were previously agreeing with.

[MakutaOfWar]

Yeah don't state opinions on this forum. By cheap I mean they're cheap, obviously tlg didn't put a large budget into the box art comics, so cheap would be a fair term. And the quality isn't up to what my standards of quality is. Overly "cheap" is not quality in my own opinion, am I not entitled to an opinion?

[DuckBricks]

Wow, the Voodoo heads are amazing! They look like something out of Tim Burton's imagination! But... They aren't clone sets... None of hem are. So why were the Toa Mata clone sets? (Perhaps to make them a cohesive team, but it's a bit sad to see we could have gotten so much more...

[GK733]

Wow, the Voodoo heads are amazing! They look like something out of Tim Burton's imagination! But... They aren't clone sets... None of hem are. So why were the Toa Mata clone sets? (Perhaps to make them a cohesive team, but it's a bit sad to see we could have gotten so much more...

Because part of those became rahi. The poor orange and blue guys didn't even seem to have any functions so they were just scrapped and every toa might have been just made from that Lewa(?) prototype.

[DuckBricks]

Because part of those became rahi. The poor orange and blue guys didn't even seem to have any functions so they were just scrapped and every toa might have been just made from that Lewa(?) prototype.

True, but there were still plenty of other ones with functions, like the axe chopper, the puncher, etc

[Bigger Fish]

I just realized the the Toa were and are still effectively a Sentai fighting squadron.

[WARHEAD]

Aaaaand you blew it. I'm all for that style, especially since I think calling them "tracings" is incredibly reductive and runs counter to the sentiment you were previously agreeing with.

they literally are tracings though, there were comparison pictures.

[dviddy]

Aaaaand you blew it. I'm all for that style, especially since I think calling them "tracings" is incredibly reductive and runs counter to the sentiment you were previously agreeing with.

I mean, they were pretty clearly tracings, with that one panel of Kopaka being line-by-line an Iron Man tracing...

Yeah don't state opinions on this forum. By cheap I mean they're cheap, obviously tlg didn't put a large budget into the box art comics, so cheap would be a fair term. And the quality isn't up to what my standards of quality is. Overly "cheap" is not quality in my own opinion, am I not entitled to an opinion?

No, cheap isn't a fair term, because you're using it to disparage an entire style simply because you don't like it, and at the expense of the hard work of others who put time and effort and skill into something using their skillsets. You also have zero knowledge of the marketing or design budget (none of us do, outside of one flippant off-hand, uncorroborated report from a toyfair stating the new line has a "small budget" when all marketing moments point otherwise). You have no idea how much they cost, how many hours went into them, etc. The "they aren't up to my standards" thing is fine- that's your view, but your standards are sub-par to me, the early G1 comics don't hold up, the linework is abysmal, the colouring often wrong, the overly-old and scratched and faded and also super reflective look runs counter to my personal tastes and reminds me of the terrible Transformers comics from Dreamwave. I'm not into that. It's fine that you are- but that's subjective. There are objective qualities to subject art criticism too- "it looks cheap to me" isn't one. If you'd like to use actual artistic criticisms, let's do it. I've taken art classes most of my life, including classes focused on art criticism in both traditional mediums (paint, pencil, etc) and photographic ones. We can talk colour theory, use of lines, etc. But I feel like you're probably not interested in that, since most of your replies to most of these topics consist of "I wish this was like G1". :/

Feel free to air opinions, I don't know why so many people have this belief that airing one on a public forum for something means their opinion shouldn't be countered. You said something, people disagree, so they say so. Don't get upset when people utilize the same media form you're using to disagree with you. That's part of what an open forum was designed for.

[Clone 01354 Productions]

Got some new info on Bionifigs, thanks to Piruk : a graphic novel will be released on November 24. 7,99$, 80 pages. And we know thanks to the Kindle edition that the Chapter Book will be titled "Island of Lost Masks".

I never read graphic novels/comics, but I guess I'll be getting it anyway. And "Island of Lost Masks".....

Hopefully, we get some Protector names. I can't see them constantly being referred to as "Protector of ___". Unless, of course, they just focus on Tahu and POF, in which case they could just keep saying "the Protector".

Edited April 23, 2015 by LN-01354

[Lord-Vorahk]

To be honest, I would prefer a more set-accurate look for the comic. Not completely accurate, I'd like to see them stylized, but not in the same style as the webisodes. I'm not a fan of that style to be honest, and if I had to pay for it, well, I wouldn't. Not that there's anything wrong with it, it just doesn't appeal to me.

EDIT: Yeah, I can see them doing that with Tahu and PoF.

To all the people narked about Tahu getting the focus... just wait till the Takua/Rocka equivalent shows up and completely steals everyones' thunder by virtue of being gold.

Edited April 23, 2015 by Lord-Vorahk

[dviddy]

I never read graphic novels/comics, but I guess I'll be getting it anyway. And "Island of Lost Masks".....

Hopefully, we get some Protector names. I can't see them constantly being referred to as "Protector of ___". Unless, of course, they just focus on Tahu and POF, in which case they could just keep saying "the Protector".

In all honesty, while part of me would love names for them, I'm also pretty fond of the headcanon that by accepting the role of "Protector of ____" they forsake their previous identity entirely. So they wouldn't have names, because their role is their identity entirely. Sort of like how the Pope chooses a name and as far as the Catholic Church canon considers it, the previous person name is gone, and the person is now solely "Pope so-and-so". History has a few other traditions where the office becomes the identity, and fiction is full of it. IDK, I'm pretty torn on this. It'd be cool to give them the names of the old Turaga (I much prefer this to the "give them the names of the Chronicler's company or the Inika/Mahri" idea), but at the same time, the whole "you take this mantle, all of who you are is gone, and you are the office" is also very cool and mythical feeling to me.

[MakutaOfWar]

No, cheap isn't a fair term, because you're using it to disparage an entire style simply because you don't like it, and at the expense of the hard work of others who put time and effort and skill into something using their skillsets. You also have zero knowledge of the marketing or design budget (none of us do, outside of one flippant off-hand, uncorroborated report from a toyfair stating the new line has a "small budget" when all marketing moments point otherwise). You have no idea how much they cost, how many hours went into them, etc. The "they aren't up to my standards" thing is fine- that's your view, but your standards are sub-par to me, the early G1 comics don't hold up, the linework is abysmal, the colouring often wrong, the overly-old and scratched and faded and also super reflective look runs counter to my personal tastes and reminds me of the terrible Transformers comics from Dreamwave. I'm not into that. It's fine that you are- but that's subjective. There are objective qualities to subject art criticism too- "it looks cheap to me" isn't one. If you'd like to use actual artistic criticisms, let's do it. I've taken art classes most of my life, including classes focused on art criticism in both traditional mediums (paint, pencil, etc) and photographic ones. We can talk colour theory, use of lines, etc. But I feel like you're probably not interested in that, since most of your replies to most of these topics consist of "I wish this was like G1". :/

Feel free to air opinions, I don't know why so many people have this belief that airing one on a public forum for something means their opinion shouldn't be countered. You said something, people disagree, so they say so. Don't get upset when people utilize the same media form you're using to disagree with you. That's part of what an open forum was designed for.

And your opinion is better then mine? Where is your source that these actually have budget and time put into these? I'm basing my claims on what I can actually SEE. It looks drawn/animated simply, if that's what you like then okay, but I don't and that's my opinion. I didn't state that they should cater to my desires when writing about the graphic novel, I said I hoped it would be better. But oh dear I'm so soooorry for liking my own preferences. And berating on my opinions in favor of your own obviously leads me to believe you feel your opinions are so good that they out-favor everbody elses. Also I feel that last part about the art classes could turn into a navy seal copypasta variant. Finally yes this is a forum for opinions, but the rules also stated friendly discussion and I have a slight feeling there are no kind feelings towards me and my opinions.

Edited April 24, 2015 by MakutaOfWar

[Bigger Fish]

You know what would be cool? If the seventh member of the Toa team wasn't a humanoid, but a dog-like beast of some sort. (Think Iggy from JJBA.) His power could be animal control ore maybe just still be light (Hard-light). It could be a really cool twist on the formula and we could get a non-humanoid build, the CCBS torso already has a tail connection point so I can't see why the wouldn't use it.

Also, I'm supper excited for the books and those "Doo Heads" looked really neat, I just wish I could've seen the names on he side of the canister.

[dviddy]

And your opinion is better then mine? Where is your source that these actually have budget and time put into these? I'm basing my claims on what I can actually SEE. It looks drawn/animated simply, if that's what you like then okay, but I don't and that's my opinion. I didn't state that they should cater to my desires when writing about the graphic novel, I said I hoped it would be better. But oh dear I'm so soooorry for liking my own preferences. And berating on my opinions in favor of your own obviously leads me to believe you feel your opinions are so good that they out-favor everbody elses. Also I feel that last part about the art classes could turn into a navy seal copypasta variant. Finally yes this is a forum for opinions, but the rules also stated friendly discussion and I have a slight feeling there are no kind feelings towards me and my opinions.

Chillax bruh. People are so tied to their opinions that they take any moment of pushback as some sort of personal feud. You have an opinion I disagree with, and of course I think mine is better, it's why I hold mine and not yours. That's how opinions work. It's not personal dude.

But the "it looks drawn simply" is still pushing the fact that you have no idea how much went into these, and you're simply saying that because you don't like them. That's not fair to those who worked on them, and the panel at NYCC and talking with the artists at the event showcases the time, effort, and passion they put into these. You don't like the style- you don't have to. But you're making unfair criticisms and those aren't okay. I've got friends who make careers out of drawing comics, and looking at the time they put into drawing things like these Toa? It's not some simple click-and-go thing. Say you don't like them, and that's fine. You don't have to! Don't be a jerk about it. Claim your interests and opinions on actual merits, not by degenerating the work others put into something. If you have criticisms, that's cool! Criticisms are cool. It's how things get better.

From the beginning all I said was that while you don't like them and I'm cool with that, it wasn't fair to say they are cheap or not quality.

As for the budget, considering the line has eight solid gold masks, has had two massive worldwide competitions so far, had the entirety of the NYCC booth dedicated to it, has novels, a graphic novel, continuous video updates in several different arenas, shirts, two separate promotional masks, etc... The line isn't hurting for budget. The animations and art style were developed simultaneously with the new theme, they are purposefully linked. The style was designed purposefully to be stylized, but also reminiscent of the MNOG. It seems to be working well for most fans online, but it's cool if it's not your thing. A similar blowup happened in the TF fandom with TF:A, but then the show ended up being one of the tightest, best-written, most consistent TF cartoon ever. Or Zelda: Wind Waker. Society has this built in idea that cartoons are for kids, and that art in cartoonish style is somehow cheaper, lazier, or amateur because it "isn't realistic", when that's part of the point behind it.

[MakutaOfWar]

^I have nothing against the box comics, it's what I would expect to see on a box, I actually find them cute on the box but a whole graphic novel of them? No. Again my opinions. As for the online animations I would have prefer that they were even more reminiscent of MNOG, of which I extremely found entertaining, but the voice acting in English is just, bleh. I only watched the first 3 promotions for and nothing more due to the voice acting. And since we are talking about promotional material I expect them to be cheaper, since they are after all still experimenting with the theme, but as I said before graphic novels step away from promotional material and into supplying the means of keeping an interest instead of working to gain it. And I'd rather see more stylized and detailed artwork, maybe even the full potential of the artists who created the box work. But these are my preferences which I care about, you have yours and I have mine, but I'm going to back up mine since I don't believe I'm in any wrong here.

[Clone 01354 Productions]

The voice acting isn't that impressive, but I like it. Now, would I like more voice actors? Maybe for a movie or TV show.....But for these animations, I think the narrator does a fine job.

Anyway, his over-the-top voice impressions make me giggle sometimes. And when he does a voice, he does have a lot of power behind it, so at least he's giving it his best effort.

In all honesty, while part of me would love names for them, I'm also pretty fond of the headcanon that by accepting the role of "Protector of ____" they forsake their previous identity entirely. So they wouldn't have names, because their role is their identity entirely. Sort of like how the Pope chooses a name and as far as the Catholic Church canon considers it, the previous person name is gone, and the person is now solely "Pope so-and-so". History has a few other traditions where the office becomes the identity, and fiction is full of it. IDK, I'm pretty torn on this. It'd be cool to give them the names of the old Turaga (I much prefer this to the "give them the names of the Chronicler's company or the Inika/Mahri" idea), but at the same time, the whole "you take this mantle, all of who you are is gone, and you are the office" is also very cool and mythical feeling to me.

That would actually be a really interesting way to portray the Protectors......I would be fine with the "Protector of ____" title if they explained it like that, but it's annoying me that they are just ignoring the matter entirely.

[Nekchir]

I would love to see some top-notch Voodoo Head MOCs.

I wonder if you could enter such MOCs in a competition that involves redesigning a character from Bionicle? Though, that would mean someone could enter a Slizer/Throwbots MOC.

[Toa Eljay]

Ew, I hope it's more like the Gen 1 comics, not the box art and web thingy style. Keep in mind that people would be paying for it, it should be of some quality.

Me too. I hope it's like this stuff. That stuff was the bees knees, man. Pinnacle of Gen1.

That said, it would indeed be terrible if the quality was like those horrible, clearly-traced Bionicle comics that surfaced earlier this year. But I don't think that's likely to happen at all.

Yeah! Fight the power! Stupid tracing! Good for nothing! Yeeeaaaah!

(This sheer lack of contribution brought to you by Eljay LLC. He's sorry)

[Phoenix_Flare]

Me too. I hope it's like this stuff. That stuff was the bees knees, man. Pinnacle of Gen1.

Yeah! Fight the power! Stupid tracing! Good for nothing! Yeeeaaaah!

(This sheer lack of contribution brought to you by Eljay LLC. He's sorry)

Ahhhhhhhh, those takes me back. Even though the latter comics weren't the best, they had that sort of charm.

But anyways, looking at the animations for this year (as well as the story), I kinda been inspired to take animation classes for college. RWBY, Kill La Kill, and many others had helped with this. I wanna make some bionicle animations of my own in the future (also want to animate some TTV stuff I've found funny ).

(Don't worry Eljay, I kinda did it to)

Edited April 24, 2015 by Phoenix_Flare

[MakutaOfWar]

^Ahhh a Bionicle anime... Hm, one can dream.

[Lord-Vorahk]

If they did a RWBY-style Bonkle thing, I would be all over that. Or some of the Project Freelancer scenes from RvB, in terms of action.

[Scarilian]

The amount of random opinions you've listed as factual in the last few comments is pushing it. You have no source to back your opinions as being facts yet you listed them as factual and when asked for facts you didnt provide them. you've pestered the guy so much he feels targetted. Hence his comment asking for a polite discussion, to which your response is to call him a jerk? I mean, what the hell man?

You say 'feel free to air opinions' and then you spend several pages saying he cannot without having experienced an art course and that he cannot criticise something because people put effort into it, that he cannot criticise on certain aspects because its unfair, that he cannot disagree about the quality or say that animation in one style feels visually cheaper than another, etc...

You've spent so much of the last few comments saying he can speak and then immediately saying he cannot speak his opinions in the next paragraph. I was going to avoid getting into this given the prior interactions we had in the confinement and the warning that if either continue their would be action. Though I feel so sorry for MakutaOfWar that he cannot voice an opinion without you targetting him for it simply based on a piece of terminology he used. Its upsetting he had to experience this sort of unfairness and non-civil discussion, so i felt the need to respond.

If they did a RWBY-style Bonkle thing, I would be all over that. Or some of the Project Freelancer scenes from RvB, in terms of action.

Personally not a fan of RWBY's animated style which has prevented me seeing more than a couple of episodes of the show

Edited April 24, 2015 by Scarilian

[Logan McOwen]

I would love to see some top-notch Voodoo Head MOCs.

I designed two System-based Voodoo Head heads that you could use for such a thing. Click the head of your choice for more pictures.

I've made a seperate thread about this, but here you are anyway :)

Edited April 24, 2015 by LewiMOC

[Mandate]

I expect them to be cheaper, since they are after all still experimenting with the theme,

What?

you've pestered the guy so much he feels targetted.

Though I feel so sorry for MakutaOfWar that he cannot voice an opinion without you targetting him

It's a bit of a stretch to say DeeVee (apologies, I'm still not sure how to refer to you?) was targeting Makuta. That's how an argument works, one person speaks, the other then speaks, then the first person that spoke speaks again and so on until the conflict is resolved. If DeeVee was targetting Makuta, this would have been an ongoing series of attacks rather than a single discussion over whether or not the new animation style is "cheap" (which it isn't). DeeVee is not targeting Makuta at all, he's simply responding to an ongoing series of claims made by Makuta.If DeeVee were to be targeting anyone, it would be demonstrably visible in an ongoing series of isolated incidents between him and another user (which this is not).

[MakutaOfWar]

@Scarilian. Yeah!

@Mandate. By experimenting I mean that it's obviously a new theme. If it had a huge budget, which past users(many of those who disagree with me)claim it doesn't, we would have seen way more to the theme, thus yes they are, in my opinion, experimenting with the theme. And not to sound childish but he did blatantly call me a jerk, and feels my posts have no meaning to this community.

Edited April 24, 2015 by MakutaOfWar