Carrera124

That's right. I'll have to drive nearly 2 hours to get there... so, thinking of time consumption and fuel costs, buying online and paying postage is my preferred method. Especially regarding saved fuel costs, I can buy one addtional set online or at my local toy store

I haven't ignored this, but what you are writing is not the complete truth. Even back in the 80ies and 90ies, Lego had to face these competitions. And the beginning of the 80ies, home computers and arcade games conquered the nurserys and living rooms. Remember Atari 2600 and Commodore 64. At the same time, RC cars started their success at affordable prices. So, today's situation is not really different from back then. Lego is a kind of "classic" toy, and during all times, "newer" and modern toys attacked them. I already thought about this. Similar to 10183, a kind of universal extension set that costs half the price of a complete train starters. And that allows to to build 2 small wagons, or 1 big waggon, or another loco, etc.

How do you know this ? Imho, this is just a non-realistic guess of yours. Of course, I am already doing this. But they don't want to buy parts, they want to buy sets. Even more, because a factory-produced set that comes with a solid box and printed instructions, is more suitable as a gift, than a rather nameless bulk of bricks. And of course, Lego wants to make money. That's quite normal. But they surely won't crash their business, if they release 2-3 sets that do not sell as well as other sets. Just for the purpose to make the train theme a little bit more attractive for non-internet buyers. Because today, the train theme is not very attractive, for the purpose of sustainability. Of course, we have 3 great starter sets (3677, 7938, 7939). All three are great and worth a buy. And we have a train station (7937). 7936 has already been dropped from the line-up. So we have a total of 4 train sets listed in the printed catalogs. Of course, we had the Emerald Express and we have the Maersk train. But both have been sold mainly or exclusively by internet. Today, train sets are a puny adjunct of the city theme. Of course, it'll never be the same as it wasa back in the 80ies and 90ies, with lots of starter sets, lots of single locos and lots of single waggons. But just a little bit more than today, it would really improve the situation.

Well, history is full of examples where specialists have been proven wrong... the fact that I am new to this board doesn't mean I am new to the hobby... I am buying and collecting for more than two decades. If the Lego marketing guys always make perfect decisions, why do they release sets and themes that don't sell well ? Maybe they were out in their estimation. Of course, this may happen in both directions: produce x sets, and nearly no one wants to buy them. Or: produce x sets, but more people than expected want to buy them. They're all only humans, and they make mistakes. It should be obvious that I am not talking about my personal relatives, but of these kind of persons in general (!). I don't think I am responsible to teach all grandmas and grandpas living in this world how to deal with PAB and Bricklink... Moreover, grandparents don't have internet access and/or are not familiar with it. As told before, PAB and Bricklink are additional (!) services for power-moccers, collectors and so on. They surely are not intended to be used by persons who just want to buy a single set.

That's true, I uploaded the evident at my Brickshelf account: Other "US-only" sets that were also released in Germany: http://www.brickshel...ry.cgi?f=494570 (All pictures come from my personal collection of old toy store catalogs) These sets were not listed within the official Lego catalogs. They were only available as special items at specific toy store chains (called "Vedes", "Idee&Spiel" and "Spielzeug-Ring"). At Christmas 1984, I could choose between 6383 and 6391, so I took 6391

*rofl* well, we are talking about today, not about 5 years ago. Yes, lots of complete starter sets. That's true, but no one doubted about this. Again, please read carefully what I've written before. What shall aounts, uncles, grandmas and grandpas do when they want to buy gifts ? They sureley won't use PAB. And they surely won't register at Bricklink (because both services don't apply to the "Lego standard customer", they are intended to be used by "power-moccers" or collectors.) They also won't buy another (too) big starter set. Indeed, they want to buy "small" extension sets, and nothing else. But Lego does not offer this. What are they doing instead ? Maybe, they'll buy another small city set. Otherwise, they might buy a non-Lego gift.

Well, this applies to many other sets, too. It is not necessary to release 7 new firement sets... 3 or 4 would have been enough. Of course. One single train on a small "o" layout makes lots of fun. No one has ever thought of needing extra train parts or more trains/wagons...

But you are continously neglecting the fact that all this happened nearly one decade ago. So, all you are saying is "things have not been sold well 10 year sago, so they will not sell well today, too". If this would be true, why does Lego offer train sets at all ? If they don't sell well, Lego should drop them. If they sell well, there must be a large amount of customers, that are potential buyers for single add-ons. It's foolish to beliebe, that all buyers of the big starter sets stick only to them... More than other themes, trains are part of a SYSTEM. Just imagine Scalextric would only set slotcar starter packs, but no single cars and only very few track extension packs...

Instructions are now available at www.brickfactory.info. They are not (yet) available via Peeron. It sent the jpg files to Peeron some weeks ago, but for whatever reason, it seems as if they are not able to put them online.

Well, times have changed since the 90ies. Today, shopping is often done online, the classic retailer's store is not the only source any more. Even today, Lego offers more sets than any retailer is able to keep in stock (remember, more than 600 new sets released in 2012). I know, not all of the 600 sets are/were available in every country, some were promo/seasonal/S@H etc. But even the big toy stores aren't able to keep the whole line-up (reference: printed standard catalog) in stock. So, this is not a valid reason against (smaller) train sets. 2 or 3 more sets in general would not make the situation worse than today. Offering additional train sets only via S@H, would also be a good solution. Better than offering nothing...

Did you read my posting completeley ? I clearly stated that Ebay is a part of the market, not the whole market. So you can be sure, I am understanding the scope. Maybe, but this applies to ALL sets that Lego releases. And it is hard to believe that every new set is selling that well. So, there must be exceptions to this rule(s).

The same as people that want just single train rolling stock... buy nothing.

Okay, that Lego doesn't need to release any other sets anymore. We don't need more city sets (already have enough of them, and we have bricklink), no more technic sets (same reason). 2 or 3 huge (10000 pcs) per year would be sufficient, thanks to all Ebay dealers and bricklink

Well, did these people ever think about the reason, why single rolling stocking is selling on eBay - for good prices ? Visit ebay, type "lego 3677" or ""lego 7939". They'll finde several sellers, and checking their feedback during the last months and years clearly shows that it is able to sell these items. Of course, ebay is not the whole market, just a part of it. But history shows a lot of evidences, that marketing guys (and girls) went totally wrong. If they were always right, every released product ever would sell the predicted way. But for some reasons, some products sell worse than expected by the marketing analysts, other products sell much better.

At least, it shows that it is a business model that works. If there would be no demand, these ebay set-slaughtermen-sellers would net sell one single brick. But when I look at their ebay rating pages, it is obvious that they are selling wagons and wagons and wagons... There is no doubt that lots of people are buying these items, right now and also during the last months. And of course, Lego is a construction toy. But for some weird reason Lego prefers to sell more sets/models than packages of bulk bricks (which would be sufficient if you want to build everything on your own). Some single wagons to extend your 3677 or 7939, I am convinced they would sell well.

Some weeks ago, a MISB 8450 set appeared on german Ebay. It started at 1€ and ended up to ~ 57 Euro. At Bricklink, the last MISB set has been sold for ~ 150 €.

As a parent, the first does NOT make sense to me. Why ? Because a train set, is only the beginning of a train layout. If the child likes it, it wants to have more. Today, the only chance to get more train stuff, is to buy another (expensive) complete train set. Again, if the child likes trains: what about his/her aunts, uncles, grandmas, grandpas ? There are no smaller train sets that could be used as christmas or birthday gifts. Therefore, I would decide NOT to buy a train set as a christmas gift for a child, because of the very limited possibilities to expand the train theme. Instead, I would buy a set from a theme, which offers the possibility to extend it more easily. Have a look at ebay: lots of sellers are buying lots of 3677 and 7939 sets... in order to put them apart and sell all the wagons individually. This seems to be a very profitable business - so it seems as if there is a considerable demand for those items. Last christmas, my two nephews received 7938 and 7939. And their dad told me and my mum (their grandma) it would be great if we could buy some additional train stuff. Hm... what to buy ? A Maersk train ? No good idea. So, I bought two single wagons from a 3677 set, and grandma bought the railway station. But what to buy for this year's christmas ? Maybe another single wagon from an ebay 3677 slaughterman ?

As I said above, all this happened nearly one decade (!) ago. Within times that were not good for Lego in general. Now we are living in 2012, not in 2002 or 2004 anymore. Times have changed, today Lego releases lots of (obsolte) firemen sets, things like Monster Fighters and "Lord of the Rings" stuff. Within these circumstances, no one can tell me that it should be impossible to release 2 or 3 additonal single train items. Have a look at Brickset: from 2000 to 2005, each year a total of ~ 400 new sets have been released. After that, these numbers increased continuoulsy, reaching a peak of 655 (!) new sets for 2012. Compared to the 80ies and early 90ies, this amount is 6x higher than then. So, it should be no problem, if 2 or 3 of 655 sets would be additional train items, instead of other stuff. Even if they would't break new selling records, I am conviced that some of these 655 sets are selling even worse... so the selling numbers are no valid reason. It is just a matter of if they want to offer a better (full) product range, or not.

But WHY ware train carriages selling worse than othe citiy stuff ? For me, it sounds like a self-fulfilling prophecy: everyone hopes that train stuff is selling not that well. Result: it doesn't sell well. As long as Lego does not offer these single items, no one can know how they will sell. There are lots of consumptions, but nothing more.

Well, the last standalone train products have been released around a whole decade ago. At that time, Lego hat trouble in general, so the conclusion is: at that time, not only standalone train products have been sold not well, but also other themes/sets, too. So I think, it could be worth a try again. Today, Lego has lots of sets and themes that are selling welling. In general, their situation is much better than back then.

Right. But single wagons don't need power functions elements, and they also don't need train tracks. So, it should be no problem to create more single wagons. That's right, too. But this does affect ALL bricks and sets, no only train sets. So, there is no reason why this should prevent releasing additional train stuff.

? But Lego only has to re-use existing moulds (bricks) in order to create new train sets. This might improve the usage of the capacity of the moulds, and therefore should reduce costs of the corresponding bricks. Other companies have often to build new moulds (nearly) from scratch when creating single carriages and goods wagons. So, regarding costs, Lego should have a great advantage. Instead, 7 (!) new firemen sets are announced for 2013 city lineup. Even 4 would have been enough, imho.

Great news !

I was able to install the 8450 instructions CD on a Windows 7-32 Bit machine. So, I made screenshots of all building steps and provided them to Peeron. But I do not know how much time thy need to put the pictures online (~ 370 pictures for the main model).

Control Center I is powered by batteries, while Control Center II has an additional jack for plugging a power supply.