Pirates Mafia III - Day Four

[Robin Tremblay]

Vote: Justin Reynaud

I wish I had kept my vote on him yesterday. 

[Daniel Lucas]

I don't see Justin telling us anything more useful except his suspicious claim and his questionable motivation of the roleclaiming PM sent to us. But also at this point he is just being forced into a more scummy narrative by Vincent in my opinion. Also Aiden's support for him in every debate is just very funny at this point. If I'd have not experienced this myself I'd say they know something we don't. Which is actually somewhat true considering the they are non-claims atm. Also we saw where this observation leads, so let's just leave it like that. 

If we lynch Justin this whole charade would just end at least.

As far as I'm concerned, I still want an answer to Vincent's supposed N1 failed action. Vincent, are you going to give us anything on that or you're just going to skip the question to continue your debate with scummo Justin?

[Justin Reynaud]

27 minutes ago, Vincent Denis said:

Weird, I just read through all of your posts from Day One and I didn't see you mention you finding me suspicious. You seem to go after Aiden, but I didn't get a clear idea that you were suspicious of me. Perhaps you can clarify? You've mentioned you have "every reason to think" I'm scum and all these pings you've felt from my posts but that's pretty unspecific. Since you've told me you were trying to figure out how to play on EB Mafia, here's some advice; It's easier for other people to follow your suspicion if you put it out there in a specific list, like this:

I read back through Day One and saw that my suspicions were not as clearly stated. But they were there. Let me refresh your memory:

On 4/8/2020 at 8:24 AM, Justin Reynaud said:

But, through all of the arguments what pings me the most is Aiden. I think both Daniel and Vincent are toxic right now. So to have anyone jump to their defense strikes me as odd.

On 4/7/2020 at 9:56 PM, Aiden Leon said:

And again right now I am in the offense of you and not as much the defense of Vincent. I'm pretty sure I've understood everything Vincent has explained to you so far, But the main factor that I'm focusing on right now is that no matter what he says to explain himself, or whatever anyone else that you've set your eyes on as says, you'll disagree with them and call them scum for it.

His explanations for why he is defending Vincent seem too simple for a townie looking to contribute. Granted, he may have just gotten caught up in the debate early on and is now looking to defend his choices. But it doesn't look that way to me.

I bolded my words to help make it more obvious for you. 

And here's the response to Day One from early on in Day Two:

On 4/11/2020 at 9:31 AM, Justin Reynaud said:

On 4/10/2020 at 5:33 PM, Vincent Denis said:

Justin, I asked you questions at the end of day 1 and I'd appreciate a response that goes beyond "I got people talking," please. 

Here is what you said at the end of day 1:

On 4/8/2020 at 1:52 PM, Vincent Denis said:

That's not what you originally said. You said you agreed with Andrew's reasoning and Andrew's reasoning was that the poke vote gets the person being voted for to start talking. I've already laid this point out for you and you ignored it. If you've been eating popcorn and supposedly reading what's happened between Daniel and me, why'd you ignore the points I made about your behavior when I voted for you?

My original and follow up reason for poke-voting was to get data, i.e. people talking so we could analyse what they said later. Here's the specific comment I made first:

On 4/5/2020 at 7:24 PM, Justin Reynaud said:

We dare not waste a chance to killer one of the intruders. And at the very least it allows us data to work off of in future days.

I don't understand what else you want. The point I made was talking is good. The point you are laying out is that I said getting people to talk is good. Where is the disagreement? All of this insistence on getting answers to questions I've already answered is a great scum play to make a townie look guilty.You, Vincent, ping very hard as scum to me.

So yeah, from the beginning I've been suspicious of you. 

You have conveniently ignored your own advice many times and stated why people ping you without listing bullet points. But to humor you, I will list some.

1. You insist on getting answers from players even when they have already answered. Want proof? Go read this again.
2. You have been inconsistent and hide it behind text walls. Proof is here.
3. Every time someone hints you might be scum you get ultra-defensive.
4. You have worked to control the narrative from Day One. Anyone who questions you is wrong. Anyone who states an argument you find disagreeable is wrong. Then you insist that they defend themselves against you ad nauseam. Obviously we are all trying to weed out the scum, but the way you have powered through each day seeking to control everything being said pings so loud as scum.

[Aiden Leon]

Just now, Daniel Lucas said:

Also Aiden's support for him in every debate is just very funny at this point.

I'll admit it is getting a little redundant, however in my defense in this particular scenario I'd already engaged Justin prior to joining in on their discussion.

2 hours ago, Aiden Leon said:

Haha. Are you saying you own your scummy behavior and weren't caught doing scummy things?

 

[Vincent Denis]

3 minutes ago, Aiden Leon said:

I'll admit it is getting a little redundant, however in my defense in this particular scenario I'd already engaged Justin prior to joining in on their discussion.

*Fwom fwomma fwom fwom*

No more redundant than Daniel defending Justin.

*Fwom fwomma fwom fwom fwom fwom fwom fwom fwom fwom fwom*

[Daniel Lucas]

Just now, Vincent Denis said:

No more redundant than Daniel defending Justin.

Are you not tired of this already? Are you lazy or intentionally provocative? Why don't you just answer the question and maybe that way I would have supported the Justin vote already.

Who did you target N1 and how can you explain that your action has failed? All the claimed blockers' target are confirmed for every night and we haven't got even a single other claim of being blocked since.

[Peter Lyon]

Here's the voting from the three blockees so far:

Justin is voting for Vincent.  That's not really a surprise after yesterday.  I don't think the "Daniel and Vincent are both toxic" comment suggests scumminess, as Justin is claiming.

Fabien is voting for Justin.  That's consistent with yesterday's voting.  He was strongly in favor of voting for Justin on Day 3, even saying that a role claim wouldn't make a difference to him.  To me, that suggests that Fabien and Justin are also not scummates.

Vincent is adamently going after Justin but isn't voting.  I find that a bit odd given that he did the same thing yesterday and led the initiative against Justin.  I don't think that Justin and Vincent are scummates.  That would be rather an odd approach if they're hoping to win this thing.  I agree with Daniel that it would be helpful to know more about Vincent's night 1 lack of success.

2 hours ago, Vincent Denis said:

I'm suspicious of Justin because:

1. The whole poke-vote thing I never believed.
2. While he claimed to have found Joshua suspicious, he didn't point out that Joshua was wrong about (whoever they were) pushing for a no-lynch.
3. He said he didn't think Joshua should be lynched on day two, then on day three said he'd been in favor of it.
4. "Didn't realize" he was the hammer vote on Joshua.
5. The PM with Daniel.
6. Admitting to targeting Jean on Night Two and being blocked last night, when there was no kill.
7. PMing me to claim his role after supposedly finding me the most suspicious and me detailing my suspicions about him every day of this game. Me having a conflict with Daniel throughout this game or not, I'm an odd chose to claim the role to.

I think all of this is valid, but #6 is giving me pause.  Why would a scum Justin openly claim to having targeted Jean on the night he was killed?  The best reason I can think of is to get information out of you, but it seems an odd way to do that.  Of course, #7 then makes it seem weirder because, it is weird.  If you're town, you don't role claim to someone you find highly suspicious.

[Vincent Denis]

Just now, Peter Lyon said:

I think all of this is valid, but #6 is giving me pause.  Why would a scum Justin openly claim to having targeted Jean on the night he was killed?  The best reason I can think of is to get information out of you, but it seems an odd way to do that.  Of course, #7 then makes it seem weirder because, it is weird.  If you're town, you don't role claim to someone you find highly suspicious.

*Fwom fwom*

Peter, I've explained this twice. Here it is a third time:

I said this yesterday–

On 4/18/2020 at 9:57 PM, Vincent Denis said:

Nothing I've learned at night has any implication towards anybody as scum yet, otherwise, I'd reveal it. Or, like Jean, I'd push for a specific lynch. Or I'd be more subtle than Jean since it got him killed.

Again, and for the third time, I think he was under the impression I had information on him as I was pushing for his lynch, but in a more subtle way than Jean. I'm surprised you have this question when I've posted it twice before this. I think Justin was trying to explain any result I might be working off of. Why else would he choose me who he supposedly thinks is the most scummy player? Why would he claim to me when I've found him scummy from the beginning? That post, I think is why. Trying to give himself cover for what I might've found out about him.

And I do plan to vote for Justin, but also as I've already stated, I don't find it helpful for the three suspects who were blocked last night to be throwing votes around. I think it's up to everybody else to discern what has happened so far and vote for themselves and I don't see how placing my vote would make a difference for anybody. Hell, after being suspicious of Justin since early on Day One, it might be nice to place the hammer on him. 

As far as my Night One result goes, if it implicated a fourth blocker I would've let someone know by now. I doubt someone with a huge brain and so much mafia experience like Daniel truly believes the only way to be unsuccessful would be to be blocked. Same goes for the rest of you. There were actually 2 examples of unsuccessful actions in Pirates II where the role wasn't blocked but they were unsuccessful, one of which was Daniel's role. So he really should know it's possible to be unsuccessful without being blocked.

*Fwom fwom fwom fwom*

[Daniel Lucas]

Just now, Vincent Denis said:

So he really should know it's possible to be unsuccessful without being blocked.

Bus driver or ninja.

I'm a bit surprised you don't even mention Joshua as the potential one who blocked you. That would have filled this gap right at the beginning but you seemingly did not give it an open thought.

[Vincent Denis]

31 minutes ago, Daniel Lucas said:

Bus driver or ninja.

I'm a bit surprised you don't even mention Joshua as the potential one who blocked you. That would have filled this gap right at the beginning but you seemingly did not give it an open thought.

*Fwom fwom fwom fwom fwom fwom fwom*

Not the bus driver. There were actually three unsuccessful actions that weren't blocked on the first night of Pirates II. Elijah tried to give Ansel an invention, but he was dead. Ethan tried to investigate Ansel, but he was dead. He should've investigated himself, shouldn't he have?? We'll talk to Bob about that later. And yes, you targeted a ninja.

Why would you be surprised that I didn't mention the possibility of Joshua being a blocker when I've said repeatedly I have no evidence of a fourth blocker? Why would I think of Joshua blocking when I have no indication that I was blocked? I have no evidence of a fourth blocker. Do you really need the same question answered every time you ask them? You're not even paying attention to the answers.  

*Fwom fwoooooooom, fwom fwom fwom fwom fwom fwom fwoooooooooooom, fwom fwom fwom fwom fwom fwom fwooooooooooooooom*  hate everything about you! *Fwom fwoooooom*

[Emmett Ware]

4 hours ago, Robin Tremblay said:

Vote: Justin Reynaud

I wish I had kept my vote on him yesterday. 

I'm sure Alex does as well. At the very least, we wouldn't have ended up any worse off.

3 hours ago, Daniel Lucas said:

If we lynch Justin this whole charade would just end at least.

As far as I'm concerned, I still want an answer to Vincent's supposed N1 failed action. Vincent, are you going to give us anything on that or you're just going to skip the question to continue your debate with scummo Justin?

Yet you don't vote for Justin, much like your defense of him throughout the days. Call him scummo, but don't vote for him and keep pounding for a roleclaim from Vincent. Brilliant as ever.

Vote: Justin Reynaud

[Andrew Laurent]

6 hours ago, Fabien Bellamy said:

If there's a serious attempt at lynching me, I will claim, and people will believe me. I mean, you're believing Justin and his super fishy claim! But Town will be the worse for it. So why don't we just skip all this and lynch Justin instead?

Frankly, I'm ok with lynching either one of you two. The killer being blocked is the simplest answer, and neither one of you screams townie enough to me to sway me away from lynching you. I'd like to lynch one of you today and probably the other tomorrow. 

5 hours ago, Aiden Leon said:

Just to fill in the board a little, I'll say that I haven't targeted anyone at all so far so you can just put down "no action" or whatever equivalent.

So either you're vanilla (and not willing to help save Alex) or you've got a limited shot role (like Robin claims to have) or you've got a passive role (bomb, etc) or you have something you are choosing not to use. The only thing I could possibly think of in the last category is vig, but surely a Vigilante would have enough suspicions to be taking out targets by N3.

Just now, Emmett Ware said:

I'm sure Alex does as well. At the very least, we wouldn't have ended up any worse off.

Yet you don't vote for Justin, much like your defense of him throughout the days. Call him scummo, but don't vote for him and keep pounding for a roleclaim from Vincent. Brilliant as ever.

Vote: Justin Reynaud

So you pile suspicion on Daniel, but then vote for Justin? That's odd... 

[Fred Dumont]

Just now, Andrew Laurent said:

So either you're vanilla (and not willing to help save Alex) or you've got a limited shot role (like Robin claims to have) or you've got a passive role (bomb, etc) or you have something you are choosing not to use. The only thing I could possibly think of in the last category is vig, but surely a Vigilante would have enough suspicions to be taking out targets by N3.

Regarding the vig, you'd think we would have one with as many blockers there seem to be in this game, unless we blocked one each night and someone is lying somewhere.

[Aiden Leon]

6 minutes ago, Andrew Laurent said:

but surely a Vigilante would have enough suspicions to be taking out targets by N3.

Oh yeah.  

[Emmett Ware]

6 minutes ago, Andrew Laurent said:

So you pile suspicion on Daniel, but then vote for Justin? That's odd... 

I've been questioning his motives for a while, as you could easily see in previous discussions. We should have lynched Justin yesterday and he helped redirect that, so I continue to question whether it is intentionally scummy or just being stupid. Pointing out how Daniel is suspicious, especially when it relates to someone even more suspicious isn't odd, to me.

[Aiden Leon]

5 minutes ago, Fred Dumont said:

Regarding the vig, you'd think we would have one with as many blockers there seem to be in this game

Maybe there is but they're like x-shot or something.

[Fred Dumont]

Just now, Aiden Leon said:

Maybe there is but they're like x-shot or something.

I could go for a shot of alcohol right now from this game.

Yet since we are here to find scum, I'm going to make my vote.

Vote: Justin Reynaud

I do believe if he's not scum, there's a good chance Vincent might. Both of them were blocked last night, no kills. As was Mr. Bellamy, which we all know. The only way to know for sure is lynch one, go about our actions in the night, and find out on the morrow.

[Andrew Laurent]

If I had to vote right now, I'd jump on the Justin bandwagon. I've said already I'm open to that lynch. 

You know what, why not. 

Vote: Justin Reynaud

He was blocked and I want to test that correlation between blocked people and no kill last night. I actually had a whole thing written about how I was not going to vote yet because we were already halfway to a lynch and I didn't want to encourage a quick wagon and the day's discussion to die out (I've seen that before). However, I don't think we're in any danger of players here not talking  Plus, it's possible that if we reach a lynch count, the day could end early and we move along. 

[Justin Reynaud]

2 hours ago, Peter Lyon said:

I think all of this is valid, but #6 is giving me pause.  Why would a scum Justin openly claim to having targeted Jean on the night he was killed?  The best reason I can think of is to get information out of you, but it seems an odd way to do that.  Of course, #7 then makes it seem weirder because, it is weird.  If you're town, you don't role claim to someone you find highly suspicious.

For the record, I role claimed to him because I thought I had a good chance of getting murdered last night. I wanted my info to be available to the town if I died. I gave it to Daniel and Vincent since they have low odds of being on the same team. Could I have picked someone else? Sure, but I wanted to minimize how many people I shared my role with that night and Daniel and Vincent seemed like the best odds.

Vincent and Aiden have been gunning for me since Day One. (Watch Vincent ask for an itemized list of examples )  If they are scum as I assume, then they knew if they kept the heat on me long enough that one of these days they could get the town to lynch me. It makes sense to lynch someone who was blocked, though of course I wish we were picking someone different. When I flip town, you all should lynch Vincent. If he turns up scum then you should immediately lynch Aiden. If there are scum left after that I would focus on Emmett or Robin since they have been caught possibly lying. If Vincent isn't scum, then you should immediately lynch Daniel.

I've been in the wrong place at the wrong time. But everything I've claimed has been verified. And really if I were scum, would the actions I've taken or the claims I've made make sense? I hope the town sees that it would be a better effort to lynch one of those who has been less open or less honest.

[Vincent Denis]

*Fwom fwom fwomma fwom fwom*

I've looked over my PM with Justin again and there are other concerning behaviors in it. One thing I realized, re-reading it, is that he had wanted his n00b-status to be a secret. Justin, if that was sincere, I apologize. I forgot that you had expressed that and I meant no disrespect by it. When you questioned what an experienced player would think of, it pinged me because of you saying you were a n00b, and I barreled forward with the suspicion without checking the PM for precise details. Truly sorry for that oversight.

I'd post the PMs but, obviously, there are things Justin doesn't want me revealing about what he said, and so I'll paraphrase what I find suspicious about it. 

1. As previously mentioned, I'm an odd choice for revealing the role to. One thing he says is that if I'm scum he'll be dead anyway because he keeps picking on me. I don't feel picked on. If anything, I feel it's the other way around. I've been picking apart everything he's said and done because I find his behavior so suspicious. 
2. He mentions if I'm town, he hopes he's found an ally, which rings hollow to me considering our interactions in public up to that point.
3. He claims to have targeted Jean on the night he was killed and, "of course found out he had been murdered." As I've mentioned three times now, I think he thought I had information that he had targeted Jean and was "claiming" to me to provide a valid reason for having done so.
4. This is where it gets pingier for me; He expresses that he's not sure he's using his role the right way but can't think of any other uses for it. He says he targeted Andrew because he had been grouped together with him and wanted to know if he was trustworthy. He claims to have targeted Jean because Jean "had been pinging [him] as scum."
5. I suggest that Voyeur is a weak watcher and that it should be used this way, as an example: "I would target people you expect the scum will target to see which roles they have. If we know of somebody targeting a specific person, we could also use your role to verify that they targeted who they said they did and what their role actually is. Let's say, for example, that I claimed rolecop and told you I was going to target Daniel. You could target Daniel to confirm he was targeted by 'rolecop.'"
6. He replies that he'd been targeting people who he thought were scum and if they were targeted by a town role, he'd believe they're town, which is nuts, IMHO. 
7. He says he's going to follow my strategy on targeting Daniel, assuming Daniel is town and hoping to catch scum targeting him. That wasn't the point of my strategy.
8. I make it clear to him that I'm not claiming rolecop and not planning on targeting Daniel.
9. Justin concludes by saying (because I asked for his opinion) Daniel's un-lynching of Alex was weird, but he thought his suspicion of Fred was reasonable and blames Daniel's behavior in this game on Mafia.gg

*Fwom fwom fwomma fwomma fwom fwom fwom fwomma fwomma fwomma fwom fwom fwooooooooooooooom*

[Vincent Denis]

*Fwom fwom*

Hammer! Sorry, didn't realize we were there.

Vote: Justin Raynaud

*Fwom fwom fwom fwom*  Every time you see me, the hammer's just so hype *Fwom fwom fwom fwom*

[Fred Dumont]

Just now, Vincent Denis said:

*Fwom fwom*

Hammer! Sorry, didn't realize we were there.

Vote: Justin Raynaud

*Fwom fwom fwom fwom*  Every time you see me, the hammer's just so hype *Fwom fwom fwom fwom*

STOP! Hammer time.

[Emmett Ware]

16 minutes ago, Vincent Denis said:

*Fwom fwom fwom fwom*  Every time you see me, the hammer's just so hype *Fwom fwom fwom fwom*

I've meant to say this before, but this is a prime example. I  the addition of lyrics to the tuba serenades, it really adds to the experience.

[Vincent Denis]

Just now, Emmett Ware said:

I've meant to say this before, but this is a prime example. I  the addition of lyrics to the tuba serenades, it really adds to the experience.

*Fwom fwom fwom fwom*

Every time there's no lyrics, it's just the Meow Mix song.

*Fwooooom, fwom fwom fwomma fwom fwom, fwom fwomma fwom fwom fwomma fwom fwom fwom fwom*  Hanging out the passenger side of my best friend's ride... (Sorry, this one got stuck in my head because of a meme someone posted on FB.  )

[Fred Dumont]

1 minute ago, Vincent Denis said:

*Fwom fwom fwom fwom*

Every time there's no lyrics, it's just the Meow Mix song.

*Fwooooom, fwom fwom fwomma fwom fwom, fwom fwomma fwom fwom fwomma fwom fwom fwom fwom*  Hanging out the passenger side of my best friend's ride... (Sorry, this one got stuck in my head because of a meme someone posted on FB.  )

... goddamnit... I prefer the pizza puppet version.