Powered Up - A tear down...

[kbalage]

10 hours ago, Asher said:

Thanks where is a good reference to do this?

This is a video that might help you get started, and you can use my code block guide as well.

[Brickthus]

On 3/29/2021 at 9:49 AM, kbalage said:

I'm sorry but I disagree. There's a huge crowd out there who does not want to touch Powered Up because it requires coding and understanding coding principles like start blocks, loops, variables, conditions etc. A straightforward step by step configuration in the app is fundamentally different from coding, even if the latter has examples and error messages. 

The basic user experience needs to be simplified to a level that becomes comparable to the physical assembly of a Power Functions motor/controller/remote combination.

I'm taking my first steps in opening up the hardware.  Using the official route (not cutting cables yet), I opened my 51515 Robot Inventor Kit Distance Sensor with a Torx T6 bit (not T7 as I read previously).

To begin with I'm emulating the simple devices, which will allow the PU hub to control my own devices using the standard control patterns from the handset or software (train motor, gearmotor or light brick).  Philo's page shows the connections to make to set the device IDs but there is another step to connect to the Distance Sensor rear half 8-pin connector.

The Distance Sensor port has 2 unused pins separating the 2 motor pins on the right from the 4 control pins on the left (Gnd, +3V3, ID1 and ID2).  The port is very small, too small for 1/0.6 wire, so I found some smaller stuff from an old electronics kit.

The connections shown on the breadboard (green & black links) are for emulating a train motor, allowing variable speed control; ID1 to +3V3 and ID2 to Gnd.  The leads to the multimeter measure the motor output voltage.

I have just tested a PF M-motor successfully, connecting it in parallel with the meter leads, using a 9V to 12V lead with 1/0.6 wires attached and a 9V to PF lead.  This allows the PU handset and hub to drive the PF motor with variable speed.  I know a 3rd-party lead is available for driving PF motors but I will be doing more varied experiments, some including a PF power supply (LiPo or mains source likely) so that the PU hub batteries are doing only the Bluetooth communications.  If only TLG had made a Bluetooth Receiver like the PF IR Receiver!

I hope this goes some way to keeping it simple, in order to drive PF or 9V devices from PU, using the non-phone-dependent handset and standard motor drive protocols.  I hope this will make PU a bit more useful.  I find the 2-Port hub and handset useful because they are not phone-dependent.  I also find the 6-Port hub useful because it can have downloaded programs from a PC or other device and can operate independently.  I have more problem with the 4-Port hub because the phone controls are not as precise as the train handset; I don't get the play value out of the Technic sets that use them.  If only the firmware would understand 1 or 2 train handsets without a phone being needed to connect them.

I just found the train sets and Robot Inventor Kit on discount and bought some more - more 2-port hubs, handsets and another Distance Sensor to open up!

Mark

[teran]

On 9/28/2020 at 3:35 PM, biasedlogic said:

Hi gals and guys...

I'm new around here and after reading this extremely interesting and useful thread I registered to add my own $0.02 to it.

I have worked out a way to 3D print a very usable plug that fits the Powered Up connectors and can provide a way to connect Power Functions motor to a Powered Up hub (it will pretend to be either a WeDo motor or a train motor).

I have posted an article about it on my microsite https://www.biasedlogic.com/index.php/lego-powered-up-connector/

This is how it looks like.

I'm a bit cautious about releasing the design files on a publicly available site as I'm not sure if/what parts of the connector are somehow protected by TLG IP. Beyond that, to actually print them right you do need a very well tuned printer, which my experience on Thingverse indicates, seems as rare as hen teeth.

Anyway, if someone is interested in this approach, comment or drop me a message.

Best regards and thanks for this informative discussion!

I like that design, can you send it to me?  I want to put lights on my trains.

Thank you

[biasedlogic]

10 hours ago, teran said:

I like that design, can you send it to me?  I want to put lights on my trains.

Thank you

I believe I've sent it to you via email already?

[DzieX]

Has anyone attempted to fix powered up train board? Bought it occasinally but it comes out that batteries leaked and there was corrosion i didn't see. It worked for a moment, but never turned on again :/ When I connect it to lab power adapter it show short circuit. I've dissasembled it and cleaned the board, but didn't help. Some links (if you have anything) would be much appreciatedSome links (if you have anything) are much appriciated.

Edited July 17 by DzieX

[XG BC]

on the 2nd image on the bottom left ic (the L8something one) i see some Pads shorted together, might see what that is

[DzieX]

1 hour ago, XG BC said:

on the 2nd image on the bottom left ic (the L8something one) i see some Pads shorted together

You mean this LB... chip connectors? I'll re-solder it.

[XG BC]

yes, exactly, some of the pins look bridged in the image, but not sure.

[DzieX]

I've managed to remove this chip. I guess is some kind of motor bridge, but didn't find exacly same online. It's interesting that one of pins is missing, so I guess it's broken. Can it be replaced by chip with similar, but not exactly same? Corrosion ate it. I've checked connection to - and + on this pin and there are both.. It's not coinicdence I think.

 

 

Edited July 17 by DzieX

[XG BC]

does it now power on? if yes, that specific chip might be broken

[Lok24]

Yes the LB1836 is the motor driver 

https://www.alldatasheet.com/html-pdf/474975/SANYO/LB1836M/306/2/LB1836M.html

Edited July 17 by Lok24

[DzieX]

4 hours ago, XG BC said:

does it now power on? if yes, that specific chip might be broken

 

4 hours ago, Lok24 said:

Yes the LB1836 is the motor driver 

https://www.alldatasheet.com/html-pdf/474975/SANYO/LB1836M/306/2/LB1836M.html

Didn't even check, because + and - are still short circut. Can it be replaced by chip with similar, but not exactly same?

Edited July 17 by DzieX

[XG BC]

40 minutes ago, DzieX said:

 

Didn't even check, because + and - are still short circut. Didn't even check, because + and - are still short circuit. Can it be replaced by chip with similar, but not exactly same?

hmm thats weird, you have to find a chip with the same pinout (i.e. which of the pins does what) and the same (or greater) specifications otherwise. the short can be anything, either in one of the ICs, a capacitor being shorted out, hard to tell.

[DzieX]

3 hours ago, XG BC said:

the short can be anything

I'll try to check which component heats up. I have nothing to lose anyway.

[XG BC]

thats a good idea aswell, try and limit the current a bit, but otherwise go ahead. if you can, try and check the supply voltages for the individual chips, maybe some voltage regulator blew.

[DzieX]

31 minutes ago, XG BC said:

if you can, try and check the supply voltages for the individual chips, maybe some voltage regulator blew.

Ok, I'll to that first, but need to check by element which are these

[XG BC]

They are usually small 3 pin ics, sometimes 4 pin, the best way usually is to check the supply voltage of for example the arm chip on the board, or any other chip (should be specified in the Datasheet which pin you need to check. if that looks okay (like no 9v where there should be 5v or something) look for what gets hot.

[DzieX]

11 hours ago, DzieX said:

 

20 minutes ago, XG BC said:

They are usually small 3 pin ics, sometimes 4 pin

So basically this side

[XG BC]

yes, but u think these are actually transistors, given that they are labelled Q something. idk id just check the supply voltage of the chips on the other side, if thats all good, then look for hot spots.

[ejayb]

I've had my second 88008 Medium Linear Motor failure in 4 years. I assume it's the internal gearing. The first runs one way, but not the other. The second runs fine in one direction and clicks in the other. 

It's hard to quantify, but I wouldn't say I run them particularly hard. 

Has anyone take one apar?

[ejayb]

18 hours ago, ejayb said:

I've had my second 88008 Medium Linear Motor failure in 4 years. I assume it's the internal gearing. The first runs one way, but not the other. The second runs fine in one direction and clicks in the other. 

It's hard to quantify, but I wouldn't say I run them particularly hard. 

Has anyone take one apar?

https://www.flickr.com/photos/30673753@N05/

It wasn't the internal gearing that failed, rather the DC motor itself. 
It will rotate in one direction but not the other.
The 'propeller' can be popped off the rear shaft. 
Replacement motors appear to be for sale on AliExpress but I need to double check measurements next week. 

https://www.aliexpress.com/w/wholesale-rf%252d300-dual.html?spm=a2g0o.productlist.search.0

 

 

[ejayb]

@Lok24 have you had any 88008 failures?

[Lok24]

54 minutes ago, ejayb said:

have you had any 88008 failures?

No, no failures with any PU device till today.