Aventador2004

Decreasing number of MOCs: affected by criticism?

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Do you know that it's more painful for MOCer to have no comments than critical comments?

I made 3 42114 alternative model but upload only 1 in here. And I got only 1 comment. While M-longer made also alternative of 42114 and he got 6 and Eric trax got 21.

I also made playable version of 42108, and I got 3 comment but all of that written by one people.

I also made large scale AE86 which can drift like thing. As far as I know there is no AE86 moc bigger than this. And I got only 8 comment.

I also upload Racing event did in my country. And no one commented.

More? World first car moc from 42095, no one commented. 42099 alternative, 1 commented. Twin motor 6 function excavator version 2, 1 commented.

Why don't you comment more on unknown producers before you ask why the number of moc is decreasing?

 

Edited by msk6003

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9 hours ago, jorgeopesi said:

when I see MOCs with fails I do not write anything.

Now I know why you do not comment my MOCS :laugh:

Kind regards 

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I think the "MOCs not getting a lot of comments" issue has two sides.

One the one side there are the readers who are too lazy or whatever to take their time to comment on a MOC thread, even though they enjoyed it. I think this is bad, because it makes the MOCer feel like noone ist even interested in his MOC. Since EB does not have a "Like" function or something similar writing a comment is all you can do to tell the author you enjoyed his work (or what you think could be improved upon!)

On the other side there are MOC creators who put no effort in presenting their MOC, (or even present a MOC that took no effort to make). I have seen enough threads with basically no text, maybe 1or 2 pics and that's it. I think it is the responsibility of a thread creator to take some time and at least try to make it interesting for the community to read. If that's too much work, then don't bother at all.

That's just my take on the matter.

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So to sum it up, a proper comment should be something like:
5i922k.jpg

Edited by Lipko

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9 minutes ago, Gray Gear said:

I think the "MOCs not getting a lot of comments" issue has two sides.

One the one side there are the readers who are too lazy or whatever to take their time to comment on a MOC thread, even though they enjoyed it. I think this is bad, because it makes the MOCer feel like noone ist even interested in his MOC. Since EB does not have a "Like" function or something similar writing a comment is all you can do to tell the author you enjoyed his work (or what you think could be improved upon!)

On the other side there are MOC creators who put no effort in presenting their MOC, (or even present a MOC that took no effort to make). I have seen enough threads with basically no text, maybe 1or 2 pics and that's it. I think it is the responsibility of a thread creator to take some time and at least try to make it interesting for the community to read. If that's too much work, then don't bother at all.

That's just my take on the matter.

That is also in several cases; there are number of reasons like we as users have number of opinions...

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11 hours ago, DrJimbo said:

What’s the point, if some MOCers (whose models I have admired and paid money for) can only seem to respond by nit-picking. 

I can totally relate to that, because I had a similar experience. On my last big MOC, while building it, Nico71 commented, saying something like : You should start by the bodywork, and then making the technical aspects inside.
At the moment of the comment Felt like this was quite rude, as, to me, it was like saying : "You have a wrong approach to your MOC, that's bad."
Now with some time, I understand the comment, and I'm trying to apply it to my new MOC.
So yeah, sometimes, a comment from someone you respect/well known in the community can be hard to handle, but most of the time, it's not mean spirited.
(I don't want to criticize Nico71, that's just to give an example I hope this doesn't feel like a "revenge/expose post" )

 

10 hours ago, Celeri said:

if you are seeking nice feedback, get on FB/Instagram/whatever, but if you want to challenge yourself and make progress, then come on EuroBricks"

I quite agree with this, and that's also why I usually don't comment on a lot of MOCs, because I feel like it's better to just watch rather than saying something like : "Great MOC"
I usually comment when I have a question about a function, or an advice to give.

 

10 hours ago, SaperPL said:

The same thing happens on Technic subreddit where people over and over again drop photos of what they bought, what they built from the set and how their collection looks and this gets upvoted and commented a lot, and in effect newcomers feel that the community is all about buying expensive sets and boasting how much of Lego they have.

I feel that the same happens on every social media, for example, I'm on instagram, and It's quite hard to find some real MOCs, most of the time I find nice pictures of sets or huge MOCs by well known MOCers.

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I think it will always be hard for a MOC to get 100's of comments. When an official set comes out, I know it will be available in a store near me, all with shiny new pieces, instruction book and boxed in a neat package, and it might come with some new parts that I don't own, and eventually at a discounted price. So this will have a potential impact on my hobby as a new purchase or parts and something new to build. A MOC is a whole different thing. It will be harder to replicate without instructions, have no new parts and I'll have to gather the parts from my own collection and likely have to buy some crazily over priced pieces on bricklink (now Lego has the same issue with electronc components but whatever). The point is that it's much harder for a MOC to have the same impact on my hobby as an official set, which I guess makes me less inclined to comment on it. But way back when I decided to build Sheepos Landrover, not only did I comment on it but I did a full review of it. 

I don't post many of my MOCs as they are rarely ever finished. But I do play as lead singer/guitarist in a band, we spend lots of time rehearsing, countless hours practicing at home, decent gig quality instruments, mics, amps are expensive, I do still get stage fright (first few times before I played in front of an audience I was physically sick!) and while most the time we get the room bouncing and rocking, we've been to many gigs and we were nothing more than background music with total silence between songs. If you think not receiving any comments on a MOC on an online forum is bad you wanna try being me, in person, after having poured everything into a rendition of U2's with or without you (try singing that and playing the guitar to it at the same time while the band are out of time with your Edge delay sound, it's hard work I tell ya!), only for the room to be silent! There have been other occasions where we are booked in a venue that we know is practically dead and there's 3 people in the audience. It can feel awful. But the times when you get a great reaction are worth it. There's been other times performing the same song where couples are slow dancing in front of me with literal tears looking into each others eyes and kissing the whole way through. Sometimes they say thankyou, sometimes they just walk away still engrossed in each other without saying anything to me (very understandable!). We also never make much money, we couldn't live off it that's for sure. The point is that if your a MOCcer doing it for little or no money then you shouldn't gauge your work, or question your reasons for sharing based on what others say or don't say, or how many people see it. You know if you've done good. And your motivation for MOCcing and sharing your work with others shouldn't be for comments but because you enjoy it. And if you do get lots of comments and views, well that's awesome, but if not, that's no reason to stop if you enjoy it anyway :classic:.

Regarding criticisms of MOCs, I agree with Celeri. If you want a bunch of yes people and a wall of "great MOC" posts then this might not be the best place. If you want to learn/improve, be challenged and see what other experience builders really think but in a (hopefully) constructive, polite and positive way then this is THE BEST place for that. It would be interesting to know if people prefer this or would they really prefer the wall of "great MOC" posts. I mean, if all you want to say is "great MOC" then of course just say that, that's infinitely better than no post at all. But we post here assuming we are all adults. Sure we are all flawed individuals and it's easy to take a constructive criticism with some anger, but we are still adults regardless and as such we understand that "I have a different opinion to you" is not equal to "I hate you", something that seems to be so simple and yet forgotten in todays divisive, lefty, identity politics!    

Edited by allanp

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I think a 'like' button on comments, and/or a star rating, could be handy for this forum to encourage participation. It's simple enough that people who can't be bothered to write a comment can still express appreciation. I imagine it's beyond Jim's and Milan's powers though, since I don't think they're the ones who pay for the forum service.

1 hour ago, allanp said:

Regarding criticisms of MOCs, I agree with Celeri. If you want a bunch of yes people and a wall of "great MOC" posts then this might not be the best place.

I don't think anyone expects that here though.

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2 hours ago, Gray Gear said:

I think the "MOCs not getting a lot of comments" issue has two sides.

One the one side there are the readers who are too lazy or whatever to take their time to comment on a MOC thread, even though they enjoyed it. I think this is bad, because it makes the MOCer feel like noone ist even interested in his MOC. Since EB does not have a "Like" function or something similar writing a comment is all you can do to tell the author you enjoyed his work (or what you think could be improved upon!)

On the other side there are MOC creators who put no effort in presenting their MOC, (or even present a MOC that took no effort to make). I have seen enough threads with basically no text, maybe 1or 2 pics and that's it. I think it is the responsibility of a thread creator to take some time and at least try to make it interesting for the community to read. If that's too much work, then don't bother at all.

That's just my take on the matter.

I think you're right here, especially on the latter part of your comment. I find it much more i compelling to comment on a thread that presents the MOC properly, with nice photos and especially proper description of the functions. I also like it when the maker tells some background on the making of the thing, and reflects on the possible shortcomings and difficulties in the making of it. Another matter is that there are some kinds of creations which simply are not interesting to me, no matter how they are made or presented.

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6 hours ago, 1gor said:

Now I know why you do not comment my MOCS :laugh:

Kind regards 

We understand our sense of humor so I only comment you because you are funny :laugh::laugh::wink: .

Edited by jorgeopesi

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18 minutes ago, jorgeopesi said:

We understand our sense of humor so I only comment you because you are funny :laugh::laugh::wink: .

I know, my MOCS suck. :wink:

...su now I have decided to make tractor that has no bonnet

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4 hours ago, Bartybum said:

I think a 'like' button on comments, and/or a star rating, could be handy for this forum to encourage participation. It's simple enough that people who can't be bothered to write a comment can still express appreciation.

Just chiming in to add my voice to this suggestion.  I don't comment a lot, because most of the time I don't have anything more to say than "nice MOC", and that always seems so inadequate.  A "like" system would allow me to express my appreciation without having to rack my brains for more words. :head_back:  I don't know if it's possible to add such a function, though.  If not, perhaps we could have a stock image which people can comment to indicate approval - maybe Emmet with the caption "Your MOC is Awesome"?

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6 minutes ago, The Shuttlefan said:

I don't know if it's possible to add such a function, though.

It’s technically possible since the company that powers this forum service, Invision Community, also powers the Kerbal Space Program forum, which does have a liking system. I think it’s just a different service tier, so whoever pays for Eurobricks would probably have to fork out even more money.

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I also think a "Like" function would be nice to have.

8 minutes ago, The Shuttlefan said:

If not, perhaps we could have a stock image which people can comment to indicate approval - maybe Emmet with the caption "Your MOC is Awesome"?

Not a big fan of that idea. I would hate to see the same pic over and over again in each thread

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I'm not sure whether a "like button" proposal is a good thing or not. For once, I know a few forums that have this implemented (and seem to be using same platform as EB, one example is LinusTechTips). But they usually have a few reaction types, i.e. hilarious, thumbs up... Not sure what kind of reactions would be suitable for a MOC presentation. As mentioned by others this sort of "fake interaction" is plentiful on other platforms. I myself am guilty of such behaviour, just scrolling through Twitter/Instagram feed and pressing like without much thought if I like the post/content - in a few days won't even remember anything I saw there. Perhaps some will find such system reassuring, but a comment means so much more - even if it's pointing a fault. A comment means that the person took their time to read through the post and look at the details, perhaps looked up/compared what the real thing looks like and took their time to write a meaningful answer (of course there can be an obvious question or a simple reply too). 

On the other side it'd be a good thing, since it's true one can find themselves short of words for a MOC - perhaps you recognise the quality of the build, the likeliness to the original or the complexity, but would end up repeating a trillionth "awesome!!" or "love this supercar!". Perhaps you'd like the author to know that you like the build, but it's not in your general area of interest, therefore you can't pinpoint a detail you find excellently done - I for one have no idea about construction or farming equipment, so wouldn't want to appear an ignorant person making a comment with an obvious remark or question. 

Sure the lack of interaction can feel discouraging, but at least this forum is alive, comparing to another local one, where posts barely have any audience at all, on the first page one can find stuff from 2016 or earlier, sometimes with 0 replies and barely any views, or an empty hearted/robotic response like "you did well.". 

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I definitely agree with the people who say a like system would be good, and that thus it would be easier to leave a quick comment than writing a full review. Personally I try to leave a longer comment with both positive and negative sides. Seeing as there are loads of talented builders on this site, it shouldn't be hard to find good things to say about there MOCs. Also it shouldn't be hard to find things that could be done better. To quote some person on a tv show: "nothing is perfect". Therefore there should be some way to find some negative things about the MOC, even if it is nitpicking. There is also the problem of trying to find the perfect balance between "that brick is a very teensy mistake" and "that looks horrendous". One good thing the Eurobricks system has is the main page, where there usually are MOCs of different styles and themes. Maybe we could even have a "medieval day" or "space day" with the respective themes displayed, and MOCs of those themes displayed. We also need to try and advertise the forum so that more people visit it and a) either discover the joy of Lego again via somebody's creation or b) discover the EB forum and use it as their go-to Lego forum. 

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19 hours ago, DrJimbo said:

Quoting from another thread that is closed:

”For example, if someone were to pour their effort into building a MOC that they’re proud enough of to go to the effort of taking photos and posting them here, and all you can muster up is “The wheels are too small” or “This doesn’t look like X” without so much as an effort to make them feel welcome for contributing to the forum then sorry but that’s just behaving like a rude piece of shit.

Sorry for digging up the first recent post since March here, now already a page ago, but there's one thing I have to ask.

Is this theoretical, or is this something that actually happens? I'm asking, because I don't remember seeing here that people reply to a moc with only negatives. Maybe it happens, I don't know, but I don't see it, and I visit the Technic forum a LOT. If anything, there's too much praise and too little criticism.

My feeling is that we're mostly discussing something that's not really actually at place, and making a problem out of this just because someone who actually left brought up the point without it actually being recent. (Of course, I may have missed something, which would only prove that the moderators are doing a good job around here :) ).

Also, second little thing I wanted to add in general that might have been said but not sure, is: language barrier. I believe we all know this is Eurobricks, meaning lots and lots of different nationalities mixed through. I see people from countries I couldn't even name in their native language, let alone that I could make myself clear in it, so I consider it a little miracle that there even exists a common language that all of us speak relatively well and can make ourselves clear in, like, at all. It's not a surprise if sometimes something is misunderstood. I'd expect it to happen much more often than it seems to do. (Heck, I sometimes get caught up in a misunderstanding in my own language.)

I do agree on the too-few-comments on new mocs issue though. Sometimes I'm just not sure what to say, partly due to the language barrier, partly due to the text-only-ness of the medium, but also indeed out of laziness sometimes.

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7 hours ago, allanp said:

And your motivation for MOCcing and sharing your work with others shouldn't be for comments but because you enjoy it.

I want to emphasis this. The mean reason we're at this forum is because LEGO is a hobby for most if us. On this forum we get inspiration and have the opportunity to ask questions and get help from very experienced builders. 

Don't create MOC's to get lots of praise, but create MOC's because you enjoy playing with LEGO.

 

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1 hour ago, GerritvdG said:

The mean reason we're at this forum is because LEGO is a hobby for most if us. On this forum we get inspiration and have the opportunity to ask questions and get help from very experienced builders.

This.

I totally agree. Also: Maybe even less experienced builders have found a way to construct something others haven't though of. Maybe it is already a very big honor to simply be able to show off our creations in a very educated environment. To me, no reply means: "Noting went terribly wrong". A few replies (let's say two to four) with some text saying something: The ones who are within my universe have taken some time to reply and discuss.

Maybe what we have created looks breathtakingly nice to us - including all the time we spent making it perfect - but maybe it is of >zero< interest to others. For us, it was the biggest and toughest effort ever - for others it is a pile of bricks arranged in an uninteresting way - a waste of time. So what? Is it about us or them? It is about us.

Inspiration, learning, giving (provided anyone wants something), and most importantly: Having fun making it, posting it, just showing >our< fun.

That is all there is for me. It feels good.

Best
Thorsten

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Hello all!

2 hours ago, Erik Leppen said:

Also, second little thing I wanted to add in general that might have been said but not sure, is: language barrier.

I think this is a major issue. I read on EB every day, yet very rarely comment on something. Not because I’m not interested, but because it is extremely time-consuming for me to find adequate words in English. In fact, when I sometimes sit down for half an hour to try and write a comment, I often quit as I don’t succeed in expressing my thoughts. I’m much more active in German language forums, where I can write and post a comment in a few seconds…
As a consequence, I strongly support the idea of establishing a „like“ system.

Kind regards,
Sven

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3 minutes ago, Maaboo35 said:

Why not use Google Translate?

Then it could look  like Tarzan wrote that post...

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2 hours ago, Tenderlok said:

As a consequence, I strongly support the idea of establishing a „like“ system.

Sven, whereas I really do share your notion, I'd rather go with a word, a sentence, a phrase, a joke - than seeing a "like" icon. Somewhere on the left or right, as this would not be in the text section of a reply, right?

Because the text section of a reply does allow us to solely reply with: :thumbup:, :pir-thumb:, :excited:, :grin_wub:, :wub_drool: - we don't have to phrase elaborate texts - as of now.

What I "like" about not having that button in a "uniting the fans of LEGO" forum is, that, well, German is not the language of the World. Nor is Danish or Bengali. Uniting means to speak one language. Or sort of speaking one: It does not have to be perfect, no way. Not even close. When reading a comment saying "You modell ist very cul", I am much more touched as by a like icon. This person tried.

When it comes to elaborate commenting, agree with you.

But: Maybe this is the big difference of EB vs ... you name it platform.

Just my take.

Best
Thorsten     

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