Lok24 Posted January 18 Posted January 18 10 minutes ago, Mr Hobbles said: For the new Lego Education Science components?! No, for the Porsche 42176 you mentioned, sorry if that was misunderstood. Quote
Mr Hobbles Posted January 18 Posted January 18 5 hours ago, Lok24 said: No, for the Porsche 42176 you mentioned, sorry if that was misunderstood. Ah yes, right. Yes, it has very basic LWP3 support - mainly for the specific VM commands used by the Control+ app. While the hub reports a suite of motors and sensors, the LWP3 implementation is woefully buggy and incomplete. Actually similar to the Boost Move Hub years ago before they updated the hub. Additionally, TLG made the hub required signed firmware, making it so Pybricks can’t be loaded onto the hub. I hope they push out some updates for the Technic Move Hub, otherwise it can’t really be used as a proper LWP3 hub for scenarios other than an RC car. Quote
Selander Posted February 12 Posted February 12 I saw today that there has been a clearance sales on shop@home for the 2ch Powered Up hub....88009....50% off, and now out of stock. This is the Swedish s@h website... https://www.lego.com/en-se/product/hub-88009 Quote
Vilhelm22 Posted February 12 Posted February 12 (edited) In the UK, the hub, medium linear motor, remote, and train motor are all saying "Sold Out", as is the PU-powered Loop Coaster. The two trains currently available (at least in Europe still) are 60337 and 60198, both forecast by usual logic to be discontinued at the end of this year. Colour/distance sensor and large angular motor have completely disappeared from the PU page on LEGO.com. Taking into account success and timescale, I'd expect the Grand Piano, lighthouse, and Liebherr Crawler Crane all to be discontinued at the end of this year. This leaves only the Technic hub, Technic battery box, and large motor, and the Technic Audi RSQ e-Tron which uses only these components. Seems to me as though by the end of this year, Powered Up is dead. I never got round to motorising my copy of 10277 - hopefully it'll fit a PF motor, RC chip and 2S LiPo. Edited February 12 by Vilhelm22 Quote
LegoAlf Posted February 13 Posted February 13 I bought five train motors 88011 last year for the planned conversion of some older locomotives - using an ESP8266 or ESP32 as a replacement for the quite expensive PU hub. Meanwhile I'm totally off the battery powered train track and will try to convert modern train motors back to 9V, as I did for 12V. I could never really make friends with battery powered trains. I'll keep an eye on what Lego will come out with as a successor to PU. But this will no longer be an option for motorizing my locomotives. I may use the new technology for switches and other things. Of course, that will also be a future price question. Lego has become quite expensive. Quote
Toastie Posted February 13 Posted February 13 10 hours ago, Vilhelm22 said: This leaves only the Technic hub, Technic battery box, and large motor This website (no idea where they get their information from, maybe it is all fake) says, these three items are retiring in 2025: https://www.brickfanatics.com/every-lego-set-retiring-this-year-and-beyond/#retiring-technic-sets Regards Thorsten Quote
ejayb Posted February 13 Posted February 13 Checked the half priced hubs in the morning, sold out by the noon when I went to order. I’d be using custom/third party electronics if anything existed like the rotation sensor motors and PiD control Quote
Phil B Posted February 27 Author Posted February 27 The hubs I ordered in December finally shipped and arrived today. The train motors are still backordered and (according to the CS lady) have no ship date assigned. She was going to remove them from my order but I told her kindly but firmly to leave them on. Quote
ejayb Posted February 27 Posted February 27 (edited) I'm interested to see what replaces Powered Up, but seeing as the firmware on the new Porsche hub is signed and PyBricks cannot be installed, I'm not very hopeful. I just got a hub, remote and a few extra bits for a good price second hand. I need to keep an eye out for more, as well as 88008 motors. Edited February 27 by ejayb Quote
Selander Posted February 27 Posted February 27 (edited) Over at the Technic theme group, there's a vivid discussion about PuP.....seems as for 2025 only the (physically) large "Porsche hub" with integrated motors&led:s will be included in high end Technic sets .. https://www.bricklink.com/v2/catalog/catalogitem.page?P=103479c01#T=C&C=86 Given the fact Lego train is a diminishing niche within TLG:s portfolio, I wonder if this is the end for sales and development of new specific train motorization... (current PuP beeing the last generation). TLG could still develop and sell unmotorized push along train sets. Like Orient Express ... Aficionados will have no problem powering them by using old stuff or 3rd party solutions... Edited February 27 by Selander Spelling mistake Quote
Phil B Posted February 27 Author Posted February 27 The Train motor is still showing as "Temporarily Out of Stock" on the LEGO website in the US, which is the status that LEGO assigns to products that will eventually come back. I'm keeping my hopes up. Quote
Space78 Posted February 27 Posted February 27 (edited) 1 hour ago, Phil B said: The Train motor is still showing as "Temporarily Out of Stock" on the LEGO website in the US, which is the status that LEGO assigns to products that will eventually come back. I'm keeping my hopes up. Yes, but once in a while the status goes from "Temporarily Out of Stock" to "Sold Out" or "Retired" without ever coming back in stock. Personally, I am not expecting the PUp train motors to come back. They have been out of stock for a very long time. I suspect Lego does not want to announce they are "retired" until they have announced the replacement (assuming there will be one), and also to not hinder sales of train sets that have the PUp motor included. Other evidence of PUp's retirement is the clearance sales on PUp components some regions have seen. I mean, I could be totally wrong, but I just don't see any evidence Lego is continuing PUp. Edited February 27 by Space78 Quote
Phil B Posted February 27 Author Posted February 27 2 hours ago, Space78 said: Yes, but once in a while the status goes from "Temporarily Out of Stock" to "Sold Out" or "Retired" without ever coming back in stock. Personally, I am not expecting the PUp train motors to come back. They have been out of stock for a very long time. I suspect Lego does not want to announce they are "retired" until they have announced the replacement (assuming there will be one), and also to not hinder sales of train sets that have the PUp motor included. Other evidence of PUp's retirement is the clearance sales on PUp components some regions have seen. I mean, I could be totally wrong, but I just don't see any evidence Lego is continuing PUp. The Hub was on sale (I bought a few of them in December), and they just shipped last week. So to me that sounds like the sale is not a "Clearance" event. Quote
zephyr1934 Posted February 28 Posted February 28 On 2/27/2025 at 1:24 AM, Selander said: TLG could still develop and sell unmotorized push along train sets. Like Orient Express ... Aficionados will have no problem powering them by using old stuff or 3rd party solutions... If they release an equivalent to the L motor in whatever the next gen electronics might be we could still power trains legally (grin) Quote
M_slug357 Posted February 28 Posted February 28 It would be great if we could get smaller, more robust motors in the next wave though! Why does everything hafta get bigger? Looking esp. at that weird all-in-one brick in that's in set #42176 https://brickset.com/sets/42176-1/Porsche-GT4-e-Performance-Race-Car Quote
Phil B Posted March 19 Author Posted March 19 Train Motor 88011 now has a backorder date of 3/30 on the US Shop at Home site. Looks like this was just a temporary shortage. Quote
LegoAlf Posted March 20 Posted March 20 This seems unlikely as the german SAH site lists this item as "sold out" (as well as the 88009 hub). And the remote 22010 is marked as "sell out". Even the danish SAH site states that the motor is sold out. Sad news, but I'd bet these things won't get back in stock. Quote
Phil B Posted March 20 Author Posted March 20 1 hour ago, LegoAlf said: This seems unlikely as the german SAH site lists this item as "sold out" (as well as the 88009 hub). And the remote 22010 is marked as "sell out". Even the danish SAH site states that the motor is sold out. Sad news, but I'd bet these things won't get back in stock. Both Hub and Train motor are "Backordered. Ships by 3/30/2025" on the US site. Quote
zephyr1934 Posted March 21 Posted March 21 13 hours ago, Phil B said: Both Hub and Train motor are "Backordered. Ships by 3/30/2025" on the US site. Indeed, that could mean they are coming back, e.g., a couple of years ago the small hub was backordered/sold out for 6 months. But it could also mean that they are listing remaining stock as it is found and will then go to sold out once it is gone. Given the fact that other PU elements are no longer listed at all (color sensor, large motor), I suspect that this is simply a final cleaning out. I would so much prefer to have one motorization system they keep improving rather than having many successive incompatible motor systems. While that is typical Lego to do something like that, it is so counter to the spirit of the Lego system to do so. Quote
Phil B Posted March 21 Author Posted March 21 10 hours ago, zephyr1934 said: Indeed, that could mean they are coming back, e.g., a couple of years ago the small hub was backordered/sold out for 6 months. But it could also mean that they are listing remaining stock as it is found and will then go to sold out once it is gone. Given the fact that other PU elements are no longer listed at all (color sensor, large motor), I suspect that this is simply a final cleaning out. I would so much prefer to have one motorization system they keep improving rather than having many successive incompatible motor systems. While that is typical Lego to do something like that, it is so counter to the spirit of the Lego system to do so. I think it just means that they are having trouble getting an electrical system out there that meets all their technical needs, all their customers needs, and all their financial needs. My 2 orders of 2 train motors that I placed in December have finally shipped. US listings for the hubs and the motors now show "Will ship in 60 days". Quote
Toastie Posted March 21 Posted March 21 11 hours ago, zephyr1934 said: While that is typical Lego to do something like that, it is so counter to the spirit of the Lego system to do so. 100% agreed - I believe it is simply a business model. Once the market is partially "saturated" and things slow down, they jump to another system, so that the next frenzy breaks out. Some will wine and tell it is the worst electrical system ever, some will clap and call it the best electrical system ever, and TLG will stuff the new system into their sets, regardless what the customers reactions are. As you said: Their typical behavior, has always been like that. Best Thorsten Quote
Jon Reynolds Posted March 21 Posted March 21 It is very apparent that there are differences between the fundamental principles of Lego as in (a) the compatibility with the original bricks from the 1950s/1960s and now and (b) the compatibility of the last control/electric system with the current control/electric system. It is a sad reflection of our throwaway word that the older systems are not longer marketed by Lego however the enthusiast users have received support for 3rd party suppliers offering products copying the PF system. It is possible that, should Lego move on from the PU system, 3rd party manufacturers will move in to support this market in a similar way. Personally, I think the 9V system was the pinnacle of robustness and longevity but I can see the advantages of the later systems, in particular PU. There is potential for Lego to develop this further and I would like to see them continue with this theme for many reasons. Whichever way they go, I would expect a rechargeable LI battery to fit with the ethos of The LEGO Group better than single use or rechargeable AAA type batteries that we are forced to use. Whilst we are on the subject of the power systems produced by or potentially developed by Lego, I would like to bring up trains again. We have beed bored senseless by the reasons Lego changed to plastic track with the inconvenient and evironmentally poor battery system but there remains the possibility of a short metal 'charge track' that could provide a small burst of recharging power to a battery train as it passes. I am aware that this may elevate the age range but think of the environment 'points' Lego could score as a toy maker by eliminating throwaway batteries! I would add that I'm of an age that enjoyed the excitement of a bit of risk and adventure so I express some sadness in how the modern world would deny this solution to my grandchildren. I really do hope the world wakes up to this and re-thinks the current approach to 'progress' Jon Quote
zephyr1934 Posted March 22 Posted March 22 16 hours ago, Toastie said: As you said: Their typical behavior, has always been like that. Not always, just the last 20 years . Even then, the first RC system was a train wreck and needed to be replaced. But PF was good, even had backwards compatible cables. But then they lost the thread. If there is a new system coming, hopefully they do not change the connectors again. Quote
Toastie Posted March 22 Posted March 22 (edited) On 3/22/2025 at 7:02 AM, zephyr1934 said: Not always, just the last 20 years Hmmm - true. However ... there was the 4.5V/12V system, which is really of highest flexibility as you can plug and play as you see fit. Then the possibility of wrong polarity became a bad thing - and out with it, 9V was here. Compatibility: Zero. 9V was a really nice replacement and used all over the TLG universe. But: No semi-smart devices, "just" power, so PF came in. Yes, there was compatibility with 9V, that was really nice. However the CodePilot/Cybermaster/RCX/SCOUT folks became a little upset when 9V was not replaced with PF plugs but - uhmm - these telephone jacks, having a proprietary "position" of that little thingy making it TLG specific. And safe of course - as time progresses, people become more and more stupid, so they for sure would have tried to hook up a phone to the NXT brick, to call-in for help. And yes, the footprint of the telephone cables was much smaller than 9V terminals, and smarter! The more wires one has, the more data can flow. PF was more a muscle thing, the Technic freaks love so much. And train folks were happy with the adapter cable. But then came PUp - more data needed to flow, 6 wires required. TLG did BLE to communicate with a smart device as "controller", but solid 6 wires to connect to the actuators and sensors ... So what's next? 8 wires? Or wireless? If the latter, 2 wires for powering are good enough ... which brings us back to ... 4.5/12V or 9V (two wires). Using a bridge rectifier, at a cost of < $ 0.01 when mass-producing, would even eliminate the danger of electronic destruction. As they say in Ghostbusters - the possibilities are unlimited ... Hey, Dean Jaeger ... I am sure that there will be a new connection system. It is 2025 and there is this wheel in perpetual motion. (I have fully reverted to 4.5/12/9V, and I am happy) All the best Thorsten Edited March 23 by Toastie Quote
Selander Posted March 23 Posted March 23 Something I've learned the past 30 years as a Lego train afol are the fantastic adaptation skills in this community. Each change of electric/electronical generation (4,5V -> 12V -> 9V -> PF -> PuP -> nn...) has been gradually accepted and creative people made good use of what was currently available. So I'm not too troubled about PuP possibly retiring. Some Afols will stay with an "old" system, some will "combine" systems and some will embrace the "new".... Even if TLG would discontinue the train theme as such, there are already several 3rd party suppliers that can step in and fill the space.... Quote
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