CMF Mafia 2 - Day 2 - Special Delivery

[Piratedave84]

Unvote: Bleeb (Bob)

Why? Because it does not sit well with me that the vote picked up steam so fast. Let's face it, Bleeb's vote was shit, his justification was very poor and his subsequent deflection of the accusations was sort of scummy. This being said, whomever would have cast that last vote would also be under scrutiny today and would probably have crumbled under the pressure as well. There is also some truth in the fact that Bleeb merely voted whereas Timmy was the one pushing hard, very hard for King's lynch.

We know what Bleeb did and if needs be we can re-visit it later or we can ask the vig to whack him tonight.

Here is what I am suggesting:

We should lynch Kelly

Why?

Because it would

1) Enable us to 'confirm' our investigator (to an extent)

2) Settle whatever feud exists between Helen and her. Derek seems to trust Helen whom appears to trust him back but Kelly and Helen do not trust each other. Something is amiss here Derek trusted Helen enough to have her relay the information about the investigation result so why would Kelly not trust the person whom indirectly cleared her?

The way I see this is win-win; we either lose a vanilla townie but 'confirm' our investigator or catch scum (possible godfather?)

I know this is bold and I am more than willing to deal with the Flak resulting from this tomorrow, but we need to settle the Derek/Helen/Kelly thing before we can move on.

As such

Vote: Kelly Lester (Kristel) sorry darling but your sacrifice is IMO what is best for us at this point.

[Scubacarrot]

One flaw I see in your plan. Say Derek was scum. How large is the chance he would lie about the first investigation result? And Godfather? As far as I know that was one of the 'ramblings' of Helen, I think you give the statement more credit than it's due. Lynching someone that has a town investigation result with that logic seems incredibly counterproductive. Bleeb would need to come up with some incredible arguments against his lynch before lynching Kelly would seem like a better idea. At this point, lynching Kelly instead of Bleeb sounds incredibly dumb to me, is what I'm saying.

And why wouldn't we be able to ask the vig to whack Kelly?

[Piratedave84]

I suggested Bob's lynch to Helen, she beat me to the initial vote. I still think we could lynch Bob but I am tired of hearing speculations on Helen, Kelly and Derek's allegiance, we need to settle this once and for all.

What other plan do you suggest? How is it counterproductive; what are the possible (negative) repercussions (besides loosing a vanilla)? What if Derek is scum and 'confirming' his scum buddies? What then? Do we wait for them to steamroll us?

Our cop is parcticaly invisible, we need to take matters in our own hands and get to the bottom of this.

[Piratedave84]

Lacey, I have now seen you pop in and out at least 4 times today. Do we need to be worried? What do you think of the current lynch prospects? do we need to accuse you or put you on the block for you to speak up? Scum.

[Scubacarrot]

What I am suggesting is that we'd be passing up an interesting lynch for something which has a chance of giving half decent results. Bleeb's lynch is better. In my opinion.

If you're getting tired of hearing about Helen and Karen and Derek's allegiances, you're going to have a bad time no matter what.

[Piratedave84]

Wouldn't Kelly's lynch also give us half decent results?

[Kristel]

Lynching me will yield the result of confirming that I am a Monster. Is that half decent?

[Peanuts]

Here is what I am suggesting:

We should lynch Kelly

Why?

Because it would

1) Enable us to 'confirm' our investigator (to an extent)

2) Settle whatever feud exists between Helen and her. Derek seems to trust Helen whom appears to trust him back but Kelly and Helen do not trust each other. Something is amiss here Derek trusted Helen enough to have her relay the information about the investigation result so why would Kelly not trust the person whom indirectly cleared her?

As I told you in private, I don't think we'd learn much about Derek from her allegiance:

If she's town, we don't know if Derek is really the cop. Scum know who is town and thus can fake investigation results easily.

If she's scum, we don't know if Derek has been lying or she is the Godfather.

It would resolve the argument between her and Helen, but I don't think that's worth the one person we've investigated town so far.

As I told you, in my opinion the only reason to lynch Kelly is if someone think's she's scum.

[LegoDad]

Lacey, I have now seen you pop in and out at least 4 times today. Do we need to be worried? What do you think of the current lynch prospects? do we need to accuse you or put you on the block for you to speak up? Scum.

No need to be worried, but at work I don't post every time I check things out. Of the current prospects, I can't say as I'm 100% convinced of any of them being scum at the moment. Who could? I'm not so much worried about Bleeb casting the final vote, but about his accusations toward Timothy at the onset of Day 2. That was bad, which is why he is my vote for now. Timothy was the main ringleader to get the lynch, so he shouldn't be completely left unaccountable either. For Kelly, yeah, you could test the cop's claim with her death, is that what you need to feel good about him? I know it would help me, but I'm not convinced that Kelly is scum. You seem very nonchalant about killing a townie to prove another townie's claim. I'm not sure why you need absolution on the subject of Kelly/Helen/Derek so much. Didn't they seem to get that figured out earlier today?

[Piratedave84]

Lynching me will yield the result of confirming that I am a Monster. Is that half decent?

Why do you not trust Helen? or rather why would Helen not trust you?

[Kristel]

Because she continued to raise suspicions in the thread here about me after I thought we had agreed our differences and had been confirmed by Derek. As per my previous thread, I believe it was her and Timothy pushing for the lynch to be sealed at the end of Day 1.

You will need to ask Helen if you want to know why Helen does not trust me.

Why does it feel like you are asking on behalf of Helen?

[Piratedave84]

As I told you in private, I don't think we'd learn much about Derek from her allegiance:

If she's town, we don't know if Derek is really the cop. Scum know who is town and thus can fake investigation results easily.

If she's scum, we don't know if Derek has been lying or she is the Godfather.

It would resolve the argument between her and Helen, but I don't think that's worth the one person we've investigated town so far.

As I told you, in my opinion the only reason to lynch Kelly is if someone think's she's scum.

So if we find out that Kelly is town, you still won't trust the cop?

What might have prompted Helen to distrust Kelly even though she was 'confirmed' as town? It seems we're missing a piece of the puzzle

What if Bleeb turns up to be town? What then, how does that help us more?

What I am trying to say is that there is a lack of trust in the investigator/investigation result so we should test the claim.

[Peanuts]

So if we find out that Kelly is town, you still won't trust the cop?

I trust him more than Helen and Kelly. However, it won't increase my trust in him. I just think if Kelly is town, Derek would get a town result regardless of his affiliation.

But I'd like to know who decided to investigate Kelly. It makes a difference whether Derek decided to do so himself or not.

[DarthPotato]

The reason I told that I wasn't talking to Kelly much, Helen, is because I was talking to her about the possibilities that you could be scum. I don't think you are yet and definitely don't think you deserve any votes, but with the amount of information you know of course it would cross my mind at one point that you could be scum.

By the way, I seriously think at this point people holding off on claiming to me should just claim. I'm trying to put a list of everything together and it can't be complete until I hear from everybody.

In fact, here's a list of everyone I don't have alter egos for yet:

Clarissa

Bleeb

Jeffrey

Carl

Giovanni

Lacey

Dragonishki

Sally

I know for a fact some of these people said they trusted, so I don't see why they're holding off.

[Scubacarrot]

You're not getting my alter ego. That's dumb.

[Darkdragon]

You have anything else, for the current situation that could help?

Yes. Sorry, i've been dealing with some very personal emergencies over the last 48 hours.

I think I'm mostly caught up with what's being discussed and I have to say that I don't like the quick bandwagon on Bleeb. He doesn't seem to be acting strangely to me. He is posting more than "usual" but I know he's been trying to work on not being a lurker for quite a few games lately. I don't know for sure where the votes are right now since we don't have a current count from the host, but I'm glad to see some unvotes of Bleeb.

What really has my mind spinning is this drama between Helen and Kelly. With Kelly asking (not quite demanding) that everyone send in their private character info to her, unconfirmed, really hit me as scummy. Who would do that, who would even suggest it? It's madness.

Then she continues to go on attacking Helen, who as far as I can tell has been trying to save our PR folks and protect them from blabbing in the thread as well. After a few arguments back and forth, finally Kelly comes out to say she is investigated so we can all trust her. Well that investigation was confirmed, but the way she presented it doesn't sit well to me. Somewhat like "don't lynch me, investigate me {so that my teammates can tailor me first/because i'm godfather}" sort of thing, you know what I mean? If we all sent her our information, even if then she was killed or lynched, she'd be able to pass all of that to her team and it's over for us pretty quick.

[Hinckley]

Because she continued to raise suspicions in the thread here about me after I thought we had agreed our differences and had been confirmed by Derek. As per my previous thread, I believe it was her and Timothy pushing for the lynch to be sealed at the end of Day 1.

Haven't you done questionable things since then? Didn't I already point out you didn't believe the investigator but wanted us all to claim to you anyway? And then didn't I point out how weird it was that you magically believed the investigator?

You will need to ask Helen if you want to know why Helen does not trust me.

Haven't I already answered this with questions several times?

[DarthPotato]

You're not getting my alter ego. That's dumb.

Then you either have something to hide or just don't want to cooperate.

[Hinckley]

I trust him more than Helen and Kelly. However, it won't increase my trust in him. I just think if Kelly is town, Derek would get a town result regardless of his affiliation. But I'd like to know who decided to investigate Kelly. It makes a difference whether Derek decided to do so himself or not.

Don't I remember that Derek made his own choice since it's his own action? Didn't we just advise and then not ask who he ended up targeting? Isn't that the best way to do it?

With Kelly asking (not quite demanding) that everyone send in their private character info to her, unconfirmed, really hit me as scummy. Who would do that, who would even suggest it?

Yes!!

Vote: Kelly Lester (Kristel) sorry darling but your sacrifice is IMO what is best for us at this point.

Why hasn't Melinda also voted for Kelly since you both were trying to convince me to lynch her?

[DarthPotato]

But I'd like to know who decided to investigate Kelly. It makes a difference whether Derek decided to do so himself or not.

Sorry, I missed this. But yes, I decided to investigate Kristel because she was more middle grounded on day 1. Also, I didn't want to investigate someone that I was directly told to investigate since it was only night 1 and there was no proof to what anyone had said.

[Bob]

The reason I told that I wasn't talking to Kelly much, Helen, is because I was talking to her about the possibilities that you could be scum. I don't think you are yet and definitely don't think you deserve any votes, but with the amount of information you know of course it would cross my mind at one point that you could be scum.

By the way, I seriously think at this point people holding off on claiming to me should just claim. I'm trying to put a list of everything together and it can't be complete until I hear from everybody.

In fact, here's a list of everyone I don't have alter egos for yet:

Clarissa

Bleeb

Jeffrey

Carl

Giovanni

Lacey

Dragonishki

Sally

I know for a fact some of these people said they trusted, so I don't see why they're holding off.

I don't trust you. I'm putting that out there plain and simple. I think there's a possibility that you're working with Kelly and you're not an investigator after all. The fact that nobody has counter-claimed you is strange to me, but I still don't think you're a Monster.

[DarthPotato]

I don't trust you. I'm putting that out there plain and simple. I think there's a possibility that you're working with Kelly and you're not an investigator after all. The fact that nobody has counter-claimed you is strange to me, but I still don't think you're a Monster.

If there was another inspector there would have been a counterclaim. I've claimed it since the start, and I'm sure if there was another inspector they would have reacted in some way. All the evidence points towards this being true, the only reason why I think people still don't trust me is because of everything that happened yesterday, but from the claims I've gotten there are multiple people with figures like me. At this point, the main evidence against me, which was the whole alter ego situation, has been debunked.

[Captain Genaro]

*snip*

If Derek is council, then where the heck is the monster cop? Why hasn't he found some way over half way through Day 2 to let us know that Derek is lying?

Besides, if Derek is lying, then wouldn't it be a pretty stupid idea to open up by claiming one of his own team members as monster? Wouldn't he start by using monsters just in case someone got the notion to check the validity of his statements?

Plus, if you're hoping that lynching Kelly will clear up the whole Kelly/Helen/Derek mess, then I think this is a rather poor reason to lynch someone. Sure their arguments are confusing and annoying, but unless you really think she's scum, I don't believe we should lynch her.

In fact, here's a list of everyone I don't have alter egos for yet:

You can cross my name off that list.

[Peanuts]

Sorry, I missed this. But yes, I decided to investigate Kristel because she was more middle grounded on day 1. Also, I didn't want to investigate someone that I was directly told to investigate since it was only night 1 and there was no proof to what anyone had said.

Thanks. Hm, I suppose if Kelly came up town that would slightly increase the chance that you're town, but it wouldn't really matter because I'm very much inclined to believe you anyway.

You can cross my name off that list.

I'm sure he noticed. Any reason you feel the need to point out to everyone that you are cooperating?

[Tamamono]

Everyone needs to realize that Kristel's for claims because when she's "confirmed" by Derek. If we can trust his results, we can trust him. Anyone who trusts Kristel because of the result is therefore assuming that Derek is also town, and if they're doing that, there's no reason not to claim.