Any Apple fans?

[Siegfried]

Forgive me if I'm interpreting you incorrectly, but I think Def was referring to the use of Bootcamp or Parallels.

Exactly. It's cheating. Saying that Apple can run any software they want by also installing Windows is like saying "I'm stronger than you... if I'm using a crane." It's not a core ability, you need to pay extra for it, so it's not really a feature. Macs are the hardware and the software. If you're going to install a second OS because the first isn't sufficient it makes more sense to me to just format the lot and run Windows all the time.

[def]

Forgive me if I'm interpreting you incorrectly, but I think Def was referring to the use of Bootcamp or Parallels.

yessss. Mac does them both naturally.

A lot of the Windows/Mac debates are really based on what was going on with the systems 10 years ago, and not accurate today. Few people have the time and money to be up to date on both. Personally, I hate Windows XP, but I've heard all the complaints I have are solved in Vista. But I don't personally know anyone with Vista and my work won't be upgrading their computers until they absolutely have to, maybe in 2020, so I'm still pretty sick of Windows. In the same way, a lot of the Mac complaints I hear are rooted in OS 9 or 10.1, but an Intel Mac on 10.5 is awesome.

Exactly. It's cheating. Saying that Apple can run any software they want by also installing Windows is like saying "I'm stronger than you... if I'm using a crane." It's not a core ability, you need to pay extra for it, so it's not really a feature. Macs are the hardware and the software. If you're going to install a second OS because the first isn't sufficient it makes more sense to me to just format the lot and run Windows all the time.

If you're going to be like that Why discuss what the systems do with only their "core ability"? Your Windows is really the same as you got it out of the box? No software you need to pay extra for? I realize you hate Macs, but you're stretching it really far here.

It's true though, Macs don't come with Minesweeper and solitaire out of the box, in that area, Windows is the winner

[Siegfried]

Personally, I hate Windows XP, but I've heard all the complaints I have are solved in Vista. But I don't personally know anyone with Vista and my work won't be upgrading their computers until they absolutely have to, maybe in 2020, so I'm still pretty sick of Windows.

I never liked XP, but I loved Vista. I'm currently running "7".

In the same way, a lot of the Mac complaints I hear are rooted in OS 9 or 10.1, but an Intel Mac on 10.5 is awesome.

Well you're the Mac user so you'd know better, but OS 9 was over 10 years ago...

If you're going to be like that Why discuss what the systems do with only their "core ability"?

I'm just saying that it's cheating. Saying that Windows compatibility is a reason to switch to a Mac? Why switch at all then? Besides, it's a proven fact that Mac OS can run on most PCs it's just that Apple have turned it into a copyright issue. It's be really funny if Microsoft did the same.

Your Windows is really the same as you got it out of the box?

Sure it is. I haven't paid for any software for a long time and most specialised programs I write myself. Also, my computer was capable of running three monitors at once (none mirrored) as standard. Can a Mac do that?

I realize you hate Macs, but you're stretching it really far here.

Hate is a strong word. I think they are overrated and it's tiresome that Apple get credit for others work over and over again; for example Mac OS X is little more than a GUI, all the hard stuff is handled by Mach and FreeBSD. But I don't see how I'm stretching it at all, and no I don't hate Macs. I do dislike Steve Job's style however and I wish they'd stop exaggerating in adverts.

It's true though, Macs don't come with Minesweeper and solitaire out of the box, in that area, Windows is the winner

Ouch! Remove thy barbs!

[Clone OPatra]

Also, my computer was capable of running three monitors at once (none mirrored) as standard. Can a Mac do that?

Yes. Well, truly all I've ever worked on is two monitors, but I'm pretty sure you could go up to three.

[Siegfried]

Yes. Well, truly all I've ever worked on is two monitors, but I'm pretty sure you could go up to three.

Well I'll give the Apple fans the last word and I'll try to stay out of this topic in the future. (I'll come on invitation only. )

[JimBee]

While trying to comprehend all this computer talk, I'll answer these with as much (or as little...) knowledge about computers as possible.

I hear this a lot, but I never quite get it. I am fairly techy (I cracked open my iMac and swapped out my harddrive by myself) and as far as I know, there's few things a PC can do that a Mac can't. Jim, you know Mac's can run Windows, right? Actually, the only thing I know that PCs easily do is offer DIY versions, which is against Mac policy. But maybe that's Dells and IBMs policy too. Anyway, hardcore Mac users know how to tweak their systems, you just need a screwdriver.

For more info, Google 'hackintosh'

Yes, I knew they could run Windows, but that doesn't really make a difference for me. And while someone with your expertise could do something like that, the vast majority of Mac users probably can't "hack" their Mac very well.

Personally, I hate Windows XP, but I've heard all the complaints I have are solved in Vista. But I don't personally know anyone with Vista and my work won't be upgrading their computers until they absolutely have to, maybe in 2020, so I'm still pretty sick of Windows. In the same way, a lot of the Mac complaints I hear are rooted in OS 9 or 10.1, but an Intel Mac on 10.5 is awesome.

I dislike XP as well. I've been using it for about five years, and it's not very cooperative (with viruses and defragmentation, even if I have a program for the former). Vista wasn't much of an improvement, either. It felt like Windows just upped the graphics and such to make it look good. Otherwise, it was the same, IMO.

Windows 7, though, is the most user-friendly and cooperative. I can't really explain it other than the fact that it's easier to use and understand without an expert's help.

[def]

Yes, I knew they could run Windows, but that doesn't really make a difference for me. And while someone with your expertise could do something like that, the vast majority of Mac users probably can't "hack" their Mac very well.

But that's the same with PC people too. Most people I know are afraid to do anything with their computer, technically. My manager's laptop broke, and she asked me if I could fix it. I asked what was wrong, and what she'd tried. She had no idea and tried nothing. She was terrified to touch it at all. That's the average computer user. Like me with a broken refrigerator. I wouldn't even try.

[Luke McAwesome]

I forgot to post in here last month... my dad got my entire family iPod Touch 3rd Generations (32 GB! w00t!), and they are the most beautiful things I've ever seen.

I just wish there was AT&T coverage out where I live... in the middle of nowhere. Or else we'd have iPhones!

Anyway, it's the coolest thing ever. And just yesterday my sister got one and she can't stop telling us how it's the most expensive thing she's ever held.

Edited April 19, 2010 by Striker

[CP5670]

XP works well as long as you configure it properly. I think practically any OS has annoyances if you use it with default settings out of the box. I have been using XP for 6 years now and will move to Windows 7 (which I only want for the 64-bit support) once the prices of SSDs drop a bit, so I can put it on one of those.

I'm not a fan of OEM desktop systems in the first place, whether they be Mac or Windows based. They are usually either overpriced or have inferior hardware, particularly the video card. Macs are especially bad with this though as they still require video cards with the special EFI BIOS, which allows Apple to charge absurd markups on those cards even after they have become outdated.

[Piranha]

On an entirely different note, Apple upgraded their line of MacBook Pro's with hardware specifically Intel's core i5 and core i7 among other things.

http://www.apple.com/macbookpro/

What is a shame is on the 13 inch model the core i5 is not available.

Back to iphone/ipod touch OS: What I don't like is they charge if you want to update.

I wonder if the OS 4 will cost you.

Edited April 19, 2010 by Macoco

[RileyC]

Back to iphone/ipod touch OS: What I don't like is they charge if you want to update.

I wonder if the OS 4 will cost you.

Usually its free for iphone users but for iPod Touch users from memory its $9.95 US. Which isnt that bad imo

[def]

Usually its free for iphone users but for iPod Touch users from memory its $9.95 US. Which isnt that bad imo

Actually, I think that's ridiculous. That's a blatant gouge. Same as the last $30 OS update (10.6) that just made old software incompatible. Some of their business practices, I really don't get I guess that's what they do when they can. Their stock is high these days.

[The Eye]

I don't prefer Apple or any other company. For me, it's whatever's best at the time.

I'm looking for a new laptop though, any recommendations?

[RileyC]

I'm looking for a new laptop though, any recommendations?

I would have to say the new MacBook 15" they seem to be pretty good if you're wanting an Apple laptop because this is a Apple topic. My brother has last years model and its got a good size hard drive and goes really smoothly.

[The Eye]

I would have to say the new MacBook 15" they seem to be pretty good if you're wanting an Apple laptop because this is a Apple topic. My brother has last years model and its got a good size hard drive and goes really smoothly.

Thanks, but I'm kind of a windows guy. But as I said, maybe I'll go with Apple for once.

Edited April 23, 2010 by The Eye