Fabulous Fox

Well I'll be dammed. Props to Lego, then! (I will admit, I did not look into the gearbox far enough myself before saying it was cheating). Now...what of these past two gearboxes are intentional accuracies and what are accidental lucky design choices?

The question is which realistic do we want 🤣 I think multipliers are in of themselves more cheating than simply including more gear meshes than necessary. I wonder why the same designer decided to add multipliers when he didn’t in the car before. I get that it’s a bigger transmission, but with all the new shifter pieces you might as well do it right.

Well that really sucks. Looks like the P1 is the more accurate supercar gearbox after all. Very glad I got that instead of this one. Then, the only thing this one has over it is maybe less friction and a more stable shifter? The P1 transmission had friction but not anything bad like the supercars before it.

Does the transmission actually only engage one clutch for each gear like the P1 or does it cheat and use a multiplier like the older supercars? I see in New Elementary's review that multiple clutches are engaged at a time in some gears.

Good art requires dedication

https://www.instagram.com/p/DaYFBWiEveP/?img_index=2&igsh=dHA0cWJmZ2R1d2dz This is perhaps one of the coolest marketing moves Lego has made in a long time.

“Just because we can.” Yes I’m glad you said this because this is what I’m getting at - what features do we include just because we can that DONmT make any difference and what are the ones we AREN’T including that would ACTUALLY make a difference. Or what features do people say we should include but don’t actually make a difference? At what point of adding complexity can Lego parts no longer achieve the same geometry of the real car suspension? I wonder if this is why Lego doesn’t do more? Have they done this analysis? I wonder how much the new wishbones in the last two super cars have done to make things more realistic? Maybe this was the biggest “80%” thing Lego could have done to make the suspension more realistic?

Precisely because I looked at the wheels carefully after implementing it with the stock limiters and didn’t notice the inner wheel moving. Even if it was, it had to be so small as to not make a meaningful difference?

Yes, I’ve built his pump up mods for most supercars I’ve had, but (just personally) I do not like HOG for anything in these types of supercars so I just made the drivetrain friction adjustments. And even then, it could still be vastly improved (I’m too lazy to come up with stuff myself atm). @Didumos69 Made a supercar a while ago with a 4-speed transmission and it was the most well-reinforced thing I’ve ever built, along with making sure the gearbox was most efficient. Why don’t people follow these strict reinforcement architectures as often as they should? Perhaps all this deserves a new topic? In fact, the latest pimp up P1 mod made the front wheels steer too far as to rub up against the body, and at that point is the Ackerman even doing anything? And if the steering had the same limiters in the stock model, I’m really skeptical if Ackerman would make a difference. The proposed limiters stopping from shifting from 1 to 7 and vise versa also isn’t realistic since the real car can shift to any gear at any time unless it’s going too fast. These are the things I’m trying to figure out, and hoping people with more real world knowledge could provide insight. To truly make a Technical model seems far more than we think it is. I believe we have so much more to go and Lego has so much opportunity for innovation. Also, in my view, it should be as close to the real thing, even if that means having to awkwardly turn the steering wheel. If it was up to me, I would even cover up the bottom and DNR selector tunnel (like the Porsche mostly did). I like the feeling that stuff is going on inside but I can’t see it, and if I want to, I can simply take the whole body off. I also hate the flappy paddles and wish Lego would more realistic shifters directly behind the steering wheel.

I do not know exactly where to ask this but here seems extremely relevant since this is the latest Lego Technic supercar. In supercars like this, with Lego at this scale, what kinds of things actually make a functional difference that usually aren’t included in these sets? From a more engineering and technical standpoint. For example, Ackerman, caster/camber angles, certain suspension geometry, gearbox architecture (which seems like this one is the closest we’ve been? The P1 also had one engagement for each gear unlike the multipliers that came before it), I know adjustable suspension would make a difference obviously, pneumatic/dampened assisted doors or suspension, etc. In other words, what type of innovation hasn’t been done yet to make these models more accurate, but also things that actually make a difference? The Z linkage in this one would be an example that wouldn’t likely do anything. I don’t know anything about real car parts or geometry just the basics, so I would be very interested to hear people say what Lego is missing out on. I know @nicjasnohas made many videos making more realistic functions for example.

Finished mine in a total of 6.4 hours while deliberately not going too fast. Sariel’s review has his at 7 hours…perhaps I broke a new record? 😉

Yup, exactly why I bought the McLauren this last weekend on double VIP week despite this just coming out 🤣 I also get a lot of Rebrickable alternative builds.

I just bought and built this set for the first time after realizing I don’t like the look of the new super car 🤣 I have no idea who will see this years later, but even after building everything correctly and checking alignments, the shifter only works 50% of the time. I don’t think the designer braced axles very well in this car, and the extremely low gear ratios are the only thing saving the drivetrain from not bunching up (like on previous supercars). Variances in parts will cause things to not work properly if nothing is absolutely perfect. I intend to implement @jb70 ‘s mods, only for the drivetrain and not the HOG or gear indicator. I’m wondering how many others experienced very poor shifting on the original model, and what it’s like all these years later? Shifting is basically unusable while a motor is running the drivetrain, too. Which is really a shame because I can’t see anything while pushing the car along due to the slow speeds. Also, running the engine instead of the wheels results in friction so high nothing can be moved, but isn’t this the realistic way to have things, rather than have the ratios be workable from the wheels? On a positive note, the very low gear ratios make the drivetrain run smoothly, except you can barely see any movement without a motor, so what’s the point?

Detailed gearbox mathematical review and visuals? Even a drivetrain roll test? This is a new bar for Technic technical reviews imo. Yes please 😍

I guess I meant discounted, as in places where you can buy it for less than retail after it’s been out a while (besides eBay and Bricklink). Would you mind filling me in a bit more on what that legwork entail? Asking for a friend 😁

Which sites do these sets usually go on sale after they’ve been out for a while? I’m based in the U.S. and it seems like they’re always some EU site I don’t know about? I really appreciate the design and gearbox innovation that went into this set (we’ve needed a more realistic gearbox for so long now), but after watching some of the review videos, due to personal preference, I simply am not very excited about this car in general, especially the color. Just not my thing. I’ve always loved the look of the previous McLauren and skipped out on it. I think it’s time to give it a buy AND build all kinds of alternate builds from Rebrickable (of which will take at least a few months for some to be made for this one). I hate that I’m not supporting the new innovation with my wallet, but oh well, what I like is that I like I guess right? Am I crazy? For wanting to buy a set just on the basis of there will be more alternative builds in the immediate future 🤣

Yes, I’ve even built some of his mods back in the day. I was referring to real life cars.

Yea, it’s systems problem. What I was really trying to say beneath all this is that I wish the entire drivetrain was super realistic and had all the exact geometries of real life. At that point though, it’s no longer Lego It’s finding the right balance and I think they did here…besides Ackermann and maybe the steering pivot point not being centered exactly. Do all cars even have Ackermann?

Thanks for the explanation! My first thought would be to say the designer could have designed the whole area to accommodate an equal pivot point for the Z-linkage without it interrupting any other parts. My second thought would be that they could have also designed another specialized part/parts for the Z linkage system, just like they did with the springs, specifically made to actually function with the rest of the suspension in a way that’s realistic but scaled down. Again it seems like the practicality of this would be very minuscule in what it actually does functionality-wise. I guess my next question is what could be done to measure exactly how effective a theoretical proper Z-linkage would be in Lego?

I haven’t gotten around to watching the video yet, but I checked out your timestamp. The Z-linkage is what actually got me really excited for this set lol! It baffles me how they would include the whole thing but not make it functional. But like you said it’s an easy fix to make it functional. Though I wonder what good that would actually do.

Indeed Interesting, what makes the Z linkage just for show?

Anyone have any insight on what I asked about suspension and steering designs actually being practical in a Lego model and at that scale?

Well it seems after all these years we finally got a Technic Supercar that's pushed the needle a bit more. Not perfect, but this one packs more new features than many of its predecessors. We have yet to see how the functions perform, though. We got: - More advanced suspension (triplex, plus the Z linkage) with new suspension parts. - Most advanced transmission with new gears and parts. - Complex door linkage system. I absolutely hate that they still use the ugly paddle shifters, though and the interior seems unfinished. I unironically liked the ones used in the Porsche, despite them not always working. What I'm really curious about is: 1. How advanced is this suspension and steering setup, really? What more could they have added that they did not? (Ackerman, caster, and camber angles, etc.) It's definitely more than we got before, but does the triplex setup and Z linkage actually affect things or is it just for show? Do the new "A-frame" suspension parts even do anything at this scale? I do not know enough about these cars to know if they even have these things or how big a difference it would make at this scale. What's always annoyed me was the lack of attention to complexity in previous suspensions, so this car seems like a step up, finally. I also hope the steering is more practical to use. 2. How will the drivetrain perform friction-wise? Also, how are the shifters? In the Sian for example, I encountered a lot of friction in certain gears, in certain directions, which sometimes ground things to a halt. I came to the conclusion that the drivetrain was designed/braced poorly and the slight difference in part tolerances all bound up throughout the system, making some people's models perform well and others, not. I hope this one is designed more for reducing friction. This will probably be a day one purchase either way, I love to test out new functions.

Yes, I was originally going to use the latest @KEvron style knife-edge, but wanted to keep the looks a certain way. The original Seiko clock had a rolling pivot "bar" and I wanted this one to look just the same. The Seiko clock will move on its own (just a little) for about a minute then stop. I may try it though, just for curiosity's sake. If it had some hidden magnetic function then perhaps I would use a better suspension.

After becoming obsessed with unique vintage Seiko desk clocks from the 1980s or so, I decided to make a Lego after one of them! This is sort of an "art deco" vibe, mixed in with modern. This particular one uses a rolling low-friction pivot point, which creates a very unique movement when touched, and can move on it's own for at least a minute. The clock side of the balance acts as a sort of "gimbal" as well. Both sides have to be exactly balanced in order to work, and I mean EXACTLY. A single stud will completely throw the balance off. The clock is simply a quartz "insert" that I found, which perfectly fits into the round black piece with friction just like a Lego (the only one I found which would fit that exact piece). Otherwise, the sculpture would have to be significantly bigger to accommodate a fully made Lego clock and ruin the intended desk proportions (which, may be a good idea for another creation). In the future, I would like to swap out the clock face for one that matches the art deco vibe of the whole thing better. Some of the unique Seiko clock sculptures had hidden magnets powered by battery, which would make the clock move in different ways, but this one simply moves when touched with no hidden magnets. More images, a video, and instructions can be found on its Rebrickable listing: https://rebrickable.com/mocs/MOC-253210/FabulousFox/balance-and-fulcrum-table-clock/#details