Reviving my 9v track

[LoneBrickerSG]

Has anyone tried rigging a PF battbox and IR receiver to 9v track power?

I recently re-constructed my 4565 loco and it's begging to roll, but my 9v controller is not working so well anymore. I started wondering if a Power Functions system could be connected to the 9v track system without damaging any of the electronics. There's a wire brick piece available that can connect to 9v and PF connections, I just have to get one.

Edited August 29, 2015 by LoneBrickerSG

[THERIZE]

I know someone told me about this system. He used a 9V motor with modified PF cables, a reciever and a PF remote. That also makes it possible to control 9V trains independetly.

[Rail Co]

You can actually use a PF Rechargeable battery box for it too if you use the little speed switch on the box and connect it using a 9v to PF cable. Personally I would pickup a new regulator as they are relatively cheap (around $20) compared to the PF Rechargeable battery box (Around $50). The only benefit of using the battery box is that it is less bulky and it has 7 speed steps as opposed to 6 on the 9v regulator. I have been meaning to make a short video on the difference for awhile now.

Hope that helps!

-RailCo

[LoneBrickerSG]

You can actually use a PF Rechargeable battery box

Honestly I refuse to ever buy into those. If PF is ever discontinued I'd rather be sitting pretty with AAA batt boxes than one that needs a proprietary wall charger.

As a track power source, I'd spring for one of the larger AA ones.

Edited August 30, 2015 by LoneBrickerSG

[AlmightyArjen]

Connecting a PF battery box to a 9V track can be done without a problem. You just need a converter cable from PF to the old 9V 2x2 bricks which then can be connected to the 9V 2x2 brick with the to track connectors (or directly but then you'll have to cut your supply cable directly). Just connect the middle two wires of the PF flat cable (4 wires total) to the old 9V 2x2 brick and that's it :)

I have no experience in controlling the trains individually on a 9V track. You'll have to break open the train motor for that...

Edited August 30, 2015 by AlmightyArjen

[jtlan]

Honestly I refuse to ever buy into those. If PF is ever discontinued I'd rather be sitting pretty with AAA batt boxes than one that needs a proprietary wall charger.

There's nothing "proprietary" about the charger -- the plug on the box is actually a reasonably common type, and the charge circuitry is pretty forgiving so it'll accept a wide range of input voltages (there was a Railbricks article about this). There's no reason to shell out $25 for the "official" charging brick (I found the one I use in a box of discarded electronics).

[LoneBrickerSG]

I have no experience in controlling the trains individually on a 9V track. You'll have to break open the train motor for that...

That was never my intention. This is my way of being able to use my original 4565 locomotive along with my other PF trains without having to hop between controllers. DCC with scale model trains has a concept that is kind of similar, where the system can operate digitally-optimized trains as well as one or two old school analog trains at the same time.

Edited August 31, 2015 by LoneBrickerSG

[dr_spock]

If battery operation time is an issue, it is not hard to modify the battery box to take a 9V DC power wall wart.

I have no experience in controlling the trains individually on a 9V track. You'll have to break open the train motor for that...

Back in the old days, we used to isolate segment of tracks into blocks. Each block is controled by its own power controler.

[codefox421]

I know someone told me about this system. He used a 9V motor with modified PF cables, a reciever and a PF remote. That also makes it possible to control 9V trains independetly.

I have modded a 9V motor to output track power and take in power to the electric motor. Could be used like you describe. I will write up a post about it when I have the time.

[LoneBrickerSG]

Here's a question I originally meant to ask at the start.

Eventually I would like to have a dedicated train table, probably not anything monstrous, but I'd like to keep the options open. If I wanted to run a system of 9v track, powered by a PF batt box and IR receiver, will I ever be at risk of the battery box not having enough muscle to power the entire line?

For the sake of example we'll figure like a 15-foot by 8-foot setup, and assume the 9v track follows the edge and has a couple of sidings. Would I ever have a power shortage problem? I know this becomes a concern in larger scale model setups, hence my question.

Maybe I could rig up some simplified "signals" along the route, too, just for the heck of it.

[M_slug357]

I think your power loss would come mostly from how many 9v motors are in operation at a time on the loop. I'd guess that more than 2-3 motors, and there might not be enough power to go around/ max speed & run time are greatly reduced.

The best idea would be to separate (isolate electrically) your layout into at least three 15 foot sections of track, each one with it's own batt box & reciever. Possibly break it down to more sections depending on how large and how many sidings you eventually put up.

Hope this helps!

[Phoxtane]

You may overheat your IR receiver. My LUG has taken to modified IR receivers that power the 9V rails, and they heat up enough to be almost hot enough to burn, sometimes even tripping the thermistor inside each receiver. At that point we have to let them cool down until they can be used to run the rails again.

Since I use PF on most of my trains, this isn't an issue for me! I can keep mine running while the receivers cool.

[LoneBrickerSG]

You may overheat your IR receiver. My LUG has taken to modified IR receivers that power the 9V rails, and they heat up enough to be almost hot enough to burn

Really. See this was something I wasn't aware of.

[Brickthus]

The snag with using 9V train motors with PF (either the IR Receiver output or the LiPo battery output) is that the 9V train motors don't like PWM - they buzz a lot. Buzzing vibrates the motor core and will heat it up and shorten its life.

The PF train motor is a new design that coped better with PWM; it whines but doesn't buzz.

I have used a dual 30V 3A bench power supply for driving 9V trains. Plenty of current, enough to stop one train and start another by changing the points at the ends of through-sidings.

I usually run 9V trains at 7 Volts for half an hour before changing, with a current limit of 2 Amps. I kept my 9V controller for the yard.

What is wrong with your 9V controller?

Mark

[LoneBrickerSG]

What is wrong with your 9V controller?

There is nothing inherently wrong with it. It still works as well as it did when I first unwrapped it 14 years ago.

I would just like to be able to run as much off my PF controller as possible.

[dr_spock]

There is nothing inherently wrong with it. It still works as well as it did when I first unwrapped it 14 years ago.

I would just like to be able to run as much off my PF controller as possible.

Sounds like you could use a microcontroller solution that can read the IR Speed Controller and adjust power to the 9V tracks.

[zephyr1934]

There is nothing inherently wrong with it. It still works as well as it did when I first unwrapped it 14 years ago.

I would just like to be able to run as much off my PF controller as possible.

Could you make an IR controlled unit mounted on the 9v controller to rotate the dial? Might be a little roundabout, but it does have some Rube Goldberg charm going for it.