moschino

This set is lovely. I consider this one of my favorite sets of all time. Too bad I lost the sail, so one day I'll have to buy it from bricklink or ebay. If I were you, I definitely not sell it for $50, because I'm not really in a bad need of such small amount of dollars. You easily spend 50 bucks on a single dinner so it's not worth to give this MISB in exchange for a dinner. Sometimes I feel bad I don't have any MISB and if I'd have one, I'd do one of the followings. -If I have enough space to dedicate a room especially to display Lego, I'd create some particular displays for MISB. -I'd keep it for my son, and when he has the 8-10th birthday, I'll give it to him. He should be happy and proud to receive a clasic MISB when all his friends get the ordinary contemporary Lego. -I'd preserve it for another decade and see what will happen. Those vintage sets become more and more valuable because not everyone keeps them in good condition. For lots of times I saw the SES Hull being damaged and not kept in decent conditions so I realize that each day we pass, these sets increase their value (not only in $) because they become fewer.

Check this out.

Here I agree with you. You said the obvious and I can't contradict that, but I can judge Lego for doing this. I saw a documentary on National Geographic about Lego, and on that doc said that Lego did a change of management after 2004 when they were close to bankrupcy. In the doc they said due to internet influences and new multimedia applications of the third millenium, the toy named Lego wasn't as catchy as it used to be and the new generation of kids weren't attracted by Lego as past generations were. So Lego changed the color palette and added more eye catchy elements so the new generation of kids finally started to be attracted by this toy. Up to this point, I agree with what Lego has done. They had to do something to stop their downfall, otherwise now Lego would have been just a page of history, but they acted too much like they aimed to make money and nothing more. They stopped creating elegant sets, and started to create the sets that I personally consider a joke. Getting back to what you said, it's normal to aim for kids, because in fact Lego is a toy, but they forgot the adults. It's extremely easy to imagine a man 60yrs old is displaying Barracuda and being proud of it. But I can't imagine a man 30yrs old displaying Brickbeard's Bounty and being proud of it. Just look at its sails... and the general palette of colors reject adults from this set. The comparsion between Barracuda and Brickbeard's Bounty is just an example, there are plenty of them... Your point is a very sensitive touch to the subject. I'll take few examples, and I will start with two ships, 6285-Black Seas Barracuda (1989) and 10210-Imperial Flagship (2010). BSB has a total of 10 colors IF has a total of 26 colors BSB looks elegant and 99% of Lego collectors agrees with. IF is a very impressive ship, and in fact a very nice ship, and this is mostly due to its impressive size but the ship itself has many flaws. I won't point all its flaws because this topic is not about IF, but I will talk about its color palette because this is what you asked for. In the picture above, on a part of 5-6 centimeters is a total of 6 colors. This simply looks like a bunch of all flowers together. And the mix between Dark Brown and Reddish Brown all together looks disgusting. Another comparison where new sets are not in the same harmony is the following: Lego 6086 has a total of 11 colors. Lego 7946 has a total of 24 colors. And so on... _________________________________________________________________ With all these said, I find no reason into go any further on color palette debate, so I leave this aspect as being a matter of taste. Well, I'm extremely glad I'm not the only one who see this change. Considering many people continued to say there's no difference, I had in mind to take few photos tomorrow and prove it. Considering you posted that link, now it's definitely not necesarily to make new photos. Your link shows everything and only a blindman will not see the difference. Thanks for that, for a short moment I simply thought there is a problem with me.

You're right, my apologies. I've made a confusion and I wanted to say the production of Connecticut who was later moved to Mexico. I'll do a recheck and I'll add some examples.

Oh, really? Please buy a MISB set from 1990, then go and buy a MISB set from 2012. You will instantly see the difference. I know they replaced old brown with new reddish brown, but just go and look at the yellow on the minifigs. It's not just the thing that there's a different yellow, but the new one looks cheap. Don't worry about me. I'm not seeing what I expect to see. Before seeing this thread I didn't even know that Lego is producing pieces in China. I discovered this thread few hours ago, and instantly I started to search about this on the internet. In 2009, I was navigating through a Lego store among another Lego collector. When that friend saw various sets with the new fake yellow introduced (the one that tries to imitate the gold), he instantly said. "Omg, why is Lego doing this? Why is this cheap piece between the others? They look like they're made in China." And guess what? He was right... Today I discovered they were indeed made in China. We didn't know that, so we didn't expect a lower quallity. It was just a fair reaction of what Lego did... Well, I totally agree with you. So far, when Lego pieces were produced only in Denmark and Mexico, everything was just perfect. Around 2000, they started to produce pieces in Czech Republic and I didn't see any quallity issues. Later, when the production was expanded to many other countries, quallity issues started to appear. Of course I have no proof that these cheap parts are made only in China, but I don't believe in coincidences. I don't believe that Denmark started to produce cheap parts instantly after they started to colaborate with China. And even if so... then this is a sign that this colaboration should stop. Me too I continue to expand my collection, otherwise I wouldn't be here on this website, but me too I'm cautious about what I buy, and I try to mentain the main colors of classics. Classic sets were made carefuly and they always kept a ballance and harmony in how they mixed the colors. In sets of today I see 3-4 different shapes of blue in the same set which turns the set into a kitsch.

Well, the story with cannons will remain a mistery. For example, the Lego set 6098 (King Leo's Castle) has it's own different release in US, under the number of 6091. Link to the 6091 version HERE. Knowing about the cannon differences, I initially thought that 6091 version had disabled the Technic Competition Cannon which is used on balista. + But as far as I know, this Competition Cannon wasn't disabled and it could shot as it could in Europe. This is something very weird, because I always thought and I still think that this cannon is far more dangerous than the normal cannon. With this one against someones eye, it really can do a bruise. So what's the point of interdicting the normal shooting cannon if you let this one available? I'm not having 6091, but I'm having 6098 (the EU version). Maybe someone who has the 6091 can tell us if the Technic Competition Cannon was shooting. So far, I know that these Cannons were both the same in US and EU.

Oh, I hope these are not just rumors and I hope they will really get out of China as soon as possible. These news would be the best Lego news I've heard during the past 5 years. Even a re-release of classic sets won't make me more happy. I don't know when this change of quality has been made as I missed Lego between 2002 and 2008, so the change was probably made between these intervals. I suggest you to get a any classic minifig between 1985 and 1998, and put it together with a minifig released in 2012. You will instantly notice a different plastic, with a completely different yellow. The new plastic is significantly cheaper and sometimes even disgusting. I only bought few sets released after 2002 and I did this only because they were absolutely fantastic, but otherwise I try to avoid new sets exactly due to this change of plastic. The new one is at the same quality with plastic stoppers for coca-cola bottles. Unfortunately I know 3 big Lego collectors who stopped to expand their collection exactly due to this issue. About myself, I still aquire Lego sets but I do it carefuly and I always chose vintage sets. Yesterday a new set arrived, but it was released in 1996.

First of all I want to congratulate you for creating this thread. I think we are here to share our knowledge and you do your part as not many does. A thread like this interests me since long time ago and finally this thread exists. To me, Lego 6285 is maybe the most inovative set of all time because implemented lots of features and stays at the fundation when differences between US and Europe were created. Discovering this set more and more, I actually start having many more questions and this is something extremely interesting because in facts it's only a Lego set, but somehow seems not be just a Lego set. If these informations about batches riggings will get known, those riggings will probably become 3x expensive than the 02 version of today, even if they were a mistake. Also, I don't really understand why the plastic trays are different. It was a lot easier to simply use the same fabrication mold. About number of pieces written on the box, this reminds me of a very weird conversation between me (living in Europe) and a friend who lived in US but spending his summer vacations in Europe. When we've been talking about Lego, he was always proud of himself but telling "I'm having the set #bla,bla with 500 pieces", and so on. And at that time, being a child, I thought he doesn't even has real Lego, but he has fake cheap imitations and he likes to think that this is the same thing with Lego. I thought this, because I knew you can't see the number of pieces of a set and at that time, in early 90', we couldn't see on the internet by checking Peeron or Brickset. But later I found that he indeed could see the number of the pieces on the box. I honestly don't think this is a language issue as it was with the text on the lid. European Lego made in Denmark could simply show the number and instead of putting a word as "pcs", they could simply add an image with a brick and it was done. But I think they simply didn't want to. About the whole difference in names, boxes, etc... I think the US Lego had a different marketing manager who wanted to promote Lego at a higher level when in Europe this was simply ignored because here Lego already had its own reputation and they didn't care about such insignificant details. I really wonder why the sails were not cutted, and I wait for the day when it will be shown the differences between Europe and US of Lego 6286.

Well, seems that Imperial Trading Post is more preferred than Rock Island Refuge or Eldorado Fortress. Me too I intend to go for Imperial Trading Post due to the following reasons. -It has 3 sails, 2 of them being completely unique, available only in this set. -It has the very rare pirate with brown vest, available only in this set and Skull's Eye Schooner. It's hard to decide between these two colors. They both look great when we're talking about imperial soldiers. No, they are all in used condition, but they've been well kept, without tooth marks, broken pieces etc... Thank you all for your opinions.

If you are up to pay €100, with that price you can find Barracuda in excellent condition and even boxed. It's not really necessarily to wait until Lego will release a new ship. With €100 you can actually buy any pirate ship excepting Imperial Flagship.

Depends of the price. If you can get it under $50, it's worth. If you get it for over $50, then I'd wait to get some more bucks and I'd go for Barracuda or RedBeard Runner. If you're patient enough, you can get Barracuda for $70-90 and I guess everyone admits that these two ships can not even be compared with each other. In my opinion, Brickbeard's Bounty is completely dedicated to kids for playing with. Look at its colors, its sails and the shark. This ship is not a ship to collect, but to play on the floor. If you mind to get it to play with, go for it. If you want it for display, just skip it...

I didn't vote yet, so I don't know the most beloved captain. In my opinion, Pirates 2009 are the worse Pirates series of all time, even worse than POTC. The whole theme seems to be dedicated to kids, and completely not dedicated to adults or teenagers. The skull on BrickBeard's hat looks extremely cartoonish comparing to the old skull which is a "real skull". His torso is pretty nice indeed, but the epaulettes and the hook are horrible. That shiny golden yellow makes the captain to look like a kitsch toy. This color is one of the main reasons why I still prefer sets before 2002. Also BrickBeard's face doesn't impress me at all. His face is also extremely cartoonish, and eye catchy... Honestly I admire much more the vintage minifigs (with the basic smiley face) due to their simplicity. Being so simple, it makes them more universal and more collectible for collectors of all ages. RedBeard? Not much to say about him... Simple, accurate, elegant! The first minfig with its own name. I consider him maybe the best minifig of all time. (but not the best pirate captain). Iron Hook seems to be the veteran of the pirates crew. He lost one of his hands and one of his legs just as RedBeard, but his torso tells about him that he fought well each day, day after day. Instead of wearing a coat, he has a simple shirt with a belt and a knife. (knife > maybe for backstabbing?) A pirate like him cares about the treasure, not about the coat. Also, a pirate like him doesn't care about epaulettes, everything being about gold and even more gold... My vote goes to Iron Hook. True. Well... at least he is not in the shadow of Captain Pete too.

Hello, I always admired these 3 sets on Lego Catalogs but I never got any of them. By reading reviews on each of these sets, they've been rated as following: 6273 by Lorentzen Design: 9/10 Playability: 10/10 Part: 10/10 Price: 10/10 6276 by Mr.Phes He didn't rate it. Just posted pics. 6277 by funkybrick Design: 10/10 Minifigs: 9.5/10 Parts: 9/10 Playablity: 10/10 Price: 10/10 Considering the reviews ratings, 6273 would be the winner, but Lego is not that simple to judge, so a debate would be better. I'm starting this topic because I have the opportunity to buy them from a neighbor, but unfortunately I can't afford all these 3 sets at the same time, and later some of them may be already sold. So, my question is Which one would you choose? (and why?) All your views are appreciated.

Considering you've been waiting for my reply, I posted the thread.

Here is the official stop motion movie created by Lego Group in 1989 in order to advertise on VHS and not only. The movie was dedicated to UK, Europe, so the names of ships and characters are different than in US. Enjoy!

Well, I agree with Weil about feedbacks and reviews. Regarding the text on the box, I reflected on this and I think I found the reason why the US versions had a small text story, and the EU version didn't. For example BSB US version was addressed to the 52 states of America. All 52 states speaks the same language, so it was worth to print a box available for all states. In Europe, if BSB (Dark Shark) had an english text on the box, it could not be addressed to all 50 states. Then Lego must had to print the box over 40 languages. (I say 40 and not 50 because Germany has the same language as Austria, England as Ireland, etc.) Theoretically this could be done, but if BSB (french version) was not sold in France, then they could move the remaining boxes to England or Germany, but then was completely weird to find a BSB box written in french in a german store. So Lego Europe decided to make the boxes standard, then they could be managed due to request and sales. I think this is the reason why US boxes have a story, and EU boxes are more basic. ______________________________________________________________________________________ By the way, not only the name of the ship was different, but also the name of the characters. These differences in name characters were also found in Adventures Sersies and even Castle Series. In US, the lego set 6285 was named Black Seas Barracuda, and the captain was named Red Beard. In Europe the same set was named The Dark Shark, and the captain was named Captain Roger. Here is a stop motion movie created by Lego in 1989, and it was dedicated to Europe, so here can be heard the Europe titles of the ship and the character. I also have a Europe catalog from 1992 where the captain was named Roger.

Well, this is disturbing. During the time I saw there are lots of differences between US and EU versions. Thank you for your effort. Thank you for posting the text on SES Box. So the US version has the text and the EU version doesn't? As far as I know, the US cannons can not fire, but the EU cannons can. Are there any other differences excepting the boxes and the cannons? Thank you posting high resolution images.

Thank you for fast reply. I'll be waiting.

Hello, On the right side in the picture below, it's written a text below the diagonal Pirate Skull. Can anyone write here what's said there? Someone who has the box of SES should be able to do it. There is also a small text inside of BSB box. Thanks in advance! PS: If someone can make some new photos to SES or BSB box, and post them at a high resolution, it will be much appreciated.

I think I was explicit, but I will put the question as an example of how should be the answer. There are 1.580.000 copies of BSB. There are 725.000 copies of SES. Etc... I would like to know how many copies of this sets have been ever made.

Hello, For so many times I just wondered about how many models of a specific model have been made by Lego Group. I am wondering if there is an inventory where I can learn how many Skull's Eye Schooner or Black Sea Barracudas have been produced. Thanks