Were some parts never sealed in bag?

[ks6349]

I recently bought a couple of old but "unopened" sets that includes the international airport and the police motorbike released in around 2004 and 2005. The boxes look "unopened" but are in "quite bad" condition in which I was notified and expected. However, some bigger parts were never sealed in any plastic bag, while most other parts were. Is it normal?? Did some parts really come without being sealed in any bag when they were first born in Lego

Edited November 25, 2019 by ks6349

[deraven]

Yes, that can be normal.  I don't know if there is a resource somewhere that will tell you which parts in which sets, but definitely larger pieces like some boat hulls, larger plates, sometimes larger tires, etc., can be loose in the box with the other parts all bagged as usual, so probably nothing out of the ordinary with those.

[ks6349]

1 minute ago, deraven said:

Yes, that can be normal.  I don't know if there is a resource somewhere that will tell you which parts in which sets, but definitely larger pieces like some boat hulls, larger plates, sometimes larger tires, etc., can be loose in the box with the other parts all bagged as usual, so probably nothing out of the ordinary with those.

Why Lego sometimes does not bag larger parts? Do you know why

[JopieK]

Last week we built the modular garage corner. That also has larger plates and the baseplate not in bags. Some sets even have cardboard boxes that contain the parts. LEGO should try to get rid of all the bags and trade them in for e.g. paper or at least compostable plastic bags, it is bad for the environment and no one needs those bags after all. 

[dr_spock]

It depends on how the parts are prepared for packaging.  Some larger pieces are still packed by hand which bagging would add unnecessary operation costs.

 

[deraven]

5 hours ago, ks6349 said:

Why Lego sometimes does not bag larger parts? Do you know why

 

5 hours ago, dr_spock said:

It depends on how the parts are prepared for packaging.  Some larger pieces are still packed by hand which bagging would add unnecessary operation costs.

That pretty much sums it up, along with the environmental/needless waste issue.  Just no reason for them to be in a bag.  If offers no additional protection, and the parts are large enough that there's no way they'd slip out of the box unless it was very badly damaged in which case they would consider it to be non-salable anyway.

[MAB]

15 hours ago, JopieK said:

Last week we built the modular garage corner. That also has larger plates and the baseplate not in bags. Some sets even have cardboard boxes that contain the parts. LEGO should try to get rid of all the bags and trade them in for e.g. paper or at least compostable plastic bags, it is bad for the environment and no one needs those bags after all. 

Bricklink sellers do :-)

Paper bags are fine, so long as they are not torn when being processed. Plus the other good thing about the plastic ones is that they are clear, so you can see parts inside before opening them.

 

 

[JopieK]

Thats true of course and a good thing indeed. Is that why TLG bought Bricklink ? ;)

[dr_spock]

To save costs on baggies, some bricklink sellers reuse the bags from the parted out LEGO sets.  Weird, getting numbered bags with your BL order. 

 

[ks6349]

On 11/26/2019 at 8:30 AM, deraven said:

 

That pretty much sums it up, along with the environmental/needless waste issue.  Just no reason for them to be in a bag.  If offers no additional protection, and the parts are large enough that there's no way they'd slip out of the box unless it was very badly damaged in which case they would consider it to be non-salable anyway.

Driving and air-conditioning are far more damaging to the environment compared to plastic bag. There are tons of reasons that majority of Lego bricks should come in sealed bags, for example, to easily make sure that all parts are there and no major missing. If they just put 400 or 200 pieces into a box without any bag it's VERY LIKELY that sneaky intelligent people use heater or hair dryer to open and reseal the box like new which is a method well advertised on youtube already. Bags are just.. Critical..... at least for most parts.

On 11/26/2019 at 5:49 PM, MAB said:

Bricklink sellers do :-)

Paper bags are fine, so long as they are not torn when being processed. Plus the other good thing about the plastic ones is that they are clear, so you can see parts inside before opening them.

 

 

Could plastic bags be resealed like new and never opened???? Why do they need those plastic bags

I've bought a "new" lego set from bricklink where they claim that the outer box is opened and damaged which is something I don't mind, but all bagged bricks inside are original and unopened. Yes they look unopened, but could it be once opened????

Edited November 28, 2019 by ks6349

[MAB]

1 hour ago, ks6349 said:

 

Could plastic bags be resealed like new and never opened???? Why do they need those plastic bags

I've bought a "new" lego set from bricklink where they claim that the outer box is opened and damaged which is something I don't mind, but all bagged bricks inside are original and unopened. Yes they look unopened, but could it be once opened????

Yes, they can easily be resealed with a heat sealer.

[deraven]

14 hours ago, ks6349 said:

Bags are just.. Critical..... at least for most parts.

I'm not going to comment on your environmental quip other than to say that every little bit helps.  But this quote here: you just answered your own question.  They put things in bags that make logical sense to do so with or need to for whatever reason.  That would be "most parts."  The others, those are what you see in the boxes not bagged.  

[ks6349]

23 hours ago, MAB said:

Yes, they can easily be resealed with a heat sealer.

How could plastic bags be resealed with a heat sealer undetected?

The first point is it's almost impossible to open a plastic bag without damage like new

10 hours ago, deraven said:

I'm not going to comment on your environmental quip other than to say that every little bit helps.  But this quote here: you just answered your own question.  They put things in bags that make logical sense to do so with or need to for whatever reason.  That would be "most parts."  The others, those are what you see in the boxes not bagged.  

I didn't know that otherwise than baseplates there could be larger parts which were never bagged before I started the thread.

[MAB]

42 minutes ago, ks6349 said:

(1) How could plastic bags be resealed with a heat sealer undetected?

(2) The first point is it's almost impossible to open a plastic bag without damage like new

 

(1) Easily (LEGO heat seals the bags in the first place) and (2) it isn't impossible, it is easy. If you don't know the exact dimensions a bag should be, then you would not notice one that had been opened and resealed.

[dr_spock]

I use a sharp razor edge knife and a straight edge to make the cut perfectly straight and clean.  I do it when I review sets just in case I have reshoot some photos of the box contents.  I don't reseal the bag but I'd arrange the bags in such a way the openings don't show up clearly in the reshoot. 

 

[deraven]

1 hour ago, ks6349 said:

I didn't know that otherwise than baseplates there could be larger parts which were never bagged before I started the thread.

It's been going for for several years at least (I found a reference from about a decade ago in another forum where they were talking about the strategy Lego uses for packing boxes & bags) but not sure if it's more prevalent now than it was then.  I know I've also seen the opposite where some pieces have extra bagging (like big-figs where each piece of them is in their own bag or section of a multi-part perforated bag) whereas before those would just be loose in another bag or in 1 bag by itself.  That seems easier to explain, though, with it likely being a case of those parts or the printing being damaged at a higher rate and thus given the extra protection.

[Peppermint_M]

Compostable plastic, or other bio-plastics would be a great replacement for the current bags used. I hate that any set has at least two plastic bags I can't recycle!  More cardboard cartons would be a much better solution to the plastic "problem". I work in a company that (in vague terms) is a delivery company, we of course have products delivered to the warehouse that we then send onwards, some of these come in interestingly sealed cardboard packets. I will try and get a photo.

Now that presentation in boxes with windows, like this, is no longer something TLG use, you would think they could put boxes with smaller boxes inside. Cardboard is very widely recycled after all.

[dr_spock]

It appears that LEGO® uses plastic number 5 PP (polypropylene) bags.  At one time my area didn't take #5 in the curbside recycling bin but they do now.

[ks6349]

16 hours ago, MAB said:

(1) Easily (LEGO heat seals the bags in the first place) and (2) it isn't impossible, it is easy. If you don't know the exact dimensions a bag should be, then you would not notice one that had been opened and resealed.

What does it mean by "Exact dimensions"

10 hours ago, dr_spock said:

It appears that LEGO® uses plastic number 5 PP (polypropylene) bags.  At one time my area didn't take #5 in the curbside recycling bin but they do now.

 

 

Could polybag be opened and resealed like new?? I can't imagine how it could be , if it could.

Edited November 30, 2019 by Peppermint_M
Please don't quote pictures.

[dr_spock]

24 minutes ago, ks6349 said:

 

Could polybag be opened and resealed like new?? I can't imagine how it could be , if it could.

The polybag would be hard since there is printing on the bag right up to the seal line.  The heat sealer would put a new seal line on the printing.  If you're sneaky, you could cut a hole in the bag and cover it up with a price tag sticker.

The numbered bags in my picture above could be done without too much giveaway.  Your bag might lose a few millimeters in length.

 

[ks6349]

1 hour ago, dr_spock said:

The polybag would be hard since there is printing on the bag right up to the seal line.  The heat sealer would put a new seal line on the printing.  If you're sneaky, you could cut a hole in the bag and cover it up with a price tag sticker.

The numbered bags in my picture above could be done without too much giveaway.  Your bag might lose a few millimeters in length.

 

I've bought a "new" lego set on bricklink, box is damaged but the bags are all original and sealed. All bags are just plastic bags without printing because it's a retired set for 10+ years. I've checked them all last night and they were all sealed and unopened. Then, from what you mean, it is "possible" that the bags of my set look unopened but once resealed??

Edited November 30, 2019 by ks6349

[Peppermint_M]

8 hours ago, ks6349 said:

Exact dimensions

The "Exact Dimensions" Of a plastic bag in a LEGO Box would be the length and height /width  of the bag when it was produced and packed, then factory sealed.

Unprinted LEGO bags will be simple clear plastic bags, someone could easily cut a sealed end off a bag and use a heat sealing tool to reseal the bag so that it looks never opened. As you do not know what length and width the factory sealed bag had, there isn't a clue this might have happened unless you find yourself short of parts once you open the set.

It is not common on sites like Bricklink, as most sellers are fans of LEGO and not trying to scam you. Ebay and Facebook are riskier, simply because people can and do scam, but that is a risk for all goods and not just LEGO (People getting a with a rock in and not an X-box, etc). Also, there are sometimes problems with returned sets in big supermarkets; of people takign parts and returning sets with resealed bags.

 

6 hours ago, ks6349 said:

Then, from what you mean, it is "possible" that the bags of my set look unopened but once resealed??

It is possible, just like any reasonable problem could be possible. Like I said, most sellers on Bricklink are not out to rip people off.

[coinoperator]

On 11/26/2019 at 11:39 PM, dr_spock said:

some bricklink sellers reuse the bags from the parted out LEGO sets

I found that some do that to give you the "new" feeling.

[ks6349]

2 hours ago, Peppermint_M said:

The "Exact Dimensions" Of a plastic bag in a LEGO Box would be the length and height /width  of the bag when it was produced and packed, then factory sealed.

Unprinted LEGO bags will be simple clear plastic bags, someone could easily cut a sealed end off a bag and use a heat sealing tool to reseal the bag so that it looks never opened. As you do not know what length and width the factory sealed bag had, there isn't a clue this might have happened unless you find yourself short of parts once you open the set.

It is not common on sites like Bricklink, as most sellers are fans of LEGO and not trying to scam you. Ebay and Facebook are riskier, simply because people can and do scam, but that is a risk for all goods and not just LEGO (People getting a with a rock in and not an X-box, etc). Also, there are sometimes problems with returned sets in big supermarkets; of people takign parts and returning sets with resealed bags.

 

It is possible, just like any reasonable problem could be possible. Like I said, most sellers on Bricklink are not out to rip people off.

Thank you very much. You are the one so far who has my concern explained the most clearly. 

You have suggested a lot of possibilities that could happen, and are feasible, and there is no rocket science involved. It really depends on the individuals. I understand all these well.

However, I do really want to know if big services like ebay / Amazon / supermarkets or even police are doing anything or having any strategies to take care of these rats? 

Or do they only try to solve problems when problems arise, when complaints arise, and just take care of this case by case?

I find that KFC and McDonalds' staff will immediately throw away any returned food even if it's still wrapped and left for only one second, which is their guideline to ensure the food safety.

 

[ks6349]

9 hours ago, Peppermint_M said:

The "Exact Dimensions" Of a plastic bag in a LEGO Box would be the length and height /width  of the bag when it was produced and packed, then factory sealed.

Unprinted LEGO bags will be simple clear plastic bags, someone could easily cut a sealed end off a bag and use a heat sealing tool to reseal the bag so that it looks never opened. As you do not know what length and width the factory sealed bag had, there isn't a clue this might have happened unless you find yourself short of parts once you open the set.

It is not common on sites like Bricklink, as most sellers are fans of LEGO and not trying to scam you. Ebay and Facebook are riskier, simply because people can and do scam, but that is a risk for all goods and not just LEGO (People getting a with a rock in and not an X-box, etc). Also, there are sometimes problems with returned sets in big supermarkets; of people takign parts and returning sets with resealed bags.

 

It is possible, just like any reasonable problem could be possible. Like I said, most sellers on Bricklink are not out to rip people off.

 

But what I do not agree with you is that "most sellers on Bricklinks are not out to rip people off".

Human is a kind of creatures that you can trust and you cannot trust. I believe that most people won't rob the bank because they need to invest cost and risk and it's criminal and we have police. However, it is not convincing to quickly give a conclusion that sellers on Bricklink or any other platforms won't rip people off. It is not like robbing a bank, it doesn't have big cost, no risk, and even if Theoretically I believe that it's criminal, but police certainly won't book a flight and travel to the home of the sellers and catch him because of the complaints from the buyers who tell the police that their $100 new Lego is manipulated, who can give a proof? and no one will take it seriously. Police won't even start a file. 

We can't request the business world to ban return of items after payment, however, as a big services like Amazon / Lego which are the direct providers should at least emphasize to their customers that they will not just sell returned Lego without investigating the contents. 

Edited November 30, 2019 by Peppermint_M
Don't quote pictures