Shadows

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Protip: FBI Agent. Which brings up something I never got to address. I really was unconvertable, just like I said. I had initially thought that might be a good clue for the other half of the team to find me. I had hoped they would either try to convert me and get a funny message or have some form of investigation to use first. Sadly, I quickly realised that I've claimed it so many times it was pointless. I guess things don't always go the way I plan them after all, huh? I honestly think that if it had been someone else claiming it, someone who hadn't claimed it so many times before, they would have been lynched that day. In all truthfulness, only scum or a SK should be able to make that claim with absolute certainty unless a townie has been specifically told that they can't be converted. We've had cases where PRs could be converted to scum, some even kept their powers, so that would not have been a safe assumption at all, plus it would be a terrible claim for a townie who basically just announced "kill me." When I didn't die after that, it should have set up a few flags, but there was so much going on that it slipped right by.

It was just a horribly mean joking way to refer to Big Cam's potty curse. He knows it's all fun and games, I only mean the horrible things I say when I direct them at Hinck, just like he only means the ones he says to me. It's how we roll, as the kids would say.

It does beat WWJD.

Believe it or not, that's exactly the combination of things I was hoping for, even the fun part. It's isn't scummy, it just almost always benefits the scum more than the town. While I knew that wasn't def's intent, it was an honest statement. So did I, he died.

It did add a lot of flavour. I've always liked the floating kill but I doubt it would have been as helpful if it had been two less-likely-to-be-investigated people sharing it. Oh, I knew it was megablocks, I just thought it was a good townie move to point out that the way people metagame on EB is almost always harmful to the town. I know I get metagamed most in town games, so it sounded like something I would say. If I was a townie and had such a role, I would use it on people I was suspicious of, sort of like a light influence vig, trying to make my suspects look bad so we would lynch them. As it was, I thought you'd made it clear enough that it couldn't be anything too drastic, so I didn't take it as a major influence, unless someone went overboard with it, of course.

I've found as many instances of prankster being town as scum, so how did you come to the conclusion that it had to be scum? It's a harmless role, we were specifically told it couldn't be taken too far. Oh, and it wasn't my role anyway, I was just trying to make it look like it was in case I ever had to actually do a kill and was seen targeting. I avoided doing them until that last day, knowing that even after being shown as not scum, I'd still be under too much scrutiny to get away with anything. It's why we didn't actually use the curse on the last day, it made it possible to claim the role and no one could dispute it, all of the targets had looked like things I would do and no one else would be showing signs of being cursed that day. Honestly, I couldn't be more obvious there and still no one ever accused me of it. I have to admit, he gets a lot of points for taking it as far as he did. I seriously doubt he was required to sing and dance every single thing he said, it was just flavour, it could have been a couple of lines and then a normal post, I'm sure. That's ok though, he owed me a poem from Ragnarok, he promised me one after I died in the midst of his sadness about it in IRC. I'm still waiting for the Ballad of Steinvoir Meatshield.

*polishes his Town badge* It's weird because I really was just playing town. No pressure, no trying to steer things. The times when I seemed confused during the game, like the 'kekeke' killer or what Scouty's role was, those were legit. The most suspicious things I did in the game were normal for townies, even though they often get them killed, so I think that gave everyone just enough lingering doubt to keep trusting me, and by trusting me, I mean not quite reaching that "aw crap, I'm not sure, just kill Shadows" point. And everyone should know that I hate stings, so I was really worried that making contact with him would look incredibly scummy, but it was the game to look scummy, so no harm done, I used "the sting" as a cover to make legitimate contact.

Too much fun. Nobody in the town should point fingers at other townies for helping us, you all did it and the most vocal will be the ones who helped the most. Seriously, we couldn't have done it without you guys! Scum: Awesome. It's sad we didn't get to spend more time together, we could have had some real fun, but we did anyway. Town: Love you. Always trust Shadows. def: Thank you for what was kind of a crazy but in spots very normal, almost classic game. There were a few times that reminded me of earlier EB games, which was especially enjoyable. I'm sure, as always, there will be a lot of discussion of balance, but at least from what I can tell so far, you set up a game that was a lot more complicated for the scum than I initially expected, and it makes the whole thing work. Blind trust, the kind that comes without at least some form of investigation result, is an incredibly difficult thing to work out in a game like this. We see towns do it all the time, and it usually gets them killed when they trust the wrong people. For scum, it would be instant death to the whole team if it's wrong, so it makes the game complicated in an entirely new way from what we're used to here, and that's both exciting and fun at the same time. Agreed!

The bold part of rule 1 explains everything, we needed to find each other, and the Alopex situation opened that door, it just took an extra day to be sure, the moment you revealed me. You're outnumbered, you can't lynch or even tie. You can't prevent a conversion and a kill. See video above.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nfa1HsnMPzA

Oh, the hell with it. It's a fair cop. We honestly couldn't have done it without you, Biggy Baby Poo Poo, it was your reveal of Alopex that allowed me to pass on the clues that the other team wisely didn't believe until your reveal confirmed it today. Sometimes a puzzle only needs two parts. Thanks for the assist! So now the question is, what are you going to do about it, townies? I know, let's play a game! There are 11 people left, 5 townies and 6 scum. No no, the game isn't "guess who's going to be lynched today", you don't get to play that one. Instead, let's play "name the surviving scum." Go on, you know you want to. I'll give you the first one, you fill in the rest. It'll give you something to do before ... well, you know. Shadows ??? ??? ??? ??? ???

Yeah, because there's no other possibility, 3yr old who has to go potty. Or maybe it's Hinck singing and dancing his way into our hearts, I knew exactly how much he'd enjoy that. Oh, and then the classic texting for Tammo, I admit, that was just amusing. Goofball, I'm the prankster, a perfectly harmless flavour role that should have been caught long before now. I thought I made that abundantly obvious with my choices, especially Jimbee being in love with Draggy. Way to jump to conclusions. What you seem to be missing is that I was investigated and proven town by Pandora (ok, specifically "not scum" which left her worried that I was the SK, a point that was quickly disproved by the death of Zepher). Since we know the idiot scum tried to convert her the next night and then tried to convert DP last night, when exactly would they have converted me? Your theories are still as bad as before. I'm starting to wonder if that's intentional. And before anyone asks, if Scouty hadn't been killed, he would have spent the day talking like a drill sergeant. I thought the yelling and profanity would be funny, and since we all know it means nothing, it wouldn't have caused any problems.

I call mine Betty. Planning to build? "Got a date with Betty." Going to buy some? "Going shopping for Betty." Think they're overpriced? "That Betty sure is getting expensive." A big fan? "I really love Betty." Seems perfectly reasonable and it never requires choosing a plural or singular form, it's just Betty, and she's built like a stack of bricks.

A boring death for a dumb scum, I like it. I take it we're being shown a conversion and then they're immediately killed, so we got lucky there and will take our victories where we can get them. And then, as always, we get screwed over ... Scouty, do you really have to die in every townie game where I trust you? I'm sure there will be some leads to consider today, hopefully someone can help us as much as yesterday and make it another successful day.

Dumb or scum? Dumb and scum. Blocker, indeed. Vote: Alopex

As we were told previously, one team can kill and one can convert. What we probably saw was proof that the two teams haven't found each other, one tried to kill and one tried to convert the same person. Obviously Alopex could claim some town role and say they are innocent, but at this point, I can't think of any likely town roles that are unaccounted for. We know he wasn't a protector, that's for damn sure. Now it just seems like we're waiting to hear anything from him. I do hope he realises that being quiet isn't going to make us forget.

Hell yes! Hell no! Hell yes, again! Can't it ever all be good, even just once in a game? I really took Zepher as scum, but getting rid of the psycho is great news given that he just kept killing us townies every day, so that's one less thing to worry about. Getting a scum is absolutely amazing, and it was one that had raised some suspicions, so not only does that mean we're starting to think the right way, but it also means that our vigilante didn't kill one of us. Keep up the good work, Vig! All of that said, we took a pretty big hit losing Pandora and her role. I'm not sure I remember any game opening where a town, scum and neutral all died, but maybe it's happened before. Two out of the three, though, it's certainly an improvement for us. Had Zepher turned up scum, I would have automatically moved on to Big Cam today, since it looked a lot like he was trying to influence us away from Zepher yesterday, but since he was neutral, I'm not sure what to make of that now. Still a little odd that after his roleclaim, he didn't end up dead. That makes me wonder why the scum thought Pandora was more important than him, or if they know something we don't. Before commenting further, I'm going to wait to see if I hear anything from the remaining PRs in hopes that someone turned up a useful lead. If not, we'll have to review the past few days and see what turns up. At least we don't need to pick a new mayor, for once. *eyes TPRU suspiciously*

I'm not sure I've ever been accused by someone for not voting for them. "according to most" would be whom, exactly? The vote says otherwise, as do the comments saying that you're both suspicious, a sentiment I would say that most of us share. Even including this post, I still think Zepher has been more suspicious than you. Wait, you think the game is ending tonight? Where did you come up with that theory? Why would you assume that anyone who is targeted by another should die? That doesn't even make sense. Hinckley, who was a townie. Do you imagine that scum would share such helpful information with the town if they had it? Except he wasn't the only one who knew, you say that Hinck did, and there's no telling who he might have told, which means it's still an odd conclusion to jump to. I think it's a lot more likely that you were blocked (if you were blocked) because someone was suspicious of you. Even you think you're incredibly suspicious looking, so how is that a surprise? Prior to this post, I didn't even know you were the supposed watcher, but now everyone knows you're claiming it, true or not. If it's true, you've put yourself at risk for no good reason. I can only speak for myself here, but I haven't been converted and at least one other person knows that for a fact, which also destroys the recruiter theory, leaving Draggy as the killer which I have no idea about. It's Draggy, anything goes (but I don't think he is, call that gut instinct).

I'm a little worried that you think voting is agenda based as opposed to honestly showing your thoughts.

When the day started, I had a very different vote in mind, but since then I have come to understand at least some of what is going on behind the scenes and after a lot of reviewing, I can only fall back on how likely it is that the scum are sitting by quietly while the town flails. The results so far have certainly indicated that. I'm not going to make a big post reviewing and restating the things that have been said so far to make my case, I'm just going to say that at this point the most suspicious person to me is... Vote: Zepher That said, I am almost as suspicious of Big Cam and have no problem with the vote going either way today. I think it's important to see how everyone votes and in the end, if this is a tie, I believe we can trust our mayor to make the right tie-breaking decision, so I hope everyone will take the time to carefully consider the position we're in and vote for who they sincerely think is scum without following bandwagons.

This is the kind of thing that makes him frustrating to deal with. First, Amy wasn't involved, I haven't actually seen anything much from Amy in this whole game and that absence is curious to me. Second, it's not 1998, does anyone use AIM now? I know it doesn't matter, but for the sake of correctness, Scouty, Draggy and I were on Steam after he sent me the pm that I asked Scouty to have him send (we've both quoted it) because I wanted to hear it from him directly and not relayed through anyone else. We were, in fact, diligently trying to figure out how to save him because he had convinced us that there was a good case against you, but he waited too long to start the whole thing and I had already warned him of that in pm. I don't know what more we could have done at that point. The sad part here is that everything Scouty was saying was coming from Hinck and it was the two of them seeming to be in agreement that got me to go with the change and we all followed through with exactly what he asked. I actually waited a bit to change my vote because I really wanted to give it proper consideration and spent a lot of that time looking at the earlier part of the day for anything that might tell me that it was some kind of elaborate scum trick between Hinck and Scouty. I'm pretty sure I even mentioned considering that when I made the vote change and came to the conclusion that it would be much too complicated for them to have tried. I know that Scouty and Draggy voted sooner, though, so it's hard to justify his claim that nobody was doing anything. I guess that's the part that keeps bugging me, and maybe his perception of the situation was altered by a day of singing and being close to lynching, but it still seems particularly out of place. He could have just come to IRC and we would have all met there, but instead he seemed to be distancing himself by doing things through Scouty, which did not help to alleviate my concerns. As for testing things, the only thing he did was make a case against you and then change his mind at the last second and turn against me. Prior to that point he never gave any of us a reason to think that he was being anything but truthful in his beliefs, so I don't know what to make of his "test" except that he fooled us? Seeing everything that he wrote you makes some of it clearer for me, not the parts in his head which are absolutely bewildering in spots, but in how you reacted to them. This feels like day 6 already, it's been an absolutely frustrating and confusing mess and I'm not sure what direction to go in. With everyone acting scummy it's like I'm a lie detector technician in a convention of psychopaths, I can't sort out the readings I'm getting at all. We should also be picking a mayor, but who really wants to volunteer for that?

Were the reasons he gave you different from the ones he gave me (and Scouty, I assume)? I do, and so far it isn't helping, it just keeps making people suspect me, which is weird in a game where so many people are acting scummy (which is why it hasn't helped so far). As for Hinck, I've seen lots of people manipulate him successfully, that wouldn't be hard for anyone who knows him, but it's true that the timing would be difficult. I will agree with that as well. Knowing that I'm town, and with the confirmation that Dave was, it would be foolish for me to focus too much on whatever was going through Hinck's mind in those last hours and letting everyone else off the hook to fight what would amount to a "he said/she said" battle. That's just the kind of distraction the scum would benefit from most. Ugh. I'm not surprised, but the use of "of course" is like adding insult to injury. I think we can leave Dave off that list now, don't you?

That's just perfect, another day of complete losses. It's kind of sad that we were actually working together and trying to save Hinck at the end and it still didn't help. Worse, someone apparently got to him (gee, it's so hard to figure out who was more interested in saving her own megablocks than helping the town, isn't it, but wait, she's more important than he was as she made clear to us) and we're left with his misplaced suspicion of me, as well as his list of other suspects that included Dave who is now vindicated by his own death. Also interesting to note that Dave voted for the same person Hinck was so certain was scum until literally the last hour and a half or so. For those who wonder, this is the beginning of what convinced me to change my vote and I wish like hell others had listened, but as I told him when he asked, it was really too late to get enough people to see the light. It's obvious he was trying to consider all possibilities and even looking to trust Pandora, but by the end of the discussion he suggested voting for her and that's what we did. As you may have read in the night topic, I asked Scouty and he was as surprised as I was at the change of direction at the end. I don't know the specifics of how he went from there to suspecting me when I believed the case he had made and voted accordingly, but I don't regret my vote and barring something amazing and unforeseen, intend to repeat it today. To me, the things he said outline a very clear case of traditional scum manipulation, namely saying some things that make sense, vouching for one legitimate townie to appear to be one yourself, and a lot of weidness and as Hinck called it, "scum perspective", basically revealing yourself as scum by forgetting to think like a townie, namely in the obligatory setup for the next day, saying that if Hinck is town Scouty would be lynched. That's a preposterous proposition and one that he seemed particularly bothered by. And now, I'll wait for the obvious attack to start. Or better yet, I won't. I'll go to bed and let things get in full swing before I deal with the lies and nonsense many hours from now. Have fun with that.

And now?