LDD 4.3.6 bugs

[Aanchir]

Here's an odd bug I discovered: Color 129 Tr. Bluish Violet (Glitter) no longer renders correctly, at least not with maximum graphic settings. The likely reason for this is that in Assets.lif, the material type has been changed from "shinyPlastic" to "glitter". Technically a glittery material would be more accurate if it would actually render, but instead bricks in this material render the same as bricks with Material IDs not programmed into the software.

[kamos]

Hi,

I found few little errors:

1. 2339 BRICK W. BOW 1X5X4 + ROOF TILEs

Direct link for picture 1

Direct link for picture 2

(side note: spoiler usage is just 'prevention' against 'unnecessary' loading and stretching page, that's the reason of picture in spoilers, The direct links for pictures are there just in case, if the pictures or spoiler itself is causing trouble and removing it / them would be required)

The pictures speaks for they self. 50746 ROOF TILE 1X1X2/3 and 92946 ROOF TILE 1X2 45° W 1/3 PLATE are just going into the 2339/76768 BRICK.

2. Right and Left Shells

Direct link for Shells picture

The 41749 RIGHT SHELL and 41750 LEFT SHELL can't be placed (as in right side of picture) against each other. It is possible to have it like 41751 (full) shell, but not if you invert one of them. The reason is some weird collision of the edge, Moving one of the bricks up, down, further of the other brick is possible. It happens when the bricks are in the same height level. Moving one of them a little higher / lover (approx. half height of plate or one plate) will make it placeable.

There seems to be an issue with parts which support the flex tool...

You're right...

Direct link for 55668

Direct link for 55668-2 + 76270

Direct link for 76270

Direct link for crazy 76270

Direct link for second crazy 76270

Direct link for different angle of 76270

Direct link for third crazy 76270

Ok I didn't tried all flex part, only 55668 and 76270 (cables).

SO... I connected 55668 and / or 76270 into 2555 (plate with holder), that is connected 4282 (2x16 plate). This allowed me to use Hinge tool, to rotate them. The one issue with it is, that only a small part (piece) of cable can be rotated only near the place where is connected (unlike the non-flex cables which allows rotate them as whole part, not small piece). BUT, rotating them using left and right arrows for few second will make them more thin. Longer you hold arrow, thinner they would be (picture 1,2,3 third spoiler). After few seconds they will start reverting into original shape. The funny thing is, that the 2555, 61252 (like in the picture) can be still connected into the 'invisible' part of the cable. Sometimes it doesn't recognize the connectivity (pic 2 shorter cable, at the time, by moving the cable to right, it could connect into that green plate by that end, but the part with the 'bulges' couldn't, like "there isn't nothing to connect although there is "dark azure" 2555). Using the Flex tool will revert the 55668 into 'original' piece (except for 76270, it will start acting strange / crazy)

For the crazy behavior, clicking with flex tool into "right" place will trigger it. Although, it is a "hop and trop" game (sometimes it happen, sometimes it just revert to last shape or slightly change shape). For me / my cases it was:

Pic. 3: clicking with flex tool on place about the green 1x1 plate is, should trigger "strange / crazy" behavior as shown in pic. 4 (more likely to happen)

Pic. 5 (+ alternative): clicking with flex tool on place about the two "medium blue 1x1 plate with holder" are, may trigger shown situation (less likely to happen, it may change right "the invisible" side of cable, for me it happened with "invisible part", it also may just change the thickness of right side, then I couldn't recreate situation)

Pic. 6: extreme case, only one time happened

Honorable to mention, that last three picture shows, what happen when you click with flex tool on the cable. It just start "shaking", but clicking again will restore them into their last shape (or just slightly modify it). So that mean, they cant stay in shapes as shown in last three pictures.

Also, saving them in shown shapes, and reopening file won't show any error. (It also goes with first point in this post) And rotating something on these flex cables may screw up whole creation by strangely rotating it into all ways.

Everything that I mentioned in this post is attachment, so if someone would like to look at these, there they are.

EDIT: All large images have been replaced by small thumbnails.

bugs_A2.lxf

Edited March 28, 2013 by kamos

[Calabar]

@kamos

The spoiler tag is a very good idea for page readability, but the images are loaded anyway with the page. As some of that images are oversized, could you resize that or convert that in text links?

[Graysmith]

I can't get any regular brick studs to attach to Technic brick holes (3005 and 6541, and so on). 87087 will attach via the open stud on the side, but not the top stud.

Plates (like 3024) do attach to the Technic holes though so surely it's a bug and a pretty huge one.

[Wolfolo]

Hello, first post here :P

I don't know if these are bugs or wanted behaviours, but they limit me a little.

1) Plates and shafts doesn't agree: sticking a shaft (ex. 87994 SHAFT 3M, 60849 NOZZLE, 4697 T-PIECE) in a piece with through holes (4070 ANGULAR BRICK or 4081 LAMP HOLDER) doesn't allow to connect a plate on the stud, also if the shaft does not interfere. Placing the plate first, makes the shaft unable to reach the end point, leaving a gap and blocking something else on another position.

2) Is not possible to connect together 2 (or more) plates in a T shape

3) Is not possible to snap a plate in a holder, this mean that minifigs can't hold maps (decorated flat tiles), but they must carry them like pizza boxes

4) Lack of flexibility on most flexible pieces (outer cables, corrugated pipes, spiral tubes and flex tube, especially 30527 which is needed for the R2-D2 model)

I couldn't provide screenshots or the lxf file yet, but these problems are easily reproducible.

Thank you for the support!

[Superkalle]

I can't get any regular brick studs to attach to Technic brick holes (3005 and 6541, and so on). 87087 will attach via the open stud on the side, but not the top stud.

Plates (like 3024) do attach to the Technic holes though so surely it's a bug and a pretty huge one.

There has been a lot of debate about this. The base rule is that LDD supports only legal designs. Legal designs are decided by Design Lab, a department within TLG that, among other things, ensures that only connections get approved that will not permanently damage the bricks so it would lose functionality or clutch power.

The base rule for studs in Technic holes is that its not allowed. First, there is no leeway, i.e. the studs are inserted quite hard into the Technic Hole without any possibly for the surrounding plastic go give (typical manufacturing tolerance issue). Secondly, the clutch area (depth) is more shallow in a Technic hole then a normal anti-stud because of the recess ridge in the technic hole. (...and thirdly, because there is no guarantee of the sideway stud position tolerance, it is absolutely forbidden to insert a 1x2, 1x3 etc brick or plate as there would be great risk for cold flow in the plastic).

However....in several official sets, 1x1 plates and 1x1 round plates have been used, so they are accepted as legal as they are mainly seen as decorations. So why not 1x1 bricks. Well 1x1 round bricks are actually OK in LDD (try it and you will see), because it was used in a couple of official sets. However, 1x1 bricks are still not accepted. Probably because TLG does not want to encourage their own designers to SNOT-build with studs inserted into a Technic hole (for reasons described above). So why are then 1x1 bricks with stud on the side OK? Well, the top stud is not (because it's seen as a normal brick), The side stud connectivity was added because that technique was used in a few official sets.

Hello, first post here :P

I don't know if these are bugs or wanted behaviours, but they limit me a little.

1) Plates and shafts doesn't agree: sticking a shaft (ex. 87994 SHAFT 3M, 60849 NOZZLE, 4697 T-PIECE) in a piece with through holes (4070 ANGULAR BRICK or 4081 LAMP HOLDER) doesn't allow to connect a plate on the stud, also if the shaft does not interfere. Placing the plate first, makes the shaft unable to reach the end point, leaving a gap and blocking something else on another position.

2) Is not possible to connect together 2 (or more) plates in a T shape

3) Is not possible to snap a plate in a holder, this mean that minifigs can't hold maps (decorated flat tiles), but they must carry them like pizza boxes

4) Lack of flexibility on most flexible pieces (outer cables, corrugated pipes, spiral tubes and flex tube, especially 30527 which is needed for the R2-D2 model)

I couldn't provide screenshots or the lxf file yet, but these problems are easily reproducible.

Thank you for the support!

1) Yes, this is a confirmed bug since a long time ago. I think it's difficult to fix for the LDD team because it has to do with how duplicate connectivity should be handled.

2) This has to do with illegal designs (read by response above). It used to be OK many years ago, but since then TLG has decided that it is not legal.

3) This is a confirmed bug/limitation in LDD.

4) This is also quite well known.

[Wolfolo]

Whoa, this was a really hard hit.

Last time i checked (10 or more years ago, eheh) when I compared Lego with MEGA, I found a document (I don't remember if one from TLG or who else) stating that gaps between studs, thickness, diameter of studs, technic holes etc were all designed to allow the weirdest connections, it's nice to know TLG changed their mind after doing tests on how pieces react to some before-legal connections.

I think I'll resort to other softwares to digitalize my weirdest mocs, and the LDD to build only the legal things.

And I hope most of the bugs will be fixed in future :P

Thank you for the good explanation!

[captainmib]

Don't know if this is already mentioned, but the cross axle 5.5 (#59426) has no functioning stop. So the axle can be put in any position through a hole.

[Superkalle]

Don't know if this is already mentioned, but the cross axle 5.5 (#59426) has no functioning stop. So the axle can be put in any position through a hole.

How do you mean. For me it stops just perfectly in a technic hole.

[kamos]

How do you mean. For me it stops just perfectly in a technic hole.

Try put the 59426 into 75535, 11458. You should be able to place "the stop" inside them.

Left (red): what @captainmib probably wanted say, the stop can be inserted into some bricks like 75535, 11458, 6536, 32068 and few other. The way it shouldn't work

Right (green): How it should work

Edited April 3, 2013 by kamos

[Superkalle]

Aha, now I get it...that was a really good bug find!

[Lyichir]

I don't know whether the problem is with part 43093 or part 93571, but I found a bug involving these two parts. Namely, that the cross axle section of 43093 does not fit completely into either end of the side connections of 93571. This means that, with two of these inserted as far as they will go into 93571, the length of the construction is slightly more than four modules; a huge problem when trying to integrate with system. For comparison, 43093 fits snugly into either end of 59443 without issue.

[Superkalle]

I don't know whether the problem is with part 43093 or part 93571, but I found a bug involving these two parts. Namely, that the cross axle section of 43093 does not fit completely into either end of the side connections of 93571. This means that, with two of these inserted as far as they will go into 93571, the length of the construction is slightly more than four modules; a huge problem when trying to integrate with system. For comparison, 43093 fits snugly into either end of 59443 without issue.

Excellent find.

And it also seems 93571 has the same problem as 59443 in that it won't allow a 3,2 mm bar to pass completely through. (At least it looks like that should be possible looking at the LDD geometry, but I haven't checked with a physical brick).

[Aanchir]

Excellent find.

And it also seems 93571 has the same problem as 59443 in that it won't allow a 3,2 mm bar to pass completely through. (At least it looks like that should be possible looking at the LDD geometry, but I haven't checked with a physical brick).

Nah, you actually can't do that with physical bricks using either of those parts. In the case of 59443 it's possible there was an earlier version of the mold with the same part number that would allow this (I don't know about this for sure), but 93571 has never allowed this.

[Superkalle]

OK, thanks for the info Aanchir.

[Graysmith]

The plain coffin lid (10304) can't attach to the top of the coffin (30163). The other two lids (30164 and 42447) attach properly.

It's easy to get around it by using a plate to place it correctly, but a bug is a bug!

[Superkalle]

The plain coffin lid (10304) can't attach to the top of the coffin (30163). The other two lids (30164 and 42447) attach properly.

It's easy to get around it by using a plate to place it correctly, but a bug is a bug!

Good find. And I also now noted that you can't stick a 3.2 mm bar in the whole of the coffin.

[captainmib]

Try put the 59426 into 75535, 11458. You should be able to place "the stop" inside them.

Left (red): what @captainmib probably wanted say, the stop can be inserted into some bricks like 75535, 11458, 6536, 32068 and few other. The way it shouldn't work

Right (green): How it should work

Thanks for the explanation.

[Mr_Geef]

Not sure if this is a bug or I'm just missing something. When I try to place an assembly on a tile, LDD won't let it sit. The assembly is meant to shift from left to right on the tile.

Haha, I poked around the forum a little more and found my answer

Edited April 9, 2013 by Mr_Geef

[Wolfolo]

It's not possible to attach a #62701 HUB CAP d 24 to a #55928 RIM WIDE 18x14 W. CROSS d 4.8 without an helper (a cross axle) as could be done in the real world, for example when using the #6562 CONNECTOR PEG/CROSS AXLE

[Superkalle]

It's not possible to attach a #62701 HUB CAP d 24 to a #55928 RIM WIDE 18x14 W. CROSS d 4.8 without an helper (a cross axle) as could be done in the real world, for example when using the #6562 CONNECTOR PEG/CROSS AXLE

Do you know if it connects without a helper in any official sets? (i.e. could the connection between the rim and the hub be considered a LEGO connection). If yes, then LDD should support it.

[Wolfolo]

It seem they only do it for scenic reasons (for example: http://www.brickset....ail/?set=8184-1 ), but this rim + round plate doesn't work too, and it's in 10220 VolksWagen Camper, so I bet it's the same problem as the rim cap and the 1x1 round plate (the largest ring) have the same diameter

EDIT: fixed link as I needed to tidy up the dropbox public folder :P

Edited March 1, 2015 by Wolfolo

[Superkalle]

I didn't know about the Volkswagen Camper one either, so that was a good addition to this problem.

[Mr_Geef]

60607 (lattice 1/2 for frame 1x4x3) does not connect with its respective frame 6556. I'm actually trying to place the part on a pair of 3794 (a real set procedure), but haven't been able to get that to work. I tried to use the trick mentioned on another thread, but since I can't get the lattice in the piece it is designed to work with, I'm kinda stuck.

[Superkalle]

60607 (lattice 1/2 for frame 1x4x3) does not connect with its respective frame 6556. I'm actually trying to place the part on a pair of 3794 (a real set procedure), but haven't been able to get that to work. I tried to use the trick mentioned on another thread, but since I can't get the lattice in the piece it is designed to work with, I'm kinda stuck.

Door 60607 and 60608 will connect to frame 60594 (left in image).

Door 2529 will connect to frame 6556

Does that answer the question?

But what I do find strange is that the 60607 doors have a wider gap between them then 60608. Is it really supposed to be like that?

BTW: where did you find the use with the 3794. Now you got me curios.