Mafia Mafia: Day Two - Lynch Lunch Hour!

[Piratedave84]

I already said that. I'd rather they know not to pick it then for a Townie PR to get it. They learn the content of six pills a day. Let's take what advantages we can. Any tracking who selected what?

Me

[Hinckley]

It would help to know what order they were selected in too.

[mostlytechnic]

I'll end the mystery right now. You fake voted for Blacked-Out Night Action Dude and as the day was beginning, I found him suspicious. I thought he and The Doctor were both Scum. I'll explain why some other time. However, since you also found Blacked-Out Night Action dude Scummy, I felt I could trust you. That's all. The Witch mentioned you and The Talking Animal as the people he thought we should tell to try and get the pill. I don't know if he spoke to The Talking Animal about it, but he said he felt The Talking Animal was in Town-mode.

Not sure why I was included here - I AM town, and I'm glad I'm appearing in town-mode to people. But I can't say that I've done enough to be worthy of serious trust - on the other hand, just asking me to get and verify a pill isn't exactly high responsibility and trust (especially if done right, like not telling me why or what effect you're looking for). And for the record, nope, haven't talked to witch privately at all yet.

[DarthPotato]

Sorry is really all I can say for being inactive today and not selecting a pill in time.

Anyway, about the subject of the Vig, I still find it really odd how they claimed to the Female Lover. At this point I don't think it's as bad anymore (she hasn't really seemed too scummy to me) but earlier I was completely unsure about her. So it's not about why the claim was made to me, it's more about when. Also, I don't really blame them for trying to kill the Witch. She wasn't overly helpful yesterday and mostly just went over things other people had already stated. Why was the Goon trusted so easily by the Witch and the Female Lover? A life saver pill is something that shouldn't be taken lightly. But, I guess it's better for it to have a chance of being in the hands of someone that's slightly trustworthy rather than a chance of it being in the hands of a member of the scum. BONAD was very eager, but like others have said I think he meant more good than harm. I think scum would be more careful of blabbing about that kind of stuff in public.

About the subject of today, I feel like the suspicion on the Male Lover has kind of gone away at this point. Though, A Cultist lynch wouldn't be bad in my mind because it would give us lots of new information. If he's scum, it could verify the argument that him and I weren't on the same side which was brought up yesterday. Maybe it could also end up shedding a little light or even a little suspicion on the Usurper for bringing up the initial case against him. So I'll:

Fakevote: The Cultist (Fred Daniel Yam)

[jimmynick]

Personally, I don't believe in the whole fake vote concept, it's way too easy for the scum to test out their targets and to see if their targets generate support from the Town. I believe the only way to make the scum nervous is to post a real vote. Not as a poke or test but as a decisive vote. No offense Female Lover, I appreciate what you are trying to do here, but scum could easily use this to their advantage.

Perhaps we should look at those people who had 1 fake vote, and who fake voted for them.

It's fake after all. Right?

I don't follow. Please explain why people with only one fake vote are suspicious. It's an issue of wanting to make clear whom the intended lynchee is without forcing yourself into a corner because of the "only one unvote" thing. It's easy to make scum nervous with fake votes, because they know that the fake votes will probably turn into real votes.

The fake votes help us organise and make sure we don't make mistakes and get caught without a changeable vote.

The Cultist certainly hasn't been around today despite being online. Panicking? Or given up? Both doesn't seem Town to me.

I also 'love' how The Doctor decides to set the standard to determine who's active or not. Who knows, he could be scum at the front trying to act all townie tommie, suspicious of everyone (including his scum buddies) so no one would possibly suspect he is scum. The Doctor is so helpful, analysing posts, talking to people, surely he's not scum. Who knows?

@The Doctor - Are you defending The Witch?

As The Doctor said, the pill The Witch took yesterday is consistent with the claim. It gives us more information and stops us from jumping the gun and lynching The Witch without substantial evidence.

About the subject of today, I feel like the suspicion on the Male Lover has kind of gone away at this point. Though, A Cultist lynch wouldn't be bad in my mind because it would give us lots of new information.

How do you feel about that? Is the interest in The Cultist's brief activity taking away from legitimate suspicion of the Male Lover? Is that a good thing? Is that a bad thing? Are they both scum? Do you think that the scum are trying to distract us? What new information would we learn from lynching The Cultist, other than merely FDY's alliance?

I'm going to get the ball rolling for our second lynch of the day:

Unfakevote: Male Lover (LegoDad)

Vote: Male Lover (LegoDad)

Ah, when I said "substantial evidence" about The Witch, I realised we don't have substantial evidence for anyone. But suggesting that The Witch was the SK was a complete shot in the dark that turns out to be invalid, so we shouldn't lynch The Witch on that reasoning.

[DarthPotato]

How do you feel about that? Is the interest in The Cultist's brief activity taking away from legitimate suspicion of the Male Lover? Is that a good thing? Is that a bad thing? Are they both scum? Do you think that the scum are trying to distract us? What new information would we learn from lynching The Cultist, other than merely FDY's alliance?

I think we should always remember all suspicions that have been brought out through the course of the game as they may very well come in handy later. So I don't really like it when one thing gets distracted by another, but sometimes that distraction could always end up being a good thing (in this case, if the Cultist ends up being scum). Are they both scum? I have no idea. There's really no way to tell if they're connected because of the small amount (if any) interaction they've had with each other. Personally, I don't think it's too much of a distraction, it's more of people just forgetting about other things going on. I wouldn't vote for the Cultist if I thought it was a distraction. Also, what do you mean we'd learn something about FDY? Aren't you FDY...? While I admit we won't learn a massive amount of new information from the vote on the Cultist, I think we'll learn more than the lynch on the Male Lover. At first, him and the Female Lover seemed to be Role playing a lot together and seeming very friendly, but now that that's changed they aren't really tied together in my mind again.

[jimmynick]

Sorry, I'm First Day Lynch and FDY is Fred Daniel Yam == Cultist.

I'm relatively satisfied with your answer.

[mostlytechnic]

I don't follow. Please explain why people with only one fake vote are suspicious. It's an issue of wanting to make clear whom the intended lynchee is without forcing yourself into a corner because of the "only one unvote" thing. It's easy to make scum nervous with fake votes, because they know that the fake votes will probably turn into real votes.

Ah, when I said "substantial evidence" about The Witch, I realised we don't have substantial evidence for anyone. But suggesting that The Witch was the SK was a complete shot in the dark that turns out to be invalid, so we shouldn't lynch The Witch on that reasoning.

I think (correct me if I'm wrong) that purpearl was saying we should look at the one-fake-vote-having people (and especially who MADE that fakevote) since it'd be a way for scum to toss out a weak accusation, see if it sticks and gets other people joining in, and then run with it if so, with little consequence if it goes nowhere.

And while witch appears to be confirmed with the pill, remember that it doesn't mean witch ISN'T the SK or other unkillable person... just that they DID have a unkillable pill when the vig attacked.

[Adam]

There, all those people are Scum. Um, maybe this isn't such a bright theory or a scary poke for the Scum, but the idea sounded pretty valid before I tried to type it out. Anyway, it's something to think about. I'm not saying that anyone who doesn't try my idea is Scum, perhaps it's still confusing for some, but I do doubt that the Scum would boldly start even fake cases against people.

You have repeatedly told us to treat fake votes the same as real votes.

You didn't fake un-vote so I'm not counting the new one. Treat it like a vote. That's the only way it will work.

My thinking when it comes to fake votes is, "Would I be confident in placing a real vote for this person? Would I be confident in lynching him or her?" That's why I poked Bob instead of fakevoting him. In hindsight this policy feels a tad Draconian, and I now realize that maybe adding pokes into the mix will generate needless confusion.

Speaking of fake votes, I believe that the Godfather (Kadabra) placed one for me earlier, and it appears to be missing from your "here's where we stand" lists.

How do you feel about that? Is the interest in The Cultist's brief activity taking away from legitimate suspicion of the Male Lover? Is that a good thing? Is that a bad thing? Are they both scum? Do you think that the scum are trying to distract us? What new information would we learn from lynching The Cultist, other than merely FDY's alliance?

This recalls the whole quality vs. quantity debate from earlier (though I will remind the Cultist (Fred Daniel Yam) that the rules require him to post in every day thread). I had wanted to hear (or, uh, read) what he has to say before passing judgement on him. Honestly, it'd take a damn good post from him to set my mind at ease, and I don't foresee that coming. I just kicked him a pigeon and hopefully that'll get his megablocks over here.

However, the Female Lover (Hinckley) made a good point earlier: the Cultist logged on and chose not to address the accusations, which leads me to believe that he is trying to avoid the whole issue and is hoping that it will be forgotten or something. For that reason I'm going to fake vote: The Cultist (Fred Daniel Yam).

I do have to wonder why The Witch revealed so easily to me that the pill was the unkillable one. Had I taken that pill and someone tried to kill me and contacted me about it, I'd certainly be a lot more dodgy. Maybe I would, who knows. Maybe I can just ask The Witch: why did you reveal the property of the pill to me so quickly? What had I done that you trusted me with the info?

Hang on a second. Are you saying that the presumed vig told you that he or she tried unsuccessfully to kill the Witch and that, completely separately, the Witch decided to reveal her pill to you? Or am I completely misreading this and did the Witch open up to you after you approached her with the vig's claim? Because if the former is true, then that level of coordination and coincidence is pretty damn suspicious.

[TrumpetKing]

The cultist lynch is certainly important for us. If you aren't going to bother defending yourself, you probably aren't going to help us. However, usually scum don't give up so easily. Could he be town? Is it worth keeping a potential townie if they aren't going to help us catch the scum? If he is scum, I wouldn't say he's doing a very good job, and while his lack of a defense is seeming slightly townie to me (I mean, why would we lynch someone for doing the same thing that the lynched townie was doing yesterday?), I still think the weird behavior that he showcased yesterday outweighs the slight towntell.

As for the 2nd lynch, I'm still stuck, but the Male Lover's assumptions are strange.

[DarthPotato]

The cultist lynch is certainly important for us. If you aren't going to bother defending yourself, you probably aren't going to help us. However, usually scum don't give up so easily. Could he be town? Is it worth keeping a potential townie if they aren't going to help us catch the scum? If he is scum, I wouldn't say he's doing a very good job, and while his lack of a defense is seeming slightly townie to me (I mean, why would we lynch someone for doing the same thing that the lynched townie was doing yesterday?), I still think the weird behavior that he showcased yesterday outweighs the slight towntell.

As for the 2nd lynch, I'm still stuck, but the Male Lover's assumptions are strange.

It's also sometimes the opposite: Townies fight for their lives because they know they're innocent and scum give up because they know they're guilty and they don't want to say something that makes them seem even more guilty (or even gets their teammates into trouble). Also, what from his defense seemed Townie?

[TrumpetKing]

He didn't defend himself. I didn't say he defended himself. I said he didn't defend himself and explained how that makes him look a little townie.

[DarthPotato]

Oh, you said lack of defense. My bad! Still, I think what I said above still sums up what I think. I see no reason to hold off my real vote at this point. Vote: The Cultist (Fred Daniel Yam)

[Tamamono]

Ugh, sorry for my absence. Been busy.

Shame that a pill had to be revealed like that, but at least Witch's story adds up. Meh.

The Cultist (Fred Daniel Yam) - for obvious reasons.

The Snake Charmer (DarthPotato) - a very smart and usually active player and yet, now that the smoke has cleared from The Cult Leader's accusation, he hasn't been contributing to all that has been happening.

The Paranoid Gun Owner (Purpearljellyblob) - Call this one a gut feeling. There's something I just don't like about him. He's flying under the radar, but seems to be paying enough attention to get pills, etc.

The Male Lover (LEGODad) - Are the inconsistencies just mistakes and sloppy reading? He seems to be trying to be helpful to The Town and I agree with a good number of his points but we've noticed some things we don't like about what he's saying as well, specifically the odd feeling that The Cop was killed for being suspicious when we know the vigilante was unsuccessful.

I like all these lynches, barring Snake Charmer (I've already stated that I feel like he's becoming more town. Cultist/Male Lover are actually my main candidates. Hopefully we can coordinate the votes so that these two (or at least the most suspicious people) get lynched?

Maybe we should continue with the fake votes and then make a tally between these people, eventually changing to real votes when the time comes?

Unfakevote Jester

Fakevote Cultist

[Hinckley]

The Cultist tells me he's quitting the game so lets make him one of our lynches. Easy as that since he claims The Werewolf is going to mod kill him anyway. Saves us the trouble of lynching two players.

[Tamamono]

The Cultist tells me he's quitting the game so lets make him one of our lynches. Easy as that since he claims The Werewolf is going to mod kill him anyway. Saves us the trouble of lynching two players.

Weird. I feel like a scummo would stick it out, but since he's getting modkilled there's no reason not to make him our second lynch.

Vote: Cultist (Fred Daniel Yam)

[fhomess]

Maybe we should continue with the fake votes and then make a tally between these people, eventually changing to real votes when the time comes?

Or maybe we should get two fakevotes since there are two lynches!

Unfakevote: Male Lover

Why unfakevote Male Lover? Because I'm ready to do this: Vote: Male Lover (LegoDad)

(Did I need to unfake vote first... do I get a new fake vote even though I have a real vote? What's the protocol?)

I've already made several points againt the Male Lover. I've not been put at ease by the responses, and I think there's a pretty good chance he's scum. I didn't like the way he said The Cop "was doing fine screwing with you guys all by himself", as if he's not a part of the town in addition to the idea that he tried to pawn the Cop's death off as a vig metagame kill.

I'm sorry to hear the Cultist was unable to participate.

As for the Snake Charmer, your contributions today have been non-committal until called out on it by the First Day Lynch.

[Tamamono]

Why unfakevote Male Lover? Because I'm ready to do this: Vote: Male Lover (LegoDad)

Male Lover is another stellar lynch. Can we get another bandwagon on him?

[Clanure]

The Cultist tells me he's quitting the game so lets make him one of our lynches. Easy as that since he claims The Werewolf is going to mod kill him anyway. Saves us the trouble of lynching two players.

Weird. I feel like a scummo would stick it out, but since he's getting modkilled there's no reason not to make him our second lynch.

Vote: Cultist (Fred Daniel Yam)

Absolutely we should make him one of our lynches. But who else is most deserving today? I'm surprised Male Lover hasn't shown up to defend himself. I'm metagaming here, but that's not his townie style.

[Hinckley]

The cultist lynch is certainly important for us. If you aren't going to bother defending yourself, you probably aren't going to help us. However, usually scum don't give up so easily. Could he be town? Is it worth keeping a potential townie if they aren't going to help us catch the scum? If he is scum, I wouldn't say he's doing a very good job, and while his lack of a defense is seeming slightly townie to me (I mean, why would we lynch someone for doing the same thing that the lynched townie was doing yesterday?), I still think the weird behavior that he showcased yesterday outweighs the slight towntell.

As for the 2nd lynch, I'm still stuck, but the Male Lover's assumptions are strange.

Way to waffle in the center, commit to nothing and play both sides of The Cultist case. So, do you think it's a Town-tell or was he too Scummy yesterday? Which is it? And there's a huge difference between The Cultist and The Serial Killer in that The Serial Killer hadn't even logged in. The Cultist has been here and even took the time to speak with some of us. So, no. It's not the exact same thing a Townie did yesterday. And if we continue this trend, any Scum we accuse would only have to disappear for us to unvote him. Is that the logic you propose we use?

Absolutely we should make him one of our lynches. But who else is most deserving today? I'm surprised Male Lover hasn't shown up to defend himself. I'm metagaming here, but that's not his townie style.

Again, has he logged in?

[Esurient]

My list of suspicious people so far:

The Snake Charmer: His sudden absence really caught my attention this time. Seemed to me like he is avoiding discussion about The Witch.

The Jester: Also seemed to be absent.

BONAD: Made a hasty revelation about The Witch, repents and turns to The Cultist without any justification. This is similar to Day 1's behaviour, first he suspected the Virgin then switched to the SK.

The Cultist: Quitting.

The Witch: So The Witch is not scum because he took the lifesaver pill? Is anyone still onto his case?

I have no problems with voting for The Cultist, but I am more concerned with The Snake Charmer and BONAD's inconsistencies.

[Piratedave84]

Sorry is really all I can say for being inactive today and not selecting a pill in time.

Anyway, about the subject of the Vig, I still find it really odd how they claimed to the Female Lover. At this point I don't think it's as bad anymore (she hasn't really seemed too scummy to me) but earlier I was completely unsure about her. So it's not about why the claim was made to me, it's more about when. Also, I don't really blame them for trying to kill the Witch. She wasn't overly helpful yesterday and mostly just went over things other people had already stated. Why was the Goon trusted so easily by the Witch and the Female Lover? A life saver pill is something that shouldn't be taken lightly. But, I guess it's better for it to have a chance of being in the hands of someone that's slightly trustworthy rather than a chance of it being in the hands of a member of the scum. BONAD was very eager, but like others have said I think he meant more good than harm. I think scum would be more careful of blabbing about that kind of stuff in public.

About the subject of today, I feel like the suspicion on the Male Lover has kind of gone away at this point. Though, A Cultist lynch wouldn't be bad in my mind because it would give us lots of new information. If he's scum, it could verify the argument that him and I weren't on the same side which was brought up yesterday. Maybe it could also end up shedding a little light or even a little suspicion on the Usurper for bringing up the initial case against him. So I'll:

Fakevote: The Cultist (Fred Daniel Yam)

When you say "she" you are referring to The Female Lover right? I kind of read this as if you are refering to the Vig as she; maybe I'm reading this wrong, am I?

If FDY will be modkilled, could we not possibly lynch another potential scum; I know this is late in the day to start discussing a third suspect but it could pay off really big should FDY actually be scum!

I personally think that the PGO's quick in-and-out comment was very weird. Not because it targetted things I said but because it clearly did not factor in any of the other elements of the discussions we were having at that time. Since then another person (on my phone, hard to type and go back in the thread simultaneously) and I asked her questions which have yet to be addressed. Some food for thought; maybe something for tomorrow!

For my vote I shall: fake vote: the Male Lover (legodad) (forgive me for not 'blueing' my vote, I don't know how to do this on my cell)

His actions in thread are getting weirder and he seems quite paranoid; my concern with this vote is that we may loose Hinck in the process. Male Lover, are you yes or no actual lovers?

[jimmynick]

My list of suspicious people so far:

The Snake Charmer: His sudden absence really caught my attention this time. Seemed to me like he is avoiding discussion about The Witch.

The Jester: Also seemed to be absent.

BONAD: Made a hasty revelation about The Witch, repents and turns to The Cultist without any justification. This is similar to Day 1's behaviour, first he suspected the Virgin then switched to the SK.

The Cultist: Quitting.

The Witch: So The Witch is not scum because he took the lifesaver pill? Is anyone still onto his case?

I have no problems with voting for The Cultist, but I am more concerned with The Snake Charmer and BONAD's inconsistencies.

Snake Charmer and Jester are still moderately suspicious (at least to me) but they aren't the persons of interest today.

BONAD got his revelation about The Witch from the person who claimed vig to both him and to the Female Lover. BONAD jumped to the "Witch must be SK conclusion". This was faulty reasoning, since we have protectors, lifesaver pills and Inventors, all of which prevent people from being killed in the night. The Witch claimed lifesaver pill, which was confirmed by Female Lover.

To conclude: BONAD is off the hook for today (different situation than yesterday) and it is still possible that The Witch could be scum (or SK), but we have no evidence to support that hypothesis any more. There is no case.

And we're lynching the Cultist because he's quitting.

How do you feel about the other lynch candidate (Male Lover), whom you did not mention in your list of suspicious people?

Great job posting zero insight or content.

Ah. And blockers. They can stop people from being killed in the night as well.

@ The Doctor:

If we decide to lynch someone other than The Cultist because FDY will be allegedly modkilled, I'm behind you all the way on PGO.

[mostlytechnic]

The Cultist tells me he's quitting the game so lets make him one of our lynches. Easy as that since he claims The Werewolf is going to mod kill him anyway. Saves us the trouble of lynching two players.

So.... I'm suspicious then of the cultist being scum. I'd think a townie that was quitting would have the decency to at least say so publicly, as well as share any final info/thoughts/etc. Hopefully if cultist IS town they've sent hinck what they know (their role, pill results). But I won't be at all surprised to see a scum result tomorrow on cultist. My gut on this one is like 60/40 scum.

My list of suspicious people so far:

The Snake Charmer: His sudden absence really caught my attention this time. Seemed to me like he is avoiding discussion about The Witch.

The Jester: Also seemed to be absent.

BONAD: Made a hasty revelation about The Witch, repents and turns to The Cultist without any justification. This is similar to Day 1's behaviour, first he suspected the Virgin then switched to the SK.

The Cultist: Quitting.

The Witch: So The Witch is not scum because he took the lifesaver pill? Is anyone still onto his case?

I have no problems with voting for The Cultist, but I am more concerned with The Snake Charmer and BONAD's inconsistencies.

Agree on snake - leaning slightly scum to me, mostly due to too quiet. Surely SOMETHING has happened that you could comment on! There IS a jester still? I think I'd forgotten about him he's been so quiet! BONAD, could be scum, but I suspect just hasty town play. Not sure the scum would have shared info so fast. Cultist, already said just above. Witch - I know I've stated at least once, probably more, that she's not off my radar.

If FDY will be modkilled, could we not possibly lynch another potential scum; I know this is late in the day to start discussing a third suspect but it could pay off really big should FDY actually be scum!

His actions in thread are getting weirder and he seems quite paranoid; my concern with this vote is that we may loose Hinck in the process. Male Lover, are you yes or no actual lovers?

I'd be open to a third, since I am leaning scummy on cultist. not sure who that would be... my top suspicions now are cult, male lover, and maybe snake in third.

I don't think they're actually lovers - it's in their descriptions, but nothing else in there is true that I know of. Worth a confirmation from hink, but I don't think it's a real concern.

[CMP]

After taking a look at Day One, I'm comfortable to Vote: Male Lover (LegoDad).

He was as fluffy as my pet dust bunny yesterday -

Ok, back to the action, just got back from watching the ball game, yeah, there's actually a tv in the corner if you didn't notice. I can't say as a lot of the chatter has come off as particularly scummy, and I don't want to jump down someone's throat yet for making a comment. I've tried this tactic, it doesn't particularly work. I think a lot of people are overly paranoid right now because what seems to be pinging you guys right now is really just some Day 1 banter. We still have a bit of time, no need to go crazy right off the bat.

Some very good insight there my loving friend. While we know that not all silents are scum, they are usually hiding there. Of your list, the NPC seems to have the oddest behavior, the talking animal bugs me as well, but I'm not sure that makes him scum.

To add:

Thanks to NPC for checking in while I was typing. I had forgotten about the Tree Stump, is this guy even in the room?

I have little to go on, but we do seem to have a handful of of players that are a bit off, shall we say. Having said that, I will vote for the ultimate non-contributor.

Vote: The Tree Stump ( Adam )

Since I don't want a no-lynch today, and nobody else seems to be worrying about the Stump, I will:

Unvote: The Tree Stump (Adam)

Vote: The Cultist (Fred Daniel Yam)

- being apparently unable to raise any suspicions that weren't based around inactivity, and made a lukewarm defense about it today.

I've still got my eye on you, though, Witch.