PoweredUp LEGO Presentation (Backwards compatibility with PowerFunctions)

[Ankoku]

Since not everyone reasons the Technic 2019 sets threat, I thought I would make an individual post about the presentation.

The images can be found here (page 82):

I actually found the images via random browsing of BrickShelf.

Anyway, this is the image which mattered to me and may well do for many others:

The backwards compatibility of the new system with the previous incarnation.

In a way, I am starting to wish they would settle on Micro-USB, or something relatively future proof and we not have to keep buying various adapters etc. Not entirely good for the environment to keep changing the format.

[Kio Liex]

Personally I really like that they are making an adapter.

Regarding you wish on a more generic connector I would like to share my though on why they are doing as they are (I'm an electronics engineer and struggle alot with connectors in my daily work).

I can't see that it would be a good idea using an connector like the Micro-USB, it is way to fragile to be used in toys. Here are some of the requirements I see that a LEGO connector shall fulfill.

• Compatible with LEGO bricks.
• Can be staked.
• Have power (9V).
• Have stearing signal (I guess this started with IR PF).
• And maybe the most important, it shall have a durability like no other connector.
  • High number of mating cycles.
  • Withstand abuse from children.
  • Good transition to wire (this could be better).

Looking at the above and the history of powered LEGO I can see an evolution as the wish for more demanded a new connector. Does any one remember the old motor and long round motor that used the large batteries? I am happy that we have the IR PF now, those old connectors was not durable (but they where easy to fix  ).

Reasons for the new connector might be (this is only what I think):

• Now LEGO wants more of the Mindstorm functionality in the main Technic parts and that requires a new connector as the old PF connector can transfer the signals used by the sensors.
• Either the PF part or the new sensors might be damaged if connected to the wrong system.
• It might just cause confusion if you can connect a new sensor to e.g. the IR receiver and then it does do anything. 
• LEGO has identified durability issues with the current design and want to improve this.

I think the reason for the new connector is all of the above.

[allanp]

Yeah, micro usb is way too fragile. The connectors Lego have chosen don't look that much stronger TBH but I haven't tried them yet so I hope they are more robust than they look. 

1 hour ago, Kio Liex said:

 

• LEGO has identified durability issues with the current design and want to improve this.

When you say current design do you mean PF or PU? 

[Kio Liex]

37 minutes ago, allanp said:

When you say current design do you mean PF or PU? 

I was referring to PF.

[kbalage]

Just to add some points to the presentation slides - although it might not be clear for the first sight that's not a definitive promise for the adapter. They are investigating what would be the best way to do this, so it's still like a strong "maybe it will come". The biggest hesitation is about the actual functionality of the adapter cable versus the cost and also potential false expectations. Should it be a simple power line to control motors? Should it support the PF Servo? What if people would expect to power a PF IR adapter? What if people try to connect the old PF sensors and expect them to work? There are a lot of questions like this. 

[allanp]

Personally I don't think the converter cable needs to be smart enough to power the PF servo motor. So if it can't control the PF servo I'de be OK with that. The biggest thing for me is that I can power the old buggy motor, the 5x4 9v ungeared motor (as seen in 8480) and the red micro motor (also as seen in 8480) because I don't see PU having any good equivalents for those motors, and because of all the motors ever released by Lego the Buggy motor has the most raw power, the old 5x4 9v ungeared motor is the fastest (and I miss those old belt drives which aren't really suitable for internally geared down motors) and the micro motor is the smallest so it would be good to be able to still use those motors with PU. Of course even better would be to see new equivalents of those 3 motors (so one with the same speed and torque as the buggy motor, one that's ungeared and very fast and one tiny micro motor) but sadly I don't think that's going to happen. So I guess what I really want (if we can't get new PU equivalents for the 3 motors) is an inexpensive "dumb" adaptor cable that goes from PU to a plug that is the old 9V system on the bottom and PF on the top that just has the power going to it. I can live without any data feedback, position sensing type stuff. The old 9V stuff wouldn't make any use of that anyway. And most of my PF stuff is M, L, and XL motors so to be able to use those would also be great. In terms of the PF servo, while it was good, I'm sure they could do better and more compact. So I'd rather see a proper RC grade more compact servo motor with more steps and possibly metal internal gears from PU than an expensive "smart" converter cable that allows me to use the old "could be better" servo. 

Edited May 31, 2019 by allanp

[Ankoku]

I remember the old motors, still have them. I always liked the gearing down add-on. That said, the connectors were a nightmare to keep plugged in. I often built LEGO around the back to hold them in place. I don't miss them.

As Sariel showed, PU seems to be 2 steps forward and 1 step back. The fact that they new connector doesn't stack is a real shame. Do we know how they are dealing with 2 motors off the same output? e.g. like powering a buggy with a motor either side at the back.

I suppose the other question is: Would the converter be bi-directional?

[dr_spock]

I would be more interested in adapting the PU motors to run on continuous power source for my GBCs.  As my PF motors burn out, PU motors would be the replacements in the future.  On the bright side, those all burnt out PF motors can provide a PF cable to make your own PU-PF adapters.

I made a dumb adapter.  The PU train/batmobile hub doesn't seem drive the PF XL motor.  It worked with the M and PF train motor.  I didn't have a L motor avaialble to test. 

 

[Ankoku]

Well, this is my thinking. The desire to power the new motors with the only 9V unit which is common place at GBC events. You need a constant supply of new motors, yet LEGO has never created a replacement power unit.