shunlabs

Nice review ! Mine had a melted 1x6 dk blue plate but fortunatelly LEGO service was quick to fix that ! They had it in Colruyt stores in Belgium, only 50 EUR at the moment. But it's true it is difficult to find in regular stores, as it is often the case with "limited editions"

Fellows, While I do share the concerns of anybody finding LEGO brick an expensive hobby (it certainly is a premium brand), I have the feeling some here don't understand the US market is NOT the 1st market supposed to drive prices. I say this without any animosity, it's just for objectivity's sake. Look carefully at the latest available annual report (2007, year 2008 will only be available later on in 2009), you'll see plain facts on this ever-debated topic : where is Lego's First market. So, click on >> Annual Report 2007 << and read page 9 of the report (page 11 of the pdf). Even with Lego's unusual way of grouping regions / countries, you'll notice that Europe is dominant by large amounts ("Central & Southern Europe" + "Scandinavia & Benelux & Eastern Europe & Asia" + UK - Asia) and you'll already be around 55%; without even counting the part coming from "Direct + Education".... Just to say that it's not the non-US prices that are steep, it's the US prices that are abnormally low, with regards to market sizes. Fact is, other markets are selling well for Lego, so they are the company's milk cows , while the US market is said highly competitive, so they accept to sell at lower margin's there. From the viewpoint of a loyal european customer, understand this creates frustration. When it becomes cheaper to have it imported from the US to Europe than by it directly here, there's a potential image problem, and even more, there's a full boulevard open for gray market and less margin globally for TLG, too ! I think that's the element that could eventually drive a new pricing policy in the US ! Add to the mix that in some cases, the bricks sold at a hefty discount in the US actually come from Europe and you start feeling deeply crooked. For those who were wondering, current exchange rate is around 1 EUR = 1.28 USD This means that to be fair, a 100 eur set should be sold 128 USD .... we are still far from it, so relax and enjoy your still low prices !

Count me in, too Wow, already 20 pages !!

Yup, noticed that too. On some sets, Belgian official prices are even higher than German ones, usually regarded as the high end of the range in Europe ... ( see Indy 7622 : Race For Stollen Treasure. 30 USD [=20 EUR] in the US, 35 EUR in Germany, 40 EUR in Belgium !! ) That's what you get when you are a good-performing market for Lego But, hey, we all know ho to order in the US and that will be my answer ! :skull:

Lots of interesting views on a ever-debated subject ! In summary here are my views : - pricing policy is NOT linked to exchange rates, and only vaguely linked to wage levels (I believe US average hourly rate might be a bit lower, but then so are also taxes!) ; - no effect from so said "absence of competition in Europe" (has been pointed out many times we DO have our fair share of competitors in Europe : MB, Knex, A'brick, Meccano and even blatant copies from China) - the "economies of scale" (US = market with nationwide big sellers as opposed to supposed clustered local sellers in Europe) that are often mentionned once all other arguments have run dry don't work either. Most toys are sold through big, specialized , cross-barrier companies these days. I'll add a funny observation here, as a self-speaking example of this : set 7784 (Batmobile UCS). US SRP : 70 USD (about 47 EUR), but EUR SRP : 100 EUR (on average). Suddenly, heaps of 7784's pop up in various stores (mostly Bart Smit here in Belgium) at a stunning 40 EUR !!! Just looking at these marvellous boxes, it appears they are US ones (English, French, Spanish language + piece count). So these big boxes are coming from the US with a 60% discount on the regular EUR price. I suppose this is a parallel import, and that Lego wouldn't be too happy about it. And back to the subject : Europe more expensive is NOT a problem of logistics either. - as already pointed out rightfuly, the only factor that really matters in Lego's pricing policy is the demand. If the demand is high, prices are high, customers are taxed until they cannot fork out more money. Just as simple as that. Seen from another angle, this is completely unfair : the more loyal markets get the less reward (discounts). This is why people are complaining, not because they are jealous weenies. I've read Lego had been doing really well in Benelux over the last months. Reward : I have checked all suggested retail prices from the new paper catalog just out this month (so 2008H2 vs 2008H1) and have been extremely disappointed in noticing a steep rise in prices for the same sets : from 5 to 15%. What makes this particularly sad :small sets are especially impacted. A striking example for bigger sets : Mindstoms NXT : 300 eur to 325 eur ! us price : 250 usd (167 eur). Belgian price = twice US price !! The limit to this demand-driven system will be : people won't be buying in EUR but through parallel imports. I personally already switched to this scheme. - a final word on the legends that float around about the size of markets (of which US would be, if not 1st, at least 2nd). Just look for facts, not rumors, feelings or dreams . Look at Lego's own annual report : Click here. In the latest version (2007), on page 11 you'll see a split on revenues by countries. Unfortunatelly, Lego chose to group countries with a sometimes strange logic. Anyways you'll agree that US + Canada + Australia + New Zealand + UK = 30%. I'll let you infer what the US alone would weight. Other facts : Central + Southern Europe : 27%. Scandinavia + Benelux + Eastern Europe + Asia = 27%. Do the math : Europe (ex UK!) + Asia = 54% of Lego's revenues. Not even discussing the Educational / Direct slice (16%), which is not country-related. The conclusion is not easy to hear but is as follows : the more you love Lego, the more Lego makes you pay for it.

Interesting to know, in most European countries, regulations would have issues with this kind of situation. There is a general concept that once a good/service is on offer and obviously available (as this is the case here, stocks are shown and even ready for the sale, with price), there is no possibility to refuse to sell. The basic idea against this "sale refusal" is to avoid discrimination. Should there be a special clause from Lego / Lucas not to sell them before a specified date, then they simply shouldn't put merchandise on shelves. If this was a storage capacity / logistics issue that obliged them to do so, they should ensure people won't grab boxes (leave them in sealed crates, place visible notices stating official release date). 100% Wall Mart responsability ! I agree serving the "Product Recall" excuse is also awful, and even detrimental to Lego's reputation as it infers the product has quality issues ! What a nice store, covering its errors with libel The good side of consistently being late on releases (as Europe usually is), is that we don't have this kind of problems

Very appealing set, I must say ! *thumbup* I would be a pity it doesn't reach all stores (not only TrU / S@H) with such a potential. Yup, prolly windows are made of stickers, beh *cry_sad* It seems loosely based on the famous and beautiful DC3, although proportions are a bit strange here and there (props go before the nose, cockpit diameter vs wing area, overal seems also a bit short), but, hey, I'll consider it a Chibi DC3, how cute is that ! *wub* Again, splendid use of the exchange rates by TLC !! FYI, we are currently in the range 1 EUR = 1.58 USD. (Check http://www.xe.com/). Which either means, if one would be fair, that a 70 EUR item should be 110 USD, or the other way around, that a 65 USD item should be 41.15 EUR... You decide in which direction the conversion should apply, lol ! *tongue*

Are Belgian nationals the only ones here to find criticism over this book ? (Must be the political climate that fails to get better :-P ) Well, nobody seemed to complain about the complete omission of : - # of figs; - theme / subtheme classification They would not eat too much space, I think, and would be very useful ! :-$ Having some price references would also have been very interesting, but, granted, since it tends to vary a lot accross countries, that would have probably meant only considering Germany and US msrp's for instance. Still, I would love to see price references.

Yup, available here with a splendid 50 EUR price tag ... using today's exchange rates, that's 77.93 USD 8-

The same error happens all the time for the prices in EUR ... for some reason they just re-use USD figures and put EUR symbol behind (they even increase amounts in some cases, you evil Lego ! >:-) ). Wait ... this isn't an error ... it's actually corporate pricing policy 8-

Meh, call that a genuine confession of quality issues with the production *sad* At least they identified the problem to the point it made it to the annual report, and apparently measures have already been taken : *sweet*

Well to me this is terribly bad news. Yeah sure EF could have been a lot better than it was, but in the end it's a pity to lose a fresh theme, a completely new universe different from the usual way of considering themes. Agents will be a ton less innovative, with the usual lot of action/spy material. I read people complain about repetitive sets ... what would they say about the unavoidable fire stations, police HQ and the like ? Come to think of it, isn't that a bit of the same thing, evoluting years after years ? What I really find difficult to understand, are satisfied reactions of people basically saying "hey you the theme I don't like, get out so that my fav theme can sell more". Despite sales figures were not up to expectations, there were people who actually liked these sets. They were also useful parts-wise and brought their fair amount of share of new minifigs. EF was a try to make things differently than the usual trilogy past (castle) / present (city) / future (space) and I am greeting LEGO for it. I will bring some (limited) information on the discussion on how popular EF was in Asia through the link to a music video below. Not many Lego sets had the privilege to be featured in official music videos, right ? Then check this one out and tell me what you see around 3:11 Fit Song by Cornelius [music video] Alright, this one is rather conceptual ;-) Artist is Cornelius, aka Keigo Oyamada from Japan. No gundams or else, just a Grand Titan (7701) *y* Now that's a tribute to EF !! *wub*

For those still interested, I received replacement parts for my faultry "Viking horns" (actually all from Castle line's Skeleton Tower set) today. *sweet* All nicely placed in a lego service bag, together with a friendly letter in Dutch (hopefully I can read it *sad* ) I still have to try them this evening, in order to ensure no replacement part has to be ... replaced :-D Now they may have production issues, but the service is trully *y* Quality Control ON !!

Thanks for your reactions :-) Well I can understand the logic behind Exclusive items, as you said, to draw people in, but then Limited Editions (non-Exclusive ones) are still another story. In fact i'm wondering how they decide which set ought to be produced for 2+ years while others for only a few months. Let's have an example with the SW Republic Cruiser. In my country it has just appeared recently and only on S@H and a few stores, at that. I'm sure they will be gone in a few weeks. (Skeleton ship appeared also recently and is already sold out on S@H). Okay, the aim of this is to stimulate demand to be able to raise prices, but for such items (generally mid to big sets), the buying decision is not always straightforward, and they shrink the timeframe to take this decision to a few weeks, that just insane ! *wacko* What I am wondering is : business-wise, wouldn't it be at least as profitable to give these sets more time to sell, even at a fractionnally lower price ? Less per item, but bigger volumes (which allow for amortization for new molds, btw). Also, some people not living our passion for Lego on a daily basis would then be allowed to catch these sets as well. I'm sure many of them don't even know such limited sets have ever existed ! Below, another aspect of today's Lego distribution complexity you probably already know : Dear LEGO

*sad* Some sets are considered as limited editions; sometimes it's clearly labelled so on the box (Republic Cruiser, Hoth Base, Skeleton ship to name a few) and sometimes not so clear-cut (for instance, EF Supernova was an exclusive in the US as I understand, but not in Europe, still it was never featured in a Belgian Lego catalog for instance and i don't remember seeing it in the belgian section of S@H.) Same Story for EF Bridge Walker, not featured in catalogs, not marked as limited edition, but this time, available through S@H... This raises the general questions of why such differences in sets production/distribution... What are they exactly : limited in time production, in numbers ? Would you have examples of sales figures for a limited set ? When did Lego start with limited editions ? What is your feeling about them ? A trendy marketing gimmick to boost sales or a regrettable policy ? About exclusives such as the ones for TRU ? About sets that are neither limited or exclusive but become unavailable way too early (Ninja line, Vikings line, Batman dragster:catwoman pursuit,...) if at all (no X-Pods from the 2nd wave in Europe ) ? Side effects of all of this : crazy prices and frustration. I personnally think that every set produced should be available for at the very least 1y on S@H. Otherwise it becomes playing with the rarity/shortage effect and I find this *wacko* ! Your reactions on the subject are eagerly awaited ! ;-)

1/ new, freshly acquired box manutention noise (just moving it, putting it in the car's boot, ...)... it announces the enjoyment to come ... this is kind of the Pavlov principle applied to AFOLs :-D 2/ rattling noise when digging into containers full of pieces *sweet* 3/ technic pin clicking noise, can't get enough of that *wub*

I certainly will ! Maybe seeing lots of (founded) complaints through the replacement page will eventually ring a bell X-O I am, for my part, 100% ready to send them the faulty parts so that they can assess the issue (and be sure nobody abuses the system). QC feedback On ! X-D

Great and very useful experiment Bonaparte ! *y* Proficiaat ;-) Keep up the good work and let us know until which point we can get rid of the yellowing effect ! X-O Just one question : did you 'refresh' the Javel at some point ? I mean, adding more after some time elapsed or even changing the whole solution ? I believe if you don't, its whitening power decreases and would eventually stop ?!

Same here. I wasn't too excited about batman when the theme hit the shelves but now I 've changed my mind a bit and find this entry set terribly interesting, minifigures-wise. *y* So I though it would be possible to simply buy it from a local retailer, it was only a 2006H2 set after all.... :-| Hell, no way, they are nowhere to be found ... except at twice the price on ebay or BL >:-( Meh, a 1 year lifespan for such a small set, what a shame 8-|

Thanks Hinckley for sharing your experience with this issue. I too find it very alarming when the quality is so bad that the core concept itself of Lego (interlocking bricks, not loose bricks, duh !) is at stakes. Finally I decided to fill in a replacement parts form with a polite (of course :-P ) comment. I already received the usual formatted answer (quality is a priority to us blah blah blah :-/ ) and from what I understood, parts are on their way *sweet* Uh, hope they are the properly-interlocking ones *wacko*

A bit of bumping myself (sorry about that :-P ) but here's another recent example of serious quality issues : I recently purchased 7093 Skeleton Tower and couldn't help ranting on the fact roughly half of the white teeth (peeron name : Minifig Accessory Helmet Viking Horn ) don't stick well - if at all - in the holes they are intended to. It seems the production of these tiny pieces is plagued with subtle size variations which results in some of them being able to hold firmly in place; while others simply move all over the place (and eventually fall down of course). *sing* I'm even more disappointed with this because I already noticed this almost 2 years ago with the Vikings Drakkar (7018). I though they would have fixed this ... >:-( I suppose some of you have come accross this problem ? How did you solve this ? Did you ask for replacement parts or did you leave it so ? I think I'm gonna complain to LEGO this time. |-/

I remember participating in a local building contest a looong time ago (I was around 12 then :-P ). The big off-roader I built for the occasion was displayed on the shelves of the store that organized the contest, but they placed it too close to the spots |-/ so a few of the plates on top of it (roof, hood) melted and were completely unusable >:-( No need to tell how happy I was when I came back to pick it up >:-( You criminals !!

That's Flextronics, actually, a well-known subcontractor. They are originally from Singapore and the company counts more than 110.000 employees around the globe. Their core activity is rather in electronics (they are behind XBox or even Playstation 2/3 for instance...) than in precision plastic molding, so outsourcing to them was not necessary a clear-cut decision :-| If I recall correctly, the production in Czech Republic and Mexico is now in their hands. China components might be mainly electronics (motors, light/sound bricks, power functions and the like). I read somewhere parts produced in Denmark would still be under the control of TLG. But then, how do you know the proportion of parts that comes from these various locations, for a given set ? I fully agree with Sne re the quality being materially different. I can still get used to color variations (I noticed this especially on red and yellow parts but it seems every color is impacted) but what really is working my nerves is the loss of LEGO's legendary precision. A simple but very indicative example : just pile up a dozen of 1x2 plates (even from the same set !) and you'll see what I mean. Old ones will be perfectly aligned, while new ones will be making zigzags. I could also mention parts that don't stay assembled very well (loose interlocking) on a random basis *sing* Another hint : I come accross more and more pieces with "flash" , i.e. residual traces of molding *n* I even had some of them replaced by Lego (the excavator buckets in Striking Venom) because they were so badly molded ... All of this is quite new and I'm really sad about it. *sing* Please TLG, don't compromise too much on quality !!! :'-(

In Belgium, Makro megastores (part of Metro group) offer the Republic Cruiser 7665 at EUR 77.50 A bargain for us Europeans in comparison with EUR 110 suggested retail price here, but still far behind regular price in the us (90 usd... that's merely 60.50 EUR, let us not even speak about clearance sales ... :-X ) Now the final touch : they have a promo running : buy for at least 100 EUR from their end of year toys catalog (and at least 3 items...) and get 10 EUR additionnal rebate. Thing is, only 7665 is really at an interesting price :-/