Sandy

I think you misunderstood my suggestion. It's not up to the QM to decide whether the enemy gets a Free Hit or not, it's down to mathemathics. An untargetted enemy will get a Free Hit on the first hero in the order of action that it can cause damage to. If the enemy cannot cause damage with a Free Hit to any of the heroes, it will instead do nothing. The Free Hit will be directed to the first hero in the order of action as long as it's able to deal even 1 point of damage. That way the entire party cannot hide behind one hero with high SP anymore. Of course Aura will still continue to draw all attacks, but if the Aura-user cannot be damaged, the enemy will refuse to attack.

Umm, that's what I said.

Ellaria cheers her troops as the enemy patrol falls. "Great work, everyone! Let us continue southwards, there seems to be more enemies there."

I'M A GENIUS! Well, not really, but I think I found a simple solution to fix the loophole without making anyone feel treated unfairly. What if we give enemies a dash of A.I., so that they will not use Free Hits on heroes that they cannot damage? If a Level 50 enemy is faced with a hero who has over 25 SP and stands in the back row, the enemy will deem the hero futile to attack, and instead targets the next hero in order with the Free Hit. Then, when only this impossibly defensive hero is left, the enemy will simply do nothing, forcing a stale-mate. This will prevent the enemies from bashing their heads repeatedly and automatically on an undefeatable barrier, and force at least one hero to take a chance and attack the enemy directly. So, am I a genius or what?

It's not really down to the enemies - they already work according to the basic game mechanics (although what BD is saying about a different balance between power, defense and health could be in order). It's the strategy of combining overly high SP and standing in the back row with automatic damage such as the Counterstrike Gloves or poisoning that's the problem here. The wait-out strategy (no matter how it's done) has never been an intentional part of the mechanics, it's a loophole. I don't want players to be able to just wait around for their enemies to die without even a slight chance of getting hurt in the process. That's not how this game is supposed to be played. You're right, the problem is not solely based on positive effects, but they certainly add to the problem. It's impossible to plan and balance enemies taking into account every possible effect that the player might have. In Quest#75 it was easier since I gave the party all effects from the get-go, knowing that they were at their absolute maximum power already. In normal circumstances stacking all the effects onto a hero doesn't just give them an edge to the battle, it allows an unrelented massacre. If the effects only worked for a limited time, the battle would be less one-sided and more susceptible to dramatic changes - making them that much more challenging. But perhaps I need to think of another way to fix the loophole.

I think that's an unfair thing to say. Must every boss really have some sort of SP-piercing, counterstrike-nullifying ability just so the party would fight them straight-on and not exploit a loophole in the mechanics? Again, I'm painstakingly aware that it's my fault that there's a loophole in the mechanics in the first place (even though I didn't invent the CS Gloves, I did approve of them), but now you guys are telling me all I can do to fix said loophole is to add an incessant amount of extra abilities to each enemy just to avoid the loophole to be abused? Creating enemies and balancing them to suit the quest party is already hard as it is, so I'm not okay with the thought of having to give them all skills that don't fit the basic mechanics (like making them pierce SP or twisting the way the Free Hits work etc.). Making positive effects last a limited time would have been a simple, QM-friendly solution. It doesn't even have to be 10 rounds, it could be 20 or even 30 rounds, just as long as there's no way for the heroes to win just by autorolling.

I think those who have not hosted a quest fail to understand how QMs cannot possibly prepare for every possible strategy the party thinks up. The basic mechanics should not allow situations where the party can kill any enemy no matter what their strength is without even a chance of getting hurt in the process. That 's what I'm trying to fix here. Simply pouring these "passive specials" that prevent the abuse of that kind of tactics onto boss enemies is counter-intuitive, because the tricks shouldn't be able to use on any enemy. Having more enemies that pierce SP isn't the solution either, because what would be the point of having SP in the first place? Having Free Hits ignore SP is illogical as well. One possible solution could be to give more control of the enemies to the QM, so that the Free Hits won't be automatically directed to the person acting first. But I don't think many people would be into the whole "party vs. QM" situation...

Ellaria's troops repeat their strike.

The Artisan's skills are only tied to the tools given by Gnomeo. Tools created by other QMs in quests do not count.

My head hurts a bit from trying to get behind that logic, but I guess I can accept it.

I have decided to continue with the planning of the "expert basic job classes". Here's what I've got in mind so far: VETERAN JOB CLASSES: At Level 40, a hero can choose to train to become an expert in his or her basic job class, following the footsteps of the original Veterans of Heroica. It is required that they have successfully completed at least 10 quests or purchased the right to these classes in the Fields of Glory for 40 Glory Points. Barbarian Chieftain – These eminent warriors lead their comrades like a unified tribe, just as the Walking Mountain did in his days. ~ High attack ~ Counter ~ Can cause inspired-effect High Cleric – These marvellous healers defy even death itself, like the Miracleworker used to do. ~ Can "Arc Heal" all party members ~ Can revive fallen allies Guardian Knight – These stalwart sentinels will not let anything pass them, in the name of the Golden Dragon. ~ High defense ~ Can use Aura ~ Can deflect more effectively Archmage – These supreme spellcasters can bend the forces of nature to their will, just like the Doomsayer could. ~ Can cast "Arc Spells" to all enemies ~ Can drain ether from enemies Sylvan Ranger – These silent hunters deeply respect their environment, following the teachings of the Fey One. ~ Can attack multiple enemies from back row ~ Can control some enemies ~ Uses flora & fauna in battle some way Rogue Thief – These stealthy robbers leave their victims hanging out dry, just as Lady Luck was wont to do. ~ Can steal gold and drops ~ Can hide ~ Can inflict negative effects

Fabian shakes his head in confusion. "Pray tell me, Mr. Hunky Warden, how do you think this scroll affects your hat? It doesn't have a negative effect in it. It's a waste of gold trying to imbue it, if you ask me."

Why? Negative effects can be removed with a remedy, positive effects cannot. The heroes already have an upper hand over the enemies in that. Besides, the only effects that last for the entire duration of the battle are petrified, afraid, enraged, slowed and jinxed. But it's not a big problem making all of those last a maximum of 10 rounds (except that it would change petrified into a non-detrimental effect), if you guys feel strongly about it.

I have never (at least on purpose) created an enemy that couldn't be defeated without resorting to the wait-out strategy. I admit that it's a flaw in game design that such a strategy even exists, but that's why I'm trying to find a solution to it.

You forget that enemies don't use remedies, so there's no balance issue with negative effects.

Care to elaborate on that? I can't take your opinion into account if you don't give me reasons for it.

QM Note: It's 30 damage each round. Wouldn't it be a lame-megablocks special otherwise?

RULE CHANGE SUGGESTION TIME! I've been thinking about some balance issues that the positive effects can cause (especially when paired with Aura or Counterstrike Gloves), so how would it sound if the positive effects that last for one battle would be restricted to lasting a maximum of 10 rounds of battle? I already used the mechanic in the continuous battle of Quest#50, and I thought it worked quite well to keep the challenge then. Yes, the elemental gem can be taken out of it, but why would that affect any other properties the shield has?

Ellaria assesses the situation. "Hmm, it seems the spearpogs have a high defense. Arthur, please move your troops next to me so we can flank the enemies." Then she orders her troops to attack the spearmen (A).

It's up to the QM to decide.

QM Note: The Crystal Mace's WP has been dropped down to 5.

You thought I was being serious about those statements?! I did use the "tongue" smiley, didn't I? It seems that is the best course of action (although I think I'll only drop it to WP:5, since it cannot be upgraded otherwise). Sorry, Fielders!

OoC: I didn't say anything about attacking, I just engaged in the battle, since my troops were next to the enemy.

Yes, Nurture both heals and removes the effect at the same time, so of course you would be healed according to your actual maximum health in that case.

Oh, it seems Elphaba has suddenly lost her entire stock of gems...