[POLL] Eldorado Fortress Assessment

[Captain Pirate Man]

1 minute ago, AnonymousAnonAnon said:

You sure do think an awful lot of things are secret ploys.

The lack of representation of women and girls in certain toys unquestionably has a role in shaping who we view those toys as "for." Showing young girls that this toy is equally for them creates a powerful statement, and I think you are failing to appreciate the significance of that--and that the burden of gender inequality it is helping, in its small way, to ameliorate, is far heavier than than the burden of having to buy a few heads off PAB.

I'm sorry, but I don't agree with ANY of this. FAR bigger problems in the world than what toy kids are playing with. My son doesn't need to play with Barbies, if you want your child to, thats up to you. But my kid isn't. For the record my daughter couldn't of cared less about Lego Pirates. have you EVER stopped to think that MAYBE, just MAYBE some of these so called "stereotypes" exist because boys DO like playing with dinosaurs, soldiers, pirates, knights, etc. While girls DO enjoy playing with dolls. It doesn't mean one is better than the other, just different. Boys and girls are DIFFERENT, I don't buy into this modern woke crap, sorry, I just don't. 

[AnonymousAnonAnon]

8 minutes ago, Captain Pirate Man said:

I'm sorry, but I don't agree with ANY of this. FAR bigger problems in the world than what toy kids are playing with. My son doesn't need to play with Barbies, if you want your child to, thats up to you. But my kid isn't. For the record my daughter couldn't of cared less about Lego Pirates. have you EVER stopped to think that MAYBE, just MAYBE some of these so called "stereotypes" exist because boys DO like playing with dinosaurs, soldiers, pirates, knights, etc. While girls DO enjoy playing with dolls. It doesn't mean one is better than the other, just different. Boys and girls are DIFFERENT, I don't buy into this modern woke crap, sorry, I just don't. 

I'm sorry to hear you think that gender inequality is not a huge problem in the world; however, given that that's the case, there seems little left to say.

[Captain Pirate Man]

1 minute ago, AnonymousAnonAnon said:

I'm sorry to hear you think that gender inequality is not a huge problem in the world; however, given that that's the case, there seems little left to say.

I never said its not a problem in the world. But its a problem that is GREATLY over estimated. I believe that men and women are equal but different, and thats ok. Some things men can do better and some things women can do better. It doesn't make one sex superior to the other, just different. Since when did being equal but different become a bad thing? But beyond all of that, this is a LEGO forum, not a political one. I'm not trying to change anyones mind, just stating MY OPINION. I am fully aware that opinions can NOT be changed on the internet, especially on a place like a LEGO forum. So lets just leave it at that, shall we? 

[AnonymousAnonAnon]

2 minutes ago, Captain Pirate Man said:

I never said its not a problem in the world. But its a problem that is GREATLY over estimated. I believe that men and women are equal but different, and thats ok. Some things men can do better and some things women can do better. It doesn't make one sex superior to the other, just different. Since when did being equal but different become a bad thing? But beyond all of that, this is a LEGO forum, not a political one. I'm not trying to change anyones mind, just stating MY OPINION. I am fully aware that opinions can NOT be changed on the internet, especially on a place like a LEGO forum. So lets just leave it at that, shall we? 

I am not quite sure why you felt the need to post a political opinion (one which flies in the face of all objective data), sans any reference to the sets being discussed, while simultaneously saying this is a LEGO forum, but, as I said--there seems little left to say to you, so have a lovely night.

[Captain Pirate Man]

2 minutes ago, AnonymousAnonAnon said:

I am not quite sure why you felt the need to post a political opinion (one which flies in the face of all objective data), sans any reference to the sets being discussed, while simultaneously saying this is a LEGO forum, but, as I said--there seems little left to say to you, so have a lovely night.

I didn't post a political opinion. I posted MY opinion on what I feel is the weakest part of the Eldorado Fortress set. I gave my opinion, but two people here didn't like it, and felt the need to respond to me. That's the chain of events. Other than that, yes I agree this topic has run its course. 

[AnonymousAnonAnon]

Just now, Captain Pirate Man said:

I didn't post a political opinion. I posted MY opinion on what I feel is the weakest part of the Eldorado Fortress set. I gave my opinion, but two people here didn't like it, and felt the need to respond to me. That's the chain of events. Other than that, yes I agree this topic has run its course. 

Glad that you have now taken the time to agree with me twice on the subject. Have a lovely night.

[GeoBrick]

15 hours ago, Yperio_Bricks said:

Does anybody think the price or the ship is the biggest flaw of the set? I had the options typed already but then removed them from the poll  

Nope. If at all I feel the inclusion of the ship made the set that more appealing. Sofar I've only built up the governors' office and the crane somewhat, but the prison tower needs some work too so it can function as the third cannon platform.

[Artanis I]

Today I learned that because of this set, girls are allowed to grow up to be pirates too

[GeoBrick]

41 minutes ago, Artanis I said:

Today I learned that because of this set, girls are allowed to grow up to be pirates too

Why, of course. All of a wenches' offspring should have the opportunity to reach a station in life... 

[Mister Phes]

2 hours ago, Artanis I said:

Today I learned that because of this set, girls are allowed to grow up to be pirates too

That's what you should have learned back in 1989 with the 6285 Black Seas Barracuda.

With 10320 Eldorado Fortress you should have learned girls are allowed to grow up to be Soldier commanders.

Guess, they missed the mark on this one

[AnonymousAnonAnon]

6 hours ago, Artanis I said:

Today I learned that because of this set, girls are allowed to grow up to be pirates too

To play with them.

If this was another pot shot at gender inclusivity in toys, I think I must have walked into the wrong room. Mods, can you point me in the right direction to delete my account? Not seeing the option on the settings page.

Edited January 18 by AnonymousAnonAnon

[Mister Phes]

4 minutes ago, AnonymousAnonAnon said:

If this was another pot shot at gender inclusivity in toys, I think I must have walked into the wrong room.

It was a pot shot at the marketing strategy of this particular set, not at gender inclusivity in toys.

[Horation]

11 hours ago, Captain Pirate Man said:

Typical rhetoric... You sure did think long and hard to find ways to prove my opinion as wrong. It's my opinion mate, and I'm entitled to it. I have yet to see a SINGLE person under the age of 15 that have these sets, online or elsewhere. But you are free to believe whatever you choose to. That's the beauty of opinions, no one is right or wrong. Yet you have made two long posts trying to tell me my opinion is wrong. You must be a joy at parties. 

Having said that, lets say what you said is true, and LEGO does care about diversity, inclusion, etc. Than THAT is the ploy to sell more sets. Not for ANY other reason, don't get that twisted. They are a company trying to make money. I accept that, and am fine with it. Once diversity and inclusion start negatively affecting the bottom line, it'll stop in a heartbeat. just remember that. 

Typical rhetoric... Uhm actually opinions ARE sometimes wrong, that's the beauty of opinions, sometimes people think the earth is flat, sometimes they think it is a sphere, those are opinions, but you can't say that neither is right or wrong, they are objectively wrong : the earth is an oblate spheroid. Instead of replying to my comment, you ignore it, you must be a joy at work, your boss tells you "this is done poorly" and instead of explaining yourself, you tell him "it's my opinion, I'm entitled to it"

So, let me get this clear, is it a ploy to sell more parts to adult collectors who (gasp!) have too many female heads in their collections, or is it A PLOY to sell more sets. It can't be both, because putting female heads WILL drive away some such customers. "Once diversity and inclusion start negatively affecting the bottom line"

"I'm sorry, but I don't agree with ANY of this. FAR bigger problems in the world than what toy kids are playing with. My son doesn't need to play with Barbies, if you want your child to, thats up to you. But my kid isn't. For the record my daughter couldn't of cared less about Lego Pirates. have you EVER stopped to think that MAYBE, just MAYBE some of these so called "stereotypes" exist because boys DO like playing with dinosaurs, soldiers, pirates, knights, etc. While girls DO enjoy playing with dolls. It doesn't mean one is better than the other, just different. Boys and girls are DIFFERENT, I don't buy into this modern woke crap, sorry, I just don't. "

I'm sorry, but I don't agree with ANY of this. Yes, FAR bigger problems in the world than what toy kids are playing with, but this is a toy forum, so that's what we are discussing. Your son doesn't need to play with Barbies, but if he wants to, that's up to him. But he doesn't want to, and that's OK. For the record my daughter couldn't HAVE (not "of", HAVE, English is not that hard for you Americans, is it?) cared less about Lego Pirates, so that doesn't mean that EVERYBODY thinks that way. Have YOU EVER stopped to think that MAYBE, just MAYBE, even though some of these so called "stereotypes" exist because kids DO HAVE PREFERENCES, that not all kids have the same preferences, and that's the point of these toys? Boys and girls are DIFFERENT, heck monkey males like trucks more and and monkey females like dolls more.  I don't buy into this modern woke stuff, either, sorry if you want to paint me in such a light, I just don't. 

Now finally, I'm going to explain this opinion to you, because you don't appear to understand. 

SO BOYS AND GIRLS HAVE DIFFERENCES. Agreed, they are different, but what if a boy is different from other boys? What if a girl is different from other girls? Well, then they should get to be different, right? Well, that's where stereotypes kick in. These aren't always bad, but they always create an expected behaviour. So by showing to kids that men are soldiers (violent) or doctors (smart) and women are housewives and cleaners (weak and stupid), it creates a perception in those kids. Studies HAVE shown girls as young as SEVEN associate brilliance with men. So then what needs to be done? Not much other than depicting in all media a more balanced picture, show MEN and WOMEN doing certain things, you don't need quotas, just a rule of thumb, because these are going to influence kids, and having kids feel like they CAN be something can help. 

Now I can already see your reply : I don't care, we each have our opinion, we won't change each other's mind. 

So, let me explain what a debate is, in 50 words : It's about trying to convince the audience that you've got the right opinion, because the two debaters are antagonising one another, they are on opposite sides. Do YOU really think that presidential candidates debate to change each other's minds, NO, it is to convince others, if you won't debate, stop.

Edited January 18 by Horation
Added section

[kuzyabricks]

I have a bigger issue with how silly the face prints are. I want more stern ones, everyone looks too jolly while firing a cannon. I wish they would include more serious faces like in 2009 for example. They were still a bit cartoony but could be used in a variety of different scenarios. Nowadays everyone has a huge smile.

[Horation]

8 hours ago, Artanis I said:

Today I learned that because of this set, girls are allowed to grow up to be pirates too

Are you pretending not to get it? Obviously nobody means you can be a pirate, what is meant is that kids should learn that either gender can serve in any role ("anybody can be anything"), so that the small minority of each gender that is interested in untraditional roles doesn't feel like they are being ostracised, nobody is saying that you can be a pirate. 

[Captain Pirate Man]

45 minutes ago, Horation said:

Typical rhetoric... Uhm actually opinions ARE sometimes wrong, that's the beauty of opinions, sometimes people think the earth is flat, sometimes they think it is a sphere, those are opinions, but you can't say that neither is right or wrong, they are objectively wrong : the earth is an oblate spheroid. Instead of replying to my comment, you ignore it, you must be a joy at work, your boss tells you "this is done poorly" and instead of explaining yourself, you tell him "it's my opinion, I'm entitled to it"

So, let me get this clear, is it a ploy to sell more parts to adult collectors who (gasp!) have too many female heads in their collections, or is it A PLOY to sell more sets. It can't be both, because putting female heads WILL drive away some such customers. "Once diversity and inclusion start negatively affecting the bottom line"

"I'm sorry, but I don't agree with ANY of this. FAR bigger problems in the world than what toy kids are playing with. My son doesn't need to play with Barbies, if you want your child to, thats up to you. But my kid isn't. For the record my daughter couldn't of cared less about Lego Pirates. have you EVER stopped to think that MAYBE, just MAYBE some of these so called "stereotypes" exist because boys DO like playing with dinosaurs, soldiers, pirates, knights, etc. While girls DO enjoy playing with dolls. It doesn't mean one is better than the other, just different. Boys and girls are DIFFERENT, I don't buy into this modern woke crap, sorry, I just don't. "

I'm sorry, but I don't agree with ANY of this. Yes, FAR bigger problems in the world than what toy kids are playing with, but this is a toy forum, so that's what we are discussing. Your son doesn't need to play with Barbies, but if he wants to, that's up to him. But he doesn't want to, and that's OK. For the record my daughter couldn't HAVE (not "of", HAVE, English is not that hard for you Americans, is it?) cared less about Lego Pirates, so that doesn't mean that EVERYBODY thinks that way. Have YOU EVER stopped to think that MAYBE, just MAYBE, even though some of these so called "stereotypes" exist because kids DO HAVE PREFERENCES, that not all kids have the same preferences, and that's the point of these toys? Boys and girls are DIFFERENT, heck monkey males like trucks more and and monkey females like dolls more.  I don't buy into this modern woke stuff, either, sorry if you want to paint me in such a light, I just don't. 

Now finally, I'm going to explain this opinion to you, because you don't appear to understand. 

SO BOYS AND GIRLS HAVE DIFFERENCES. Agreed, they are different, but what if a boy is different from other boys? What if a girl is different from other girls? Well, then they should get to be different, right? Well, that's where stereotypes kick in. These aren't always bad, but they always create an expected behaviour. So by showing to kids that men are soldiers (violent) or doctors (smart) and women are housewives and cleaners (weak and stupid), it creates a perception in those kids. Studies HAVE shown girls as young as SEVEN associate brilliance with men. So then what needs to be done? Not much other than depicting in all media a more balanced picture, show MEN and WOMEN doing certain things, you don't need quotas, just a rule of thumb, because these are going to influence kids, and having kids feel like they CAN be something can help. 

Now I can already see your reply : I don't care, we each have our opinion, we won't change each other's mind. 

So, let me explain what a debate is, in 50 words : It's about trying to convince the audience that you've got the right opinion, because the two debaters are antagonising one another, they are on opposite sides. Do YOU really think that presidential candidates debate to change each other's minds, NO, it is to convince others, if you won't debate, stop.

  

Oh no, there isn't enough female representation in the emoji list. Better alert the keyboard warriors!! 

For the record, I was at NO POINT engaged in a debate with you. Once again, I gave MY OPINION on what I felt was the biggest flaw in this particular set. It was YOU that decided to turn MY OPINION into a debate. Again, you must be a JOY at parties.

15 minutes ago, Horation said:

Are you pretending not to get it? Obviously nobody means you can be a pirate, what is meant is that kids should learn that either gender can serve in any role ("anybody can be anything"), so that the small minority of each gender that is interested in untraditional roles doesn't feel like they are being ostracised, nobody is saying that you can be a pirate. 

That logic is flawed, for many reasons, but again it's heading into a political sphere that I don't want to go into here. I will say this though, as a society trying to bow down and appease a vocal minority is a mistake that will be the downfall of our society. If an issue is important enough, the majority will agree with it, that's how democracy works. But trying to appease a vocal minority, just creates MORE vocal minorities. It's a never ending cycle. 

If a young girl wants to play with a Lego Pirate sets, then good for her. I don't have a problem with that. But to think that a toy that HISTORICALLY was aimed towards boys (Lego Pirates) will attract a whole bunch more female fans because of a few gender swapped minifigs, is just asinine. By this logic, young boys must be buying Friends sets in droves because they include some boy minidolls. "Look mom, I don't want that Star Wars set, I want that Friends set because it has a boy minidoll, just like me."  

[Mister Phes]

I'll just suggest that this discussion is specifically regarding 10320 Eldorado Fortress and not LEGO sets or toys in general...

[Captain Pirate Man]

10 minutes ago, Mister Phes said:

I'll just suggest that this discussion is specifically regarding 10320 Eldorado Fortress and not LEGO sets or toys in general...

Yar!! 

[Horation]

3 hours ago, Mister Phes said:

I'll just suggest that this discussion is specifically regarding 10320 Eldorado Fortress and not LEGO sets or toys in general...

Ok, but let me just have  one last reply.

4 hours ago, Captain Pirate Man said:

  

Oh no, there isn't enough female representation in the emoji list. Better alert the keyboard warriors!! 

Again, as I have said before, I am not an SJW, and I ain't woke, stop trying to claim otherwise. 

4 hours ago, Captain Pirate Man said:

For the record, I was at NO POINT engaged in a debate with you. Once again, I gave MY OPINION on what I felt was the biggest flaw in this particular set. It was YOU that decided to turn MY OPINION into a debate. Again, you must be a JOY at parties.

You know it takes two people to turn something into a debate right? If you didn't want a debate, you could have chosen not to reply.                                                                                                 

4 hours ago, Captain Pirate Man said:

That logic is flawed, for many reasons, but again it's heading into a political sphere that I don't want to go into here. I will say this though, as a society trying to bow down and appease a vocal minority is a mistake that will be the downfall of our society. If an issue is important enough, the majority will agree with it, that's how democracy works. But trying to appease a vocal minority, just creates MORE vocal minorities. It's a never ending cycle. 

If a young girl wants to play with a Lego Pirate sets, then good for her. I don't have a problem with that. But to think that a toy that HISTORICALLY was aimed towards boys (Lego Pirates) will attract a whole bunch more female fans because of a few gender swapped minifigs, is just asinine. By this logic, young boys must be buying Friends sets in droves because they include some boy minidolls. "Look mom, I don't want that Star Wars set, I want that Friends set because it has a boy minidoll, just like me."  

 Your logic is flawless but contradicts your own opinion : trying to appease to a vocal minority (ex: a few neckbeards like YOU and ME who HAVE to replace their minifigure heads to have only males) is a mistake that will be the downfall of that company. If an issue is important enough, the MASSIVE armies of neckbeards making up 90%+ of Lego sales will Make Armies (of Lego minifigs) Great Again by making it clear that the majority agrees with them, that's how democracy works. But by trying to appease every vocal minority. Lego will merely create MORE vocal minorities. It's a never ending cycle, the best way to stop it is to ignore said vocal minority (ex: ignoring the requests for more male heads).                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    I agree with the second half, YOU are the one who said these females were being added in a PLOY to INCREASE SALES, so you are here admitting this logic, YOUR logic, is asinine.                       

I said that was the last of it, it is, but if @Captain Pirate Man wants to continue the "not-a-debate", I am encouraging him to do so in my private messages, this has sincerely been an interesting discussion.

4 hours ago, kuzyabricks said:

I have a bigger issue with how silly the face prints are. I want more stern ones, everyone looks too jolly while firing a cannon. I wish they would include more serious faces like in 2009 for example. They were still a bit cartoony but could be used in a variety of different scenarios. Nowadays everyone has a huge smile.

I agree, I think kids really prefer such serious faces. 

Just an Effort For effective Faces can Really Energise the Young ones (speaking from experience here) and End Power Struggles over Totally Effective and Interesting designs. Nonetheless, Do I Determine which design Number of face gets used for These sets? Kilometres from where I Live, they Let Honourable people pick In the name of Mass Sale increases and, in the End, if they Let us pick the Faces, would we really make the best choice? 

Edited January 18 by Horation
Ugly formatting and mistakes

[Captain Pirate Man]

3 hours ago, Horation said:

Ok, but let me just have  one last reply.

Again, as I have said before, I am not an SJW, and I ain't woke, stop trying to claim otherwise. 

You know it takes two people to turn something into a debate right? If you didn't want a debate, you could have chosen not to reply.                                                                                                 

 Your logic is flawless but contradicts your own opinion : trying to appease to a vocal minority (ex: a few neckbeards like YOU and ME who HAVE to replace their minifigure heads to have only males) is a mistake that will be the downfall of that company. If an issue is important enough, the MASSIVE armies of neckbeards making up 90%+ of Lego sales will Make Armies (of Lego minifigs) Great Again by making it clear that the majority agrees with them, that's how democracy works. But by trying to appease every vocal minority. Lego will merely create MORE vocal minorities. It's a never ending cycle, the best way to stop it is to ignore said vocal minority (ex: ignoring the requests for more male heads).                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                                    I agree with the second half, YOU are the one who said these females were being added in a PLOY to INCREASE SALES, so you are here admitting this logic, YOUR logic, is asinine.                       

I said that was the last of it, it is, but if @Captain Pirate Man wants to continue the "not-a-debate", I am encouraging him to do so in my private messages, this has sincerely been an interesting discussion.

I agree, I think kids really prefer such serious faces. 

Just an Effort For effective Faces can Really Energise the Young ones (speaking from experience here) and End Power Struggles over Totally Effective and Interesting designs. Nonetheless, Do I Determine which design Number of face gets used for These sets? Kilometres from where I Live, they Let Honourable people pick In the name of Mass Sale increases and, in the End, if they Let us pick the Faces, would we really make the best choice? 

[Horation]

2 hours ago, Captain Pirate Man said:

?

[Mister Phes]

Now, let's relate the recent discussion back to 10320 Eldorado Fortress...  (and only this set, not toys and LEGO in general)

@Captain Pirate Man does make an interesting point, in saying:

My only minor complaint is that LEGO is continuing the trend of female heads for soldiers, officers, knights, etc. Look, I know it Lego and I can just change the heads (and trust me I do). But between this set and the most recent Castle sets, Im running out of good male heads, yet I have TONS of female ones.

10320 Eldorado Fortress is not a general retail release targeted towards 7-12 year olds, rather it's a nostalgia product marketed towards adults, otherwise The LEGO Group wouldn't have put "18 years & up" on the box.

Undoubtedly some parents will buy this set and build it with their children, but they're making the purchase for themselves based on the endorphins released by nostalgia.

And understandably, manufacturers strive to ensure their products are appealing to the widest market possible; so the inclusion of more female minifigures/characters may attract more female customers.

But it's far more nuanced than simply adding female characters to a traditionally male niche - that alone won't significantly boost sales among adult female customers.

So marketing aside, let's consider which demographic(s) are likely to:

• Purchase multiple copies of 10320 Eldorado Fortress
   
• Build blue coat minifigure armies

[Breakspear]

On 1/17/2024 at 7:37 AM, Horation said:

I feel like this set's biggest flaw was the marketing and the its design ethos ; the set was clearly a giant playset, but marketed towards nostalgic adults, in other words it did not know what it was. 

The result was : 2015 style soldiers (with lighter white) and play friendly features (low walls making it easy to access the inside, the modular design, the office being next to the cannon, etc..) but also nostalgic elements (the black docks, the whole build's shape, the marketing for the set being "the whole gang is here", all the while not including all of the original cast of characters, etc...)

I 100% agree: from the outset there was huge ambiguity over who the set was for (nostalgic adult collectors or young familes?) and what it was supposed to be (display set or play set?).

With hindsight, I can see much of my initial grumpiness with the set was because I was holding it to the standard of recent display sets (e.g. Medieval Blacksmith, LKC, Ninjago City). I wanted it to be more realistic, more grown-up, based on an original design, infused with rich storytelling, and with more and better minifigures.

However, once I switched gears and started judging the set on its own merits (i.e. as a playset), most of my gripes melted away. It really is an excellent play set, and the finest Imperial fort Lego has ever produced. The use of modularity to allow the fort to be split up and reconfigured is ingenious, with the separate towers/ramparts/docks etc. evocative of the many, many small Imperials sets (e.g. Sabre Island, Broadside's Brig). The smiling mini-figure face-prints feel entirely consistent with the light-hearted history of the theme. The addition of the trading ship is entirely unnecessary, but adds heaps of play value and shows the designers love of the theme.

Similarly, if we assume that TLG defined the target audience for the set as "nostalgic adults building with their children", then I think the designer hit it out of the park. When my six year old daughter saw it at our local Lego store, she immediately recognised the bluecoat soldiers from "Daddy's collection" and got excited at the idea of us building it together (which definitely tugged my heartstrings!). 

So the design of the set (in the context of the presumed design brief) seems an unqualified success. Whether the brief was correct in the first place is unclear.

I fear that if the set underperforms,  TLG will erroneously conclude that there is no audience for future imperials sets, when in fact unmet demand (either for large display sets or smaller, more cost effective play sets) may still exist.

[Mister Phes]

11 hours ago, Breakspear said:

I 100% agree: from the outset there was huge ambiguity over who the set was for (nostalgic adult collectors or young familes?)

Why do you feel there was ambiguity?

It's clearly stated several times on the official 10320 Eldorado Fortress webpage on LEGO.com and the related marketing collateral.

To quote that webpage:

• "Play like you did as a kid"
• "Do you remember these vintage LEGO® sets from your childhood?"
• Rediscover the world of LEGO® Pirates with the LEGO Icons Eldorado Fortress (10320) building set for adults.
• Make time for you
• Spend quality time with premium LEGO sets for adults.
• A classic LEGO® Pirates build for adults – Step back in time for a nostalgic building project with the LEGO Icons Eldorado Fortress (10320), a tribute to the iconic 1980s LEGO Pirates range
• A pirate-themed gift for adults and fans of the 1980s LEGO® Pirates range – Take time out for yourself
• Made for adults – The LEGO® Icons Eldorado Fortress is part of a range of building sets designed for adults

Granted it has a line which reads "We’ve updated the Eldorado Fortress of 1989 with new details and surprises to thrill pirates of all ages."

Nonetheless, the bulk of the marketing copy is directly targeted towards adults who were fans of LEGO Pirates as children - it literally says that.

Nowhere does it mention families (beyond purchasing for a loved one) or encourage the involvement of current children.

[SpacePolice89]

I like the set very much but original minifigure designs would've been so much better like the minifigs in the Galaxy Explorer and the Blacktron Cruiser.