Star Trek 2 Mafia - Day Five

[Hinckley]

Vote: extend the day

2 hours ago, Pandora said:

You can park your sanctimonious attitude, Deanna.

2 hours ago, Pandora said:

Having been faced with a terrifying revelation that I'm probably here until the bitter end,

2 hours ago, Pandora said:

 Troi, do you have any thoughts about Riker? Just pretend for a moment you and I are both Town - who do you think it is?
 

Gee, maybe:

On 3/3/2020 at 6:13 PM, Hinckley said:

Riker, before her personality-ectomy, thoroughly looked through Day One and had words for most people, analyzed behavior, and asked questions. The person he was most gentle on was Beverly. Even when quoting Beverly, he only responded to the vote on himself. Did Beverly place a vote on a Scum buddy for distance and then Riker stayed away from hammering Beverly by not scrutinizing the Scummy actions of Beverly? Really, he analyzed everyone and went after Geordi without giving a reason why he didn't agree with the Beverly lynch or any response to her behavior. I know he can't answer for this, but it's interesting that it's kind of a defense. When he responds to my vote:

he can only say that it seems out-of-character for me, but gives nothing of credence to the "bright red Scum beacon" I claimed to have seen. If I'm going to analyze Wesley's behavior as a defense, I have no choice but to see this reaction the same way.

On 3/3/2020 at 6:39 PM, Hinckley said:

Has anybody actually looked at Riker's posts?

Riker is a really smart player and has a ton of experience, especially with the three big egos in this game, who are all currently going after each other.

Here's his only post, of substance, from Day Two. I know Wesley keeps saying that Riker seems like Town because he's looked at all cases and not just gone with the most simple way to vote out a Townie, but let's give him credit for knowing that bandwagoning can seem Scummy. And again, why would he want to remove a huge target for the lynch like Wesley, who had a ton of scrutiny already? He even says he gets why there are so many accusations against Wesley, but then cites my post about Wesley not knowing there would be a Scum kill if we didn't reach a lynch. That's not the strongest argument against him and was mostly a joke push on my part. Yes, Riker has had his own case against Picard for the last two days, but has he done much analysis of other players? Really, I'm asking, because I don't know yet. Riker. Is. Flying. Under. The. Radar.

Or a Townie with a busy life.

On 3/3/2020 at 6:50 PM, Hinckley said:

Town or Scum, Riker is playing a great game:

Under the radar. Two significant posts on Day Two, both seem innocuous. Could be a really smooth Scum game. With a paranoid mind, he could be tapping into my paranoia about players always sheeping onto my vote, he would know this very well about me, having played so many games with me. Keeping Wesley around to keep suspicion off of him.

Or being an analytical Townie and doing the best he can do with the time he has.

I hope this is being read and not being chalked up to me spamming up the thread with walls of text. I have the nagging feeling that we're all fighting and flailing while Riker picks us off, one by one. Not seeing who Scum choose to kill, in a way, is a disadvantage to the Town.

The numbing of the whiskey has made me appreciate this game again and not hate it with every ounce of my being as I was for the last 24 hours...

I don't know who I am, I don't watch the fucking show. I'm a nerd, but not that type of nerd.

Why are you still here? Scummily hovering around to see the end of the day...

Remember when we used to call this type of post a "book report?"

 

Why am I pushing for Wesley's lynch but Forg isn't? Information booth? See, there is a question!

Where the fuck is @Lind Whisperer Picard? This stalling the vote and ducking out until the last minute is becoming a habit, and not a Town-looking habit.

[Lind Whisperer]

@Hinckley I felt horriblhom yesterday,m, gave myself a break from posting. Read occasionally, that was it.  Don't feel any better today, but not posting isn't really an option.

You want an early vote? Fine.

Vote: Wesley(Pandora)

He'a probably not guilty. I have no idea which of you two is less scummy, you've both been setting the other up all the last two days.

[Hinckley]

13 minutes ago, Lind Whisperer said:

@Hinckley I felt horriblhom yesterday,m, gave myself a break from posting. Read occasionally, that was it.  Don't feel any better today, but not posting isn't really an option.

13 minutes ago, Lind Whisperer said:

You want an early vote? Fine.

Vote: Wesley(Pandora)

He'a probably not guilty. I have no idea which of you two is less scummy, you've both been setting the other up all the last two days.

Early??? The day will end today unless other people are going to vote to extend it. "Oh I felt so horriblhom for voting Forg I couldn't even bring myself to post!" Real proactive Town move there. So, I'm your other option for being Scum? OK. Sure. Let's go with that.

Jesus fuck, you're all so Townie and Scummy at the same time.

Picard, you're rising to the top of the Scummy list with your himming and hawwing and melodrammatica and feeling horriblhom!

[Lind Whisperer]

On 3/3/2020 at 10:08 PM, Darkdragon said:

Is it possible scum-Deanna or scum-Wesley thought Worf was a more important player to take out of play? That is very possible. I think he was the most dangerous one of us left in the game. His ability to see through cleverly crafted defenses was terrifying to one of you, obviously.

? There haven't been any"clever" defenses. Just a bunch of people crafting overly long scenarios.

On 3/4/2020 at 6:08 AM, Pandora said:

So running with that thought (bearing in mind I'm not scum, and I honestly have had to check that I'm not scum!) maybe Beverly wasn't scum until the point that she was lynched? Like a Schrödinger's scum? Nobody started off scum, but whoever got lynched day one became scum one and there isn't another scum and we're actually playing against Q, not each other? I know how batshit this sounds, but you're going to lynch me anyway.

Anyway, if this is all just a simulation I'd like it to stop please. Computer - end holodeck programme Q's game please? Vote: Q (Bob) ?

A re-tread of Witch Hunt Mafia isn't as impossible as Hinckley seems to think. The original didn't even have as many reasona for it as this one does.

"If only the computer were to tell us that your vote didn't count...!"

(The rules mandate we must all vote.)

20 hours ago, Hinckley said:

We don't have much to work on, so I'll throw this info out there: I was stalking Riker and he was online, but not here, he was using Personal Messenger. He went idle and I saw Beverly had just come online so I stalked her too and she went immediately to Personal Messenger. This is circumstantial evidence of perhaps nothing, since we live in a multiverse here with lots of places and activities besides the bridge of this nerdy ship, but it did happen.

Scum can PM after death? Not in any game I've been on.

17 hours ago, Bob said:

This is not Witch Hunt Mafia Redux.

Vote Count:
Wesley Crusher / Pandora - 1 (Hinckley)

With 4 players left, a majority of 3 if required to lynch. About 27 hours remain in Day Five.

And there it is.

13 hours ago, Hinckley said:

Why am I the only one who has voted?

I'm still floored that Wesley might honestly think that Beverly wouldn't know she was Scum until she was lynched.

Becuase the townies can't make up their minds, and the scum doesn't want to stand out. As usual.

Witch Hunters didn't, why should it be any different here?

2 hours ago, Pandora said:

I don't see how Troi creates confusion - @Lind Whisperer Picard could you please expand on that? And saying everyone would have killed him (except me) is also... odd. Hmm.

She would, however, be able to handle a final day with Riker and Picard both suspecting each other

I forget. You, Fqorg and her were three-ring circus of chaos. Knocking one of you out would disrupt that.

And, no, in retrospect I added that you COULD ALSO kill me, becuase 'why would you kill the one person standing up for you'.

 

This is a true point.

The last day should have been Troi/Fworg/Riker.

 

No, Troi, I'm going to play how I play. I don't make hasty decisions becuase people are inpatient. I take too long, but I'm not hasty.

Unvote: Wesley(Pandota)

Vote: Picard(Lind Whisperer)

[Hinckley]

Just now, Lind Whisperer said:

Unvote: Wesley(Pandota)

Vote: Picard(Lind Whisperer)

Ugh...

[Lind Whisperer]

4 minutes ago, Hinckley said:

Early??? The day will end today unless other people are going to vote to extend it. "Oh I felt so horriblhom for voting Forg I couldn't even bring myself to post!" Real proactive Town move there. So, I'm your other option for being Scum? OK. Sure. Let's go with that.

Jesus megabluck, you're all so Townie and Scummy at the same time.

Picard, you're rising to the top of the Scummy list with your himming and hawwing and melodrammatica and feeling horriblhom!

Quote me where Isaid it had anything to do with Fworg. People have lives outside of Mafia.

 

Good! I l should really have been more scrutinized. Every game before, scum or town, I tried to be a Townie. No one was a better Townie than me!

Naturally, everyone assumed I was Scum.

So last game and this, I just gave up trying, and just played it as fast and loose as possible irregardless of "how it looked".

And, apparently, my "ludicriously scummy" is everyone's "probably townie."

[Hinckley]

How the hell does voting for yourself help anything??? You haven't even explained why you're doing it. Do you find yourself the Scummiest? Did you just re-check your role PM ( , and yes I roll my eyes with the utmost sanctimony) and discover that you were, in fact, Scum this whole time?

And no, PMing with your dead Scum buddy is strictly forbidden, but it's common for the remaining Scum to post their thoughts and the dead Scum to read them, although that typically takes place on a writeboard. But whatever, those are the trees, focus on the forest.

Just now, Lind Whisperer said:

Quote me where Isaid it had anything to do with Fworg. People have lives outside of Mafia.

It sounded like you were saying you felt horriblhom and I assumed it was about the game. Are you sick? Is there something else you feel horriblhom about that allowed you only to read and not post?

Just now, Lind Whisperer said:

Good! I l should really have been more scrutinized. Every game before, scum or town, I tried to be a Townie. No one was a better Townie than me!

Naturally, everyone assumed I was Scum.

So last game and this, I just gave up trying, and just played it as fast and loose as possible irregardless of "how it looked".

And, apparently, my "ludicriously scummy" is everyone's "probably townie."

[Lind Whisperer]

Just now, Hinckley said:

Are you sick? Is there something else you feel horriblhom about that allowed you only to read and not post?

I have some personal stuff going on.

I checked occasionally to see if there were any shocking revelations being posted. There weren't. End of story.

[Hinckley]

1 minute ago, Lind Whisperer said:

Good! I l should really have been more scrutinized. Every game before, scum or town, I tried to be a Townie. No one was a better Townie than me!

 

[Darkdragon]

NOTE: I see you just voted yourself Picard, I guess you figured i'd bring that up.  I'm not going to rewrite anything after hours of looking through all the days, I still find it scummy and nobody here agrees self-voting is a good idea.

NOTE 2: I have not yet read the other posts that were made in the past 5 mins.

---

Alright, so I've tried to include everything here.  I had suspicion before the new Picard showed up, but i don't think it's fair to bring that into play now since it's not the same person. Interestingly though, the suspicions are pretty much the same - which one might expect since the role didn't change. It's one of the outlying things that makes me feel pretty confident about Picard being the last scum.

Bullet points as asked, but explained more in detail below

• Parroting
• Double posting
• Posts that don't have any substance or useful reasoning/breakdowns
• Wasting time and space with long posts about pointless promises
• Calling things scummy and then doing the same scummy things
• Disappearing for half a game-day when called out about things

 

On 2/28/2020 at 8:13 PM, Lind Whisperer said:

I have noticed that, throughout this game, Troi has never recieved a great deal of scrutiny(Troinckley will disagree I'm sure) - or at least, not as much as might be expected. She's done hefty infodumps that have kept attention off her - almost as if she was relying on her "if I WAS scum" to take the pressure off....having trouble articulating my point, and I don't have much time to post. Basically, if she generously keeps applying the idea that she could be scum, people assume that that's a townie move, and forget her.

Very first post by new-Picard.  Saying that Deanna looks scummy for doing the exact same thing that Picard starts doing the next day. Yeah, scum sometimes will say "oh man, that makes you look so scummy" and then forget they said that and because they are scum they do the scummy thing later

On 2/28/2020 at 8:13 PM, Lind Whisperer said:

Wesley = 50/50. Leaning town/bad scum player.

This not an example of why I think Picard is scum, just to mention to @Pandora that the two accusations against you from Picard were from different Picards so a massive change in opinion shouldn't really be looked at in that particular case.

On 2/28/2020 at 8:13 PM, Lind Whisperer said:

The bandwagon on Wesley's a.bit too easy - probably aided by fan sentiment..

Parroting what I had said just a couple of posts previously, so that's not even a thought of his own.  In all other later days he has since waited until the end and then jumped onto each bandwagon.

On 3/1/2020 at 1:24 PM, Lind Whisperer said:

Vote: Wesley(Pandora)

Why? Because I keep my promises. And I promised Data I would cast a first vote. (Wesley beat me to Fworg).

Unvote: Wesley(Pandora)

If Wesley's scum, he's doing a master job of it. He keeps throwing the option of his own lynch out there. "Just get rid of Fworg when I come up town!"

Troinkley's repeating what I said on Day Three - long, energetic posts. But, he seems to have stopped, or slowed down, saying "If I was a scum...". Interesting.

Riker's post boils down primarily to fluff. 

Fworg: MIA.

Picard: I gave a run-down of my actions at the end of yesterday. Wesley posted further clarification.

Pretty much everyone on this list gives me red flags, including me (from an outside perspective).

His first post from Day Four, completely worthless post-for-the-sake-of-posting.  Which is strange because he's calling out basically everyone else for doing the same thing he is doing or is about to do (AGAIN). This was followed up with another post, I see double-posting as scummy and the reason is that it shows a person is so eager to show their surprise or whatever that they just post something to be out there fast and not actually thinking anything through at all. The post itself is that bizarre list of "if we were each scum this is who we'd kill" which I still find unhelpful and pointless in a game where we can easily prevent a scum kill by just voting as a team.

Then throughout the day he keeps talking about the promise to vote Wes out (even though he never really did because a vote/unvote a moment later is ludicrous).  Talks about how willing he is to self-vote even though self-voting is basically the only thing the rest of us agree is just a bad idea.  He never actually does self-vote of course, just says he's willing to do it

On 3/3/2020 at 1:30 PM, Lind Whisperer said:

I wasn't piggybacking off of Data, I've been offering to self-vote since Day Two.

This Picard wasn't even here during Day Two! If you want to claim you can't be scum because of something previous Picard said, then we can go back and look at all the other scummy things that one said too.

After a couple days of me trying to point out his scumminess, Picard just gets really quiet and jumps on bandwagons late in the game-day.  I'm guessing to not make any more missteps that allow more dissection of his posts.

 

 

[Lind Whisperer]

Vote: Extend day

Just now, Hinckley said:

"I wouldn't shut up about how hard I was trying to be town, so people assumed I was scum."

I was making a joke about myself.

[Hinckley]

2 minutes ago, Lind Whisperer said:

Good! I l should really have been more scrutinized. Every game before, scum or town, I tried to be a Townie. No one was a better Townie than me!

Naturally, everyone assumed I was Scum.

So last game and this, I just gave up trying, and just played it as fast and loose as possible irregardless of "how it looked".

And, apparently, my "ludicriously scummy" is everyone's "probably townie."

What is this bad guy monologuing at the end of a straight-to-streaming action movie speech? Is there a grenade in your hand and the pin is pulled but you're holding the trigger with your thumb? "I did it because you all said you loved the game! The game? The GAME???!! It was never a game to me."

How's my meme game?

Just now, Lind Whisperer said:

I have some personal stuff going on.

I checked occasionally to see if there were any shocking revelations being posted. There weren't. End of story.

What?! I'm sorry to hear that. Come play Mafia to relax and forget those things. Don't bring them in here with you.

Unless you need help. In that case, we're here for you...while we lynch you? Or don't. But we all you! Never forget that.

What the fuck is happening in this game?

12 minutes ago, Lind Whisperer said:

I checked occasionally to see if there were any shocking revelations being posted. There weren't. End of story.

So...the revelation that Forg was Town was...expected?

[Pandora]

I don't have much time right now, so I just want to quickly Vote: Extend the Day.

I'll be back later with more to say.

[Bob]

Vote Count:
Wesley Crusher / Pandora - 1 (Hinckley)
Jean-Luc Picard / Lind Whispherer  - 2 (Darkdragon, Lind Whisperer)

Extend the Day:
Yes - 2 (Lind Whisperer, Pandora)

A little over 4 hours remain in Day Five.

[Lind Whisperer]

9 minutes ago, Bob said:

Extend the Day:
Yes - 2 (Lind Whisperer, Pandora)

A little over 4 hours remain in Day Five.

Troi voted also, check top-of-page.

[Pandora]

6 hours ago, Hinckley said:

[General snarkiness]

If I said "Having been faced with a terrifying revelation that I'm probably here until the bitter end," you would normally pick up my sarcastic tone, but you'd rather accuse me of melodrama. Things have certainly gone in a weird direction with a few of the posts later today. 

I asked about your thoughts on Riker, thanks for requoting a lot of your unedited guff. Essentially you think Riker is scummy for not hammering the vote on Bev and being too generous in his assessment of her. You think he's flying under the radar (or busy)... and then the last quote is just rambling waffle. So not much of a case against Riker, but hedging your bets in case you need to make a case later. Hmmm.

5 hours ago, Hinckley said:

Jesus fuck, you're all so Townie and Scummy at the same time.

Yes, that's curious. It's almost like the rest of us are Town.

5 hours ago, Hinckley said:

Oh I felt so horriblhom

5 hours ago, Hinckley said:

himming and hawwing and melodrammatica and feeling horriblhom!

5 hours ago, Hinckley said:

It sounded like you were saying you felt horriblhom

5 hours ago, Hinckley said:

feel horriblhom about that allowed you only to read and not post?

Do you feel like you're on the home straight? This is like oinking, but not. I do not like this.

 

5 hours ago, Lind Whisperer said:

A re-tread of Witch Hunt Mafia isn't as impossible as Hinckley seems to think. The original didn't even have as many reasona for it as this one does.

The odd thing that struck me after-the-fact was that the super-duper paranoid, crazy theory conspiracist that is Deanna Troi dismissed all this completely out of hand, despite the fact that in any other given game under similar circumstances she'd be the one proposing stuff like this herself. There was no "that's interesting, I wonder" it was just completely "absolutely NO, you are insane and have lost your mind, of course Beverly knew she was scum". Which is the kind of opinion you would tend towards if you were actually scum. If you already knew Beverly knew she was scum, because you found out when Beverly found out and you knew exactly what the setup was.

5 hours ago, Lind Whisperer said:

I forget. You, Fqorg and her were three-ring circus of chaos. Knocking one of you out would disrupt that.

This was in response to me asking what made you say that Troi was creating confusion, and I see your point. It hasn't disrupted it completely because Deanna's see-sawed back into it.

5 hours ago, Lind Whisperer said:

Every game before, scum or town, I tried to be a Townie. No one was a better Townie than me!

Naturally, everyone assumed I was Scum.

So last game and this, I just gave up trying, and just played it as fast and loose as possible irregardless of "how it looked".

And, apparently, my "ludicriously scummy" is everyone's "probably townie."

It do be like that. I'm sure Riker would agree here too.

 

5 hours ago, Hinckley said:

And no, PMing with your dead Scum buddy is strictly forbidden, but it's common for the remaining Scum to post their thoughts and the dead Scum to read them, although that typically takes place on a writeboard. But whatever, those are the trees, focus on the forest.

I think we're into the territory of straight out taunting now. 

Vote: Deanna the Spanner Troi

You challenged Forg when he said he thought you should be voted out if I were Town (which, because I haven't said it for a while, I am) and you challenged me this morning with "bring it on" expecting a fight from me. When you posted the quote from Bob about the "silver tongued challenge" or whatever - that had been on your mind, clearly. You can taste it, can't you? You've been itching for a proper fight because you want to show how good you are and we've been disappointing you. It's almost like you think it's too easy and you want to drop a little bait. I don't know how much fight I have left in me and I don't know how much Riker or Picard are going to listen to me, because you've done a good job of wearing me down, but let's see how far we get.

4 hours ago, Hinckley said:

How's my meme game?

Scummy as fuck, as it happens.

 

But first, this:

4 hours ago, Darkdragon said:

I'm not going to rewrite anything after hours of looking through all the days, I still find it scummy and nobody here agrees self-voting is a good idea.

Alright, so I've tried to include everything here.  I had suspicion before the new Picard showed up, but i don't think it's fair to bring that into play now since it's not the same person. Interestingly though, the suspicions are pretty much the same - which one might expect since the role didn't change. It's one of the outlying things that makes me feel pretty confident about Picard being the last scum.

Bullet points as asked, but explained more in detail below

• Parroting
• Double posting
• Posts that don't have any substance or useful reasoning/breakdowns
• Wasting time and space with long posts about pointless promises
• Calling things scummy and then doing the same scummy things
• Disappearing for half a game-day when called out about things

I've added the emphasis because I really want to say thank you. I appreciate this, but I also respectfully disagree. I don't want you to feel like you've put effort in for me to just disagree out of hand. I can understand your points and how you reached your conclusions, but interestingly some of the things you have against Picard are also true for Troi, particularly the double posting and posts without substance. There's a considerable amount of waffle in Deanna's posts, much more than usual, and there's been much talk of her 'walls of text'. The more recent posts from Deanna have been like Data on a bad and scummy day. I remain unconvinced that Picard is scum, and I remain unconvinced that you are scum, and I am becoming increasingly convinced that Troi is scum.

Troi has played well, which is to be expected, she's a good player, some might even say legendary. There aren't going to be any concrete cases because this is all based on our actions, timing and opinions. 

On Day One, Forg votes first for Bev which is followed by Troi voting also for Bev, however couched with a "whoever you are" and without a good explanation - just "I agree with Forg". I've already mooted the idea that it wouldn't be unusual for a scum to be bussed day one, I thought Forg had done it but clearly not and it's not unreasonable to think Troi might do so once Forg had his sights set on Bev. I can attest first hand to the tenacious attitude of Mr Worf. A larger than usual proportion of Troi's posts have been really waffly, like ridiculously so, and there's been a fair amount of double posting and "what are you all waiting for" and "what's going on" which rather sounds like a worried lone scummo wondering if the shoe is about to drop. 

Looking at Day Four when we voted out Forg - what strikes me is the end of the day. Troi hammered the vote for Forg, and said she was 'floored' we were lynching him and then posted a bunch of suspicions about Riker. Troi didn't need to hammer Forg at all - what was the worst that could happen? That there was a scum kill that night and Forg would be killed (she'd already said it was clear Forg would have been their target)? It didn't matter either way, but wiping away a tear and starting to setting up some more suspicions is pretty damn scummy. If you believe someone's town you don't vote for them. Three out of four of us here have already demonstrated this a few times.

[Hinckley]

1 minute ago, Pandora said:

Essentially you think Riker is scummy for not hammering the vote on Bev and being too generous in his assessment of her.

No. For not assessing her, at all.

1 minute ago, Pandora said:

The odd thing that struck me after-the-fact was that the super-duper paranoid, crazy theory conspiracist that is Deanna Troi dismissed all this completely out of hand, despite the fact that in any other given game under similar circumstances she'd be the one proposing stuff like this herself. There was no "that's interesting, I wonder" it was just completely "absolutely NO, you are insane and have lost your mind, of course Beverly knew she was scum". Which is the kind of opinion you would tend towards if you were actually scum. If you already knew Beverly knew she was scum, because you found out when Beverly found out and you knew exactly what the setup was.

I do know the exact setup because the host told us what it was at the beginning of the game. It's an open setup just like the last one. There are no tricks. Suggesting there's some hidden mechanic is hidden when the host has blatantly told us there won't be. Two Scum, no Night Actions. Go. That's it. That's the one thing we can actually be sure of.

1 minute ago, Pandora said:

Vote: Deanna the Spanner Troi

Like a wrench? Are you calling me a tool?

1 minute ago, Pandora said:

You challenged Forg when he said he thought you should be voted out if I were Town (which, because I haven't said it for a while, I am) and you challenged me this morning with "bring it on" expecting a fight from me. When you posted the quote from Bob about the "silver tongued challenge" or whatever - that had been on your mind, clearly. You can taste it, can't you? You've been itching for a proper fight because you want to show how good you are and we've been disappointing you. It's almost like you think it's too easy and you want to drop a little bait. I don't know how much fight I have left in me and I don't know how much Riker or Picard are going to listen to me, because you've done a good job of wearing me down, but let's see how far we get.

Well, this is insulting. No. I'm Town. I'm only itching to get this game over with because it's frustrating the hell out of me. We all have different playing styles and all act differently when frustrated, so if I went to memes, I went to memes. And there was a lot of melodrama today with your "What if we're all in Terry Gilliam's Time Bandits and the evil has been in the toaster oven this whole time?" And then Picard with his "I was too upset to post" which I did think was referring to his reaction to Forg's lynch, not to make light now of what he's said is personal matters.

1 minute ago, Pandora said:

On Day One, Forg votes first for Bev which is followed by Troi voting also for Bev, however couched with a "whoever you are" and without a good explanation - just "I agree with Forg". I've already mooted the idea that it wouldn't be unusual for a scum to be bussed day one, I thought Forg had done it but clearly not and it's not unreasonable to think Troi might do so once Forg had his sights set on Bev. I can attest first hand to the tenacious attitude of Mr Worf. A larger than usual proportion of Troi's posts have been really waffly, like ridiculously so, and there's been a fair amount of double posting and "what are you all waiting for" and "what's going on" which rather sounds like a worried lone scummo wondering if the shoe is about to drop.

Except I immediately voted for Beverly after the Scummy post that was just a joke and only saw Forg's vote once I went back and read. And what shoe would drop that I, or the real Scum, would be waiting for? There are no PMs in this game. Where would this other shoe be a-brewing?

1 minute ago, Pandora said:

Looking at Day Four when we voted out Forg - what strikes me is the end of the day. Troi hammered the vote for Forg, and said she was 'floored' we were lynching him and then posted a bunch of suspicions about Riker. Troi didn't need to hammer Forg at all - what was the worst that could happen? That there was a scum kill that night and Forg would be killed (she'd already said it was clear Forg would have been their target)? It didn't matter either way, but wiping away a tear and starting to setting up some more suspicions is pretty damn scummy. If you believe someone's town you don't vote for them. Three out of four of us here have already demonstrated this a few times.

You want the Scum to have a night kill? I hammered Forg to keep that power away from them. And I thought Forg was a bad lynch, because he was a bad lynch. I'll admit it wasn't my strongest Town day but I was wondering why Picard was around so much and not voting. So, I called him out on that and he gave us a vote. I told him I'd rather vote you out, and by then, it was so late in the day that I found myself needing to look into everyone quickly as that was also the only time I had for the game as I've been incredibly busty busy. There were a couple of things that pinged me about Forg yesterday and I thought there might be something to your suspicions, but as the seconds ticked towards the end of the day, I really started feeling uneasy about it. I regret not voting for you yesterday. I was going to wait around today until I got a bug in my craw about how that strategy failed spectacularly yesterday. If you think it's no big deal for the Scum to have a kill then why bestow a sainthood on Data? Who, by the way is the meme-iest when he's Town. So, you're now suggesting I hammered Forg to get rid of a strong Townie, the one you were sure was the remaining Scum yesterday, and diabolically set up a case against Riker and then followed that up by insisting I leave my vote on you today?

I honestly still have no idea who the Scum is.

Wesley, @Pandora your behavior has been erratic for you this entire game. I've explained over and over why I think you're today's best lynch candidate. I'm beginning to see Picard I's point about your split personality. Day Two was "Oh geez, I really stuck my foot in it there. I understand if I get lynched," to a more fierce fight since then, defending yourself, to being sure that Forg was the last Scum, from a relatively Deanna seems Town, geez, what if the game has no Scum? let's vote for the host to let's lynch Diabolihinck. You crazy.

Riker, @Darkdragon has tunnel vision on Picard and has been flying under the radar. Way under the radar. Nobody's even looking at him. It's a great place for Scum to hide in this setup. A consistent case on Picard gives him plenty of reason to keep Wesley or I or both in the game so we keep going after each other, and that would be the most diabolical move of the game, or of many games if that's what he's doing and he pulls it off.

Picard, @Lind Whisperer has waited to vote late every day, had the odd moment of saluting Data if he was Town and promising to be the first vote on Welsey and then not–fuck the letter of the promise, you broke it. Is pulling this weird "I'm also a saint" thing today. It's like the best Town ever has been waiting from his first post to self-sacrifice. That was literally in his first post as himself, Picard II. Doesn't anybody see that as a potential gambit here? The last one who voted himself out was Town, maybe they'll think I'm Town and unvote me.

Ludicrously Scummy is the new Town. Well, we tried that one out on the Forg yesterday and his Towniness of delivering a case against the first Scum turned him up Town. Do you need another test of the theory, fine, go ahead and lynch me. I'm fine with that, but just know there will be a Day Six. I apologize for having no final words (I realize there's only one vote on me, anyway) to impart with who I think should be tomorrow's lynch candidate if you all decided to follow Cybill Wesley. Because, I just don't fucking know. It's been a long time since I've been lynched as Town without it being Kyle taking advantage of penalty votes. Could be fun. It will definitely be easier to watch the rest of the game from the writeboard. What I won't do is vote for myself though, because that sucks.

[Bob]

Vote Count:
Wesley Crusher / Pandora - 1 (Hinckley)
Jean-Luc Picard / Lind Whispherer  - 2 (Darkdragon, Lind Whisperer)
Deanna Troi / Hinckley - 1 (Pandora)

A majority of 3 is required to lynch. 

Extend the Day:
Yes - 3 (Lind Whisperer, Pandora, Hinckley)

Day Five is now extended an extra 24 hours. A little over 25 hours remain in Day Five.

[Darkdragon]

5 hours ago, Pandora said:

 I appreciate this, but I also respectfully disagree. I don't want you to feel like you've put effort in for me to just disagree out of hand. I can understand your points and how you reached your conclusions, but interestingly some of the things you have against Picard are also true for Troi

Not at all, I have been hoping someone would take a look at my reasoning for days and let me know if I seem to be onto something or am totally nuts. No ill will that you disagree, I think this is how we should be discussing instead of just fighting each other. Fighting has not been giving us the result we want so far, so why continue down that road? Though, fighting has been working very well for the last scum so there might be a reason s/he is contuing that way.

You make some really interesting points in regard to Deanna. I was chalking most of it up to the normal MO.  I may have been so convinced and tunnled on Picard that I let some obvious things slide right by. She does know your triggers and that can make it easy for her to keep the fighting going.

On the other hand, I found her defences tonight to be fairly sound. I can't change my vote right now,  but I am going to look back at the events you mentioned specifically and see if I agree with your assessment of things.  This split vote is the worst thing we can do right now. I will be back in about 10 hours.

4 hours ago, Hinckley said:

Doesn't anybody see that as a potential gambit here? The last one who voted himself out was Town, maybe they'll think I'm Town and unvote me. 

Umm... I said this exact thing already and it was dismissed by everyone or ignored, I'm not sure exactly what's going on here. You don't usually parrot someone else's ideas.

[Hinckley]

On 2/29/2020 at 4:05 PM, Lind Whisperer said:

If you're being serious, here, then voting for yourself is always, technically, an option.

 

 

On 2/29/2020 at 4:06 PM, Lind Whisperer said:

Not a good option, mind. But an option.

 

On 2/29/2020 at 4:08 PM, Lind Whisperer said:

@Fugazi @Darkdragon 

*salutes*

If you're town, I will personally place the first vote on Wesley...or possibly Fworg.

 

On 2/29/2020 at 4:27 PM, Lind Whisperer said:

Data said he'd rather be lynched than the scum get a night kill. You said you'd rather have a computer result than a night kill...I remembered earlier when I"d offered to potentially vote for myself, and suggested if Data was really serious, he could take that route - mostly assuming he wasn't, because his responses were so scummy.

He was serious.

These four posts took place at the end of Day Three. This isn't the only time Picard offers up an admittedly bad idea. I know I ping-ponged a lot as all of that happened, as well. But, Picard makes the suggestion, calls it a bad one and the lets it ride. Then is still around waiting to see the end of the day to offer a book report on what happened.

On 3/2/2020 at 12:16 PM, Lind Whisperer said:

My gut says a Troi/Wesley/Fworg standoff will end in a Town loss.

If it comes down to it, I don't have any problems being lynched, other than being tired of dying every game. Riker would provide more answers, at least for me, than mine(I just realised typing that out how obvious an observation it was), but I know I'm town, and I don't feel like wasting a day defending myself if Riker comes up as town.

Thinks Riker will provide the most answers, doesn't vote Riker.

On 3/3/2020 at 1:30 PM, Lind Whisperer said:

Troi and Wesley keep making the points I'd like to make before I make them. Repeating isn't helpful, and I thought Troi might be on to something with letting a scum kill. So I ran the numbers, trying to put myself in evey ones shoes.

 

Odd that two other players just keep making the same points you've made and you don't mention it until you're pressed.

On 3/3/2020 at 4:53 PM, Lind Whisperer said:

If you're really waiting on me...I guess Vote: Worf(Fugazi).

Not a fan, though. Not at all.

( I have maybe 10 more minutes before I'm AFK)

Set the lynch in the direction of Worf, claimed not to be a fan, then gave us ten minutes to do anything about it. In that time I mentioned I would rather go for Wesley instead and Picard did not change his vote.

All in all, none of this screams Scum but it's an odd game. The biggest takeaway for me is that Picard has never voiced a conviction and then followed through with a vote. One might say he's sheeping onto other's suspicions and riding it out.

Like I said, I can see all of you as Scum so I'm pretty much blind at this point, but going over all of both Picard's posts, it does seem he's waffling, but not as Wesley is saying that I am. I have done my best to follow my convictions with the glaring exception of waiting to see what Picard would do and then following the Forg vote. That was also sparked by Riker's suggestion that everyone just votes the way I do. But suggesting I'm waffling is not unfounded, but the waffles come from searching and trying to win this. I've waffled off of the person voting for me twice and now that makes me Scummy, OK. But the Picard waffling is generalized and without conviction and none of his votes have been decisive, he's even pre-apologized for yesterday's.

40 minutes ago, Darkdragon said:

Umm... I said this exact thing already and it was dismissed by everyone or ignored, I'm not sure exactly what's going on here. You don't usually parrot someone else's ideas.

Sorry, there's a lot going on today. I either thought it before I read you said it or forgot you had said it, not sure which. Either way, I independently came to that conclusion when it happened and expressed it in meme form instead of wording it the way I did above. It is not parroting, the idea originated in my own head from my own experience just as my vote did for Beverly.

Apologies to anyone who thinks I'm shouting, fighting or being sanctimonious. I am playing and posting in my style and mean no offense by it. None of these verbs or adjectives that have been attributed to my behavior are in my heart or intentions.

12 hours ago, Darkdragon said:

 

• Parroting
• Double posting
• Posts that don't have any substance or useful reasoning/breakdowns
• Wasting time and space with long posts about pointless promises
• Calling things scummy and then doing the same scummy things
• Disappearing for half a game-day when called out about things

Dear Lord, I even read this and then said the same thing in a roundabout way. I even read it again when Wesley accused me of doing the same thing. I must have some sort of mental disorder where I can only fully understand what someone is hypothesizing when I reach the conclusion on my own. I'm pre-apologizing for coming to the same conclusion you concisely expressed through yet another wall of text. I need a rest from this...

[Pandora]

12 hours ago, Hinckley said:

I do know the exact setup because the host told us what it was at the beginning of the game. It's an open setup just like the last one. There are no tricks. Suggesting there's some hidden mechanic is hidden when the host has blatantly told us there won't be. Two Scum, no Night Actions. Go. That's it. That's the one thing we can actually be sure of.

That has never stopped you from hypothesising crazy stuff before. You have never been sure of this, even when you've been hosting yourself!  

12 hours ago, Hinckley said:

Well, this is insulting.

I do not have any intention of insulting you (or anyone else for that matter). You have previously said you think that I think your ego is your greatest weakness, and I do believe it is true that part of what you enjoy about this game is demonstrating your ability to be incredibly Townie when scum and get away with it. I'll say again, you have looked as if you're gearing up for a fight and almost relishing the idea.

12 hours ago, Hinckley said:

Except I immediately voted for Beverly after the Scummy post that was just a joke and only saw Forg's vote once I went back and read.

The scummy post that was a joke? The scummy post that I said was a joke? And it's not like all that happened really quickly (and certainly not immediately), there were a few hours between the posts:

On 2/22/2020 at 1:07 AM, mostlytechnic said:

Glad to see people saw my deliberately bad logic.

On 2/22/2020 at 3:39 AM, Fugazi said:

Ok, this is all really fishy.

Unvote: red shirt (Hinckley)

Vote: blue shirt (mostlytechnic)

On 2/22/2020 at 5:23 AM, Hinckley said:

Congratulations to you as well for being Scummy when you don't need to be in a game where there are no Actions. This is a bright red Scum beacon.

Unvote: Geordi LaForge (Kotz)

Vote: Whoever the fuck, put your god damn name in your sig (mostlytechnic)

 

12 hours ago, Hinckley said:

There are no PMs in this game. Where would this other shoe be a-brewing?

I didn't say anything about shoes brewing anywhere, but in reference to what I did say about waiting for the other shoe to drop, I meant that you were looking nervous like you were just waiting for everyone to start accusing you, like you and your guilty conscience expected it.

12 hours ago, Hinckley said:

You want the Scum to have a night kill? I hammered Forg to keep that power away from them. And I thought Forg was a bad lynch, because he was a bad lynch.

No, I don't want the scum to choose who dies, which is a more accurate way of putting it. If you don't think someone is scummy, you don't vote for them. Especially not when you have already said your worst case scenario is the scum actually killing the person you're voting for. You cannot blame other people for your vote, you know as well as everyone else it is your only weapon in the fight against evil or whatever. You voted for Forg to die when you clearly and admittedly did not think he was scum to avoid.... Forg dying?

12 hours ago, Hinckley said:

I told him I'd rather vote you out, and by then, it was so late in the day that I found myself needing to look into everyone quickly as that was also the only time I had for the game as I've been incredibly busty busy. There were a couple of things that pinged me about Forg yesterday and I thought there might be something to your suspicions, but as the seconds ticked towards the end of the day, I really started feeling uneasy about it.

I feel like I've just asked you where the new stain on the carpet has come from.  

"Well, you see, I was talking to..... and then I was... and then just as I... "

12 hours ago, Hinckley said:

If you think it's no big deal for the Scum to have a kill then why bestow a sainthood on Data? Who, by the way is the meme-iest when he's Town. So, you're now suggesting I hammered Forg to get rid of a strong Townie, the one you were sure was the remaining Scum yesterday, and diabolically set up a case against Riker and then followed that up by insisting I leave my vote on you today?

You keep saying I bestowed sainthood on Data, like I even have that power.  I'm sorry to say for Data, and Data I mean you no offence with this, but there is a big difference between losing Town Data and losing Town Forg. Data potentially sacrificed himself for Forg. You sacrificed Forg for nothing when you didn't even think he was scum.

And you don't really care if I get voted out today or not. If we don't vote anyone out then you can kill who you like and start all over again tomorrow. You know the vote against me hasn't really gained any traction, so setting up the cases for Riker and Picard give you options. 

12 hours ago, Hinckley said:

I'm beginning to see Picard I's point about your split personality. Day Two was "Oh geez, I really stuck my foot in it there. I understand if I get lynched," to a more fierce fight since then, defending yourself, to being sure that Forg was the last Scum, from a relatively Deanna seems Town, geez, what if the game has no Scum? let's vote for the host to let's lynch Diabolihinck. You crazy.

Actually, that's pretty normal for me, and you know that. And I don't dispute that I might well be crazy, but that doesn't mean I'm wrong.

12 hours ago, Hinckley said:

Riker, has tunnel vision on Picard and has been flying under the radar. Way under the radar. Nobody's even looking at him. It's a great place for Scum to hide in this setup. A consistent case on Picard gives him plenty of reason to keep Wesley or I or both in the game so we keep going after each other, and that would be the most diabolical move of the game, or of many games if that's what he's doing and he pulls it off.

I have looked. I've looked several times and said so. I'm not finding anything scummy there. The most diabolical move of the game would be to bus your scum teammate early on Day One, I don't think there's much all that diabolical in having a reasonable suspicion of Picard. And why would Riker only want to keep one of us?

12 hours ago, Hinckley said:

Picard, @Lind Whisperer has waited to vote late every day, had the odd moment of saluting Data if he was Town and promising to be the first vote on Welsey and then not–fuck the letter of the promise, you broke it. Is pulling this weird "I'm also a saint" thing today. It's like the best Town ever has been waiting from his first post to self-sacrifice. That was literally in his first post as himself, Picard II. Doesn't anybody see that as a potential gambit here? The last one who voted himself out was Town, maybe they'll think I'm Town and unvote me.

I have considered the gambit, but the gambit didn't pay off for Data remember as he was actually lynched. It's not the fact that he wants to lynch himself that makes him look town anyway.

12 hours ago, Hinckley said:

Do you need another test of the theory, fine, go ahead and lynch me. I'm fine with that, but just know there will be a Day Six.

You whinged at me for saying stuff like this, and for other people voting for themself, and then you say this! 

12 hours ago, Hinckley said:

I apologize for having no final words (I realize there's only one vote on me, anyway) to impart with who I think should be tomorrow's lynch candidate if you all decided to follow Cybill Wesley. Because, I just don't fucking know. It's been a long time since I've been lynched as Town without it being Kyle taking advantage of penalty votes. Could be fun. It will definitely be easier to watch the rest of the game from the writeboard. What I won't do is vote for myself though, because that sucks.

Shall I start looking for a violin?  It's only me voting for you! And who is Cybill? I don't get the reference.  

 

7 hours ago, Darkdragon said:

You make some really interesting points in regard to Deanna. I was chalking most of it up to the normal MO.  I may have been so convinced and tunnled on Picard that I let some obvious things slide right by. She does know your triggers and that can make it easy for her to keep the fighting going.

She knows most people's triggers, I think it's fair to say.

7 hours ago, Darkdragon said:

I can't change my vote right now,  but I am going to look back at the events you mentioned specifically and see if I agree with your assessment of things.  This split vote is the worst thing we can do right now. I will be back in about 10 hours.

I'd be interested to hear what you think. I agree about the split vote to an extent, but I'm not going to vote for someone if I don't believe they are scum. I will keep re-reading too.

 

7 hours ago, Hinckley said:

All in all, none of this screams Scum but it's an odd game. The biggest takeaway for me is that Picard has never voiced a conviction and then followed through with a vote. One might say he's sheeping onto other's suspicions and riding it out.

I don't remember you doing that either. I could go and look, but this is a long post, sorry.

7 hours ago, Hinckley said:

but going over all of both Picard's posts, it does seem he's waffling, but not as Wesley is saying that I am. I have done my best to follow my convictions with the glaring exception of waiting to see what Picard would do and then following the Forg vote. That was also sparked by Riker's suggestion that everyone just votes the way I do. But suggesting I'm waffling is not unfounded, but the waffles come from searching and trying to win this. I've waffled off of the person voting for me twice and now that makes me Scummy, OK. But the Picard waffling is generalized and without conviction and none of his votes have been decisive, he's even pre-apologized for yesterday's.

You've flip-flopped over me many times. And you've just waffled about waffling!  An enjoyable thesis depicting how one form of waffling is superior to another!  

7 hours ago, Hinckley said:

Apologies to anyone who thinks I'm shouting, fighting or being sanctimonious. I am playing and posting in my style and mean no offense by it. None of these verbs or adjectives that have been attributed to my behavior are in my heart or intentions.

It is indeed a game, and I am also playing and posting in my style, just like you. But not as scummy.   I've not taken anything to heart, and I hope that you haven't either.  

7 hours ago, Hinckley said:

I must have some sort of mental disorder

Something we can agree on! Hurrah!   

[Hinckley]

2 minutes ago, Pandora said:

I'll say again, you have looked as if you're gearing up for a fight and almost relishing the idea.

 there were a few hours between the posts:

 

That would insinuate that I relish the idea of fighting, which I don't.

I'm not sure I can make it any clearer. Yes, there were a few hours between posts, but do you read the thread backwards? Because I read it in order. I read Beverly's post, hit quote, and voted. Then went back to Beverly's Scummy post, which you're still defending as a joke, and continued reading from there and only when I got to Forg's post realized he had also voted for Beverly.

[Darkdragon]

1 hour ago, Pandora said:

I'd be interested to hear what you think. I agree about the split vote to an extent, but I'm not going to vote for someone if I don't believe they are scum. I will keep re-reading too.

I have to say, going back over all these Deanna posts is a lot to take in.   It seems like you're right about the waffling, even on Day One.  She also seemed to have it out for you in mild ways even since the first day but definitely not mild since Day Three.  What you point out about the Worf lynch does bother me, Deanna saying it was a bad idea - saying he would be scum killed even if not lynched - then voting for it anyway.  It's not at all logical. There's a lot of talk about wanting the three of you (Wes,Troi,Worf) to work together but seeing it is impossible and yet she keeps mentioning it.  I think the lack of PMing with y'all has gotten to her.  Even though scum could PM with scum, she's only got herself in there now too since day one. Even though she's been after you almost every day, she suddenly has reasons for suspecting Picard and myself now that things are focusing on her.

The case against Deanna is getting the stronger as I read back through posts without my Picard blinders on.  I am starting to feel like her behavior is more telling compared to Picard, the scales are tiling in my eyes. I'm not ready to vote for Deanna, I'm honestly still trying to get back through the posts but it's taking a while - figured I'd give my thoughts so far up through mid Day Three. 

I can't at this point keep my vote on Picard because my belief that he is the last scum has been shaken. 

Unvote: Picard (Lind)

[Pandora]

2 hours ago, Hinckley said:

That would insinuate that I relish the idea of fighting, which I don't.

Even if you don't relish the idea, and I'm not sure that's not the case, you were still, as I actually said, gearing up for a fight:

On 3/4/2020 at 7:11 AM, Hinckley said:

Bring it on.

 

2 hours ago, Hinckley said:

I'm not sure I can make it any clearer.

I've only asked you once and it's not that hard.

2 hours ago, Hinckley said:

Yes, there were a few hours between posts, but do you read the thread backwards? Because I read it in order. I read Beverly's post, hit quote, and voted.

I read the thread like everyone else. I read everything that's been posted and then I reply. Most people do that, that's why and how they respond to multiple people, using multiquote. Something you do all the time, aside from, apparently, this one occasion for no clear reason. You would have seen there was another post, a few other posts in fact, and who knows they might have said something to change your mind or draw your attention to something even scummier. Most people, Town at least, don't just throw their vote around spontaneously and immediately on a post they've just seen without at least reading the rest of the thread.  

2 hours ago, Hinckley said:

Then went back to Beverly's Scummy post, which you're still defending as a joke, 

I'm not still defending it as a joke, I was pointing out that you, yourself had referred to it as a joke:

16 hours ago, Hinckley said:

Except I immediately voted for Beverly after the Scummy post that was just a joke and only saw Forg's vote once I went back and read.

Emphasis mine, of course.

 

2 hours ago, Hinckley said:

only when I got to Forg's post realized he had also voted for Beverly.

..... really?  

 

@Hinckley Deanna, can you pinpoint what it was about Beverley's post that made you drop everything and vote for her before reading the rest of the thread please?

[Hinckley]

25 minutes ago, Pandora said:

I read the thread like everyone else. I read everything that's been posted and then I reply. Most people do that,

I don't! Especially when I'm drunk, which I was.

I haven't even read your whole post yet. I think you can see the evidence in my posts that I jump on my reactions and then go back and read more.

26 minutes ago, Pandora said:

I read the thread like everyone else. I read everything that's been posted and then I reply. Most people do that, that's why and how they respond to multiple people, using multiquote. Something you do all the time, aside from, apparently, this one occasion for no clear reason. You would have seen there was another post, a few other posts in fact, and who knows they might have said something to change your mind or draw your attention to something even scummier. Most people, Town at least, don't just throw their vote around spontaneously and immediately on a post they've just seen without at least reading the rest of the thread.  

 

You're really going to try to make an accusation out of this. I. Voted. For. Beverly. Before. I. Saw. Forg. Had. Voted. For. Her. So. Your. Or. Ig. In. Al. Point. Is. Moot. Period.