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[The Sarge]

I don't know, I'm quite enjoying myself. My first challenge build was sub-par, I admit, so I've resolved to not enter if I can't build something decent. Simple self-management really.

I also build as much as I can while I have time. My goal is to be posting 2-3 free builds per month and have a couple in reserve in case I have a month where I can't build much.

I think the rules are pretty good as is, with one exception - I think free builds after 2 shouldn't earn dubloons. If you want to build your story that's great, and if you want to be licencing three properties every month you'll need to do three freebuilds, but I think one model every two weeks is a good pace for quality.

[Capt Wolf]

Captain Braunsfeld's post hit on a lot of points that I wanted to add my two cents to.

I love that the game makes me build things I never would have built many of them otherwise. While I built a cotton plantation because it was financially advantageous over another type of plantation, as a player in the game I would have built some sort of plantation because it is a part of the fabric of the game. Without the game, I never build a plantation, but building a plantation at all was not done because of doubloons.

I do feel rushed to crank out the builds, and I wish the pace were a little more relaxed. That said, some of the most fun I've had in the game so far is building long form story scenes that aren't doubloon-driven at all. In fact, I didn't even register my first build in my ongoing duel story with Fuzzy MacFuzz because i just didn't think doubloons should be part of the equation. I do find myself with several build ideas and mapping out a plan to do two a month. Some are simpler than others. I'm working on one I don't expect to have done this month or next, but also have plans for a couple of builds I can complete next month.

But even though I feel rushed, I appreciate the pressure. I only posted a couple of items on the regular pirates forum in the past year, and doubt i would have posted anything more were it not for BoBS. The incentive wasn't there for me. And the incentive is not doubloons, it's storytelling.

So where is my rambling post going? I'm not sure, other than I really don't have problems with overhauling the economic system as long as there remain incentives to build and tell stories.

P.S. And what I failed to say above is that the incentive to build should be incentive to build quality builds, not just crank them out.

Edited March 24, 2016 by Capt Wolf

[Kai NRG]

Everyone is just going to have to find their own balance between building for DBs and building for fun. I think the system is great because it encourages builders to do things they probably otherwise would never have done - how many of us would ever have built a plantation otherwise?

But, like every other good thing, it's quite possible to overdo it.

I've had a lot of fun with story-geared builds myself and have even given them priority over licensed builds; for instance my science building really should have been a textile factory but I just got inspired by Bregir's idea. I think that's another great thing about this - there are so many story opportunities! (Of course, that means that sometimes, we'll have to choose between story opportunities or DBs... and that really depends on you.)

Speaking of Bregir's idea; it's not a Corrington only thing ATM, though it doesn't have any in-game benefits ATM either and actually it isn't really a thing. I thought it sounded cool, so I PMed Bregir to get more info, and then I built my thing for fun, and we'll see if the society takes off, and if I'm a part of it. If you want more info, I'd suggest PMing Bregir.

@Capt. Braunsfeld - Garmadon is about to post a build that has taken him well over a month! (And, I'll have to admit, it's pretty awesome...)

With regards to quality: I think we all want to improve. Which doesn't mean every single build is going to get better and better. There have to be those just average builds where you try out new things and find out what doesn't work so well. But I don't think anyone is, or anyone is likely to, post builds that he/she feels are definitely way underpar just for a few measly DBs.

[CelesAurivern]

Do we want to have high quality?

Would that not be a deterrant for new joiners/junior builders?

Do we want to have fun?

Would that be more interesting than going for high quality?

Or is it really all about money?

A lot of it is about money. Lego is expensive. Brinklinking even more so.

I'm starting to feel that the expectations of 'high quality' correlates with the number of parts used in a build.

Unfortunately for some of us piddling builders, we just don't have the time or parts to create builds of epic proportions in a matter of days.

Not everyone of us has tens of thousands of Euros worth of spare bricks just lying around.

I think this might have deterred a lot of people from joining or made them drop out after a month; because the word 'quality' keeps getting thrown around non-stop.

But I'm here because I love the pirates theme. I love ships. I love building them. I love bringing them into the shower and for walkies.

BoBs made me came out of a 5 year lurk-mode. So am I enjoying myself? You bet your grandma's last doubloon I am!

[Capt Wolf]

I guess when I say "quality" what I really mean is "effort" in some fashion. I know I have felt intimidated from posting in the past because the MOCs posted by many builders are far beyond my skill (or brick collection). I just want to know that as we feel the push to build, that means building something we enjoy, whether it means building a subject we've never tried before, trying a new technique (be it building or storytelling), tackling an area we know we have trouble with as we try to improve, or simply building something that pleases us. That takes all forms, and I've been very impressed with the "quality" of builds in BoBS so far. What I'm trying to say is we don't need much doubloon incentive to play the game, but I will miss the approval system if it goes away because I felt the feedback was better on those builds and it made me push myself a little more.

[Captain Dee]

... ...

No, these are not just your "strange thoughts." I've had similar thoughts as well.

Edited March 25, 2016 by Captain Dee

[Fuzzy MacFuzz]

This is a really interesting discussion. I had never thought of the game as being any sort of competition, except with myself! To me, the whole point of earning doubloons is to develop my sigfig's portfolio and story, not to catch up with Bregir! If my next MCRA goes wrong, that's a chance for a fun build. Look at Gularag's recent builds for the Amara sigfig; the quality was not perfect and the builds were small but what a great story, all inspired by MRCA disaster.

I am far more interested in story quality than build quality, although I admire good builds. A good build with little story is less interesting than a poor build with great story; I am looking for 'fun' in a build, and to see the builder has taken real pleasure in it. And the challenge scoring system allows for both. I spent a lot of time building my Quarry and Glassworks because I wanted to satisfy myself. The lovely comments I got for this build mean far more to me than the doubloons I'll earn from the license, though that is a nice bonus.

Having said all that, if there is a general feeling that having to 'keep up' with too many builds is a source of stress and means people are cutting corners on quality, then that is major concern. Perhaps we should say only the first two FBs each month earn doubloons; any FBs after that are for story only?

I do think the rules system at the moment is a bit of a mess, it caused me a lot of confusion when I joined. This is not the fault of the rules themselves, but of how they are set out. It is often very hard to find the information you need, some rules like the skills tree are not in play, others are buried in obscure places. I keep offering help with this kind of thing but no-one seems interested, still, I would be happy to try and summarise or index the rules if that would be useful.

[TitusV]

I agree with almost everything said here. The rules are indeed a bit complicated...

For myself, I try to put as much quality in a build as possible, but due to the amount of builds required their size has really dropped.

I'm really against a limited amount of MOCs, but we should limit the amount of DBs. As someone aboce said, means a comment on a build far more to me then the DBs it brought. But due to the huge amounts of MOCs here, it's becoming pretty hard to answer all!

[Garmadon]

This is a really interesting discussion. I had never thought of the game as being any sort of competition, except with myself! To me, the whole point of earning doubloons is to develop my sigfig's portfolio and story, not to catch up with Bregir! If my next MCRA goes wrong, that's a chance for a fun build. Look at Gularag's recent builds for the Amara sigfig; the quality was not perfect and the builds were small but what a great story, all inspired by MRCA disaster.

I am far more interested in story quality than build quality, although I admire good builds. A good build with little story is less interesting than a poor build with great story; I am looking for 'fun' in a build, and to see the builder has taken real pleasure in it. And the challenge scoring system allows for both. I spent a lot of time building my Quarry and Glassworks because I wanted to satisfy myself. The lovely comments I got for this build mean far more to me than the doubloons I'll earn from the license, though that is a nice bonus.

Having said all that, if there is a general feeling that having to 'keep up' with too many builds is a source of stress and means people are cutting corners on quality, then that is major concern. Perhaps we should say only the first two FBs each month earn doubloons; any FBs after that are for story only?

I do think the rules system at the moment is a bit of a mess, it caused me a lot of confusion when I joined. This is not the fault of the rules themselves, but of how they are set out. It is often very hard to find the information you need, some rules like the skills tree are not in play, others are buried in obscure places. I keep offering help with this kind of thing but no-one seems interested, still, I would be happy to try and summarise or index the rules if that would be useful.

Most of what you've said here is spot on (the only thing I disagree with is that I'm not sure I can say I far prefer a good story to a good build) - excellent stories to go with the builds, almost more than the great builds themselves, are what make an RPG like this stand out. The game mechanics are an awesome story-provoking thing, and I'm quite looking forward to when I have a MRCA result to build!

The rules could use a bit of reorganization and updating about now, but keep in mind that there is a very handy master index right here, which is what I always use when looking something up!

This thread has been derailed a bit, though - maybe most of this conversation would belong more appropriately in the Introduction and Starting thread?

[Fuzzy MacFuzz]

Wow Garmadon that index is awesome! I wish I had spotted it sooner. Thanks for the heads up.

But I'm not sure it matters where this discussion takes place, it has just evolved in a certain direction like any conversation. I wouldn't have been ready to form many of the points I made without reading the wisdom of others in this thread first.