HectorMB

Really nice review; as in others, I liked very much that's written and not in video (Sorry, I'm old school here...). About the price tag, I liked as well your comment and opinion, and seeing how excited you were during the building you ALMOST conviced me to get one. But, as you said, it is impossible to ignore the elephant ;).

I'm afraid that's not possible, @pleegwat. The Avtoros is able to turn in regular ways and in crab mode too. This means that all the wheels should be able to turn. Turning the hub 90 degrees will restrict the movement only to the vertical for suspension.

Cannot agree more

So, correct me if I am wrong, but it seems that we came to some sort of common point which is that the insanely expensive CAT11 (is a pretty high price, regardless the piece count, price per kilo or whatever) converted most of the lego sets in quite cheap ones. Honestly, for me lego sets are a hobby. And I hope it won't become something else than that. And for this kind of hobby, I think that 450 EUR is just too much. Other opinion that I have -and I have the impression that it is shared by some people in the forum- is that one set has to have very good reasons to overpass a 2500 piece count. Big red, for me, have plenty of good excuses for such piece count. Even the 42055. I think, sticking in that range, lego has still a huge potential to do amazing things, instead of making moles of sets that are impressive just because they are massive and looks nice in the vitrine. This applies for regular technic sets; the super cars are targeting other public, I think.

In part, I agree with @Jim: The Zetros have 4 motors as well, 2000 pieces less, and 150 EUR less. This means that the 150 EUR accounts for the pieces count. Then, I also bring up the other good set this year, the 42128, which counts up to 2000 pieces, with no motors and a price of 150 EUR. So, basically, within this year, the CAT is on price (CAT = Zetros + 42128). nevertheless, the 42114 is very similar in piece count and only 1 less motor than the Zetros, and is significantly cheaper. Then, if we compare to the 42100, we lose all possible reference, as it was said all arun the forum, the 42100 leaves in a very bad position the CAT or the Zetros... and basically, any other PU-based set. Why? In my opinion, the 42100 and 42099 were introducing the PU motors, which implied a significant increase in price compared to PF sets. So TLG might have made with these two sets an "intermediate step" towards the final real price of the PU-based sets, which is what we are seeing nowadays. Conclussion: if you want PU motors, grab one 42100 before is gone. If you want pieces, then go for old models. If you want new pieces, then you have to pay the price either of the new sets or bricklink. The downside for me of all of this is precicely that: it makes sense. TLG is taking a direction of increasing an already expensive toy because, basically, the public still pays for it. Unfortunately, that means that a lot of people will give up on lego, but little will change company-wise.

I have to say that the twisted 6L link is quite handy...

I meant the 6L link, sorry! I'm getting old and my memory fails! >_<

Using the 42099 setup you may link the 5L link to the axle hole of the steering rack, solving the 1-extra stud width, I think (that's why I use that setup in the hub, so you can use the link in vertical... I don't know if I manage to explain myself! ;) )

I would say that this setup won't solve the issue. I rather think that with this one, you will have issues with the steering with the wheel in the lower position, isn't it?

That's also true. But, in the other side, using that part you may have 2 issues: 1) the strengh that holds the axle on that part is not that strong as in the setup of the 42099. In consequence, and because that the 1L with pin hole piece is inserted from up to down, it will go out of its place quite easely, I think. 2) In case that the piece holds in place, when the wheel is raised, thanks to the suspension, above an horizontal position, you might also have issues with the steering, as the 5L link that connects the hub to the steering rack will colide with the hub itself. At least, those were the issues that I found when finding a solution for the Avtoros and, in general, when using the new hubs in vehicles with suspension.

That's exactly what I meant, yes. I am sorry i couldn't post a pic, but i do not have my computer with me right now. Nevertheless, to increase the resistance of the 2L axle, you can use a 3L axle and place in the lower part a 2L liftarm with axle hole.

That is indeed true. I mean, honestly, i agree with you that the might have ended up in a better structure. But at the end, they are not bad and having and axle and a pin hole bring some potential combinations as well.

Well, the new hubs have a potential that the previous versions didn't. Is true that their geometry is not identical to previous ones, but i think it is not a big deal in the long run. If you don't want to customize any part, you may use the regular 5L links and put a perpendicular connector like in the 42099's front axle. I think it should work.

Indeed, I built the Avtoros few months ago with the new hubs... and encountered the same issue than you. To solve it I had to make a custom piece, which is to twist 90° the 5L link used to connect the hubs to the steering rack, so i could make the following setup. In this way, I managed to minimize the structural changes. I am very sorry that I do not have better and more accurate pics... https://drive.google.com/file/d/1_J9J5UX8sFo55Y6Yb_1TxpHvf-FscVN1/view?usp=sharing https://drive.google.com/file/d/11KA2JYmcJOVSOYR90BcALfeghg_2r7en/view?usp=sharing I am also sorry that I do not know how to show the pictures when are uploaded elsewhere... ;)

So, at the end, i made it. To keep everything simple, i maintained the old PF L-motors (changing them will imply to make 1 stud longer each suspension axle, with implications in the general geometry) and just changed the BW brick. To place the BW 3.0 i hace to move the 5x7 frames that encapsidates the BW bricks 1 stud backwards. This, indeed, implied several strucutral modifications. The most challenging one is that, moving the 5x7 frame the resulting structure is less sturdy. Nevertheless, it did not tranlate in any real issue when driving the car. As an example, i almost did not use any new part. When i said "almost" I should mention that I used the 15-long liftarm with alternated stud holes for linking the 5x7 frames. Besides that, all the modifications were done "on the run", so I would not say thay were kind of complicated. Nevertheless, it worths mentioning that the conections to the bricks are tricky. As the of PF L-motors are maintained, as well as the PF M-motor (could be easely changed though), I had only 4 ports available, which meant that i had to multiplex the rear and front motors. Obviusly this is not ideal, as the power may not be enough. But i have to say that given the output of the BW 3.0, the car performed well.

As I do not have any technic hub (only the bulky 6xAA batteries), I might try to squeeze the BW3.0 instead of the BW 2.0 and maintain the PF L motors. As in the model the BW 2.0 are located in the rear part, it might be feasible to make room (1 extra stud) for the BW 3.0. On the other side, the PF L motors are really integrated in the structure and the dimensions are to different between PF and PU L motors... Well, I will try to make some pics if I end up a some sort of solution!

Has someone build this MOC with the BuWizz 3.0? I bough the instructions some time ago, thincking about getting as well a couple of BWs 2.0. Then, the 3.0 came out and i got a pair. Now, aiming to make this MOC i just realized that neither the dimensions of the BW 3.0 are the same then the 2.0 nor the L PF motors are identical to the PU L motors. Then, i have two alternatives, either adapt the MOC to the PU motos and the BW 3.0 or just squeeze in the BW 3.0 and multiplex the PF L Motors.

Many people considered the Zetros overpriced. It has 2100 parts and some new pieces, including new tyres, relatively expensive ones like the wheel hubs, plus 4 motors, one of them new one in Technic (Although not very usefull, true). The CAT has almost the double of pieces, and not-that-valuable new pieces, costing 50% more (150 EUR). So, basically, the difference in price is the piece counting, circa 1800 pieces, which is close to the piece count of the Heavy tow truck (150 EUR). Is true that one could argue that the type of pieces included in one and other models are not exactly comparable, but this comparison gives me indeed the idea that, at least the Zetros and the CAT, are in the same range of "proportional price". My personal opinion, which applies to the Zetros and the CAT is that both are pricey. The CAT lost all the interest for me, while the Zetros is better (nevertheless, still out of my budget)... but it is just a matter of taste.

I don't sorry. Nevertheless, I plan to rebuild this MOC (I love it!); so next time, when i do it, I won't forget the pics! ;)

Regardless of they're rumors or not, it the official set comes with 1 hub and 4 motors, I don't complain, I'll just get disappointed about Lego and, obviously, I won't buy it. Unfortunately, despite all the complains, many people will still buy it, giving to TLG the motivation to continue increasing prices. Anyway... Just wait.

@JaBaCaDaBra, indeed, you might be not the only one that finds very difficult to take the price of this set. Nevertheless, instead of calling "parrots" and asking for impossible-to-deliver proofs to people who has been always respectfull and just shared some info from the upcoming sets, it is way more productive to JUST WAIT. Swearing to whatever is not going to change a thing if the sets are indeed as M_Longer or someone else said.

In my opinion and with all the respect, and despite all the reliable comments pointing out that there's only one hub and 4 motors, I'll wait for the official release. Honestly, for me it's hard to believe this price with these electronic components.

I agree on this. Best it's just to wait.

If this model comes with one hub and 4 motors with 450 eur prize b is a not-in-this-life for me. The gearbox I'm sure that would be interesting to see, and the piece count is also a plus, but as other stated, it will be almost impossible to compare with the 42100.

Well, I just cannot synchronize the motor, so I'm afraid I cannot answer that...