kelceycoe

I may be generalizing too much. You can tell the difference between an American box and boxes that many fans claimed are from the UK but may just as well be European boxes. For the 1989-1992 (about that time) American boxes had the ages listed on the front. European boxes listed these on one of the sides. That's the only way to tell looking at the boxes online. I've never had an European box so I am unable to know much else (like weight difference, dimensions, etc).

After doing some more research, a user on Facebook gave some brief info about the set, saying it was a promotional limited set and gave box pics: https://www.facebook.com/share/p/1DFo2zNeSg/ And the guy who supplied the info for this post talked bout it possibly being a Woolworth exclusive: Quote: My original info is still what I have and had it kind of confirmed by some more online research. The set was only sold during a brief period in 1990 in Woolworths UK. I also heard it got handed out as part of a promo, but that would be contradicted by the price label (so at least no free promo). Maybe it was a set you could get for a low price as a store bonus or something like that. Information is still VERY scarce. If you have any more info (or even photos of other sold sets with price stickers), please let me know!"

Under normal circumstances I'd agree but I cannot when the price is wrong lol. As for 1680... The ONLY evidence in existence that hints it was sold in the UK is the UK box found for this set on Bricklink: And this older listing on facebook complete with a woolworth price sticker: It was sold recently in E-bay from a seller in Bulgaria for over $300 USD - ONLY the parts and instructions and that person did list the full instructions, confirming that version of the set was made in 1990. https://www.ebay.com/itm/277008332939?_skw=lego+1680&epid=9053424680&itmmeta=01K7FWCDEESQ0GC90V68XMYTHS&hash=item407efbb88b:g:9GkAAOSwMKFn8SCn&itmprp=enc%3AAQAKAAAA8FkggFvd1GGDu0w3yXCmi1eNLZvw3DrfpGhZiHaFxIsDua%2BZNLlntY2fTGU75LBj%2BJlwsqkypWea4WOVws2cBbgqOCD52bvbMx8SPWERJZJ0TZ340CVMi%2BDPQ%2B5YeM7tI7yYcEpOs8AGL92eS%2BI5x6FppPSOD%2FIZldIs6259OyPwImUrizd33UyJA5tSQ1T4AI3XrWWvX3%2Fi3z0cdjkq0M3lUeylKbScrWb5TOH3lbxO9DR57szMjgw9WUVsv9GAe39%2BQLmvWyhR2zZ%2B18R51MTnBaDBgMXssqQunhPm00e0HpcvI6%2B4w8NmSMs%2FC4HOLg%3D%3D|tkp%3ABk9SR7DXsfy7Zg Also, in reference to 1877... pretty much any Value Pack I have found back then was only sold in the USA. I did not see it or 1680 in the 1990 UK catalog so

Those were both done by a flat bed scanner. Some of mine were done using a phone because my flat bed scanner has issues.

For 1680, I just bought the 1877 set and bought a separate extra minifigure because it was way cheaper than buying 1680 outright. That sold was sold in stores here in the United States. UPDATE; Photos removed because I linked to the 1989 Value pack set with the cart with the black fences. I cannot find any instance of 1680 in any UK catalog but 1877 does appear in the US Medium catalog on the Futuron page.

That is 100% correct! I had the Black Seas Barracuda, Eldorado Fortress and Forbidden Island in the same year (1989) and mine all had firing cannons!

Yes that is accurate. Those sets came to retail stores officially here in the USA in 1990. I do not know anything about Canada yet. As you will see in the page from the 1989 Shop at Home Catalog here in the United States, these four sets were available to those of us here in the United States starting August 1, 1989: Pirate Mini-Figures, Shipwreck Island, Castaway Raft, and Sabre Island They were also for sale in the Holiday 1989 catalog: https://www.flickr.com/photos/203530674@N07/albums/72177720329114990/with/54797131271/ As mentioned already, Lego Club members here in the United States could ONLY buy Buried Treasure and Harbour Sentry from the club magazine. If you look here, this is a Christmas catalog from Sears USA from 1989. This link should take you directly where the Lego Pirates sets are listed - only the "big four" I call them. They were marketed as having working cannons as well.

I posted somewhere else on this board that, yes while the first 4 big Pirate sets were first made to us in 1989, through the 1989 SAH catalog we could buy most of the other sets the UK got. And that bundle was a cool thing Leo did for club members. To clarify: As far as I can tell, only 6285 Black Seas Barracuda, 6276 Eldorado Fortress, 6270 Forbidden Island and 6274 Caribbean Clipper were actually sold in stores. The others COULD be bought here in the US but either through the 1989 shop at home catalog or that club magazine.

I thought everyone knew about these lol! I found a bunch of ads from Donald Duck on Archive.org a couple weeks ago. I searched for "donald duck" "lego" 1989 or something and found many that way. Our Medium catalog for 1989 only contained the four big pirates sets here in the USA. The 1990s one looked almost identical to the UK one above, minus the minifig set and comic book. Here's a 1990 NL catalog scan: https://archive.org/details/netherlands-Katalog_Lego-1990/page/n19/mode/2up

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In my continuation of updating vital Pirate information so everyone has the correct information - especially Influencers - I found a very good reliable source that dispels the full details to how it began. Across the Internet fans had hinted on it but never demonstrated any evidence that connected what we knew to actually how Pirates originated - until now! If you read the article published by Blocks Magazine, Issue 100, we learned - from Niels Milan Pedersen again - that in 1986 The Lego Group had actual Pirate models completed and ready to go BUT WAS DELAYED UNTIL 1986 because the Castle theme was so successful. But now - thanks to the book, The Secret Life of Lego Bricks, we actually learn - again through Niels Milan Pedersen - that Lego Pirates' origins began IMMEDIATELY after the launch of the Castle theme in 1984. https://www.flickr.com/photos/203530674@N07/54816846910/in/album-72177720329308752 I uploaded the pages from The Secret Life of Lego for everyone to read and see and learn about the Western theme's early cancellation (which most of us knew) but also details on Europa and Roman themes that haven't really been discussed anywhere else. I am still reading Brick by Brick. That book - which goes back and forth too much - has a lot of factual information about the rise/fall of Lego in the 1990s. Many of the wikis have the specific reasons correct but they're incorrect with the dates and I'll put the details about that in the appropriate forum at another time. TIMELINE OF Niels Milan Pedersen / PIRATES LINE: Summer 1980: Niels Milan Pedersen is hired by The Lego Group 1984: Castle is relaunched / Pirates are automatically envisioned 1986: Pirates theme / models completed and ready for launch ; 1986: Pirates Launch DELAYED due to success of Castle theme 1989: Pirates theme is launched throughout the world. 1990: America releases the rest of the 1989 Pirates line the rest of the world got in 1989 Are there any other magazines I should be made aware or books that give the full facts? I am NOT considering The Lego Book (all editions) valid due to the enormous amount of errors and how they're hastily organized/published.

Right now on here and in the minds of every archivist. I'm trying to redo my web site but at the same time having this info is helpful so the Influencers can get it right and stop passing off misleading info as correct. For example, I just read a about about Lego that discusses the origins of Pirates. Seems like everyone thinks they conceived it in 1987... but that's when they began devising plans for the comic book. The research I'm about to gather will "shake up" the Pirate community while revealing details about the Europa theme, the never-released Romans theme, and more and I'll include photos as well.

Also just confirmed from a seller on Ebay... Bonus Pack #1900 was also listed in the 1993 Summer SAH US 32page catalog. This same seller is selling 1464 - The polybag. So I imagine these were available in 1900 as polybags but also sold separately. I was more frugal as a kid so I likely opted against buying this set especially since I wasn't a fan of this pirate and its lack of accessories. Neither bonus pack was listed in 1993 SAH Imagination Book, 48 pages, which only had 2 pages devoted to Pirates. It did list Rock Island Refuge, a 1991 set, but introduced as new 5059 (Pirate elements with Islanders pieces a whole year before their debut) and 6252 Sea Mates

Yes when you get a chance please grab photos of the Australian 1992 catalog. Information is like is desperately needed to help collect data and provide accurate information. I didn't want to come of as an arrogant American but in my experience Australia is somehow connected with the UK and in one of the companies I work with if you're in Australia and buy something it's shipped from a UK warehouse so I suspected Australian catalogs were almost carbon copies with only prices differing.

That's good to know, photos would be nice. Did you buy yours directly from a retail store in Australia or from a seller who may have imported it from Europe? Did Australia normally get the European versions of sets, for some reason?

Recently I made a list of all the known North American exclusive sets and even polybags, etc. However, when researching sets released in 1992 I found myself running into a problem: There is no evidence that 1696 - as a boxed set with 1696 - was EVER released anywhere outside of Europe. I also am suggesting that 1464 was the North American version. However, I only have one 1994 SAH US catalog and none from the UK and it does not mention which set number appeared in the 1994 Value Pack numbered 1900. https://brickipedia.fandom.com/wiki/1900_Special_Bonus_Pack?file=1900-1.png So as of right now, I can only speculate. Why? Because the Brickipedia listing for 1900 claims its 1696 that's included in this bundle. However, there is no evidence suggesting which set number and the one catalog entry at Brickpedia is unsourced: https://brickipedia.fandom.com/wiki/1900_Special_Bonus_Pack What's worse? Bricklink has a conflicting date for this Value pack as 1993: https://www.bricklink.com/v2/catalog/catalogitem.page?S=1900-1#T=I However, this directed me to search the 1993 SAH catalogs and, of course, Brickipedia is wrong and Bricklink is right. In the Spring 1993 SAH Catalog, on page 17 you can see this set listed - but by its name, NOT its number. What's worse... NONE of the catalogs in 1992 I have and NONE of the two in 1993 even mention 1464 (probably why Brickset lists it as a retailer set since those eventually made the catalog a year after they were released). https://brickset.com/library/catalogues Can ANYONE verify is this Bonus Pack was even made available to sell since it was only seen once and does anyone have any other information - besides the polybag for 1464 and box from 1696 showing them for sale anywhere? If not all we have to go by is what people have listed on Ebay and past auction sites and I stand by my original statement... 1464 is the number for the US REtail polybag 1696 was available only in Europe in a box Set Bonus Pack #1900 contained Pirate's Lookout - we do NOT have a specific set number listed for the Pirate set and ultimately it's irrelevant since, as far as we can tell, the sets are the same but packaged differently. HOWEVER I believe this find on E-bay suggests I am correct and that 1696 was available as a special promotional item in France (this seller is from Germany): https://www.ebay.com/itm/127351700076?_skw=lego+6266&epid=22053598830&itmmeta=01K5SZ924NM4PMAAWG809PWKKR&hash=item1da6c0ba6c:g:xrgAAOSwRXtn7RR7&itmprp=enc%3AAQAKAAAA0FkggFvd1GGDu0w3yXCmi1evtSILJWgO3Zi%2B6OueICT6X1MIDDJKeOcuXmmx%2FMEdmt%2FvWn47jz2ieQlklqoNwAADfGAFjBWnlpJyBKgu62eTijhKGqZbk8sbobBJqz9m1ERpjQ%2FoZ0LFLDCfGwQaIIhAoUebwqaWygPvlpmB2Rjuh9ED%2FQ9bWeBrFspmTxGUBGApz4DtUoWh5roRNbuUMBXCa1KHSLzxeu4WcI0Ot1jeQw3m6miLQN6PEa7ozj7NI7SEah7IIG9nKobWAfRMKEA%3D|tkp%3ABk9SR7iipL-uZg FURTHER UPDATE: As I was searching for 1464, other sets with the numerical sequence 146* popped up and I noticed these were the same sets in the Bonus pack. My discovery also led me to find 1695, which also has a polybag that lookes similar to 1463. https://www.ebay.com/itm/205708200682?_skw=lego+1463&itmmeta=01K5T3PN1TVJ5EM8NHSF15A7DR&hash=item2fe52a0aea:g:4vgAAOSwho5i7VVM&itmprp=enc%3AAQAKAAAA8FkggFvd1GGDu0w3yXCmi1d8B7h1SqHo0yJ9BizjTqSEqNO%2B2MJrl8Z6DhTOWFnfVcdDyVU3twBroaP0QcNcNbuONiggfM0uaPc6di%2BLmRGyoLCo9mbJtncenp584%2FJvXYmuH4hHEr8lQriaYYzZ8ibAH3OisMcmNFATTHHpfm7eDNdiT7DSTa1kkTeknZM3mkG39rFQUDRC5PUzTvYuvJhqTGnqcpK67zJo7CjNCTJqgoJdRrsl3Q8f%2FbDiQO8LWIDghVh5pheiPWnX8LynSSD4rsZOSE7Zn98MRznLeGRltprZMcTI%2BbDTclCNHr3%2Flw%3D%3D|tkp%3ABk9SR5TR2sOuZg Same thing with Galactic Scount 1462 and 1694 https://www.ebay.com/itm/136073939262?_skw=lego+Galactic+Scout&epid=24053420534&itmmeta=01K5T44QSEKSP40ECMXAWQ0NCA&hash=item1faea3893e:g:3bQAAeSwG~loYFLg&itmprp=enc%3AAQAKAAAA0FkggFvd1GGDu0w3yXCmi1dLfGOUIynh%2Fh4bXuV24vaH%2Blq9ryYWvt4lxbnfxgwjC2SLOPUevjeOFY2AQ1xP4WYmh1dJlwzc1Zu8FFol5c4diYBIfBfDRzvNSjm4hgrANNd7pCikvLJ7dVX95skvZrPix75uSNdj3oFLBnZ%2BDP7pw39I7bJaobbv6A7lkjNWhroHxcW030dfubcy49NBuiHkfHpGEhe0kfCaoIAE42kvMoL0HwguYcDNR7%2F7Mivv54BpzuUVsqGbdzKyrzDs2PE%3D|tkp%3ABk9SR_j8ksSuZg https://www.ebay.com/itm/317045937792?_skw=lego+Galactic+Scout&epid=18053427876&itmmeta=01K5T44QSEBBZ0J31MV1MDXB27&hash=item49d1691680:g:~1wAAeSwKc5oY~5N&itmprp=enc%3AAQAKAAAA8FkggFvd1GGDu0w3yXCmi1f9wjOpsGl6Qu0CDFIpY2LwbibNI2vlZTVxzDJVlYlaSmV9%2F2YCR2YpWrWrYYiIkTm7K0VekQCzgggmXmQVt4TzlaohrEOYnIZ8hUplOG78hubHpdAnRPWsOmqD9vdlLa4azssjksa73aeDi4U9XSdMpHBby7nbgmo5N%2F5VsAfeer%2FPunXprT6VF9yLwrFyX99jWVTXuMnMAnTYSUv0C3QSnjPRNNYpK1%2Fe090Lt70PuYCLZbsBmfeSUzyOrNvphy9rct06me02uBtheHeUf0ymjFXvQu9VIcWx5ulUhNacew%3D%3D|tkp%3ABk9SR_j8ksSuZg LATER UPDATE: This whole USA Polybag vs Europe Boxes dilemma extended to Shipwrecked Pirate - 1713 Polybag and 1733 Boxed AND 1747 / 1802.

Yes here

Those weren't mine and photos I took off of Ebay. Best we have until someone else with that book scans them.

I just uploaded these new documents I hadn't seen on the Internet before. I hope you enjoy them since all but the Builder's Club form had Pirate content (The Builder Club form is what you would have gotten in any of the four Pirate sets released in 1989). 1989 Builder's Club Brochure 1989 Parent's Guide 1989 SAH Holiday Catalog (Partial) 1990 Parent's Guide 1991 Parent's Guide 1992 Parent's Guide https://www.flickr.com/photos/203530674@N07/albums/72177720329145684

As many of you know, I have been frantically trying to gather as much information as possible about vintage Pirate Lego sets, mainly here in America because we had sooo many changes in product design (boxes) and availability (cannon types). Not to mention, as we near the 40 year mark, we are faced with a serious problem: Not too many unopened MISB original sets exist and the ones that have been opened and logged have likely been lost to time or simply their contents weren't logged. This information is helpful especially to both buyers and sellers in knowing what they are facing. Some sets, like 1989's Buried Treasure, went through differences over the years - The 1989-1991 versions contained treasure chests without slots and thin-hinged lids as well as solid-stud heads, while the 1992 version - impossible to know if you have it even if you have the box unopened - changed to the 1992 changes of hollow stud heads and slotted chests. Not to mention I read that someone's set did not come with any inserts but a 1992 copy actually came with the 1992 Pirates leaflet as well as a Club leaflet, for example. Not Piratey, but I also found one 1991 set (6509) with a 1991,1993 copyright on the box that complied with the ASTM F963-92 toy standard, not the 1986 one the early Pirate sets did. Anyway, on with this show, so to speak... In 1991, The Lego Group continued to use the same yellow packaging as they had been doing since 1978 (the older LEGOLAND white with five-color flag had been started in 1966, although Brickipedia claims LEGOLAND would be started s a theme in 1969). However, something was missing - these yellow boxes were known to fans as "blue-on-yellow" and, you guessed it, the blue LEGOLAND logo had been removed for ALL 1991 Pirate sets introduced that year. This is very strange and I consider this another transitional period. For the record, I have not examined if Europe and other regions' sets reflected these changes, so unless I say otherwise, everything I am talking about is simply about American packaging. BUT in 1992, one of the worst things that could happen to Lego Pirate packaging happened - the boxes were now purple and branded with the SYSTEM logo and crappy Pirates logo (But PURPLE? That's unforgiven!). Now I have been researching to see when The Lego Group "went wrong" so to speak with drastic changes and this is definitely the beginning (more on this topic later as I am still trying to narrow down the facts). Not only this, but in this year all of the minifigure heads were now hollow AND the treasure chests had slots in them (this was a great move since the originals wore out very fast and easy). Additional color note: Castle kept the yellow; Town got Blue; Space got Black and Paradisa had Pink. So I am using this time to list all of the Lego Pirate sets released first in 1991 AND THEN REPACKAGED IN 1992. Also worthy to note, any Pirate sets released in 1989 and 1990 retained their same blue-on-yellow LEGOLAND packages with their original copyright dates: Here in the USA, only Black Seas Barracuda, Forbidden Island, Eldorado Fortress, and Caribbean Clipper had a 1989 date on the box while every other 1989 set released here in the USA in 1990 had a 1989, 1990 date - as far as I can tell. We already know both Shop at Home and Club members were given opportunities to buy all the other sets (minus the comic) in 1989 here in the USA BUT I have yet to see concrete evidence to what their packaging looked like (and it is only a guess they used the 1989, 1990 date - assuming they were even actually released at all). (Note all of my photos are in albums so follow them and you can see more of the boxes) Also, note the box art on the yellow 1991 boxes below reflect the new cannon changes since none of the 1990 boxes included changed box or instruction art. I have NOT investigated most boxes for sets produced/released for 1993-1997 so I am unaware if any of those had any changes but I hope to report back with any if they did. 1991 Yellow Box - 1992 Purple Box Comparison: 6234 Renegade's Raft : 6259 Broadside's Brig: 6267 Lagoon Lock-Up 6273 Rock Island Refuge

You're welcome but I wanted to help clarify there were only two Maniac commercials, period, that year and not just for the Pirates line. I think the 1990 Dealer catalog will be even more insightful since that's the year we got the all of the 1989 Pirate sets a once here in the USA but I only found 4 hard to read pages and nothing about Pirates.

I know it's been 13 years but you noted there were no promotional materials inside... do you still happen to have the box and can you photograph the copyright side? To my knowledge none of these American boxes, except for the big four Pirate sets of 1989, has just a 1989 copyright date but also a 1989, 1990 date.

My sincerest apologies as I quickly skimmed pages 28-29. In the 1989 Toy Fair Dealer Catalog for he United States of America, the Lego Pirates line was only introduced but not actually featured. If you look on the table of contents on page 3, you'll notice you do not see Pirates anywhere yet at least 4 sets appear on pages 28-29. Why? Because I overlooked what page 28 says - Advertising and Promotion. This was a subchapter for the LEGOLAND chapter. The text on Page 28, while the page itself displays some Pirates info, reflects the promotional marketing plan for December 1988-December 1989, in that the ENTIRE yer would only see TWO commercials promoting Legoland sets - ONE in FIRST QUARTER (I am guessing January-March) and ONE in the FOURTH quarter (October-December). What we know now about the commercials thanks to archivists is that this was referring to these 2 Lego Maniac commercials: Town/Space Lego Maniac USA Commercial : Castle/Pirates Lego Maniac USA Commercial: It should also be noted that I have found December 1989 airings of the Castle/Pirates commercial during the Rudolph the Red-Nosed Reindeer airing here in the USA: https://archive.org/details/capture-a-4544 There were also commercials for the 1989 Lego McDonalds Happy Meal toys released here in the United States. The Lego Motion campaign ran from July 28 through August 24 in 1989. I have found 2, one featuring Dick Christie who played the boy's dad in the weirdly-hit 80s sitcom, Small Wonder. I am sharing them below. The Happy Meal toys weren't anything fancy and honestly too reminiscent of Lego era prior to 1978 with its blocky bricks construction and more of a major advertising win for Lego (despite having success in 1986 with McDonalds already): Better quality: McDonalds even used their own mascot - Ronald McDonald - to promote these sets: And just for the fun of it, because unlike Europe which released all of the original Pirates sets in 1989, here in the United States the Big Four were available to retailers with the 1990 SAH catalog claiming they were making four smaller sets available to catalog customers August 1989 (no confirmation this ever happened - also, every box I have ever found for these sets had a 1989, 1990 copyright date; only the Big Four had a sole 1989 date. ALL of the 1989 sets in Europe had a 1989 date but I have not seen of 1990 was ever added to any in Europe). 1990 is really when the Pirates line took off here in the United States and was officially launched here in the United States, so the 1990 US Toy Fair Dealer Catalog is now heavily sought after for scans/photos of every page. So for the fun of it, this was the commercial for the Pirates line here in the United States: UPDATE: 9/16/2025 : I have found further evidence that Lego did reuse commercials in later years. This 1990 commercial was reused towards the end of 1991 with new voice-over naming the actual 3 sets: https://archive.org/details/capture-a-1370 I did NOT remember Lego doing this but they re-released a 1987 commercial for 1989; in this case they used the Thomas Edison commercial (for the record they did at least one ore like this homaging the Wright Brothers): https://archive.org/details/capture-a-3992 ADDED BONUS: The Pirates line, as you have seen above, was co-promoted with the Castle theme in 1989. This was done in the above commercial and again in the small leaflet/poster/mini-sheet/one-sheet found in small Lego sets in America : https://archive.org/details/1989-lego-mini-pirates-castle-us-catalog/mode/2up They each had their own mini-catalogs in 1990: https://archive.org/details/1990-lego-mini-pirates-catalog/page/n1/mode/2up https://archive.org/details/1993-lego-mini-castle-catalog They also each had their own sheets in 1989 Europe: https://www.bricklink.com/v2/catalog/catalogitem.page?C=m89eupi#T=S&O={"iconly":0} Note: I *may* update the first post of this thread later with this new information to make it all clearer.

Thanks to a recent E-bay seller, we now have very good phone photos of this highly in demand catalog. I was able to save them from Ebay and uploaded them for everyone to enjoy. A bit of disappointment but neat nevertheless. View and download these "scans" here: https://archive.org/details/lego1989toyfaircatalog What do you think the other Pirates commercial was? I know about the Pirates / Castle Lego Maniac commercial (it aired fourth quarter and you can find some recordings of it along with many program airings, such as a December airing of Rudolph the Red-Nosed Reindeer in 1989) but I don't think I have seen another Lego Pirates USA commercial.

Anyone know what the difference was during the 1980s and 1990s : How did Lego define small, medium, and large? Because back then the smaller sets got 1 page mini-sheet catalogs while the medium and large sets got the medium catalog (here in the US) and large sets got the Large catalog in Europe.