Deathleech

I agree. Here is what Lego SHOULD have done: Instead of wasting a mold on new orc hair, why not give us a proper orc battle helm (or even use an existing helm from another castle theme like this one in a different color)? Put said orc helm on all the orcs in the wave, not just two. A new orc print would have been a bonus. As cool as it is to have Thorin with his crown on, I think people would have MUCH preferred Bolg instead with a new molded head (though this might have been slightly more expensive..?). Lego probably wanted to include an eagle in the Bo5A set to make sure they represent all five factions, but a new print on the existing bear would have worked as Beorn and made the set all that more desirable without leaving an important character out. It looks like Dain's helm has a piece in the middle that can possibly be removed? Why not instead of Bard, include an Iron Hill dwarf soldier with this helm instead? Use existing beards. An added bonus would of been Thranduil with armor print instead of Legolas. So with those changes you are looking at what, two or three new prints and maybe one slightly more expensive mold taking the place of another new mold anyways? With the Lake-town set I have no real issues, maybe just use the SDCC Bard instead and it's all good? The Witch King Battle seems fine for what it is. I dunno about others, but for me this would of made the wave go from like a 4 to a solid 7 on a scale from 1-10.

I'm not sure why people are so surprised we didn't get a ram. I mean think about it, Lego probably wouldn't be able to use that expensive mold in any other themes and definitely wouldn't be using it in any more Middle-Earth sets. Why would they spend the money on something so spendy when it would only be used in one set? The eagle makes much more sense. Beorn would have made the most sense though. Lego could of just used the existing bear, gave it a new print and ta-da! Bear form Beorn at a minimal cost. Not perfect due to size, but it definitely would have sufficed. I guess the reason Lego had the eagle was to include all five factions from the Battle of Five Armies in the set (Bard for humans, Legolas for elves, Azog and Orcs for orcs, Dain and Thorin for dwarves, and eagle for.. well eagles)? At any rate I seriously doubt we will get a store exclusive, and a polybag seems unlikely. If by some chance we DO get a polybag, I really hope it's the orc with hair though. We haven't gotten a bad guy army builder polybag in some time. I would imagine the named good guy polybag would be Thorin. Those would make this pretty sub-par wave ever so slightly better. It's hard to say from the blurry pics. I thought they were just existing prints mixed and matched to make "new" looking minifigures though. It looks like the existing Gundabad face print and possibly the Uruk-hai print on the brownish tan Mordor Orc bodies? The torsos are definitely re-hash prints.. Mordor Orc and Gundabad Orc torsos. Nothing new about them. Knowing what we do now, I REALLY wish the Council of Elrond set would have been scrapped in favor of a Witch King Battle set. It could have been $30, had a molded Fel Beast, Eowyn, the Witch King, and maybe a Gondor Soldier (or two.. or orc) with a small ruin or wall piece. If the Fel Beast mold is too expensive to put in a smaller set like that they should have put it in the Black Gates set and saved the eagle for the Orthanc and BoFA sets. In terms of minifigures, the Black Gates set should have had the same Gondor Soldier instead of one of the Mordor Orcs. Throw in a Gondor Soldier polybag for more army building appeal and BAM! Lego would of basically filled the giant hole in their LotR line with minimal effort. The only figure we would be missing is Arwen then, and honestly she wouldn't be missed by most if we had the Witch King, Eowyn, and Gondor Soldiers in her place.

My thoughts exactly. It seems like after the first waves for the LotR and Hobbit Lego just kind of let these themes fall to the wayside. There just doesn't seem to be near as much effort put into them, almost like the budget was significantly cut or something. This third (and most likely final) Hobbit wave is mostly just re-hashed characters with a few new prints. The builds are mostly uninspired. Bard is in two sets, Legolas and Azog are re-hashes from wave two, there is the same eagle we have seen in a few sets now, and four more orcs with the same prints (albeit with new hair in one set, which I guess is a plus.. though armor would of been MUCH better). Where are the armored soldiers? The Iron Hill Dwarves, the Mirkwood Elves, the Orcs in armor? Where is bear Boern? Where is Bolg? Armored Thranduil? Where is Alrid or war rams? Why were these characters not made instead of all those crummy re-hashes? The only saving grace is the smallest Witch King Battle set. It actually looks like a decent build with great minifigures. The Lake-town build also seems decent enough. The minifigure count seems fairly high for the price points as well (each set has at least one more minifigure than the past sets at each price point, with the Bo5A set having two more). From what we can see of the Bo5A build though, it looks atrocious. Most of it's a huge catapult and a small bridge/arch connected to a tower? Really? This set could of had so much potential but Lego squandered it all away.

And THIS is an example of why Lego probably will never announce a line is ending, especially when related sets are coming out or still on shelves. It's hard to start collecting a line you know will be ending soon or might not put out sets based on your favorite scenes.

Yes, but how long is Sauron shown in his necromancer form, a whole second as well? Heck, you don't even get a clear shot of his face, it's just a black shadowy figure from AUJ (NOT DoS!). While showing him in armor in DoS may just be an image and not his actual physical form, who cares? Maybe people want to use the Sauron "image" so they can have him floating around Dol Guldur being all menacing? It doesn't matter if he has a physical form or is just an image, he appears the same regardless and I am sure kids want to re-create the scene as accurately as possible. I mean if we are going to get technical about this sort of thing shouldn't the necromancer be done in a smokey transparent plastic at the very least with no face or chest print? Lego took liberties with him. Well of course you would know who it is if you are a big LotR/Hobbit fan AND were told the set he is in. There aren't a lot of people it could be. My point was there are a lot of the LotR/Hobbit minifigures that are instantly recognizable after seeing just the figures by themselves. For example I can show almost any LotR fan the Legolas minifigure and they will know exactly who it is. I don't need to tell them what scene or set he is from or even mention he is a LotR figure to most people. People can just tell because he looks very much like Legolas in the movies. The necromancer on the other hand is based on a shadowy figure and it appears Lego just kind of did their own thing with his mint green chest and face print (which I guess is better than a solid black minifigure, but still...) It matters because of reasons I already gave. That's great your loyalties lie with the author, but these sets are based on the movies, NOT the books (which barely even mention Dol Guldur...). People want cool figures that are movie accurate. The necromancer has been one of the most criticized figures to come out of the LotR or Hobbit sets. Go back and look at how many people complained about him when the Dol Guldur Battle set was first revealed. I know there isn't a lot Lego could do with the figure, but if possible they should of picked the other version to model him after. Also, the wave 2 sets are primarily based on the DoS movie where Sauron doesn't even appear in necromancer form, he is shown as the armored version. I take it by your avatar you are a huge necromancer fan so you seem to be taking this personally, but the figure is just not a fan favorite. Want a little more proof? Look at the Dol Guldur Battle review. He has the least votes for favorite new figure. Out of 120+ votes he doesn't even hold 5%. Even the hairless Gundabad Orcs that appear in several sets have more votes than him. Do you honestly think the same would be true if we got a figure based on the armored Sauron "image"? I am just saying people want Sauron in his armor form. Since, as you said, the only way we would see that is in some promotional item or a prologue set, neither of which will probably EVER happen, why not take this perfect opportunity to give us an armored Sauron? Who cares if it's not a physical form and is just an image, we still get an awesome looking armored Sauron that we probably wouldn't otherwise get. Like I said before, you are killing two birds with one stone. We get an accurate DoS version AND a version that could pass for Sauron in the LotR. Instead we got a figure that is boring and doesn't look very good. Lastly I am not really sure how you can say I make a lot of posts about "how much LEGO effed everything up" and that they are not very well thought out. Do you even read through my entire posts? Most times when I start a post criticizing something, by the end I am more asking questions why they did it or bringing up possible reasons. Heck, I even did it with the Sauron/necromancer discussion. I acknowledged it was probably a movie change made too late for Lego to fix or they didn't have the budget to give Sauron a new helm mold so opted for something easier. I don't see how that is poorly thought out in the least, nor how I am always complaining about Lego's decisions. In fact I think I am actually pretty mild on the criticism compared to a lot of people on these forums. A lot of sets I am ok with when other people HATE them (like Mines of Moria or the new Erebor set that got tons of hate from others...). Sometimes it's just hard to understand things Lego does. By all accounts, why would Lego neglect to make a Gondor set with the Witch King, Eowyn, and Gondor Soldiers, but they will give us the Mouth of Sauron only seen a few minutes in the EE of the films? I mean how do you NOT criticize that? We are all huge LotR/Hobbit fans AND Lego fans so we just want to see the best treatment given to the Middle-Earth themes. We complain because we care a great deal about the sets and are passionate. That is all.

I was imagining more of a black or dark gray for the armor with a lot of darker orange and red highlights around the shoulders/head.

Actually... THIS is how Sauron appears in Desolation of Smaug, which the Lego set is based on. It actually would have made complete sense for Lego to use THIS version instead of the shadowy necromancer version they used (who doesn't even appear in DoS, he is in AUJ). Not only does he fit BETTER than the version Lego used, he closely resembles prologue Sauron. Lego could of killed two birds with one stone here... The only reason I don't think they used this version is because it was either added to late in production or Lego didn't want to splurge on a new mold. Nope, I meant Lego fans. I am saying if you are a LotR fan, but not a Lego fan and saw that necromancer figure, you probably wouldn't even know it is Sauron. I am pretty sure you are the minority here. The resounding consensus was the necromancer version was extremely dull and boring when we first saw him. It was one of the few minifigures from the LotR or Hobbit line people weren't impressed with.

It's been said a million times before, but a chess set OR a CMF set for LotR figures would of made Lego a killing. Aragorn in his king attire as the king, Gandalf the White as the queen, two brick built Ents as bishops, 2 mounted Rohan soldiers as knights, 2 Rangers of Gondor as rooks, 8 Gondor Soldiers as pawns for the good side. Bad side would be Sauron as King, Saruman as Queen, two mountain trolls as bishops, 2 mounted warg riders as knights, 2 white hand Uruk-hai as rooks, 8 Mordor Orcs as pawns. I would easily pay $80-100 for a set like this. Of course it would NEVER happen. Even if Lego somehow made a LotR chess set they would most definitely fill all the spots except the pawns with Fellowship characters, not grunts. I think a CMF LotR set would have been an even better option. Imagine all 9 fellowship characters in wave 1. That would leave 7 spots left. Sauron, Saruman, Gondor Soldier, Rohan Soldier, Uruk-hai, Mordor Orc, Witch King (with black hood to also serve as Nazgul). BAM! Instant hit. You nailed all 9 fellowship characters, the main bad guys, AND got all the big factions at least one army building figure. Wave 2 could be some more obscure characters and alternate prints. Gandalf the White, King Aragorn, Arwen, Eowyn, Faramir, Haradrim, Easterling, Rohan Merry, Gondor Pippin, Theoden, Lothlórien Elven Soldier, Gollum, Gothmog, Haldir, Elrond, Moria Orc. BAM! Another hit with a good mix of main characters and army builders. Lets be honest, the LotR sets are all about the figures anyways so these two options would of worked wonders. Most people aren't even that big a fan of the sets, they catch the most flak but hardly anyone ever complains about the figures other than a color being slightly off.

That Sauron looks NOTHING like his iconic armored self from the LotR prologue. I bet most people wouldn't even recognize that figure as Sauron if they weren't already Lego fans. He looks more like some sort of ghoul or radioactive ape. I really wish Lego would of modeled him off of what we see in DoS, he at least has his armor and more closely resembles the Sauron we all know and love. Then we could use him for all our cool LotR stuff too. Exactly. The smallest set probably has 3 minifigures, the $30 set probably has 4, and the 60 dollar Bo5A set probably has 5 figs (if the figure count is the same as the previous sets at those price points). That's 12 more minifigures. 8 dwarves would mean only 4 new minifigures. We know we are getting some new prints of existing characters like Bard though so that would mean even less new characters. That wouldn't work considering we are getting Bain, Galadriel, the Witch King, Elrond, and still need Dain and Bolg.

Well regardless Lego has nothing to gain by announcing a line is done. What do they get out of it? People might go back and buy more existing sets? I doubt it. People will probably do that anyways if they don't get anything new for awhile or if they think the line is done. Not knowing entices people. Look at all the chumps who bought the SDCC Azog last year for 1200 bucks only to have him released a few months later in a $70 set.

Not everyone is the same. Some people might stop buying current sets cold turkey if they know there will be no more after the third Hobbit wave. Maybe they didn't get what they wanted and see no point in continuing to buy sets for an "incomplete" line. Maybe someone that just learned about the LotR/Hobbit sets wants to get into them, but if they find out the line is ending they see no point. If you don't make any official announcement, these type of people would still potentially buy sets. You say you would buy more existing sets if you knew the LotR and Hobbit themes were done? I think you are the minority. For most people, not knowing is a benefit to Lego. If Lego doesn't release anymore sets after the next Hobbit wave I will probably go back and try to stock up on more orcs, wargs, and maybe some other factions. If they do release more I will save my money and buy tons of Gondor Soldiers and hopefully new printed orcs. If I have no idea what Lego is doing I might just buy tons of older sets with orcs AND the newer ones when they come out.

They all look pretty accurate. Sure there are some glaring differences like none of the Hobbits have flesh colored feet and instead all have brown pants and feet, but for the most part the printing has been amazing on the LotR/Hobbit figures. I think Lego intentionally uses brighter colors so the figures pop a little more.

Also, I would prefer if we had the option to get tons of Gondor Soldiers without needing to spend a fortune. One soldier in a $15 or 20 book would make this near impossible. This is why I wish we had gotten 1 Gondor Soldier in the Black Gates set then Lego would of also released them in a polybag available for mass purchase at TRU like the Mirkwood Elf and Lake-town Guard.

And by that logic who is Bard going to fire it at? The clouds? Smaug isn't in the Lake-town set either so it's not like Bard is going to be able to use the windlance against any figures in the set itself. Who knows, maybe Bard will be in the Bo5A set. It does seem weird to put him in two Lake-town sets that go together. I think everyone is assuming he won't be in the Bo5A just because there isn't any room for him really. I mean if Dain and Thorin are pretty much givens, that only leaves 3 spots left (if it's a $60 set like the past Middle=Earth ones). Bolg could be in either the Bo5A set or Lake-town. Worse case I am guessing we will get a larger molded eagle or warg, Thorin with a different print, Dain, armored Thranduil with a different print, Azog, and another generic Gundabad Orc like the ones we received in wave two. I'm not terribly optimistic about receiving any Elf or Dwarven soldier types because look at Black Gates. We got two Mordor Orcs, Mouth, Aragorn, and Gandalf. There were no Gondor or Rohan Soldiers at all.

Another reason the Erebor set should be Bo5A based, the $30 set should be a Bo5A army builder, and the $60 set should be Lake-town with Smaug. Lego could of made a ram and had it in the Erebor AND the army builder set then (not sure where Beorn would go in bear form though...)

This would be great. I would also like to see an Orc polybag of some sort since the Uruk-hai is the only one we have ever gotten. The last two polybags with army building potential were just the Mirkwood Elves (which we got better versions of in the MEA set) and the Lake-town Guards. Both good guys. Totally off topic, but I really wish Lego would of put a single Gondor Soldier in the Black Gate set and then offered it as a polybag in wave 2. It would of tackled one of the biggest issues the LotR line currently has in one simple step.

An Iron Hill Dwarf polybag might be a possibility if we get a new minifigure for one in the Bo5A set. There is no way Lego would put a minifigure AND a molded ram in a polybag though. I don't think they have ever put a minifigure and large molded creature in a polybag before, have they? Usually it's just a small build, a minifigure, or a combination of the two.

Ya, I get that Faefrost. My point wasn't Lego needs to plan out an entire wave and cover everything before the license ends. I am sure no matter what the license is and no matter how long Lego has it, they will miss some things. My point was that unlike most of the licenses d-delay listed (PotC, Star Wars, Super Heroes), LotR and Hobbit don't really have anything else that can carry the line once the third and final Hobbit movie is out. The chances of Lego releasing a LotR set in 5 years are slim to none because there probably won't be any more Middle-Earth themed films for a looooong time (if ever). Once the Middle-Earth license ends for Lego they won't pick it up again. PotC on the other hand comes out with a new movie every few years. Star Wars is an on going license with all the tv shows, movies, etc. that come out. With these licenses there is potential for Lego to always make sets based on scenes not yet covered. If we don't get a third Lotr film though we probably never will see Gondor Soldiers, Eowyn, or the Witch King in official Lego form.

Most of those licenses we KNOW Lego is coming back to or will get to eventually though. Lego is suppose to be coming back to the PotC line in a few years when the new film is released so they might give us some sets from previous films then. The same with DC Superheroes.. there are new movies constantly coming out so Lego can always make new stuff based on it. Star Wars is ongoing and shows no signs of slowing down so I am sure we will get another Cloud City or something never produced sooner or later. LotR though? Once the Hobbit films are done we probably won't get anything new from the Middle-Earth franchise fir a long time. At least not for several years. I mean it took a decade between LotR and the Hobbit to be made into films, and the only material really left are the more obscure works like the Similarion (which I doubt will be made into a full length feature). This means Lego has a limited amount of time to get all the sets in they can before they lose the license and never come back to it. They don't have the same time restraints with any of those other themes.

Well, not all of us demanded a Council of Elrond set. Kids, who Lego is mainly aimed at, certainly didn't demand it nor want it. A lot more of us AFOLS have also demanded a Gondor set and that has yet to come to fruition. And really that is my issue with the LotR theme. There were so many choices that just make us go "wtf?" Just look at this thread. Almost every poster who gives their "dream wave" has Eowyn vs the Witch King and/or Minas Tirith/Osgiliath at the very top of their list. Why were these not made over Council of Elrond? Ok, so maybe there was something going on behind the scenes that explains it and we are not privy to that info. But why other choices? Why do the Mordor Orcs STILL have the same print when they have been in a total of 5 sets now and they have appeared in said sets 10 times? Yet Undead Soldiers and Goblin Town Goblins have two prints, only appeared in one set, and appeared two times each. It makes NO logical sense. "Hey guys, lets not waste money on a second or third Mordor Orc print cause they are only gonna appear in five sets and we will put two in each set, instead lets use those prints on two figs like the Undead Soldiers and Goblins since they will be used in one set and never again". Ok, so Lego maybe wanted to appeal to pirate/ship fans with the Pirate Ship Ambush set. I get that. However did it not cross Lego's mind that the scene is not even 5 minutes long, even in the EE of the films? And they made it over stuff people are literally clamoring for like Eowyn vs Witch King and Gondor Soldiers?

I totally understand what you are saying, and quite honestly the LotR and Hobbit themes don't seem to be selling incredibly well. They might be doing ok and turning a profit, but they are not on the same level as Lego's cash cows like Star Wars, City, Ninjago, Friends, etc. If you look at Lego Ideas there isn't a single LotR or Hobbit project with over 5,000 votes, let alone anywhere close to 10,000. The last Hobbit wave was barely stocked in stores when it was first released compared to The Lego Movie which had half an aisle, end caps, etc. full of product. So with all of this in mind, given the choice between more Star Wars sets with their budget or more LotR sets, which do you think Lego would choose? Each SW set which will make 5x what a LotR set will make so why choose that over a LotR set just to satisfy a small handful of fans? No one in their right mind would. With all that said, the problem I have is it's like Lego almost TRIED to make their Middle-Earth themes fail. Now obviously that isn't true, but there are so many questionable choices they made. Mouth of Sauron over Witch King? Pirate Ship Ambush over something Gondor? Council of Elrond over pretty much ANY action scene from the films? No Eowyn or Gondor Faction? It's like for the first LotR/Hobbit wave Lego gave it their all and after that they kind of have just been skating by. I have no idea why this is but understand their are tons of forces at work. Maybe these sets tested really well with their test groups or maybe the first waves didn't sell as well as Lego thought so they focused more on other project? Maybe Lego was going to release 3 LotR waves but had to cancel plans due to the Hobbit movies being split into 3, or due to poor wave 2 LotR sales? Maybe it's not Lego's fault at all and it is all WB and PJ's doing (this wouldn't be unthinkable considering the huge lack of Hobbit merchandise and issues other companies seem to be having with Hobbit stuffl...)? Regardless of what has happened, I think Lego COULD get by with just one more LotR set. The only new molds it would need are the Witch King's crown and a Gondor Soldier helmet. It doesn't even need a Fel Beast, give us a chunk of white wall, the Witch King (with crown AND black hood to be used as Nazgul as well), Eowyn (with new print but all re-used pieces), 2 Mordor Orcs (preferably with a new print and hair/ears) and 2 Gondor Soldiers (new prints). There you go, pretty much all the big stuff people want done in one small $30 army builder with relatively few new molds (though lots of new prints). Make it a special D2C? If Lego did this I think they would pretty much satisfy all LotR fans and keep us on board for future Lego projects. As it stands a lot of us just have a bad taste in our mouths. I honestly don't think I will be buying any more Lego after the LotR/Hobbit lines end if we don't get some Gondor stuff. Leaving such a huge faction unrepresented makes me question future Lego decisions, especially with the lackluster wave 2 that coulda been so much more. I mighta been interested in future Caslte sets had Lego done a better job with the LotR and Hobbit themes...

And World of Warcraft came out with dwarves who had Ram in 2004 which was four years earlier than that I think Bolg is the only one we can realistically expect to have a new mold (if we even get him...). I dunno about a crowned Thorin, if we were going to get him wouldn't he have been in the Erebor set so he can sit on his throne (even for a tiny bit? ). I suppose it depends on how he is portrayed in the movies the most, but I assume he will be without crown since that means one less new mold for Lego AND that is probably how he will be through most of the movie fighting and such. As for the dwarves and elves, I am thinking they might just get re-used Gimli helmets re-colored and elf ears and hair instead of crowns. Not perfect but I am not sure Lego will be able to justify new molds for them. Heck, who even knows if we are getting them in Lego form at this point. The Bo5A set seems to be the only set they could feasibly be placed in and it already looks like it is going to be jam packed with other characters (Bolg, Dain, armor Thranduil, Thorin...)

They woulda had to change the name to Battle of Four Armies if the Iron Hill Dwarves woulda been cut. That rumor was so far off and unbelievable PJ has been playing too much World of Warcraft methinks... Also, those are RAMS the dwarves are riding, not sissy goats people. THIS is a goat: THIS is a RAM!

That is just two scenes across three long films. In the Hobbit we pretty much get something like this ever action sequence, or worse the WHOLE scene is this kind of silly nonsense. Well Smaug had been sleeping for how long when Bilbo woke him up? And it's mentioned he NEVER leaves the mountain? Not only is he probably fat and out of shape from years of doing nothing, he is pretty groggy when the dwarves come after him. Thorin even calls Smaug a slug and constantly taunts him. As for why Smaug was not able to hurt even one dwarf but killed thousands of soldiers? I view that as Thorin and company engaging in a more gorilla warfare type of fighting rather than up front lets try to throw everything we have and try to over power you brute strength style the dwarf soldiers used. In those corridors and small chambers Thorin's style works to their benefit. Not only that, when Smaug originally attacked Erebor most of the dwarves were caught off guard (kinda like Smaug was with Thorin and company attacking him). They weren't expecting to be attacked and were full of themselves thinking they were invincible so it took them completely by surprise. Imagine Pearl Harbor if it were to be compared to a real life event. You can't underestimate the element of surprise. I always thought it was even more silly in the book Thorin and his company of 12 dwarves, a Hobbit, and a wizard were going to kill Smaug yet they had NO plans on how to do so and seemed even less versed in the ways of combat (they killed very few goblins in Goblin Town and didn't fight the trolls or Mirkwood Spiders pretty much at all). At least in the films the dwarves have some combat skills and Thorin has a clear plan... steal back the Arkenstone so he can use it to unite all the dwarves and then try and face Smaug with the entire dwarven might. In the book the Arkenstone doesn't signify leadership or anything at all, it's just a big pretty stone everyone wants. Well the Hobbit book was originally a children's novel and when Tolkien wrote LotR he intentionally wrote it more dark and menacing. Regardless I think people are referring more to the action sequences when talking about how cartoony the Hobbit is, not so much the locations or settings. Having mythical creatures and races and even magic is fine in fantasy. That is what it's all about after all. Totally disregarding physics and gravity are another thing. The action sequences in the Hobbit feel more like they are from a super hero movie than a fantasy one. LotR nailed it perfect, the combat was intense and action packed but not ridiculous and unbelievable. You see Legolas doing a FEW crazy things, but you don't see Gimli rolling down the path of Helm's Deep like a Donkey Kong barrel knocking all the Uruk-hai off. In fact that brings up a good point.. Gimli needs Aragorn to throw him from the edge of Helm's Deep to the path cause he can't make the jump... yet in the Hobbit the dwarves are all doing jumps like this and more in Goblin Town

Ahh, ok. Smaug's body and wings would definitely work if nothing else. They aren't ideal though considering Smaug's wings have three claws and Fel Beast only have one, as well as Smaug is WAY bigger than a Fel Beast (he is at least triple the size, if not more).