Lord of the Rings Ongoing Discussion

[Black Falcon]

19 minutes ago, zoth33 said:

That was discussed with Rivendell on how they couldn't name the dwarf other than Gimli.  They don't hand out generalities in those licensing agreements.  We just got info that the Gollum movies got greenlit.  There is no way that was in the licensing agreement Lego made several years ago when they got the license again and decided to do Rivendell.  They would have no idea that the Gollum movies were being made that's how I know it's not in the licensing agreement.  They would have to gain the rights if they wanted to make sets from those movies now as they just got confirmed.  They just don't say any movies down the line you can go ahead and make sets from them that's not how that works there has to be set parameters to work off of and Lego would need to know what they can and can't do.

They can´t name that dwarf, because it wasn´t named in the Lord of the Rings - not because they have no License for other films. Even with the license for the Hobbit they wouldn´t be able to name him because it is said nowhere that this dwarf is indeed Gimlis father Gloin.

And you are still failing to understand, that I nowhere, and never said the Hunt for Gollum or any of the new movies would be part of an years old licensing agreement. Again, they can have agreed on making sets yesterday, last week, last month - or not at all - we just don´t know, even if you claim otherwise. On a side note, even before the film was officially announced we knew they were working on new films and it doesn´t seem that unlikely that they made that agreement before the official name of the film was announced. We shouldn´t forget that Lego doesn´t need to be the one that reaches out to them for making sets, but Warner can also offer them, as again, free advertising + money from licensing would be something Warner would be interested in too.

19 minutes ago, zoth33 said:

I wouldn't mind more LOTR sets. But these movies seem to be a stretch from WB based on only like 1 or 2 pages from the books.  I don't think these movies are a good idea personally.  There are many other stories within the Tolkien world that could be told instead of this story.  The images of the War of the Rohirrim looks good, I had hoped they made sets for those but it seems unlikely at this point as we've heard nothing about sets and the movie is coming in December.  I hope they make sets from LOTR in a smaller price range and an actual wave of sets that everyone can enjoy.  I just don't see them tapping into the Gollum movies if they didn't tap into the ROP.  If Lego is smart they should just concentrate on the Hobbit and LOTR and release several sets from those franchises like Minas Tirith, Osgiliath, Bree, Lothlorien, Mirkwood, Rohan, more hobbit holes, Cirith Ungul, Minus Morgul, Angmar, etc.  

Well, that is something we can agree on, Hunt for Gollum indeed seems like a strange choice, since I don´t see them doing any big battles there, really - though you never know. Still it can get a good movie, but there would certainly things I would be more interested in (War in the north - or even storys that play after the LotR-movies. 

And yeah, I would have loved sets for War of the Rohirrim too, but guess since at this point we don´t have any clue about them, it seems very unlikely.

Where I do disagree, though is that Sets for the new movies are more unlikely because there were none for RoP. First of all there is no merchandising for RoP at all, so I would actually doubt that Amazon is able to make licenses based on their series. Additional to that the new Film will be from the same partner like the others, so it is more likely the films get sets than RoP

[zoth33]

2 hours ago, Black Falcon said:

They can´t name that dwarf, because it wasn´t named in the Lord of the Rings - not because they have no License for other films. Even with the license for the Hobbit they wouldn´t be able to name him because it is said nowhere that this dwarf is indeed Gimlis father Gloin.

And you are still failing to understand, that I nowhere, and never said the Hunt for Gollum or any of the new movies would be part of an years old licensing agreement. Again, they can have agreed on making sets yesterday, last week, last month - or not at all - we just don´t know, even if you claim otherwise. On a side note, even before the film was officially announced we knew they were working on new films and it doesn´t seem that unlikely that they made that agreement before the official name of the film was announced. We shouldn´t forget that Lego doesn´t need to be the one that reaches out to them for making sets, but Warner can also offer them, as again, free advertising + money from licensing would be something Warner would be interested in too.

Well, that is something we can agree on, Hunt for Gollum indeed seems like a strange choice, since I don´t see them doing any big battles there, really - though you never know. Still it can get a good movie, but there would certainly things I would be more interested in (War in the north - or even storys that play after the LotR-movies. 

And yeah, I would have loved sets for War of the Rohirrim too, but guess since at this point we don´t have any clue about them, it seems very unlikely.

Where I do disagree, though is that Sets for the new movies are more unlikely because there were none for RoP. First of all there is no merchandising for RoP at all, so I would actually doubt that Amazon is able to make licenses based on their series. Additional to that the new Film will be from the same partner like the others, so it is more likely the films get sets than RoP

I just don't see them doing sets for the Gollum movies I could be wrong but I would rather they stuck to LOTR and the Hobbit.  We already know the story of Gollum.  If they would do Beren and Luthien or the story of Morgoth just something that we haven't already seen I think it would be a huge success.  But rehashing a story we already pretty much have seen from the movies themselves minus some details seems like just rehashing an already told story.  The fanbase seems hesitant on these new movies and most people seem to want to see something else from middle earth not more Gollum.  

I think Lego is just seeing how viable the LOTR license is for them at this point and will determine whether we get more sets or a possible return of a full fledged theme.  It's going to be hard to get all these $500 sets.  I still don't have Rivendell or Barad Dur yet and I also would like to get the MTS at some point also.  Plus there are some Ninjago sets I would like to get especially the new red dragon looks great.  I just hope they make some smaller more affordable LOTR sets and castle sets in the future.   

[eric_son_of_joseph]

6 hours ago, zoth33 said:

I hope they make sets from LOTR in a smaller price range and an actual wave of sets that everyone can enjoy.

When asked about potentially releasing lower priced LOTR sets, a LEGO designer mentions, "A lot of smart people are thinking about it, I guess."

 

Edited June 14, 2024 by eric_son_of_joseph
link

[BrickBob Studpants]

9 hours ago, zoth33 said:

I just don't see them doing sets for the Gollum movies I could be wrong but I would rather they stuck to LOTR and the Hobbit.   

It‘s only one movie, luckily  Making a feature-length movie about Gollum set in-between The Hobbit and FOTR is hard enough as it is, let alone more!

I‘d rather they do anything else, but this is what we‘ll be served  Serkis being involved both behind and in front of the camera is the only thing it has going for it in my opinion, apart from tie-in sets maybe!

[TheDoctor]

1 hour ago, BrickBob Studpants said:

 Serkis being involved both behind and in front of the camera is the only thing it has going for it in my opinion

At the risk of getting off-topic, it should be half decent as Jackson is returning to produce along with a couple of the the original writers; as well as WETA being involved too.

[Black Falcon]

15 hours ago, zoth33 said:

I just don't see them doing sets for the Gollum movies I could be wrong but I would rather they stuck to LOTR and the Hobbit.  We already know the story of Gollum.  If they would do Beren and Luthien or the story of Morgoth just something that we haven't already seen I think it would be a huge success.  But rehashing a story we already pretty much have seen from the movies themselves minus some details seems like just rehashing an already told story.  The fanbase seems hesitant on these new movies and most people seem to want to see something else from middle earth not more Gollum.  

Well as I said, I´d had thought they would do something else too but we will see what they make out of it. I would suspect it is less about how Gollum came to the ring and how he lost it, as much more about Aragorn chasing him after Bilbo already had it for a long time. Anyways I certain it will still be a good movie, probably not as good as the LotR, but I doubt it will turn out bad.

15 hours ago, zoth33 said:

I think Lego is just seeing how viable the LOTR license is for them at this point and will determine whether we get more sets or a possible return of a full fledged theme.  It's going to be hard to get all these $500 sets.  I still don't have Rivendell or Barad Dur yet and I also would like to get the MTS at some point also.  Plus there are some Ninjago sets I would like to get especially the new red dragon looks great.  I just hope they make some smaller more affordable LOTR sets and castle sets in the future.   

Well I am saying this for years, new films are the best chance to get playsets for the LotR again, so I am happy we are getting new films again and honestly any decent fantasy film is highly welcome ;). So of course we can´t be certain if we will get sets for the film but I would guess the chances aren´t the bad. So I could see them doing sets to accompany the Film and the next year sets based on the LotR. If any of this is going to happen, time will tell and we can just hope.

Personally, without seeing any of the films I´d rather have sets for the war of the Rohirrim than for the Gollum movie though, as that is the film I am more excited about and overall I expect to be more promissing to make sets of - but as there is still no info about any sets for this film it seems unlikely to happen at this point. For Hunt for Gollum it is just completely uncertain what they could make as a set there, so kinda hard to imagine.

[MAB]

1 hour ago, Black Falcon said:

Well I am saying this for years, new films are the best chance to get playsets for the LotR again, so I am happy we are getting new films again and honestly any decent fantasy film is highly welcome ;). So of course we can´t be certain if we will get sets for the film but I would guess the chances aren´t the bad. So I could see them doing sets to accompany the Film and the next year sets based on the LotR. If any of this is going to happen, time will tell and we can just hope.

 

A new movie aimed at kids would give a better chance to get playsets than a movie aimed at 15+ or adults. I guess we will have to wait and see what the recommended audiences are for them.

 

[Captain Pirate Man]

 

[zoth33]

9 hours ago, TheDoctor said:

At the risk of getting off-topic, it should be half decent as Jackson is returning to produce along with a couple of the the original writers; as well as WETA being involved too.

Hopefully.  But Jackson made the Hobbit movies and those were not great.  If you just take the Hobbit movies as a fun fanfic it's fine but it really butchers the story and the weird love triangle just didn't work at all.  My son likes them and they are a fun adventure movie but based off the book they are not good.  The problem with this Gollum movie is do people really want a 2 plus hour movie about this storyline?  I thought there were 2 movies being discussed.  I like the look of War of the Rohirrim can't wait to see a trailer for that.  This Gollum movie doesn't really interest me and it seems many people would've liked to see some other story made from middle earth.  

4 hours ago, Black Falcon said:

Well as I said, I´d had thought they would do something else too but we will see what they make out of it. I would suspect it is less about how Gollum came to the ring and how he lost it, as much more about Aragorn chasing him after Bilbo already had it for a long time. Anyways I certain it will still be a good movie, probably not as good as the LotR, but I doubt it will turn out bad.

Well I am saying this for years, new films are the best chance to get playsets for the LotR again, so I am happy we are getting new films again and honestly any decent fantasy film is highly welcome ;). So of course we can´t be certain if we will get sets for the film but I would guess the chances aren´t the bad. So I could see them doing sets to accompany the Film and the next year sets based on the LotR. If any of this is going to happen, time will tell and we can just hope.

Personally, without seeing any of the films I´d rather have sets for the war of the Rohirrim than for the Gollum movie though, as that is the film I am more excited about and overall I expect to be more promissing to make sets of - but as there is still no info about any sets for this film it seems unlikely to happen at this point. For Hunt for Gollum it is just completely uncertain what they could make as a set there, so kinda hard to imagine.

I just hope they make smaller sets.  The more I looks at the pictures from War of the Rohirrim the more I like it, can't wait to see a trailer.  It's the only film I'm really excited to see this year.  Hopefully LOTR theme continues and we get some more great sets.  If they make sets for the Gollum movies great I will definitely buy them but it would be nice to see some smaller sets within LOTR so everyone can enjoy the theme.  

[Black Falcon]

5 hours ago, MAB said:

A new movie aimed at kids would give a better chance to get playsets than a movie aimed at 15+ or adults. I guess we will have to wait and see what the recommended audiences are for them.

So far I would guess both movies are more aimed at adults rather than kids. But yeah, we will see.

2 hours ago, zoth33 said:

Hopefully.  But Jackson made the Hobbit movies and those were not great.  If you just take the Hobbit movies as a fun fanfic it's fine but it really butchers the story and the weird love triangle just didn't work at all.  My son likes them and they are a fun adventure movie but based off the book they are not good.  The problem with this Gollum movie is do people really want a 2 plus hour movie about this storyline?  I thought there were 2 movies being discussed.  I like the look of War of the Rohirrim can't wait to see a trailer for that.  This Gollum movie doesn't really interest me and it seems many people would've liked to see some other story made from middle earth.  

There were definitely more than just one film planned, hence I thought they would make another trilogy but it turned out to be stand alone films - or at least the first one. What else they have planned, time will tell.

As for the Hobbit, it certainly wasn´t perfect and I can understand when people are disappointed with it especially considering some choices/changes from the books. But they are far from beeing bad. I will judge the Gollum movie when I´ve seen it - so far there isn´t even a trailer to tell if it can be good or bad. 

2 hours ago, zoth33 said:

I just hope they make smaller sets.  The more I looks at the pictures from War of the Rohirrim the more I like it, can't wait to see a trailer.  It's the only film I'm really excited to see this year.  Hopefully LOTR theme continues and we get some more great sets.  If they make sets for the Gollum movies great I will definitely buy them but it would be nice to see some smaller sets within LOTR so everyone can enjoy the theme.  

Yeah, if they would make sets for the Gollum movie, it would really surprise me if they wouldn´t do smaller LotR sets in the future.

[Captain Pirate Man]

2 hours ago, zoth33 said:

Hopefully.  But Jackson made the Hobbit movies and those were not great.  If you just take the Hobbit movies as a fun fanfic it's fine but it really butchers the story and the weird love triangle just didn't work at all.  My son likes them and they are a fun adventure movie but based off the book they are not good.  The problem with this Gollum movie is do people really want a 2 plus hour movie about this storyline?  I thought there were 2 movies being discussed.  I like the look of War of the Rohirrim can't wait to see a trailer for that.  This Gollum movie doesn't really interest me and it seems many people would've liked to see some other story made from middle earth.  

I just hope they make smaller sets.  The more I looks at the pictures from War of the Rohirrim the more I like it, can't wait to see a trailer.  It's the only film I'm really excited to see this year.  Hopefully LOTR theme continues and we get some more great sets.  If they make sets for the Gollum movies great I will definitely buy them but it would be nice to see some smaller sets within LOTR so everyone can enjoy the theme.  

I respectfully disagree. ALL things Middle-Earth are so far and few between, and its SUCH a rich, and amazing world that Tolkien created that at this point any piece of content is better than none. This "Franchise," if you want to call it that, isn't in the same position as say Star Wars, for example. Star Wars has been mined SO MUCH for stories at this point, that its just becoming a parody of its self IMO. For Middle-Earth content, only 4 outlets REALLY exist: 1. the Books 2. The 3 old animated films 3. The Jackson Franchise 4. Rings of Power. But that's it, nothing else exists. So when I think about the upcoming films, I'm SUPER excited to go back into that world again, I can't get enough. So IMO, YES a two hour Hunt for Gollum film sounds FANTASTIC!! 

As far as The Hobbit films go... If you know the behind the scenes stuff, it's an amazing feat that they turned out as well as they did. Guillermo Del Toro was the original director of those films, but due to studio interference, left the project while production had already begun. So Jackson had to step in, and basically save the day. So from that perspective, I'd argue they are a pretty remarkable accomplishment. As good as the LOTR films? No, but still a REALLY solid trilogy. If Jackson had been the director from the start, it COULD have rivaled the LOTR trilogy IMO. I'd also argue that Desolation of Smaug has the BEST dragon sequence EVER seen on film, so that has to carry some weight as well.    

The biggest "issue" this franchise has is that Tolkien purists will always find faults with any film or show that gets released. Tolkien's work is so MASSIVE and historical in nature, that it makes them nearly impossible to turn into films as is, so some changes are required. It would almost be like trying to turn a history book into a film, you would HAVE to cherry pick certain stories, and "alter" time lines to a certain degree. Don't get me wrong, I LOVE Tolkien's work, I HONESTLY believe it was the single GREATEST work of fiction of the 20th Century, in any medium. It's so great... it's almost untouchable. The Silmarillion in particular, that would be like trying to turn the entire Bible into a film. There is just so much there... Something will get missed or over looked. 

 

To bring this full circle, I LOVE this franchise, and I LOVE the Lego sets. So I want it to succeed, because I want more LOTR Lego.   

[zoth33]

1 hour ago, Captain Pirate Man said:

I respectfully disagree. ALL things Middle-Earth are so far and few between, and its SUCH a rich, and amazing world that Tolkien created that at this point any piece of content is better than none. This "Franchise," if you want to call it that, isn't in the same position as say Star Wars, for example. Star Wars has been mined SO MUCH for stories at this point, that its just becoming a parody of its self IMO. For Middle-Earth content, only 4 outlets REALLY exist: 1. the Books 2. The 3 old animated films 3. The Jackson Franchise 4. Rings of Power. But that's it, nothing else exists. So when I think about the upcoming films, I'm SUPER excited to go back into that world again, I can't get enough. So IMO, YES a two hour Hunt for Gollum film sounds FANTASTIC!! 

As far as The Hobbit films go... If you know the behind the scenes stuff, it's an amazing feat that they turned out as well as they did. Guillermo Del Toro was the original director of those films, but due to studio interference, left the project while production had already begun. So Jackson had to step in, and basically save the day. So from that perspective, I'd argue they are a pretty remarkable accomplishment. As good as the LOTR films? No, but still a REALLY solid trilogy. If Jackson had been the director from the start, it COULD have rivaled the LOTR trilogy IMO. I'd also argue that Desolation of Smaug has the BEST dragon sequence EVER seen on film, so that has to carry some weight as well.    

The biggest "issue" this franchise has is that Tolkien purists will always find faults with any film or show that gets released. Tolkien's work is so MASSIVE and historical in nature, that it makes them nearly impossible to turn into films as is, so some changes are required. It would almost be like trying to turn a history book into a film, you would HAVE to cherry pick certain stories, and "alter" time lines to a certain degree. Don't get me wrong, I LOVE Tolkien's work, I HONESTLY believe it was the single GREATEST work of fiction of the 20th Century, in any medium. It's so great... it's almost untouchable. The Silmarillion in particular, that would be like trying to turn the entire Bible into a film. There is just so much there... Something will get missed or over looked. 

 

To bring this full circle, I LOVE this franchise, and I LOVE the Lego sets. So I want it to succeed, because I want more LOTR Lego.   

Fantasy is my favorite.  Star wars used to be my favorite growing up with fantasy right behind.  

I still like the Hobbit movies but there is a lot to be desired from that trilogy.  Some of the Dwarves personalities were not related well in the movies and like I said they injected a weird love triangle that did nothing for the story and I know it wasn't Jacksons fault it was the studio's time constraints and other factors that led to the movies not being great.  Smaug is one of my favorite things they did.  There are some really fun parts and some great visuals in the Hobbit.  I also love Tolkiens World and love seeing it come to life but just like Star wars not everything created for a franchise is good.  It's ok to not like something from a property that you are extremely fond of.  Like I've said in other posts ROP is absolute garbage and is really badly written and acted.  The lore is absolutely trashed in ROP and it shows.  I also love Lego but I don't like every set they produce.  

You are also missing the biggest outlet of content for media and that is video games there are some absolutely great LOTR games out there like Battle for Middle earth, Shadow of Mordor, the Lego LOTR games, etc.  

I hope that the Hunt for Gollum is good but like I said I would rather see something we haven't seen before.  We've seen Gollum in 2 different trilogies.  Beren and Luthien would be great.  Or the story of Melkor.  Anything to do with the Valar or Maiar would be great.  

But I'm not just going to like something just because it's from Star wars or from LOTR.  The ROP is bad, the Acolyte is bad, the Rise of skywalker was trash.  You can tell when people put in the effort and care about the property they are using.  You can also tell when people are just using a property like Tolkiens just to make themselves a name or push their crap on said property.  You can tell that with JD Payne and Patrick Mckay are just using Tolkiens name for their own devices.  Conversely you can tell that Peter Jackson respects and love Tolkien and it shows in what he's done and how he's done it.  The Hobbit may not be great but I could still feel Tolkiens world in the movies whereas ROP just feels empty and void of anything Tolkien created.  

 

[Altair1]

Both the Hobbit films and ROP are unfortunately really bad and I don't plan on ever watching them again. But I will continue loving and watching the LOTR movies (and buying LOTR sets of course) for as long as I breathe :-)

[Black Falcon]

8 hours ago, zoth33 said:

You are also missing the biggest outlet of content for media and that is video games there are some absolutely great LOTR games out there like Battle for Middle earth, Shadow of Mordor, the Lego LOTR games, etc.  

Yeah a shame that Battle for Middle Earth isn´t avaiable today anymore - unless you buy used copys for insane prices 

8 hours ago, zoth33 said:

I hope that the Hunt for Gollum is good but like I said I would rather see something we haven't seen before.  We've seen Gollum in 2 different trilogies.  Beren and Luthien would be great.  Or the story of Melkor.  Anything to do with the Valar or Maiar would be great.  

We should keep in mind, that Warner will make films that will appeal to the masses though, and there are certainly some stories that would greatly appeal to fans of the tolkien universe mainly. I still think there might be stories that are better than Hunt for Gollum, but they wouldn´t have choosen it, if they wouldn´t have a plan for it. Though, one of the main reasons might be that the can use known figures from the LotR such as Gandalf and Aragorn which will help to atrract viewers.

2 hours ago, Altair1 said:

Both the Hobbit films and ROP are unfortunately really bad and I don't plan on ever watching them again. But I will continue loving and watching the LOTR movies (and buying LOTR sets of course) for as long as I breathe :-)

Comparing the Hobbit and the RoP with another and putting them into one catergory is quite hard IMO. The Hobbit is way better IMO.

[QuiggoldsPegLeg]

12 hours ago, zoth33 said:

Fantasy is my favorite.  Star wars used to be my favorite growing up with fantasy right behind.  

I hope that the Hunt for Gollum is good but like I said I would rather see something we haven't seen before.  We've seen Gollum in 2 different trilogies.  Beren and Luthien would be great.  Or the story of Melkor.  Anything to do with the Valar or Maiar would be great.  

To be fair, Star Wars is fantasy. 
 

Also, you unfortunately aren’t going to get anything about Beren and Luthien or Melkor, because the Tolkien Estate still holds on to all of the rights for stories derived from the Silmarillion, and has yet to lend those rights out to anyone. 

[Captain Pirate Man]

2 hours ago, QuiggoldsPegLeg said:

To be fair, Star Wars is fantasy. 
 

Also, you unfortunately aren’t going to get anything about Beren and Luthien or Melkor, because the Tolkien Estate still holds on to all of the rights for stories derived from the Silmarillion, and has yet to lend those rights out to anyone. 

To my understanding, that is not true. I have looked into this very topic, and unless the Internet is lying to me, the estate HAS given Jacksons team the rights to the Silmarillion. Not only that, but Rings of Power was also granted access to use things from the Silmarillion in this upcoming season 2. 

Christopher Tolkien was VERY much against the Jackson films, for whatever reason. So he refused to give anyone rights to the Silmarillion, for any reason. But he has passed on, and has been gone for a few years now. Those that hold the rights, are not as against giving access, as Christopher was. 

I read a lot of people saying "They don't have access to the Silmarillion" but from what I have researched, that is no longer the case. If someone can provide some proof to the contrary, I welcome it.

 

https://www.cultureslate.com/news/peter-jackson-will-return-to-middle-earth-to-direct-the-silmarillion

Edited June 15, 2024 by Captain Pirate Man

[Captain Pirate Man]

16 hours ago, zoth33 said:

Fantasy is my favorite.  Star wars used to be my favorite growing up with fantasy right behind.  

I still like the Hobbit movies but there is a lot to be desired from that trilogy.  Some of the Dwarves personalities were not related well in the movies and like I said they injected a weird love triangle that did nothing for the story and I know it wasn't Jacksons fault it was the studio's time constraints and other factors that led to the movies not being great.  Smaug is one of my favorite things they did.  There are some really fun parts and some great visuals in the Hobbit.  I also love Tolkiens World and love seeing it come to life but just like Star wars not everything created for a franchise is good.  It's ok to not like something from a property that you are extremely fond of.  Like I've said in other posts ROP is absolute garbage and is really badly written and acted.  The lore is absolutely trashed in ROP and it shows.  I also love Lego but I don't like every set they produce.  

You are also missing the biggest outlet of content for media and that is video games there are some absolutely great LOTR games out there like Battle for Middle earth, Shadow of Mordor, the Lego LOTR games, etc.  

I hope that the Hunt for Gollum is good but like I said I would rather see something we haven't seen before.  We've seen Gollum in 2 different trilogies.  Beren and Luthien would be great.  Or the story of Melkor.  Anything to do with the Valar or Maiar would be great.  

But I'm not just going to like something just because it's from Star wars or from LOTR.  The ROP is bad, the Acolyte is bad, the Rise of skywalker was trash.  You can tell when people put in the effort and care about the property they are using.  You can also tell when people are just using a property like Tolkiens just to make themselves a name or push their crap on said property.  You can tell that with JD Payne and Patrick Mckay are just using Tolkiens name for their own devices.  Conversely you can tell that Peter Jackson respects and love Tolkien and it shows in what he's done and how he's done it.  The Hobbit may not be great but I could still feel Tolkiens world in the movies whereas ROP just feels empty and void of anything Tolkien created.  

 

You are correct, I DID forget about video games. To be fair though, as popular as video games are, I would still put them well behind, even Rings of Power, as far as mass appeal is concerned. We have both the Lego Hobbit and LOTR, we still wish they had finished the promised DLC for the Hobbit...

 

As for Rings of Power, I just gave it a second watch this past week, and it's not as bad as people make it out to be IMO. The biggest issue is, like you said, the show runners not having proper respect for the source material. I completely agree there. But having said that, I would argue that the show is still decent, and FAR better than pretty much anything Disney has done with SW. The highlights for me are Durin and Elronds relationship, seeing Mordor get created, and the crafting of the rings of power. Having said that, the show DOES have some issues, specifically how they handled Sauron and Galadriel in season 1. I'm hopeful they will do better with season 2, but I understand if most people have just out right written it off at this point. 

 

One interesting fact though... The Tolkien estate seems to prefer Rings of Power OVER what Jackson has done. They are legally NOT allowed to be connected to Jackson's films, that was a major stipulation. Having said that, they DO seem to want to be in the same continuity, even if not allowed to do it legally. 

[BrickBob Studpants]

1 hour ago, Captain Pirate Man said:

They are legally NOT allowed to be connected to Jackson's films, that was a major stipulation. Having said that, they DO seem to want to be in the same continuity, even if not allowed to do it legally. 

Still weird. If that's the case, then why does the Balrog look identical to how it did in FOTR and TT?  

1 hour ago, Captain Pirate Man said:

I'm hopeful they will do better with season 2, but I understand if most people have just out right written it off at this point.

While I don't hate RoP, they made some major blunders in S1, and there are already two things in the trailer for S2 that don't make much sense.

1. How come Barad-dûr is already under construction when in the lore it required the power of the One Ring to do so? Even the LEGO set got that right, as it's mentioned in the instruction booklet!  Unless this scene takes place after Sauron has crafted it, but I doubt that's gonna happen this season since the remaining 16 rings have to be done first (and they already botched the order)
2. How come the elves don't see through Sauron's elven disguise (Annatar, if they have the rights to call him that), when he's apparently also played by Charlie Vickers? Are the elves stupid?  Or is that just for the sake of the audience and the elves see something else in-universe?

A third issue may be Tom Bombadil, but at least he fits better here than he would've in the Jackson films. Excluding him in FOTR was the right choice in my opinion since he completely breaks the momentum of the plot and undermines the urgency of the mission by being immune to the One Ring. In this story, at least he won't do anything like that!

Other than that, I'm cautiously optimistic, but the show will never be on the same level as the two Jackson trilogies to me.

Edited June 15, 2024 by BrickBob Studpants

[kuzyabricks]

12 hours ago, Altair1 said:

Both the Hobbit films and ROP are unfortunately really bad and I don't plan on ever watching them again. But I will continue loving and watching the LOTR movies (and buying LOTR sets of course) for as long as I breathe :-)

The first Hobbit film is great the other two are okay. Still a league above ROP

[Captain Pirate Man]

1 hour ago, BrickBob Studpants said:

Still weird. If that's the case, then why does the Balrog look identical to how it did in FOTR and TT?  

While I don't hate RoP, they made some major blunders in S1, and there are already two things in the trailer for S2 that don't make much sense.

1. How come Barad-dûr is already under construction when in the lore it required the power of the One Ring to do so? Even the LEGO set got that right, as it's mentioned in the instruction booklet!  Unless this scene takes place after Sauron has crafted it, but I doubt that's gonna happen this season since the remaining 16 rings have to be done first (and they already botched the order)
2. How come the elves don't see through Sauron's elven disguise (Annatar, if they have the rights to call him that), when he's apparently also played by Charlie Vickers? Are the elves stupid?  Or is that just for the sake of the audience and the elves see something else in-universe?

A third issue may be Tom Bombadil, but at least he fits better here than he would've in the Jackson films. Excluding him in FOTR was the right choice in my opinion since he completely breaks the momentum of the plot and undermines the urgency of the mission by being immune to the One Ring. In this story, at least he won't do anything like that!

Other than that, I'm cautiously optimistic, but the show will never be on the same level as the two Jackson trilogies to me.

Rings of Power WANTS/ wanted to be a part of Jackson's film cannon, it was the Tolkien estate that demanded it be separate. Both projects have New Line Cinema involvement, so it's not for a lack of effort to make them the same cannon.

As for the Balrog, and other similarities, they did that on purpose. While they can not officially be a part of Jackson's films, pretending they have continuity is what they plan on doing. I expect to see more similarities such as this going forward. 

[Cyprinus]

2 hours ago, Captain Pirate Man said:

As for Rings of Power, I just gave it a second watch this past week, and it's not as bad as people make it out to be IMO. The biggest issue is, like you said, the show runners not having proper respect for the source material. I completely agree there. But having said that, I would argue that the show is still decent, and FAR better than pretty much anything Disney has done with SW. The highlights for me are Durin and Elronds relationship, seeing Mordor get created, and the crafting of the rings of power. Having said that, the show DOES have some issues, specifically how they handled Sauron and Galadriel in season 1. I'm hopeful they will do better with season 2, but I understand if most people have just out right written it off at this point.

The show in general suffers from bad writing, terrible pacind and paying no attention to time, distance and logistics. They also seem to want to mimic whatever they can from the Jackson movies, even parts that weren't too well received. The Durin/Elrond bits are among the best parts of the show, with a proper gem or two in there, but they also kinda get elevated due to how bad the rest is. Also Elrond is arguably the least fitting elf to choose for the "timeless being forgets mortal lifespans thing" - his own twin brother was a mortal after all.

Th creation of Mordor suffers from the shows usual logistics and logic issues, but even with those aside, you wonder who made such an unique magical item a key to a dam. That thing is impressively obviously magical compared to most artifacts in Middle Earth.

Meanwhile while some visuals of the ring-making are nice, Celebrimbor behaving like alloys were some arcane secret nobody thought about was dumb. And I feel making the Three first, with Sauron around the forge is a change we didn't need.

Quote

One interesting fact though... The Tolkien estate seems to prefer Rings of Power OVER what Jackson has done. They are legally NOT allowed to be connected to Jackson's films, that was a major stipulation. Having said that, they DO seem to want to be in the same continuity, even if not allowed to do it legally. 

Eh, wouldn't put too much stock in the Estate's opinion ever since Christopher stepped down. While he wasn't a fan of Jackson's movies, I doubt he'd have a better opinion about RoP, which could change things.

[Captain Pirate Man]

1 hour ago, Cyprinus said:

The show in general suffers from bad writing, terrible pacind and paying no attention to time, distance and logistics. They also seem to want to mimic whatever they can from the Jackson movies, even parts that weren't too well received. The Durin/Elrond bits are among the best parts of the show, with a proper gem or two in there, but they also kinda get elevated due to how bad the rest is. Also Elrond is arguably the least fitting elf to choose for the "timeless being forgets mortal lifespans thing" - his own twin brother was a mortal after all.

Th creation of Mordor suffers from the shows usual logistics and logic issues, but even with those aside, you wonder who made such an unique magical item a key to a dam. That thing is impressively obviously magical compared to most artifacts in Middle Earth.

Meanwhile while some visuals of the ring-making are nice, Celebrimbor behaving like alloys were some arcane secret nobody thought about was dumb. And I feel making the Three first, with Sauron around the forge is a change we didn't need.

Eh, wouldn't put too much stock in the Estate's opinion ever since Christopher stepped down. While he wasn't a fan of Jackson's movies, I doubt he'd have a better opinion about RoP, which could change things.

I would say pretty much all of your opinions here in regards to Rings of Power are justified. While I do find some merit and worth in the show, I'm also not willing to die on the hill that it deserves to be defended either. I find a certain "magic" in any media containing Tolkin's world. So I'll admit I am bias there, lol. I really enjoy the Ralph Bashki LOTR film, especially for it's time. I enjoy watching a good animated trilogy with the Rankin and Bass Hobbit, Bashki's LOTR and the Rankin and Bass Return of the king. I often try and get my family to watch them, but someone will just say "Let's watch the live action films instead" because they are better. 

Having said all of that, I very much will defend the Hobbit films, especially the first two. I agree, The Battle of Five Armies is the BY FAR the weakest of the six films. But IMO I prefer An Unexpected Journey and Desolation of Smaug over The Two Towers. The Two Towers was amazing upon first viewing, yes. But once you know the story, it's just the middle chapter that doesn't move the story along all that much, if we are honest. In the Fellowship of the Ring (which is my fav of the franchise), we get introduced to all the characters, the world, what's going on, etc. Return of the King (my 2nd fav), is where we get all the resolution, which makes it incredibly satisfying. The Two Towers on the other hand... Has a great battle, and we meet Rohan and Gollum. But it's a film that CAN be skipped upon repeat viewings, and you won't be left unsatisfied. So for me, it's the 2nd worst film in the series. 

 

[Captain Pirate Man]

As far as LEGO is concerned, I don't know about the rest of you, but I would prefer a full theme, of smaller sets over a $1000 Minas Tirith. Don't get me wrong, Minas Tirith would be welcomed as well, but if I had to pick... Give me smaller sets. Between this year and last year, I've spent nearly $1000 on LEGO LOTR. We got two absolutely amazing sets, now it's time to give us more minifigs and smaller builds to help populate the world of these two massive sets.

 

IDK about the rest of you... But I could use some more Elfs and Orcs at this point. At least before we introduce another faction (Gondor) to the equation. Not to mention I'd argue a Bagend remake would probably FLY off of shelves, faster than a Minis Tirith would. You could make Bag End the big set of the theme, and go small from there. 

Opinions?

[Mandalorianknight]

5 hours ago, BrickBob Studpants said:

Are the elves stupid?

"I know what I have to do, but I don't know if I have the strength to do it."

 

 

As to the wider topic, I'll simply say that "low quality content is better than no content" is how we got the current states of SW and marvel. Though as @BrickBob Studpants says, LOTR seems to already be having as much trouble with their canon as star wars currently is.

[BitByBrick]

1 hour ago, Captain Pirate Man said:

As far as LEGO is concerned, I don't know about the rest of you, but I would prefer a full theme, of smaller sets over a $1000 Minas Tirith. Don't get me wrong, Minas Tirith would be welcomed as well, but if I had to pick... Give me smaller sets. Between this year and last year, I've spent nearly $1000 on LEGO LOTR. We got two absolutely amazing sets, now it's time to give us more minifigs and smaller builds to help populate the world of these two massive sets.

 

IDK about the rest of you... But I could use some more Elfs and Orcs at this point. At least before we introduce another faction (Gondor) to the equation. Not to mention I'd argue a Bagend remake would probably FLY off of shelves, faster than a Minis Tirith would. You could make Bag End the big set of the theme, and go small from there. 

Opinions?

Totally agree with Captain Pirate Man! 

“But that is not for us to decide. All we have to decide is what to do with the (LotR LEGO sets) that are given to us.”

 
“Even the smallest (LotR LEGO set) can change the course of the future” 

Edited June 16, 2024 by BitByBrick