Lord of the Rings Ongoing Discussion

[wesker]

16 minutes ago, Kaijumeister said:

Fully agree with you. As much as a massive Rivendell set is a dream come true, gauging interest in the theme based on a massive Lego Icons set just seems so utterly ill advised. How many fans will want to spend that much money, let alone have the space for such a set? Demand will be there for sure, but I’m holding out hope we’ll get a system-scale wave in the summer, even if it’s a small one.

Same here. With Avatar and Indiana Jones both getting a small wave of four sets based on their original films, it would be nice if LOTR also gets the same.

I just hope if they do release a summer wave they don't skip out on the Balrog or Eowyn/Witch-King this time, especially with Rivendell already likely to be covering the whole Fellowship.

[SirBlake]

3 hours ago, wesker said:

Same here. With Avatar and Indiana Jones both getting a small wave of four sets based on their original films, it would be nice if LOTR also gets the same.

I just hope if they do release a summer wave they don't skip out on the Balrog or Eowyn/Witch-King this time, especially with Rivendell already likely to be covering the whole Fellowship.

Don’t forget Gondor! Battle for Osgiliath or battle trolls crashing the gate is a must. Heck, I’d settle for the white tree and some soldiers. 

[MAB]

18 hours ago, Balrogofmorgoth said:

I would not be happy if they used that. Doesn’t work at all. I’ll take the old Gandalf hat over that. Also, your Lindir and Figwit purist figures sound great! But as much as I love making purist figures that work well enough with prints that are available, I would always prefer official prints, especially for something like LOTR where there’s a very particular look that need to be captured. Lego has no excuse to reuse things like Chinese New Year prints for LOTR

I wouldn't be happy either. It is just that I wouldn't be surprised if they did reuse it.

As to purist customs, I quite enjoy finding pieces in other themes that work well for LOTR. There are always missing parts of course, nearly always torsos. Faramir really needs a nice Gondor print torso. I've done plenty of versions of him in the past but none look quite right without it.

[Balrogofmorgoth]

8 hours ago, SirBlake said:

Don’t forget Gondor! Battle for Osgiliath or battle trolls crashing the gate is a must. Heck, I’d settle for the white tree and some soldiers. 

If the theme truly is returning, it would be absolutely crazy for lego not to make battle packs. I mean it’s like the concept of battle packs was made for a LOTR theme, it’s so perfect. Gondorians, Rohirrim, different types of Orcs, Uruk-Hai, Haradrim, Easterlings, Oathbreakers, Lorien Elves, Rivendell Elves, Second Age Gondorians, Corsairs of Umbar, the potential is endless. Army building factions in Middle Earth is so perfect for lego. That’s the kind of thing lego should be doing to gauge interest in the theme instead of Brickheadz and a $500 D2C (as excited as I am for the D2C). They should have done a small wave consisting of one large location set, two medium sets, and two battle packs, then release a D2C in the summer/fall to test the collectors market

Edited November 30, 2022 by Balrogofmorgoth

[Trunkbass]

1 hour ago, Balrogofmorgoth said:

If the theme truly is returning, it would be absolutely crazy for lego not to make battle packs. I mean it’s like the concept of battle packs was made for a LOTR theme, it’s so perfect. Gondorians, Rohirrim, different types of Orcs, Uruk-Hai, Haradrim, Easterlings, Oathbreakers, Lorien Elves, Rivendell Elves, Second Age Gondorians, Corsairs of Umbar, the potential is endless. Army building factions in Middle Earth is so perfect for lego. That’s the kind of thing lego should be doing to gauge interest in the theme instead of Brickheadz and a $500 D2C (as excited as I am for the D2C). They should have done a small wave consisting of one large location set, two medium sets, and two battle packs, then release a D2C in the summer/fall to test the collectors market

Well they were crazy not to do it last time when it was already a staple for Star Wars, yet they didn't. We cannot know what LEGO thinks will sell well, only hope that they'll see the light :D

[Balrogofmorgoth]

2 minutes ago, Trunkbass said:

Well they were crazy not to do it last time when it was already a staple for Star Wars, yet they didn't. We cannot know what LEGO thinks will sell well, only hope that they'll see the light :D

Yeah they aren’t exactly known for good decision making. “LOTR didn’t sell very well last time so let’s approach it differently. I know! $500 set and Brickheadz because everyone loves those!” Lol I’m so scared this theme will die before it actually gets a chance to live

I still can’t quite wrap my head around the sets not selling well before. They were amazing sets, I just don’t get it. I feel like they would have appealed to a lot of people. I’ve heard some say the set choices were bad but I just can’t agree with that. It felt well paced, they can’t make all the most wanted sets at once and then lose their audience. Idk what happened.

[SirBlake]

13 minutes ago, Balrogofmorgoth said:

Yeah they aren’t exactly known for good decision making. “LOTR didn’t sell very well last time so let’s approach it differently. I know! $500 set and Brickheadz because everyone loves those!” Lol I’m so scared this theme will die before it actually gets a chance to live

I still can’t quite wrap my head around the sets not selling well before. They were amazing sets, I just don’t get it. I feel like they would have appealed to a lot of people. I’ve heard some say the set choices were bad but I just can’t agree with that. It felt well paced, they can’t make all the most wanted sets at once and then lose their audience. Idk what happened.

I remember the time when this theme was on the market well, and that last LotR wave was questionable. Obviously, relative to the castle drought we got after LotR went away, it was fantastic, but if we're talking about the theme at it's best (and worst), that last wave had a very strange set selection that left out some important scenes.

[Balrogofmorgoth]

16 minutes ago, SirBlake said:

I remember the time when this theme was on the market well, and that last LotR wave was questionable. Obviously, relative to the castle drought we got after LotR went away, it was fantastic, but if we're talking about the theme at it's best (and worst), that last wave had a very strange set selection that left out some important scenes.

The only questionable choice I can think of is Pirate Ship Ambush, but I don’t even think that was a bad choice. The ship itself was very detailed and large and accurate and the Oathbreakers were extremely desirable. I remember the sets being almost impossible to find at launch, I had to order them on Amazon. I always wondered if they had bad production issues and if that helped lead to the death of the theme

Edited November 30, 2022 by Balrogofmorgoth

[MAB]

To LOTR fans, it makes sense to introduce battle packs. But I can also understand why they might not do it. I cannot see parents and grandparents picking up a pack of Easterlings or Haradrim and buying it for a kid. Even if they do just a single battle pack with one Rohirrim, one Gondorian, one Orc, one Uruk-Hai with LOTR branding on it will not sell anywhere as near as well as SW battle packs, because kids are not interested in them. Of course, adults will be, but are there enough adults that would buy them? Probably not enough to have them sold through toy stores and supermarkets like the original sets were. The only adults wanting to buy them are ones that would purchase the big set too, or already have LOTR sets from a decade ago. Without smaller sets aimed at LOTR fans not willing to drop $500 on the big set, any battle packs would not sell. Very few people would want a Gondorian army without also having the Fellowship. Without a range of set sizes, battle packs would be doomed.

No doubt their sales stats showed that LOTR/Hobbit was not of interest to kids a decade ago. So why think it will be any different now? There is a clear market for (expensive) adult aimed sets though, the secondary market shows that. Why do a $200 set when you can do a $500 set. Casual fans might drop $50 on a set if they are interested in the license but not really into LEGO. By the time you get to $200, I imagine most people willing to spend that much (even if just once or twice per year) will probably also spend $500 on a set. So it makes sense to focus on hitting that large adult set price point. Forget the kids, go for adults. Their recent releases have gone high in part counts and prices. They must have data to show that instead of releasing multiple small/medium (or what we might have called large in the past!) sets, they might as well go for one big one without giving choice of armies that individual adults might want to build.

Also the funko-brick-pop-headz seem to be aimed mainly at adults too. They are build once and display items with next to no play value. If the LOTR ones sell well, maybe we'll get a few more brickheadz for LOTR but I cannot see good BH sales translating into the development of smaller minifigure based sets.

 

I imagine LOTR is going more the way of Ghostbusters and Stranger Things than going the way of Harry Potter. GB got the small IDEAS set first, but then got the expensive HQ for adults and later some BH. It also got Dimensions sets as they were popular at the time. Stranger things got the expensive Upside Down house and some BH. These both seem focussed on the adult (or older teen) market than on more traditional playsets like the original LOTR sets.

Of course they could go like HP and do both adult (or older teen) aimed sets as well as play sets, but personally I don't think the market is there for play sets as much as I'd like to see them.

 

[Balrogofmorgoth]

17 minutes ago, MAB said:

To LOTR fans, it makes sense to introduce battle packs. But I can also understand why they might not do it. I cannot see parents and grandparents picking up a pack of Easterlings or Haradrim and buying it for a kid. Even if they do just a single battle pack with one Rohirrim, one Gondorian, one Orc, one Uruk-Hai with LOTR branding on it will not sell anywhere as near as well as SW battle packs, because kids are not interested in them. Of course, adults will be, but are there enough adults that would buy them? Probably not enough to have them sold through toy stores and supermarkets like the original sets were. The only adults wanting to buy them are ones that would purchase the big set too, or already have LOTR sets from a decade ago. Without smaller sets aimed at LOTR fans not willing to drop $500 on the big set, any battle packs would not sell. Very few people would want a Gondorian army without also having the Fellowship. Without a range of set sizes, battle packs would be doomed.

No doubt their sales stats showed that LOTR/Hobbit was not of interest to kids a decade ago. So why think it will be any different now? There is a clear market for (expensive) adult aimed sets though, the secondary market shows that. Why do a $200 set when you can do a $500 set. Casual fans might drop $50 on a set if they are interested in the license but not really into LEGO. By the time you get to $200, I imagine most people willing to spend that much (even if just once or twice per year) will probably also spend $500 on a set. So it makes sense to focus on hitting that large adult set price point. Forget the kids, go for adults. Their recent releases have gone high in part counts and prices. They must have data to show that instead of releasing multiple small/medium (or what we might have called large in the past!) sets, they might as well go for one big one without giving choice of armies that individual adults might want to build.

Also the funko-brick-pop-headz seem to be aimed mainly at adults too. They are build once and display items with next to no play value. If the LOTR ones sell well, maybe we'll get a few more brickheadz for LOTR but I cannot see good BH sales translating into the development of smaller minifigure based sets.

 

I imagine LOTR is going more the way of Ghostbusters and Stranger Things than going the way of Harry Potter. GB got the small IDEAS set first, but then got the expensive HQ for adults and later some BH. It also got Dimensions sets as they were popular at the time. Stranger things got the expensive Upside Down house and some BH. These both seem focussed on the adult (or older teen) market than on more traditional playsets like the original LOTR sets.

Of course they could go like HP and do both adult (or older teen) aimed sets as well as play sets, but personally I don't think the market is there for play sets as much as I'd like to see them.

 

I disagree, I think the market is there, I just think lego is intentionally blind to it for some reason

[Killian]

I was hoping it wouldn't be Rivendell..

Damn it. Now I'll have to buy it for my Lego Elves 

[SirBlake]

2 hours ago, Balrogofmorgoth said:

The only questionable choice I can think of is Pirate Ship Ambush, but I don’t even think that was a bad choice. The ship itself was very detailed and large and accurate and the Oathbreakers were extremely desirable. I remember the sets being almost impossible to find at launch, I had to order them on Amazon. I always wondered if they had bad production issues and if that helped lead to the death of the theme

Agree to disagree I guess. From my point of view, 3 waves and not a single Gondor soldier is a fail, plain and simple. 

I didn’t have any problem finding everything at retail. Maybe it’s a geographical thing? I’m in Texas. 

[Balrogofmorgoth]

3 minutes ago, SirBlake said:

Agree to disagree I guess. From my point of view, 3 waves and not a single Gondor soldier is a fail, plain and simple. 

I didn’t have any problem finding everything at retail. Maybe it’s a geographical thing? I’m in Texas. 

There were only two waves of LOTR sets. Three waves of Hobbit sets. Gondorian soldiers definitely would been in the next wave. Wave two was just so small

[Killian]

54 minutes ago, Killian said:

I was hoping it wouldn't be Rivendell..

Damn it. Now I'll have to buy it for my Lego Elves 

It's on social media, apparently Stonewars said

 

 

[Seaber]

I think Uruk-Hai Army and the Mirkwood Elves sets from the last lot of sets were near enough battle packs. Both were sold to be massable (extra Helm's Deep/elf fortress walls, army building figs, army building animals, ballista/siege ladders) and so comparable to the Star Wars 501st set in terms of price and content. 

There are several types of figure packs available now from Lego over various themes, ranging from about £12-£30 which could be served by LOTR. 

I really hope this goes on to be a full line, but the fact they're starting with a huge set looks promising. I hope they hit the key locations and figures so we don't end up with huge holes like the last waves, but I think Harry Potter has been an indication about how well a revisited franchise can be done, hopefully LOTR and Indy fare the same. 

[Balrogofmorgoth]

3 minutes ago, Seaber said:

I think Uruk-Hai Army and the Mirkwood Elves sets from the last lot of sets were near enough battle packs. Both were sold to be massable (extra Helm's Deep/elf fortress walls, army building figs, army building animals, ballista/siege ladders) and so comparable to the Star Wars 501st set in terms of price and content. 

There are several types of figure packs available now from Lego over various themes, ranging from about £12-£30 which could be served by LOTR. 

I really hope this goes on to be a full line, but the fact they're starting with a huge set looks promising. I hope they hit the key locations and figures so we don't end up with huge holes like the last waves, but I think Harry Potter has been an indication about how well a revisited franchise can be done, hopefully LOTR and Indy fare the same. 

Harry Potter is definitely more popular than LOTR (which blows my mind, I like HP but it’s not even close), so I wouldn’t expect that same treatment with something like LOTR. Although even a fraction of that budget would do wonders for a LOTR theme

[Seaber]

2 minutes ago, Balrogofmorgoth said:

Harry Potter is definitely more popular than LOTR (which blows my mind, I like HP but it’s not even close), so I wouldn’t expect that same treatment with something like LOTR. Although even a fraction of that budget would do wonders for a LOTR theme

I only meant that Lego have done HP right so I trust they'll do the same with LOTR - the price of Rivendell makes me think they won't skimp if it comes to a full wave. 

HP also has a lot of single use minifig and accesaory molds, LOTR doesn't have too many in my opinion so more money for prints, dual molding and pieces hopefully. 

[Balrogofmorgoth]

3 minutes ago, Seaber said:

I only meant that Lego have done HP right so I trust they'll do the same with LOTR - the price of Rivendell makes me think they won't skimp if it comes to a full wave. 

HP also has a lot of single use minifig and accesaory molds, LOTR doesn't have too many in my opinion so more money for prints, dual molding and pieces hopefully. 

Idk, LOTR has a lot of unique weapons and armor that would need to use new molds, not to mention creatures

[MAB]

2 hours ago, Balrogofmorgoth said:

I disagree, I think the market is there, I just think lego is intentionally blind to it for some reason

Where do you think the market is though? In adults, children, or both.

I think it is adult dominated, hence them going for adult sets (in terms of size and cost,  and collectability rather than play for the BH). Ideally it would be both adults and kids and we'd get a range of set sizes and styles like HP, but I don't think LOTR has that following type of following for younger kids.

[QuiggoldsPegLeg]

I’m extremely pumped that it’s Rivendell, that would’ve been my first choice for a LOTR D2C set.

However my wallet as a student is very much not happy that it’s releasing so soon.

[Wardancer]

A 500 Euro Rivendell? Cannot wait to buy the 150 Euro China clone of that. 

[Moexy]

Anyone got a Balrog vibe from the new head mold from the new Ninjago set : 71782 Cole’s Earth Dragon EVO? Those horns look interesting!

Edited November 30, 2022 by Moexy
Typos

[Balrogofmorgoth]

22 minutes ago, Moexy said:

Anyone got a Balrog vibe from the new head mold from the new Ninjago set : 71782 Cole’s Earth Dragon EVO? Those horns look interesting!

It definitely shares a resemblance although I hope they wouldn’t use those same pieces for a LOTR set, the shaping is wrong for an actual Balrog. It is a cool resemblance though 

[wesker]

18 hours ago, SirBlake said:

Don’t forget Gondor! Battle for Osgiliath or battle trolls crashing the gate is a must. Heck, I’d settle for the white tree and some soldiers. 

I haven't forgotten about Gondor. Knowing now that Lego is releasing a $500 set for LOTR does make me more optimistic about the chances of getting Minas Tirith one day should Rivendell prove to be successful. But while it would be nice to get Gondor Soldiers, they aren't as high a priority to me compared to getting the rest of the primary characters and iconic creatures.

[Agent Kallus]

Perhaps not for Rivendell but do you know what would be a fun new mold they could introduce? 

A pony mold. Make it 2 studs wide like the horse but have it be shorter and stouter.