Deathleech

I would just love for Lego to do something new and unique. The Castle them for 2013 was really boring imo. It was about as standard as they come. There was nothing really new or exciting. While I doubt I would love a Chinese theme as that doesn't interest me a whole lot, I would take it any day over something like the 2013 Castle theme.

Well Lego did give us the Pirate Ship Ambush and it took up the $100 flagship spot in the second LotR wave. That was featured about as long as Minas Morgul. I wouldn't put it past Lego to give us some obscure set like this. We don't think it makes much sense, but Lego...? I am sure as long as it fit a certain price point and had enough action and unique characters they would do it. I could see them giving us the Witch King, a Fel Beast, and maybe even throw Gothmog in. That's two of the big name baddies right there.

It seems Lego likes to give us 2 polybags per wave, if they decide to do them at all (they skipped any for the second LotR wave). So far every time it has been a main character (Frodo, Gandalf, and now Legolas), and a soldier-type (Uruk-hai, Mirkwood Elf, Lake-town Guard). I don't think a dwarf soldier would be impossible to see, though a nice orc polybag would also be great. I really wish Lego would give us two soldier polys for the last Hobbit wave, but I am sure we will get a Bilbo or Thorin or some other character. That is, if they do them at all. If my second wave split theory is correct we might not see any polybags for the third Hobbit wave. The third LotR will have them though, explaining their absence in the second wave. If Lego had intended only two waves per theme and split them when it was announced there would be a third Hobbit film, it would of made sense they only had a set of polybags for each wave. Rather than make two more polybags to accomdate the split waves, they probably just gave them to us for one wave and left them out of the other.

I think that's just referring to it being built in America. Probably not something I would advertise though, considering they look like Megabloks gone bad. That is really saying something... I don't think several of K'NEX themes are even marketed at kids anyways. Kiss, Beatles, etc? Those seem more like they would be aimed at the adult crowd.

Yup, or they might be Sauron's black Uruk and not the Moronnan Orcs?

+1 to MstrOfPppts and +1 Robianco Both excellent transactions, trades!

Definitely Bag End. The build is fun and it looks amazing without needed to buy multiples (like Black Gates).

Well of course Lego couldn't just start making minifigure (action figure) packs with no brick built components. Even if no one else has the action figure license, I am sure WB would be pretty ticked if they found out Lego was making something without having bought the license to do so. I just imagine SW-type battle packs would be something Leg could get away with MUCH easier than they can with SW since no one seems to be holding the LotR action figure license (or really using it). I am guessing that Lego didn't pay a ton for the LotR license though, or WB is much stricter, so that is indeed what's prohibiting it. This brings up yet another question I would love to know the answer to. What kind of prices did Lego pay for the LotR license? It's not a current merchanding juggernaut like Star Wars and the movies are a decade old so I can't imagine they paid a ton. I am guessing it was kind of a two for one deal where they got the Hobbit license and the LotR was thrown in for a relatively small fee or negotiated in for a little more?

Ya, or even a bigger $100+ set. The Minecraft one isn't huge, but imagine sitting there and counting out almost 2000 pieces for something like the Ewok Village!

Ya, I am not sure what to do. He already left me positive feedback and I am debating on what to leave him. I mean it isn't a huge deal, I was able to find the pieces and include them in another order I placed but it still cost me an extra $5 or so. The part that gets me is he was almost annoyed/offended when I brought the issue up, despite me clearly saying I wanted the older version of the pieces. He made the comment "A Lego piece is a Lego piece, I don't see the difference". If he didn't have them or didn't know what I was talking about he should of cancelled the order or asked first! The fact he didn't respond back after the second e-mail and his overall attitude makes me want to give him a negative feedback, or neutral at best.

That wasn't my point though. Usually with a license it is granted for a specific type of toy or merchandise. When one company get's it they usually have some sort of exclusive contract so only they can produce that type of product. In Hasbro's case they have the action figure license for Star Wars and Lego has the construction license. This is one of the reasons why Lego said they couldn't do the Cussoo Dark Bucket project, because it was nothing but 100 minifigures and would breach their contract. Likewise Lego had to start gluing their magnetic figures to bases because of legal issues and them being to close to action figures. Of course there are plenty of other examples. The SW Battle Packs are about as much as Lego can get away with because they still have a fairly decent size brick built vehicle included with them. My question is, why does the LotR/Hobbit license seem more strict with the brick to minifigure ratio than SW is? Hasbro has an action figure license and obviously doesn't want Lego encroaching on it because it can hurt their sales. SW action figures are one of Hasbro's main products. No one has a LotR action figure license right now though? Maybe a company has the license to do statues or one or two highly detailed action figures, but neither are being used hardly at all. You would think LotR would be the license Lego could get away with more and throw together a $12.99 with a bunch of minifigures and a minimal build.

I dunno, I feel like even if we get the "dream" wave three (Witch Kings vs Eowyn, some sort of Gondor set/army builder, and a Balrog), people will still be a little upset Lego missed out on opportunities in wave two. I know I would of MUCH rather seen a Mumakil set with some Haradrim than the Pirate Ship Ambush. I would love a $20 Treebeard set with Merry, Pippin, and Grishnak, more Rohan Soldier variations, some Easterlings, a Golden Hall and Lothlorien set, etc. Of course I am realistic and I know we aren't going to get every last set we want. I do think giving us a Gondor set and a third wave would really help satiate fans appetite. Then we wouldn't feel like the line is only half complete. One other thing I forgot to mention in my long rant above is I don't understand the licensing agreement either. How can Star Wars have the battle packs they do when Hasbro is actively producing SW action figures and it's one of their main lines, yet Lego can't do the same type of BPs for LotR when there are literally no LotR action figures on the market and there haven't been for almost a decade? It just seems crazy. I know there has to be an explanation for all of this and I am sure there are a number of check boxes Lego needs to mark when making a set. I just wish we had some explanation from them. I love seeing the designer videos because they often drop us some hints about their thought and design process, I just wish we had more so we didn't have to speculate on pretty much everything.

You might get lucky and find someone trying to unload all their LotR collection for cheap, or a few random sets they bought that they no longer want. Other than that I don't think there is any really good solution for you, unfortunately The sets have been out for over a year and a half and out of production for almost 6 months so the prices are just going to keep going up from here on out.

The part that gets me is the seller didn't refund you immediately when he shipped your pieces out. He obviously had to notice he was short a few pieces but it's almost as if he hoped you wouldn't notice/care? Only after you brought it up did he refund you. To make it worse you already placed another order for the additional pieces you needed and now you will need to place a THIRD order for them since he made an error. Don't get me wrong, I know errors occur but as a seller you should notify the buyer immediately to try and reduce any issues. As is he didn't refund you immediately or even notify you so I think a neutral feedback is definitely warranted. On a similar note, how would you guys handle someone sending you the wrong version of a piece? I ordered some older pieces and specifically stated in the notes I wanted the older version but the seller sent me a mix of newer and older versions. I contacted him about it and at first he didn't even know there was a difference, despite them both being listed separately on BL. I sent him a picture and he never responded back. What should I do?

I wish the Lego Store let me build my own bags out of bricks! But breaking those Lego was just.. sad

Hmm, interesting. I have never heard of this working on smaller items at normal retailers. I know you can do it at some places like Best Buy when purchasing multiple big appliances, but you generally only save a few hundred dollars when you bundle them better than nothing though!). I guess it probably only works on clearance items? Stores are selling those for a loss and just want to get rid of them so they probably don't mind taking even less for that stuff.

See, this is the big issue I have with a lot of people's arguments defending Lego's decisions. They like to cherry pick things. I am not saying you are wrong (because you probably are right, Lego has to have a reason), and this isn't directed soley at you, but on one hand people claim "oh, Lego needs to put accurate characters into sets and they need to be child friendly!" But Lego doesn't do this all the time. This helm is a perfect example. They could of used the existing castle helm they have in a dark pearl gray color and it would have worked almost perfectly for the Morannon Orcs armor. Instead they use the Uruk-hai helm which is totally wrong and never seen once on a Morannon Orc? People say the sets have to be child friendly and have recognizable characters like Frodo, Gandalf, etc., but then we get sets like Black Gates which has the Mouth of Sauron who is ONLY seen in the Extended Edition of the films and it's during a pretty gory scene. And likewise we get Frodo and Gimli in Council of Elrond, but how much did including Arwen and Elrond hurt that sets sale with kids? I imagine Elrond is like old Obi-Won Kenobi and not exactly a highly sought after character among children. We all know how little boys feel about female characters. People say $12.99 army builders won't sell well with kids because they don't include main characters and parents won't want to buy multiples for their children. But parents WILL want to buy a $30 army builder set, and kids will want it for that one special Eomer character? Or Black Gates.. how many parents really bought two of that set like the back packaging suggests? What about the Mirkwood Elf Army where it's advertised you should buy multiples to hook the walls together? How many parents are going to dole out $60, $90, or more to get enough for their kids to connect them all? I think parents would be MUCH more likely to buy a couple $12.99 army builders and then get their kids a $20 set with most the name characters, like Darth Caedus suggests. And don't even get me started on the waste of prints. Seriously, Lego can give us three goblin prints and three undead prints all of which are only used in ONE set but they can't give us more than a SINGLE Mordor Orc print, which is used in four or more sets? I mean I am sure Lego has a reason for doing it, otherwise it is a HUGE oversight on their part (which wouldn't be impossible considering we get elf hair that doesn't even accommodate quivers and clothing colors that are all wrong ala Aragorn... ). But it's just like a giant WTF moment. It seems to defy all laws of common sense.

Ahh, maybe it was that one. That raises an even bigger question, if they have an existing helm that looks closer to the helms in the movie why on earth would they give us Uruk-hai armor? That Castle helm mold is obviously still in use, Lego just used it on some of the new dragon Castle minifigures.

I don't think so. The Fantasy Orc helmets seem to sit higher, covers less face in both the forehead and cheek area, and it doesn't have the line detail doing down the entire front of the forehead: vs I think Lego was going for this helm design, which admittedly looks similar to the Fantasty troll helm. As for the print it's hard to say since it's covered up by the chest piece. Regardless the point still stands, Lego was trying to differentiate the Black Gate/Pirate Ship Orcs from the other Mordor Orcs we got.

Nope, it was a brand new mold/head piece for the goblins unless it was used in some other theme I am unaware of. Ok, then look at the Black Gates. While I love the Mouth of Sauron minifigure, was he really necessary? That's a second wave set that used a new mold for a character not even seen in the theatrical versions of the film. It was also a very violent scene. This goes against everything Lego supposedly looks at when deciding what to make. Does he have mass appeal to kids help move the sets? No. Is the scene kid friendly? No. Why not use the Mouth slot to give us a new Gondor helm and a new Gondor print instead? It would kill two birds with one stone by making the set more multi purchase friendly too, like Lego advertises, since there would be less unique characters (though still too many to really justify buying more than one). I don't think that's the reason. The prelim pics of the wave two LotR sets showed the orcs with new prints and helms that looked similar the their armor in the film. This shows Lego was obviously considering it. I think Lego just got super lazy and said screw it, throw in the old Mordor Orc with a Uruk-hai helm and call it a day! Of course Lego skimps out on the henchmen in the Batman sets because they only appear in one, maybe two sets max. Even then the Joker, Two Face, etc. have their own set of henchmen with special prints. As for the current Castle theme, there was only one more good guy print than there was bad..? But there were tons more good guy soldiers offered in the sets (11 good soldiers vs 9 bad, not including uniques)? I don't have the sets, but from what I can tell there are three good soldier prints and two bad soldier prints. Both had a knight with a new printed armor. This of course excludes special characters like the king, princess, wizard, etc. EDIT: Here is the prelim pic I am talking about.

I would beg to differ. Obviously we don't have any specific sales figures, but if the battle packs sell as bad as you claim why does Lego continually churn out four of them in their waves? If they were bad sellers wouldn't Lego only offer one or two max in a wave?

It had plenty of unique characters without the goblins though. It was the only set with Ori, Dori, and Nori. Plus I am not saying Lego shouldn't of done a new print for the goblins, I am just saying three new torsos was a bit much. One would of been more than sufficient. Why do 3 torsos for figures that seemingly will never be used again when they could of made a new Mordor Orc print instead?

Right.. but there are literally no major toy companies doing LotR action figures right now. On the other hand Hasbro does Star Wars action figures and they are one of their main lines, yet Lego was able to work out a license deal to still make Star Wars army builders. I know not all companies are the same and I am sure Lego paid handsomely to have the rights to make those SW battle packs, but I just can't imagine it would of cost them a whole lot, or been much trouble to do the same for LotR. You would think considering how big a role the huge armies play in the movie, that would of been top of Lego's priorities when they struck their license agreement.

I just can't fathom why Lego does some of the stuff they do. "Hey guys, lets make a set based on Goblin Town and in it have 3 new torso prints for the goblins, a new goblin bald cap with ears, and a big Goblin King figure, all of which we will NEVER use again!" Meanwhile Mordor Orcs have one print that has been used in over four different sets. Couldn't Lego have given us a new Gondor helm mold and soldier print instead? Both could of been used in the Black Gates set and another Gondor army builder similar to UHA and MEA. Instead Lego wastes the new prints and molds on stuff they will never use again like they did in Goblin King Battle. They did the same in Pirate Ship Ambush, three new Undead prints on the undead and they will probably never be used again. Why not just do one undead print and then give us a new Mordor Orc print for Black Gates and Pirate Ship Ambush that is actually closer to what we see in the films? They would of been able to use it in at least 2-3 sets vs 1 set. And don't even get me started on Arwen or Mouth of Sauron. Whyile those are great characters for AFOLs most kids prolly have no interest in Arwen or never even have seen the EE. It's like Lego tries to throw us a bone but don't get it right. As for the Gandalf Arrives set, I remember not liking it even when it first came out. The ONLY thing I liked about it at the time was the exclusive Gandalf minifigure, but since then he has been in a number of other sets. Minifigures aside, I never really cared for the cart. If Lego really wanted to make it iconic why does it only seat one fig? They could of easily made it wider and fit two and used less than 10 pieces to do so. I know they aren't considered normal releases and are more promotional, but did we really need a Gandalf and Frodo polybag when we could get boith figures in Gandalf Arrives for a few bucks more? This would be yet ANOTHER way for Lego to please AFOLS, make more army builder polybags? I mean seriously, how many kids bought the Gandalf poly when he is in two other $13 sets? Lego kind of, sort of uses the polybags to our benefit like with the Lake-town Guard, Uruk-hai, and to a lesser extent Mirkwood Elf Guard, but they could REALLY please fans here. Imagine if Lego had even just done a Black Gates set and had one new Gondor Soldier in it. Then they could of given us a Gondor Soldier polybag and BAM! I bet you the complaining would be cut down by two thirds (the only people still complaining would be those who don't have access to the polybag, and rightfully so). It just seems like Lego misses the boat so much and there really is no explanation. I don't think ANYONE was clamoring for a Mouth of Sauron figure and yet Lego gave it to us. While it's nice it just leaves us AFOLs thinking wtf? We would of MUCH rather had a Gondor Soldier instead.

What does it matter if parents only buy an army builder their kids one time? That's as much as anybody (kids or AFOLS alike) are going to buy the current Gandalf Arrives, Riddles for the Ring, or Wizard Battle. The way I see it, even if Lego does battle packs and kids only buy one that's still just as profitable as their current $10-13 offerings, is it not? One $12.99 battle pack sale brings in the same profit as a Gandalf Arrives or Wizard Battle? Yet there is the potential to sell dozens upon dozens of battle packs to AFOLs, and even two or three to kids which is not there with the current smallest sets. I think the only real argument is if kids will buy ANY army builders if they don't have a special character? That's debatable. Like I said before, the Star Wars line doesn't even offer any small sets anymore that AREN'T army builders. Every $10-15 set is an army builder (except the weird ones like the planets or new micro ship builds), and they have 4 army builders in a wave. Now I know Star Wars isn't the same as LotR, but surely LotR would be just as successful? I would love to know Lego's reasoning. Is it sales? Is it licensing agreement? What? I have a hard time believing they can't do a BP like Star Wars considering no one really makes LotR action figures any more, and Bridge is barely making any Hobbit ones now.