Legends of Chima 2013 (Action Figures)

[Bfahome]

I personally think Chima is more likely a pun on "chimera", what with the part-human animals. Not much obvious Asian influence in this theme, at least no more than a typical modern action cartoon has.

That's what I figured, and now I have to mentally stop myself from pronouncing it "ky-ma" because apparently that's WRONG.

[vexorian]

I wish that after the Bionicle-Maori debacle, they would have spent a bit of time in google with the word "Chima" before using it.

I don't understand why everybody is actually worried about the possibility of Chima replacing Hero Factory. After all these robot-themed constraction lines, I wouldn't mind if TLG would shift it's focus on a more fantasy-like approach.

HF has already been replaced by a fantasy-like theme. They just need to remove HF from the label. Maybe leave it there and say "From the creators of Hero Factory".

I love how everybody was hattin when HF dirst showed up, but now nobody wants it to go away.

The first HF things we got were a more limited, and more expensive Bionicle build system. It was justifiable to dislike it.

Except that having multiple constraction themes at the same time is a publicly acknowledged goal of TLG's. They've said many times in public that they want to get to a place where they have multiple unlicensed constraction themes.

Where?

They want to own this market.

Your entire argument is basically "I see them at my store, so they must be unpopular, and I can't imagine this, so it must not be real."

Your entire argument is "HF is doing good here so it must have been so successful it convinced TLG to try two constraction themes at once.

Still not seeing any evidence that HF was such a sales game changer.

My argument is based on multiple things: That HF has not shaken over the world. That the latest HF wave we have any info of is mediocre and seems to have a visual style of Chima's instead of its own (Reminds me of Atlantis, Exo Force, and Bionicle's last waves). That HF has been around for 4 years already and that we know that TLG learned not to over extend a constraction line to far long like Bionicle. And that Chima constraction figures are the only thing we know of 2013-2 yet.

All I am saying is that probabilities are such that I would bet that HF is going away rather than bet on it not going away.

Edited December 19, 2012 by vexorian

[Aanchir]

I wish that after the Bionicle-Maori debacle, they would have spent a bit of time in google with the word "Chima" before using it.

There's a difference between having a theme whose name resembles a real-world culture completely by coincidence and having a theme that stereotypes a wide range of cultures with names taken directly from those cultures' languages (or at least, from a root language from which those cultures' languages are derived).

For the record, there are lots of meanings of "Chima" in the real world; it's a pretty common combination of letters. I don't think any culture whose language has a word spelled that way could claim that a toy line about talking animals is exploiting their language and culture. Not so with a toy line using Polynesian names and terms with relevant meanings in a clearly Polynesian-inspired setting.

HF has already been replaced by a fantasy-like theme. They just need to remove HF from the label. Maybe leave it there and say "From the creators of Hero Factory".

Nah, the Brain Attack sets are still pretty clearly science-fantasy, just as the theme has always been. Mind-controlling brain slugs are, after all, a plot device straight out of science-fiction B movies. Saying it's a different theme for shifting slightly in the fantasy direction is like saying BIONICLE became a different theme because it shifted gradually in the sci-fi direction.

Where?

At fan conventions in the United States, wasn't DeeVee clear about that?

Your entire argument is "HF is doing good here so it must have been so successful it convinced TLG to try two constraction themes at once.

No, it's not. Please try to pay attention. DeeVee is basing his statements on things TLG has actually publicly stated.

Still not seeing any evidence that HF was such a sales game changer.

Nobody ever claimed it was a game-changer. Something doesn't have to be exceptional to be successful.

My argument is based on multiple things: That HF has not shaken over the world. That the latest HF wave we have any info of is mediocre and seems to have a visual style of Chima's instead of its own (Reminds me of Atlantis, Exo Force, and Bionicle's last waves). That HF has been around for 4 years already and that we know that TLG learned not to over extend a constraction line to far long like Bionicle. And that Chima constraction figures are the only thing we know of 2013-2 yet.

1) The latest wave being mediocre is entirely a matter of opinion. IMO, it's not quite as good as the Breakout wave, but there's a huge difference between "not as good as my favorite wave" and "terrible".

2) The Hero Factory sets this year don't seem to use Chima's aesthetic at all, besides the ones that share parts with Chima. The others have a slightly more fantasy-inspired aesthetic than past waves, but they are more element-inspired than animal-inspired, unlike any of the Chima sets and characters. This is like arguing that the Breakout series was the last HF series because they shared parts and aesthetics with that year's Super Heroes constraction sets.

3) Part of the point of creating Hero Factory was to create something that wouldn't be crippled by a lengthy lifespan the way BIONICLE was. From the beginning the theme was touted as "more flexible", by which it was referring not to the building system (which was still BIONICLE-level at best) but rather to the fact that it wouldn't pile constraints onto itself year after year.

4) Apparently you made this post before seeing the teaser video which debuted this week, which shows scenes from this year's Hero Factory episode including some obvious future sets.

All I am saying is that probabilities are such that I would bet that HF is going away rather than bet on it not going away.

I won't place any bets against you, because frankly I've seen nothing strongly suggesting that Hero Factory will be continuing in 2014. It would be silly to even expect any strong hints of that a full year in advance, except in cases like Ninjago where it's a matter of damage control. However, I don't think any of your "evidence" really amounts to much in the grand scheme of things.

[Vinyl Scratch]

I won't place any bets against you, because frankly I've seen nothing strongly suggesting that Hero Factory will be continuing in 2014. It would be silly to even expect any strong hints of that a full year in advance.

Well.

There's the Villain Factory thing going on with Von Nebula. I don't think they'll end Hero Factory with Brain Attack when they have another story to tell.

[Bfahome]

That the latest HF wave we have any info of is mediocre and seems to have a visual style of Chima's instead of its own (Reminds me of Atlantis, Exo Force, and Bionicle's last waves).

Given that Chima has a visual style with more connection to last year's HF sets than the upcoming year's sets, you kind of don't have an argument here.

Also in what way did BIONICLE have HF's visual style in the Stars line? If you're going with "small impulse-sized sets" then you're probably forgetting how that started in 2008.

[vexorian]

Given that Chima has a visual style with more connection to last year's HF sets than the upcoming year's sets, you kind of don't have an argument here.

Also in what way did BIONICLE have HF's visual style in the Stars line? If you're going with "small impulse-sized sets" then you're probably forgetting how that started in 2008.

It remains me of Atlantis, Power miners and Stars for being so different to previous waves. It reminds me of Stars for being mediocre.

[Bfahome]

It remains me of Atlantis, Power miners and Stars for being so different to previous waves. It reminds me of Stars for being mediocre.

All Atlantis changed was their headgear and canopy color. After a year of digging into the ground, Power Miners dug slightly deeper. Stars were the same impulse build as the previous two years, but with the obligatory new pieces. They were more similar to previous waves than the Toa Metru were to the Rahkshi, or the Piraka were to the Hordika.

But no yeah you're right, the fact that you don't like them is pretty irrefutable evidence.

[Jetrax99]

PWNED BY Bfahome!!! Seriously vexorian, this is not the topic to whine about HF. Do that elsewhere like, oh, an HF topic.

Also, Ninja'd by Vinyl Scratch on the Villain Factory thing.

Edited December 20, 2012 by Jetrax99

[ZORK64]

Given that his post was already deconstructed it's rather pointless, but hey, I was quoted, so I want to respond...

HF has already been replaced by a fantasy-like theme. They just need to remove HF from the label. Maybe leave it there and say "From the creators of Hero Factory".

Sure, Brain Attack features more fantasy-like monsters, but the protagonists are still robots, and the whole setting is clearly sci-fi. To me, Hero Factory is just as much sci fi as, say, Warhammer 40.000 is.

Given that science fiction is also just another form of fantasy, your mileage may vary on this topic though.

[Devorath]

From Bionifigs :

The heads look good, but the lion feet are pretty weird

These look TERRIBLE! Out of proportion and skinny in some parts, then too bulky in others. Nope, sticking with HF.

EDIT: The Croc Dude looks cool, it's the lion I dislike.

Edited December 21, 2012 by Devorath

[Aanchir]

These look TERRIBLE! Out of proportion and skinny in some parts, then too bulky in others. Nope, sticking with HF.

EDIT: The Croc Dude looks cool, it's the lion I dislike.

Laval (the lion character) probably will look better if his legs are posed correctly... as it is, they're bent straight, which looks patently ridiculous. He's still got flaws, such as how that style of foot really fails to work well on digitigrade legs, since it seems to add an extra "heel", but I'd chalk most of his other problems up to bad posing.

[Devorath]

Laval (the lion character) probably will look better if his legs are posed correctly... as it is, they're bent straight, which looks patently ridiculous. He's still got flaws, such as how that style of foot really fails to work well on digitigrade legs, since it seems to add an extra "heel", but I'd chalk most of his other problems up to bad posing.

Oh, OK. Would these be Ok to put on Bzp?

[Aanchir]

Oh, OK. Would these be Ok to put on Bzp?

Probably not, since we don't know their source. They may be leaked.

[Mesonak]

BZP typically considers anything not released by Lego officially to be "leaked". Even un-watermarked pictures on shopping sites. So I'd wager "no'.

[Jetrax99]

BZP typically considers anything not released by Lego officially to be "leaked". Even un-watermarked pictures on shopping sites. So I'd wager "no'.

which is why I spend most of my time here. There's no rules against pics, otherwise the mods would be on us already.

[Aanchir]

which is why I spend most of my time here. There's no rules against pics, otherwise the mods would be on us already.

Well, here there are still rules against embedding pics that are clearly watermarked as preliminary (doesn't really apply here), and mods can take pics down or prohibit linking of pics if they get a specific request from The LEGO Group (doesn't seem to apply here, though that can change).

Also, it's not like BZPower has no reasons for their rules... as I understand it, being a US site, oversight is handled by the North American community team, which might for some reason be stricter than the European community team. According to the BZPower staff, they've been threatened with having the site shut down if they post leaked content. Eurobricks seems to just get requests to take down offending content.

[DraikNova]

I wonder if it's because Eurobricks is a larger site. Harder to shut down, I guess.

[Mesonak]

Well, here there are still rules against embedding pics that are clearly watermarked as preliminary (doesn't really apply here), and mods can take pics down or prohibit linking of pics if they get a specific request from The LEGO Group (doesn't seem to apply here, though that can change).

Also, it's not like BZPower has no reasons for their rules... as I understand it, being a US site, oversight is handled by the North American community team, which might for some reason be stricter than the European community team. According to the BZPower staff, they've been threatened with having the site shut down if they post leaked content. Eurobricks seems to just get requests to take down offending content.

Very true. Despite the issues I have with BZP and their policies, I know that most have valid reasons behind them; as such, I try and cut the administration a little slack, unlike some that I know.

ANYWAY YES. Chima. Constraction. Get hyped.

[Devorath]

Very true. Despite the issues I have with BZP and their policies, I know that most have valid reasons behind them; as such, I try and cut the administration a little slack, unlike some that I know.

ANYWAY YES. Chima. Constraction. Get hyped.

No. I saw pics of the actual Hf sets out of their boxes. Getting hyped.

EDIT: Constraction?

When we can talk about these on Bzpower, where would we put them? Hero Factory? System Lego?

Edited December 22, 2012 by Devorath

[PenPlays]

Constuction+action figure=Constraction Figure

Just to speculate, should we be expecting them to use the three fingered talons from Ben 10 for Eris and Razar? It seems likely that they would do this, but then again, they already have talons for feet.

[vexorian]

I would discuss Chima's action figures, but those skeletal legs and arms in the Crocodile and the out of place legs in the lion still make me try to change topic. Oh wait, now I notice the strange black blob on the Croc's head! How exciting.

Maybe the birds will be better. Good luck finding a new image before a couple of months though.

EDIT: Constraction?

Now that you mention it, it is very confusing to keep using that word. Let us avoid it from now on.

PWNED BY Bfahome!!!

Yet another win for team HF! Number one!!1

All Atlantis changed was their headgear and canopy color. After a year of digging into the ground, Power Miners dug slightly deeper.

Are the changes in color schemes not a big departure? To me at least , they were.

Stars were the same impulse build as the previous two years,

The the lack of the larger builds is to me a very important drop in available set quality and a big departure from previous waves. This one is a non-negotiable fact: Remove the titans from any Bionicle wave and the average set quality of the wave will drop.

I wonder if it's because Eurobricks is a larger site. Harder to shut down, I guess.

Larger actually makes it a site an easier target. The EU placement is probably a better reason. Like was mentioned.

Edited December 22, 2012 by vexorian

[Dorek]

Yeah, let's not use officially designated terms to help conversation flow better. Obfuscating the English language ftw!

Also...

The the lack of the larger builds is to me a very important drop in available set quality and a big departure from previous waves. This one is a non-negotiable fact: Remove the titans from any Bionicle wave and the average set quality of the wave will drop.

Mathematically, sure, maybe that works... if there were titans deliberately subtracted from the wave. The Stars line was the result of a negotiation by Kelly and others in order to have SOME sets in 2010 as opposed to none at all. If you're saying the quality of those sets should be judged based on some grander imaginary sets that were never going to exist on the first place, well, I suppose quantum mathematics isn't my thing.

[Bfahome]

Are the changes in color schemes not a big departure? To me at least , they were.

No, not really.

2/3 of the Toa Metru had different colors than any previous BIONICLE sets, but BIONICLE didn't end in 2004. Unless you want to try and argue that this sudden shift in aesthetics means that Hero Factory is going to end in 5+ years. I may grant you that one.

As of now, though, there's no indication of when or how it'll end, and talking about how bad you think the color differences or set designs are is not going to change that.

[dviddy]

I wonder if it's because Eurobricks is a larger site. Harder to shut down, I guess.

It's the exact opposite. BZPower was much much larger than EB when we were threatened with those problems, and EB was much smaller than BZP and flew under the radar.

[Devorath]

It's the exact opposite. BZPower was much much larger than EB when we were threatened with those problems, and EB was much smaller than BZP and flew under the radar.

And Eurobricks didn't have a 5-month(?) downtime. :/