LH4PI

Yes , that is the link , fantastic work !

Hi Toastie et all I found recently old link with description using the interface A and use it together with DOSbox-X . I now have installed version 2024.03.01 . I want to test if I can get the orignal dos version of Lego controlab with interface B using Dosbox-x running on win 11 Pro and using a a USB to RS232 dongle to work . Anybody that have tested that before ? Best /Lars

Update I find finally the real problem with the serial transmission using my old Omnibook 600 C running win 3 .11 and Dacta control lab . It was the ground pin nr 5 in the 9 pin serial port that have mechanically been pushed into the base of the connector and therfore not keep the ekectrical ground path I was able to push it out again and fixate pin 5 with superglue ,so now the OB 600C works without the dockingstation ( that was providing the ground path using its extension connector to its 9 pin serial connector ) So all good now !

Hi Good news today for me for the use of Dacta original control Lab . I found the original docking station to my HP Omnibook 600C and using that serial port I could get the serial transmission to work running windows 95 version on my windows 98 computer . I have run the software and program the graphical interface without any errors for several hours so the software /hardware is stable I almost get the same software working on another computer Running windows XP pro using an ATEN USB to serial dongle , I could read inputs and control motors but only for a short time but the software get transmission errors that you could delete , but soon you get the same error message again . Using bricklab.exe the communication works without problem . So I can confirm taht other has said that the Dacta control lab win95 version do not work on XP (but almost) Now I should the my other Omnibook 600C that have windows 3.1 installed and see if I can that computer to run Dacta control lab win 3.1 version ! Best/Lars

Yes , fully agree, It is something with the RS 232 world ! . When you get it to work You almost sense how the hardware and software , work together. I have still a lot of tools that uses serial ports , a lot of HP 95, 100 and 200lx palmtops with a wonderful terminal program (actually,I have to try to run the original lego data software on this Dos platform if I can find a mouse that can run from the IRDA interface that this small palmtops has besides the RS 232 port and PCCARD slot ) , two German made ISEL made 4-axes cnc milling machines, a dispenser unit, voltmeter, oscilloscop and now Lego interface B all about 30 Years old and still going strong ! Have heard about .an Irda controlled mouse with driver for 3 1 DOS ? Best Lars

Hi Thorsten Thank You, Thank You I couldn'r resist already verified that the same program also worked on a Win 11 computer using Aten UB to RS-232 adapter model no UC232A The driver installed sutomatically . Have to change the serial port number from port 7 to port 1 in the system manager . I could hook up a few sensors/motors and could verify that all inputs/ outputs works! Now I should install original Dacta software on my Laptop running windows using this usb/serial dongle ! All the best/ Lars

Hi Thorsten Success! I change the computer from the 30 year old laptop to an old mains powered desktop XP Pro Sp3 that have two serial ports on and now using Com1 interface and "correct voltage levels with a standard UART in the XP" the 970909 interface works directly with the BrickLab.exe that I have handy . I test all outputs and varied output levels and directions and I am almost sure everything work, but I have to mount together the box to verify . I should now look for a usb to serial dongle for further test on another old HP XP laptop that I have . as soon I get the bricksafe account approved I can start to send images . I have to spend some time to make a nice schematics of my drawings before it is readable ! Best Regards Lars

Hi Thorsten et .al. I now have started to found the problem with the "faulty" serial connection for my 70909 So far I have mounted two 100uF 16V tanthal capacitor in serial (all I have ) instead of the 220uF 35V that was bad . Maybe it is not enough to make the voltage stable ( only used two rectifier diodes now around 14 V with 2V ripple ). I found that this Voltage is used as input to create the for 5V on the main board used for the SAB 80515. I found how the small power card was working and could make the schematics for it . I can confirm that also pin 4 is connected in the cable up to the main board (put I do not know if it is actually sensed by the microprocessor). as well as pin 5, 2 and 3 in the serial interface as well as GND ,a stable 9 V and a unregulated 12V DC for the main board . On the main board so far I found that the 5 V as well as the oscillator 12Mhz its okay . I put my USB oscilloscope directly on the RxD pin pin 21 on the microcontoller Siemens SAB 80515 and decode the message : As You can see from the image taken it is something electrical wrong with the first part of the pulse train (voltage levels is not correct ) so the micro controller have no chance to read correct the send string . It should be "p\0 ###Do you byte, when I knock?$$$" but as you can see from the image and the decoding of the pulse train the first characters is missing due to the poor pulse waveform in the beginning ; only from "u byte, when I knock?$$$" can be read , so of course the controller program can not initiate correctly . Hopefully it is nothing wrong with the Micro controller and as soon I can get pulse train into the computer serial port it should "start up" finger crossed My next step is to control how I can fix the initial pulse train ( more stable voltage supply, more faulty capacitor on the main board , bad shielding ? ) and also test with desktop PC that normally has with better ground and more stable Voltages for the serial port interface if that could be the problem since now the laptop I use is battery operated and the battery is poor due to 30 Years old battery so I run it on power supply that introduce a a lot of noise from the power line (can not easily be grounded) . I keep you informed and if anybody have any suggestion related to my finding so far please tell All the Best Lars

Hi Thorsten I have not yet been able to test that since the external power supply (a small card near the 9 pin serial connector do not include a 5 V regulator so it must be on the main board . By the way how do I attached pictures , i only have 40 Kbyte allowance .

Fantastic LegoROBOLAB !!I Exactly what I have hoped to find !, I have translated the pdf it to Swedish and now I can clearly see from the pictures how easy the front and the circuit board can be separated . By the way ,do you own yourself this interface ? I should first look for old tantale capacitor that is a big error source on this 31 old card , already have to de solder the 220 uF 35 V one on the 9V power supply board that was short circuited , so I have now 9V , but no communication , maybe this capacitor is vital also for the serial communication to work so I have to test with a new one . Nevertheless now i can start digging in the problem and hopefully the SAB 80515 chip is intact ! Thanks again All the best Lars

Hi Thorsten Here is what you write ( I searched on" SAB 80515" to find your comments about a picture , do you still have it ?) -------------- ; On 6/25/2020 at 8:51 PM, GianCann said: https://www.bricksandchips.it/2020/06/25/linterno-del-control-lab-9751/ Now this is what I call decent electronics. This is so nice and clean. How much did you pay? I know, BL is our friend. Best Thorsten ---------------------- Best/Lars

Thanks BPB I try to document my finding ! Hi Thorsten I fully agree that in almost all cases the serial cable wiring is the source of communication error That's why ask several times in this forum for exact confirmation and BPB has confirmed that in deed only three wire was used to 3 pair of pins . I should check up the link again to the Italy guy! All the best Lars

Hi Thorsten and BPB, I try to find info before I start to try to fix my broken interface B: Maybe you remember the following: Scanning this forum I found that at least Thorsten got pictures from an Italien guy that seem not to be on the forum anymore of the inside of the interface B and even found info about the ucontroller used : (SAB 80515/SAB 80C515 8-Bit Single-Chip Microcontroller ). the info was from from 2020 discussed in the train forum but the links to the pictures no more is active . It looks like photos was taken describing the contents of the board . Do any of you have this pictures still handy to send me ? my mail is lars.herrnsdorf@gmail.com Best Lars

Hi again I check with my multimeter and find an cable in my archive that exactly was configured as Battery PoweredBricks picture shown and tested once more the connection between computer and interface B (9751 (070909)) . No luck ! . I have to dismantle the thing to see what circuity that is broken . To my knowledge nobody have so far dismantled and documented the inside of interface B on this forum so I may be the first ! ----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- I also look at my archive back in the beginnings of 1990 when my children was small and find a lot of stuff that I have forgotten.: I am owner of a full documentation of Dacta 9701 manuals (including Dacta 9701-1,2,3,4,6,7 (9701-5 is missing) as most parts of the Legoset of 9701 including the mentioned 9751 (that I have to fix !!) . May this manuals and building instructions are of any value for the Vintage Lego Robotics archive ?. I also are the owner of the 1992 yers old "Equipment for Primary Schools, Pre-School and Special Education " from Dacta 44 page info that covers from education material from "Early Years to Special Education" in fact describe in the end interface A applications . I also have the most parts and documentation including camera for the Vision Command constructopedia 9731 , including but not test software for the Windows 98 and XP but may be this is counted as Mindstorms products and threfore not of interst here to collect. Finally I also find the 50 page catalog for the "Lego Technic Control Center " 8485 including the hardware as well as a 5 language (DK,S,FIN,D,China) 14 page user manual how to use the Lego Technic Control Center to manually program it from 1995. I played with the Lego Technic Control Center just recently and it is very intuitive and a great way to learn to program in a very basic way without a computer " As I understod I can not attach files since I am not allowed to upload more than 0.04MB since I am still a "New Member" By the way, I also have two NXT Mindstorms packages and was programming in in Labview(robolab) and use it as a prototype platform professionally at R&D department in my earler work : Now I have other focus and I want to see if I can get the Robolab working together with interface B if i can it fixed and tested the original software on my existing computer (see earlier photo) and then running vintage computer (Windows 98 or XP, so if anybody still run that ,please contact me . So if this material can be of any use for other in this group , you know I have it . Sorry for the long message but it was fun to look back at my existing material and thinking what remarkable things Lego made in for education area already 30 years back ! Best Regards Lars Herrnsdorf

Thank You all . I should test once more using only 5-5 ,3-2 anf 2-3!

Thanks again for the Quick response , To clerify O did test if course the " normal" 2 to 3 and 3-2 configuration first , without Success, that why then tested the extension cable approach since it was unclear for me what actually is needed . So if anybody has a cable that works from Lego , what pins are used and how is they connected. I hate to dismantled the box and hook up the oscilliscipe to find why I did not get serial communication to later find out that I have the wrong cable ! Thanks again

Thanks for reply,but what is exactly the minimum pin to pin configuration between female and male to be sure . a Straight cable 2 to 2 , 3 to 3 and 5 to 5? Best Regards Lars

Hello AlexGS I found the initial error , it was a tantalum capacitor 220uF 33V that has shortcircuit and as soon it was desoldered I get 9V! . I have not yet mount a new one since i didn't have such at home but i have now 9 V stable output and the green power light is coming up , and the red Stop light also be on (all the time ) Unfortunately I can not get the serial connection to work yet (get no connection (get a message ) to the lego interface B , but the serial port is initialiated ok , (I can see that the program send out "###Do you byte, when I knock?$$$" to a terminal at 9600 baud okay)) . I have no Lego original cable for this interface but I could read that 2,3 and 5 should be used and I suppose it should be a straight cable . I find a modem cable with one 9 pin female and one one 9 pin male connector where 1-1, 2-2,3-3,4-4,5-5,6-6,7-7,8-8,9-9 sall was connected . Can you pleas check your cable and see what pin connector you use in your cable that works for your interface B. If not the cable, then I have to investigate further and open up the box more , but hopefully it is just the cable that I hav not get right Best Regards Lars

Hi, I am new to this group , but has recently start to try to get the 70909 Lego Interface B 9751 set to work with an old Omnibook 600 C (has PC card ) running Windows 98 and original control lab software . The plan is to assist my grandson to learn to run some of the teaching electronics Lego applications I have been able to get the software installed (using compact flash cards as a way to copy files from the vintage lego Robotics page !!), Thanks all for bring that page to life !! The problem is that when tested the Interface B from 1993 it seems to not power up ( only for a very short time the "ON LED" near the "Stop" label was flashing ) . I get no 9 V to the board from the power supply when connecting using the standard AC 10 V ~7VA transformer 70928. Burt I have correct AC 10V when not connected . It maybe could be short circuit from this big 220uF 30 year electrolytic capacitor ?. But before I go further on I want to as if anybody have any photos or electrical schematics from the interior of the Lego Interface B that could be shared ? Please share any information related to the electrical schematics or components used in this interface so it can be easier to fix the problem . I have attached a picture so Yo see what I am talking about